<div class="quoteheader"><div class="topslice_quote"><a href="https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=166544.msg8143760#msg8143760">Quote from: BigBuckBob on 30-04-2013, 07:03:31</a></div></div><blockquote class="bbc_standard_quote">While doing something else, you suddenly notice that everyone is gone. You have done nothing since noticing they were gone, so you haven't learned anything.<br/></blockquote><div class="quotefooter"><div class="botslice_quote"></div></div><br/>I buy this statement less than I buy they vanished into thin air. "Spotter distracted" applies a -5 to the check (PHB 83), and Listen DC similarly goes up by 5. Plus, again, we were RIGHT NEXT to Alice. What's the point of dumping skill ranks in Spot and Listen if I'm not going to get a reactive check when I should be allowed one?<br/><br/><div class="quoteheader"><div class="topslice_quote"><a href="https://elliquiy.com/forums/index.php?topic=166544.msg8147052#msg8147052">Quote from: BigBuckBob on 30-04-2013, 22:56:14</a></div></div><blockquote class="bbc_standard_quote">Assuming unwilling travelers there are only a couple ways to do it, ice crystal teleport, wish, or the 'victim' girl grabbed the others and plane shifted.<br/></blockquote><div class="quotefooter"><div class="botslice_quote"></div></div><br/>Ice Crystal Teleport and grabbing before a Plane Shift both have very visual elements, Wish would probably have a visual element (it's not really specified) and all three spells probably have verbal components (haven't actually looked, and in the case of SLAs that's irrelevant). In either of those first two cases it shouldn't even REQUIRE a check for Trakas or Lethiel to see what happened, and in any of those cases Roland should have gotten saving throws/grapple checks (as well as Alice, though with Siereis' absence I won't cry foul at that, and I suppose I'm assuming that you didn't make rolls behind-the-scenes).<br/><br/>I will let this particular argument go because you're the DM, but please, if you need to move the game along faster,<em>please</em>resort to something besides railroading, especially<em>completely</em>arbitrary, unjustified railroading like this.<br/><br/>EDIT: I'm also going to wait on a post from Kunoichi so Lethiel can report her findings.<br/><br/>EDIT 2: And after learning Lethiel's information, Trakas will make a Spot check to look for shards of ice: At 2013-04-30 17:17:04, Rhaegar14 (uid: 28142) rolls: 1d20a18 Result: 23 (http://elliquiy.com/forums/dicebot.php?r=46061)