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"FacebookPinterest\n\nWe all know the problem with John Kerry\u2014the personality disorder. Could this guy seem any more like an Audio-AnimatronicsTM creation ready-made for the Hall of Presidents at Disney World? Before casting my vote this November, I had to find out for myself if he's as stiff as we all seem to think.\n\n So it was that I met Kerry at All Stars Sports Bar Grill in Cedar Rapids, Iowa, late in the afternoon of July 4 for a few beers. What better way to get a man to reveal his true character? But that's not all I had come for. There was the unresolved matter of a strange encounter he and I had outside a New York City men's room a year and a half ago....\n\nGreat to meet you, Senator.   \n\n Sure. Love GQ. Always have it around the house. Hey, let's go meet these people. [Kerry takes a lap around the bar, shaking the hands of a half-dozen or so drinkers, then returns.] Well, what're we drinking?\n\nBeer good for you?\n\n Sure.\n\n [to bartender] Two Buds.   \n\n I shoulda asked if you have any dark beer. [The bartender says he has Guinness.] Yeah? [Kerry thinks for a minute.] That's okay. This'll do. [Sips.] Cheers.\n\nCheers, Senator.\n\n  Boy, that hits the spot today. I had a tough day. Damn hot.\n\nSince we're in a sports bar, let me ask: Who's your sports hero?\n\n I've got so many. Bobby Orr. Jaromir Jagr. Wayne Gretzky. DiMaggio.\n\nHow about Phil Esposito?\n\n Absolutely. I wore number 7 because of him. I have a photograph, it's one of my most prized possessions, me with Phil Esposito in a charity game. And he wrote to me, \"Keep your head up and your stick on the ice.\" [Laughs.] I like that.\n\nThere's your new campaign slogan. Forget that Real Deal stuff.\n\n I love the old Bruins. I love the Red Wings.\u2026\n\nDid you ever\u2014   \n\n I love baseball. I love football. I love sports. French skiers. Franz Klammer\u2026\n\nSure. '76. Going like a mofo.   \n\n Absolutely. Unbelievable. Toni Sailer going way back.\n\nIt seems you play aggressive sports\u2014hockey, snowboarding. Do you have a death wish?\n\n I love competition. I love the feeling of it. For instance, I love just throwing the lacrosse ball around.\n\n In college, did you play Coed Naked Lacrosse?   \n\n [Laughs.] Gosh. I wish. We never had a chance. It's a great idea. Too bad we didn't invent it. Frisbee. I love Ultimate Frisbee.\n\nDo you still play that?   \n\n Hell yeah.\n\n I think you're hyperactive.   \n\n I don't think I'm hyperactive. I love to play sports, but I can also come in and veg on the couch for the next three hours. I can sit and watch football like anybody else. If you want me to be one, I'm a great veg, a couch potato.\n\nThere's another campaign slogan for John Kerry: \"Vote for me, America. I can be a great couch potato!\"   \n\n You know what I like? Just doing things. I like when I'm engaged. I was watching the Tour earlier today and I love that. You want a sports hero: Greg LeMond. And obviously Lance Armstrong. You know, back in the old days, Bruce Jenner, when he broke through. And Frank Shorter.\n\nYou follow the NBA?\n\n I'm not as big on basketball as other sports.\n\nYou don't follow it?\n\n No, I follow it. I followed the Lakers and the Pistons. No, I love basketball. Beautiful game.\n\nWhy is the NHL so irrelevant? When I was a kid, it was Bobby Hull, Tony Esposito, Stan Mikita, all those guys on the Chicago Blackhawks. Now I can't name anyone.\n\n I think the NHL overexpanded. The season's too long. Most seasons are too long in sports. Money and television have drawn out everything. I think it's hurt sports. Hockey is not what it used to be. I love the big, open Russian Olympic game. They're always swooping, always diving; there's a motion to it, which is very different from the NHL, where you get the hooking and the holding and you slow the game down. I prefer the game that's got wide-open stick handling and skating and passing. There used to be a joy to watching Bobby Orr wind up behind the net. It was beautiful.\n\nWhat was your greatest moment as an athlete?\n\n A hat trick as a senior in the Harvard\u2014Yale soccer game.\n\nReally? Why don't we know about this?\n\n Well, it's not something you talk about.\n\nSo what was it like when you got the third goal?\n\n Pretty exciting. I think I got down on my knees and hit the ground.\n\nDid you get drunk that night?\n\n [Laughs; leans in.] Shhhh\u2026\n\nI mean, I would have. That was your senior year?\n\n Senior year. I was lucky. Nice way to end the career.\n\nWho's the better band: Stones or Beatles?\n\n Um\u2026\n\nAnd don't give me some lame political answer and say \"I like them both.\" Pick one.\n\n Well, I can pick both. I can tell you the truth, and the truth is I love both. I love \"Brown Sugar.