&gt;I just don&#x27;t see the need to say it goes beyond physical reality - there&#x27;s just no proof of that.<p>What physical reality are you talking about? To the best we can ascertain, we only have subjective experiences of perceptions of electromagnetic phenomena. We don&#x27;t get to perceive physical reality, only our own interpretation of what is postulated as an image of the physical reality.<p>It appears that there can be no proof either way whether a physical reality actually exists or not. All we can know is that we have a subjective experience. We can hypothesize that it arises from some other &quot;thing&quot;, but there is no way we can know.<p>Also, I&#x27;m not sure anyone in this thread chain has claimed that consciousness goes beyond physical reality. I think you are the only who has assumed a physical reality (also, with no &quot;proof&quot;).