when queenie talks about the increased expenditure on recreation from nineteen eighty to now, that's quite right, there has been a huge increase in spending, and that's because the labour council was committed to improving recreation facilities in the city, and it didn't continue the appalling record that the conservative administration had had before of virtually no recreational facilities, it invested in recreation facilities — you listed them yourself — and of course those facilities have to be paid for and on  when we have stood for election we've always made it clear that we want to provide quality services, but of course that they have to be paid for, and so the second point that you then made was that, you know, our budget's gone up beyond belief, well i mean this year it's being cut by two million pounds, last year it was a standstill budget, and erm that has been done at a time when in fact central government has been transferring responsibilities from central government onto local government without increasing, indeed at the same time decreasing the amount of central government grant that's gone to local councils.