\" I love \"Jumpin' Jack Flash.\" I love, you know, \"Satisfaction.\" I like \"Little Red Rooster.\" I love every Beatles song. I mean, I love the Beatles. I love the Abbey Road album, I love the White Album.\n\nBut, c'mon\u2014you have to choose one.\n\n But I don't have to. And that's the glory of life. I play them both. I do! I play them both. I've got them both in my car.\n\nWhat about Dylan? Ever met him?\n\n I have. It was like meeting an icon. I love Dylan. He's brilliant. One of my favorite songs ever in life is\u2026I mean, I can name any number of his songs that I love [long pause]\u2026but you know, Lay across my big brass bed\u2014\"Lay, Lady, Lay.\"\n\nRight. That came out around the time you were in college.\n\n Yes.\n\nSo do you want to fill in the blanks?\n\n Hmm?\n\nDo you want to fill in any blanks?\n\n [Laugh.] Oh God, what's that other song? [Long pause.] I'm having an elder moment here. What's that great song?\n\nIt's okay, I know you had a long day.\n\n No, no, no, I want to remember it, because it's such a great hit song. [Pauses.] Oh God, help me out.\n\nIs it early Dylan? Late Dylan? Blonde on Blonde? \"Masters of War\"?\n\n No. [Long pause.] I'll come back to it. But that whole period I loved. He and Baez. Peter, Paul and Mary.\n\nDid you ever read Positively 4th Street? It's a history of that period when Dylan moved to the Village and met Baez.   \n\n I love to read that kind of stuff. I really do. I'm a great culturalist.\n\nIs there anyone you want to meet that you haven't?\n\n Lots of people.\n\nYou're a senator, though. You can call up anyone.\n\n Yeah, but you don't go around doing that.\n\nI would. You could subpoena them to testify.\n\n When we're in the majority. [Laughs.]\n\nIs there a fictional character you identify most with?\n\n That's a really good question. There's a little Huck Finn in me; there's a little Tom Sawyer in me.\n\nI think there's some Gatsby in you.\n\n No!\n\nIn the way that Gatsby comes out of the Huck Finn tradition\u2014a truly American character.\n\n I think he's a little shallow. He was too materialistic. I wouldn't want to be that at all.\n\nHuck Finn? What's that about?   \n\n I like the adventure. And the observational qualities he had for what was going on around him. I like Conor Larkin too.\n\nThe guy from Trinity? \n\n Yeah. He stood for something. Fought for it. Fell in love. Took risks for his principles and values. And I liked what's-his-name, Jett Rink.\n\nOh, in Giant?\n\n James Dean.\n\nSpeaking of movies, Brando\u2014\n\n You know Brando used to call me.\n\nWhat?\n\n I had a telephone relationship with Marlon Brando. Back in '86, '85, when I was doing the contras. He took a huge interest in it. And he would call me. He was always asking questions. And he'd give me advice.\n\nGood advice or weird advice?\n\n Well, I never met him. We had a great telephone relationship. I just gave him a chance to get out all his thoughts. I didn't want to abuse his privacy. You know, if he had said, \"Hey, come on out and see me\" or \"I'd like to see you,\" I'd have done it. But\u2026\n\nDid you ever use any of his questions in the hearings?   \n\n I took his advice on a couple of angles. A couple of points.\n\nThat's like when Nixon called a play for the Dolphins in the Super Bowl. Can you imitate Brando?\n\n Nah, I wish I could. [Pauses.]\n\n You're thinking about it.\n\n I'm thinking about doing The Godfather, but I won't. I love his stuff.\n\nWho is the sexiest film actress of all time?\n\n I think Charlize Theron is pretty extraordinary.\n\nShe's got a few things going for her.   \n\n Catherine Zeta-Jones...\n\nHow about when you were 20 years old?   \n\n Marilyn Monroe. I thought she was funny. Complicated. And obviously very attractive, very beautiful.\n\nSo if you become president, who's going to sing \"Happy birthday, Mr. President\" to you? Charlize Theron?\n\n My wife!\n\nGood answer. What's your comfort food?\n\n Comfort food? Ice cream. Makes me think of being a kid. I loved cookies as a kid. I was a cookie freak.\n\n Have you changed your diet since the prostate cancer?\n\n A little bit. I'm not doing quite as much lactic. And red meat and so forth. But I generally eat pretty clean and pretty carefully. I'm going to get in trouble for singling out one or two.\n\nWhat, you mean from the Beef Board or the Chicken Council? See, you worry too much. Be yourself.   \n\n No, I'm not talking about meat, I'm talking about Hollywood actresses. [Laughs.]\n\nWhat's wrong with spouting off? It's what you do over beers.\n\n Somebody's going to say, \"You didn't say so-and-so...\"\n\n You're covering bases.   \n\n No, I told you what I think.\n\nAre you a Bordeaux or a Burgundy guy?   \n\n I don't think I'd describe myself that way. It depends. I'm not, you know, just as politically I don't like to be categorized, I don't like to be categorized with wine. It depends what I'm doing. What I'm eating.\n\nWhat's the best bottle of wine you've ever had?   \n\n Probably a Latour 1961.\n\nDo you remember where you were when you drank it?\n\n Yes.\n\nWhere? \n\n I'm not telling you.\n\nDid you have your clothes on?   \n\n [Laughs.] Yes. I was with a bunch of other people, and we had a great time.\n\nHow big a wine cellar do you have?   \n\n Not very big. I mean, you know, a decent one. I don't drink very much at all. Now. Because when you're working as hard as I am and you're on the trail, you can't be tired; you're dehydrated.\n\nWhen you're elected president, what bottle of wine will you drink?\n\n I'll celebrate great American wines.\n\nThere you go again. Good political answer.\n\n I'll give you another great wine: Beringer Private Reserve.\n\nSo back when you were single, between wives, you were the Bachelor Senator. I mean, that must've been a great time. It sounds like the premise for a sitcom or a Ben Affleck movie or\u2014\n\n That's ridiculous. Those were not good days, is all I can say. I think if you ask anyone, Bob Kerrey, or anyone who's been single on Capitol Hill, you'll find it's no fun.\n\nWhy? Because you can't trust anyone?   \n\n It's just not fun. That's not a good world, and everyone wants a piece of you, and all I can say is, thank God I found Teresa.\n\nI'm single. What should I look for in a woman?   \n\n Look for what gets your heart.\n\nWhat would it be for you, with Teresa?   \n\n Someone who excites you, turns you on. It's a quality of character. It's a kind of presentation. Sense of womanhood. Full woman. Confident. It's a woman who loves being a woman. Who wears her womanhood. Who knows how to flirt and have fun. Smart. Confident. Has a sense of self. Strong. And obviously sexy and saucy and challenging.\n\nHow do you like to be challenged? I want a woman who's going to call me on my shit.   \n\n I think every man wants a woman who also is supportive, there for you. But that's only part of a relationship. It's work. It's hard. Nobody who's not had a relationship or who hasn't been married understands. You have to care about it. You have to invest in it, and you compromise on certain things. But if it works, it's great.\n\nAnd when it doesn't?   \n\n When it doesn't, for one reason or another, you wind up like I did.\n\nDivorced? \n\n Yeah.\n\nBut that's\u2014   \n\n It happens.\n\nBut you don't regret any of that.   \n\n Well, I think you're always saddened by it.\n\nBut sadness is not regret.   \n\n Right, but it takes its toll. And anybody who's been through it will tell you that. I would advise people to try to find a way to avoid it. It's not fun. It's tough on kids; it's tough on people.\n\nA friend of yours has said that Teresa has changed you for the better, opened you up.\n\n No doubt. After my first marriage, I was like a lot of people who had a relationship that doesn't work\u2014you want to make sure that the next one does. And you're a little gun-shy and apprehensive and nervous. And Teresa gave me a sense of confidence about relationships that filled that. As you get older, you sort of realize what's important and what's not. What's worth worrying about and what's not. And all that helps.\n\nBut confidence? You seem like the most confident guy in the world.\n\n Everybody always has doubts about something. If you don't, you're not thinking. I'm confident about a lot of things, but I'm not somebody who's blind to human frailty and to the need for humility. We all have our flaws. And Teresa, you know, gave me just a great sort of strong, clear commitment to who I am. So you know, she loved me. And I think that kind of love is very compelling.\n\nDoes it frustrate you, the way your wife gets characterized?\n\n Yes. It's very unfair. She's not defined by her money. She's not defined by her surname. She's defined by what she thinks. Who she is. Where her heart is. What her gut is. And by the things she does with all of that. She spent years as a mom, like every other mom in America, taking care of her kids. She wasn't spoiled. She didn't have nannies up the kazoo, things like that. She cooked for her kids, she took care of her kids, she raised her kids, and, you know, she works really hard. And after her husband, her first husband, was killed, she took on enormous responsibilities. She is really phenomenally capable. She's a great leader and thinker.\n\nSomething that's frustrating to me and people who want to vote for you: We feel that we still don't know who John Kerry is. There's that lack of personality, of charisma. What's up with that, with you?\n\n [testily] Who said that? In the last few weeks?\n\nYeah. \n\n Have you been to our events?