text_combined: phillip j eby moetelecommunitycom 1008 pm 3202008 0000 apbrcdivmodcom wrote offlist situation except one extremely pressed time actually attempting use setuptools use features experience project uses distutils apt installation probably works uses setuptools probably throws traceback wall text explaining environment inadequate perform installation people chose use broke setup manually copying files cases _lot_ easier attempting diagnose repair software didnt even want use interesting packaging distribution far run software svn checkout _detest_ involved discussions deployment installation however general message negative subjective experience using setuptools fud accurate portrayal great deal frustration setuptools date solved single problem personally professionally caused many distutils despite many flaws actually solved quite actually information helpful makes blindingly obvious difference loving hating setuptools whether youre intentionally using whether shows ecosystem uninvited also makes difference whether get involved investment tool minimal motivation rtfm ask questions fix bugs people scenario communicate distutilssig much likely impatient hostile likely view system fundamentally broken makes total sense dont solutions problem mind least understand seemed like sort bizarre anomaly literally thousands people use setuptools many dozens actually express happiness even love system others hate like hate microsoft worse meanwhile outsiders point view setuptools looks like matrix borg happily assimilating masses start coming say youll much happier join us distance hear quiet rumbling zombies chanting eeeeggs eeeeggggs mussst havve eggggssss hm seems maybe one thing would help setuptools haters guide setuptools short documentation specifically written people dont want use setuptools want minimize impact systems could probably write something like fairly easily idea go existing documentation sucks count nonassimilated persons help critiquing document suggesting topics miss _______________________________________________ pythondev mailing list zvlllneumpythonorg httpmailpythonorgmailmanlistinfopythondev unsubscribe httpmailpythonorgmailmanoptionspythondevpythondev40tangomucom wed 06 aug 2008 132940 0400 pythondev wow think actually get