&gt; So do you include the future and the past?<p>Yes.  I think the point of confusion is around &quot;universality&quot;.  I&#x27;m not talking about a unanimous agreement on preference between people born and unborn, I&#x27;m talking about attributes that define kindness (the set theory kind, not the Disney princess kind).  I was hoping to make that clear with the perfect circle bit, but I wasn&#x27;t aware of contention on the issue... pretend I said square, I&#x27;m pretty sure that is a safe universal definition.  I have no opinion on the morality of geometry, but all squares share universal attributes.  All humans share universal attributes as well, by way of biological imperatives - life is preferable to death, all things being equal and outside of coercion.