\n\nNo. But I'm just saying\u2014\n\n They're amazing, I think that we are doing very well.\n\nThat's a different thing. I'm talking about how you come across.\n\n I'm not Bill Clinton, okay? I like Bill Clinton, and I admire him for his political skills enormously. He's a very smart guy. And the decisions he made for our country were the right decisions. The direction he took us in was the right direction. But I'm not Bill. I'm me. And I'm not trying to be anybody else. I'm gonna be me. And I got elected four times to the Senate. Bill Clinton, if you recall, didn't start out where Bill Clinton is today. It took time. You know, I can remember a thirty-five-minute speech in Atlanta.\n\nDoes it frustrate you that you run in his wake?  \n\n I don't even bother with it. I really don't. I'm having fun. I'm going straight ahead. I'm having a good time. I think I'm relating to audiences. I'm learning certain skills as time goes on. You get better at certain things. I'm listening very carefully to people. There are things that I need to learn how to do better. I'm learning.\n\nBut you've been a campaigner your whole life. Why has it taken you so long to learn this? I'll give you an example. I met you once before, not that you'll remember.\n\n Tell me.\n\nIt was at The Four Seasons about a year and a half ago.\n\n Four Seasons in\u2026?\n\nNew York. The Four Seasons Restaurant.\n\n Oh, I remember that. I was sitting around afterwards?\n\nNo, what happened was, I went to use the bathroom and then\u2014wham!\u2014out walks John Kerry. I couldn't have been more excited. And I stuck my hand out and said, \"Senator Kerry, Michael Hainey, GQ, pleasure to meet you.\" And it seemed like the last thing you wanted to do was meet a supporter. Why didn't you care about meeting me, an average voter?\n\n Yeah, I probably\u2026 I don't have a clue what the situation was.\u2026 It's interesting when you say that.\n\nNo, I mean, really\u2014it's important because you need to be aware of how you project yourself. Because right here, man, you're cool and relad and fun.\n\n Had you been in the bathroom or come out?\n\n It was locked, so I was waiting outside\u2014\n\n And I was coming out?\n\nAnd I just sort of got you.\n\n I probably didn't want to be ambushed. It probably was late at night and when you announced you were with the press, I probably felt even less so. [Laughs.]\n\nRight. But you have to be ready for that. You're a politician.\n\n I think there are times when you fight for a little bit of a privacy zone. I value personal time. I enjoy conversation. I love to sit and talk. But I don't like to feel a lack of control over my life.\n\nBut c'mon, you're running for president! You gotta show 'em what you're showing me.\n\n I fight that a little bit\u2014being \"on\" all the time. I think anybody who's thoughtful fights that a little bit. And sometimes you sort of say, okay, my mind's not in it today, I want a break.\n\nBut you can't do that in a campaign, for God's sake.\n\n No, obviously you can't. And that's one of the learning curves. You realize, wait a minute, I've accepted a responsibility and that is to always be available. And you have to learn that. I didn't do that when I first began in this business. When I first began, I was so issue oriented. And I've learned through the years, through friends, through colleagues, through experience, through mistakes, that it's a very personal thing. Look, I'm not hard to figure out. I'm not a big complicated deal. I'm very straightforward, I'm loyal to a fault, I care about friends and relationships\u2014I have thirty-year, forty-year friends.\n\nWho's your best friend?   \n\n I never\u2014because I have a lot of friends who are very close. And I wouldn't do that to one of them. I care deeply about things. I think the world is in a very dangerous place. I think I can make it better. I know how to lead. I think I have a good value system, a good set of instincts, and I think these guys in power are out of touch with the average people of our country. And people are getting hurt. And if you look at my life, I'm a fighter. I'm a guy who picks up fights and takes you on. I didn't have to come back from the war and go out and demonstrate and say we're going to end it, piss off a lot of friends and cohorts and the military, but I did. It was a matter of conscience.\n\nAre you frustrated that the Republicans have painted you more the protester than the warrior?\n\n I think they're pathetic. If George Bush wants to have a debate about what he did versus what I did, I'll meet him anywhere in the country and we can talk about opposition to the war and fighting in a war. Bring it on.\n\nRight. But what about how he's painting you?