i said well that's what is, i said if you look at it the depreciation is so heavy  compared with the income, and i said and the insurance as well but i said hopefully cos we haven't had any  of er  any claims at all this year  you know, i said i know but all of the insurances of gone up, but i said  i'm hoping that we can sort of get the insurance down if possible  so he said, yeah fair enough then.