\n\n I just think it's pathetic. It indicates how craven they are. You know, in the dark of night I might call them some names, but I just think it's kind of stupid. I really do. I think it's so pathetic. It's stupid. And I think it hurt them. I mean, I think more people now know my record than did before, thanks to them. If you want to have that debate, let's have it. [Bartender puts down two pints of Guinness.] Cheers. Here's to Guinness.\n\nCheers. \n\n The thick stuff. I love Guinness. This is one of my favorites.\n\nI used to be a real good chugger of Guinness.\n\n Chugger?\n\nYeah, you know. Chugging.\n\n That's a thick chug.\n\nIt has practically no carbonation, so it goes down easy. It's like chugging syrup.\n\n [Laughs.] That's good; Yeah, it's really soft.\n\nSo, in the past few years, you've lost both your parents.\n\n Yes. It's a shame that they are not here to see this, to see me. Not that they would enjoy it.\n\nWhat do you mean? Did they not want you to go into politics?\n\n Well, not so much that. Just really the whole thing of running and all the attention it puts on everyone. It's not a lot of fun for everyone else. It's hard. And I think at different times they might have wondered about it all. But no, they were happy. They'd be happy.\n\nReally?\n\n Yes.\n\nWere you closer to your father or your mother?\n\n At different times closer to each. But like with any son, there sure were times when I parted ways with my old man. I also never saw my father a lot growing up because he was in the Foreign Service and always traveling. So when I became a father, I wanted to be sure and carve out time for my kids, to let them know I was there for them and how much I loved them.\n\nHere's a crazy theory.\n\n Okay.\n\nYou've got a great r\u00E9sum\u00E9, you're an internationalist, patrician. You're more the son of George Bush Senior than W. is.\n\n I don't want to go anywhere near that. Except to say this: I like Junior, but I like the senior Bush enormously. A very decent, thoughtful guy. And I have great respect for him.\n\nW. seems like he came out of a laboratory.\n\n I don't comment on him personally at all.\n\nWhat's that gold chain around your neck?\n\n It's a Saint Christopher's medal, given to me by a family friend before I shipped out for Nam, and I haven't taken it off since.\n\nYou beat prostate cancer. Was that your first thought of mortality?\n\n Oh God! No. You kidding, man? I mean, Jesus, I saw my own death any number of times in Vietnam. There was this period where I was convinced I'd be killed. But I made it back with a sense that every day is extra. You know, we used to have a saying over there when we were screwing around and getting in trouble, breaking the rules. We'd look at each other and we'd say, \"We're fuckin' idiots, and this is Vietnam.\" I mean, that attitude is liberating. It's sort of been there, done that. And they can't\u2014I'm gonna get in trouble for saying the F-word there\u2014but people who come back from that are very lucky and know that, and it is very liberating.   You know, there's not much that scares me. So I'm not worried about things\u2014certainly not dying, because too many of my friends did. And so I think it empowers you to go out and tell the truth and let the chips fall where they may. Bush and Cheney don't understand that. That's one of the things I think is most lacking in their stewardship of our country. So when I was, you know, when I heard about the cancer diagnosis, to me it was, just, okay, next challenge. Let's get it done. What do we do?\n\nDid you come back from Nam with any psychic damage?\n\n I was very lucky, Mike. I think I was able to take that pain and put it out there in my efforts to end the war. And so I very publicly laid out my depth of opposition to what was happening and my feelings about what had happened over there in a way that, you know, a lot of guys didn't have that opportunity, or couldn't or didn't, and they kind of held it in. And I think that's the harder thing; that's the problem for a lot of guys. So I never did have any of those issues. It doesn't slow me down; it motivates me.\n\nYou've never seen a therapist?\n\n No. I had some nightmares when I came home, which is not unusual.\n\nLike what?\n\n I can't say. To me Vietnam is an old place, an old memory. It is old history, it's gone, it's past. The less I have to talk about it, frankly, the happier I am.\n\nHow does it all end for you?\n\n It's up to the American people.\n\n I'm talking in a metaphysical sense, big picture.\n\n I mean, that's yet to be defined.\n\nHow would you want it to end, if you could choose?\n\n Boy, that's just really hanging out there, isn't it? [Long pause; wells up.] Gracefully. Yeah, gracefully.\n\nmichael hainey is gq's deputy editor."^^<http://www.w3.org/2001/XMLSchema#string>
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