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Monday, 25 March, 2002, 10:41 GMT
Will street crime crackdown work?
Tony Blair has chaired the first meeting of a new taskforce aimed at tackling rising levels of street crime.
Before the meeting Home Secretary, David Blunkett, said concerted action was needed to combat the 25% increase in muggings and robberies across England and Wales.
Police and court authorities will work together to increase detection rates and cut delays in 10 hotspots around the country.
But is this the best way to crackdown on the rise in muggings, illegally-held weapons and drug-dealing?
Do you feel safe on British streets? What else should the government do? Would resources be better targeted solely on putting more bobbies on the beat?
This debate is now closed. Read a selection of your comments below.
It's high time the liberal lobby were ignored. They have been putting the criminals' rights before those of the victims for years, and the current social problems are a direct result. Young thugs don't need pampering, they need to be taken into the centre of the towns they terrorise and flogged. See if that gives them any extra 'street cred'.
I seem to remember Tony Blair saying "Tough on crime, tough on the causes of crime". Fine words but little action as usual from this Government. They jump from one headline grabbing initiative to the next, but there is precious little evidence of a coherent strategy or any real progress.
The blame is not solely with the Government however. My parents would never have let me out alone or unsupervised at a young age. I still believe parents have a responsibility to teach their children right and wrong and to keep them out of trouble. Too many kids are just roaming wild and their parents have no idea where they are or what they are doing.
Will street crime crackdown work? This depends very much on your definition of work
If you take it to mean will it drastically reduce crimes against the person, then no, of course a number of people who are part of the problem, not the solution getting together for a chinwag won't work. If, however, you take the Blair/New Labour definition of work, i.e. "will it deflect flak until the next sleazy scandal comes along?" then sadly it probably will.
Has it occurred to anyone that most of the young people perpetrating these crimes are the products of parents who were products of Margaret Thatcher's 1980s policies? Chickens have come home to roost, and in some ways it's a real shame that the Tories don't have to deal with the consequences of their 18 years in government. After all, they claimed there were more police officers under them, but crime still managed to soar!
Blair and Blunkett are like an overplayed, cracked record. Side "A" is another re-release of their old favourite: "Crackdown on Crime", and Side "B" features: "Release Prisoners Early". The fact that the sentiments expressed in these themes directly contradict each other seems to have escaped their notice - and suggests that this record is purely commercial and lacking in any intellectual depth.
Everyone seems to assume that youth crime arises spontaneously whereas it really arises from poor parenting by feckless or clueless parents whose dire influence on their children then contaminates others in the "gang" mentality. A major attack on youth crime has to make use of existing legislation. We don't want more prisons where youths can achieve a sense of criminal community and present criminality as an alternative way of life.
Instead we need to force parents of these criminals to stop blaming everybody and take some responsibility.
If we are to retain the civil rights we've established for people over recent decades perhaps zero tolerance is an answer. The risk of being prosecuted for doing 35 mph in a 30 mph zone is a small price to pay if I can leave my car somewhere without it being broken into or vandalised, can walk into town without being harassed or don't have to wake up to count the cost of last night's vandalism to my property.
Billy Cameron, England
What the government should be asking itself is, why has street crime, vandalism and general behaviour got so much worse since Labour have been in power? We were promised a more harmonious society under them.
'Street crime is out of control, so let's have a meeting about it.'
What a way to run a country.
We need a high police presence and the odd visible armed one to reassure criminals that the police mean business. Then from the government, the courts and the public MUST support the police 100%.
So Altaf believes that "freedom and democracy" have created a "disease that has infected these criminals". Well its not infected me in that way - anybody else care to blame capitalism, freedom and democracy for crime? No doubt he'll be telling us that crime doesn't exist in countries with dictatorships or Sharia law !
To Altaf, UK: Are you implying that crime only exists in the West? There are murders, rapes, robberies and kidnappings all over the world. There always have been. In fact, more prosperous societies have lower rates of crime than the developing world. I don't understand your point of view.
Once an area has been identified as high crime then the police should establish a 24/7 presence there until the rate of crime falls to an acceptable level.
There is too much fortress mentality in police forces, especially the Met. This has led to the closure of many police stations when the reverse should be happening. If a housing estate or commercial area is a problem then the police should be there.
Finally, all police canteens should be shut immediately. It will force the police out onto the streets to eat, if for no other reason.
Michael, Dublin, Ireland
Another Downing Street summit chaired by the Tony Blair being hailed as a success. Political stunts like these never cure anything!
So the police are going to make a concerted effort are they? When? In between issuing the extra paperwork on why they have dared to stop or search a suspect? The police are already working their socks off but are hampered by ineffectual court processes and a government supporting absurd liberal policies.
Messrs Blair and Blunkett, things will only change when you stop worrying about the spin and support the police with the powers they really need!
Adam Taylor, UK
This government's crackdown on crime will have the same effect as the crackdown on NHS waiting lists. Some crimes will be targeted at the expense of others to try to give the impression of an improvement. What is needed is a policy of "tough on crime, tough on criminals". Now haven't I heard something like that before? Take a look at Lord Woolff's report to release young killers and see how far the crackdown on crime will go.
Nick Brown, England
Brian Naylor, England
The answer to the problem is simple, give the police the necessary power to deal effectively with the problems that the criminal fraternity impose on society. Put victims first and treat them as first class citizens not third class and take away these social rights from any criminal who is found guilty beyond doubt. If criminals opt out of the basic laws and rules of our society but call for them to be re-invoked when they get caught, how can this be? Laws are only there for the people who wish to be governed by them. Society can only exist when there are laws that everybody abides by.
John Andrew, New Zealand
John Andrew, New Zealand has hit the nail on the head about the roots of the problem. Violence and civil disobediance is ingrained in our culture. With this in mind the fix needs to be a long term solution that addresses cultural issues, not just cleans up the mess for the cameras and massages statistics. More police on the beat is clearly required. The police need to better resourced, but also young people need to develop respect for the police. Parents need to play a crucial role in this as do schools. Too many children are being raised to see the police as the opposition rather than a service there for their benefit and protection. Of all the countries in the EU, you will never see such a '"them and us" attitude as in the UK.
I'm afraid John Andrews's remarks are absurd. The UK doesn't have an embedded culture of violence, but it has in recent years had a culture of pandering to criminality and youthful misdemeanours. This has been inflicted on the unfortunate English by a self-appointed left-wing elite who have made a lot of money for themselves out of it and a lot of misery for the rest of us.
Alan P, UK
As a former UK policeman, and nine-year resident of New York City, I can tell you that zero tolerance really works. If you haven't seen it first-hand, then don't fall for the left-wing claptrap of a police state. New York is a terrific place, where for the past few years, you can walk about at all hours in relative safety. I am certain that you are safer here in New York than you are in most British towns. Fixing the root problems I hear? It can't be done, and even if it could, it would take generations. The New York experience has worked brilliantly and is now the model for cities around the world.
A long-term crackdown is required, not an initiative lasting maybe six months that reduces crime temporarily. It's quite simple - more policemen on the streets = less chance of people getting away with it. It's the kind of maths that has escaped the leaders of the UK for years.
I strongly support the zero tolerance attitude and for more serious crime the "three strikes and you're out" policy. The police will do all that is asked of them, believe me they are as sick of the situation as we all are. But, support is needed from the courts, we need less of the do good, political correctness approach. I am against capital and corporal punishment, there are other ways of strict controls. Incidentally I think that advocating the return of a military national service is a bad idea. Why foist the problems of our society on to a voluntary and exceedingly professional military?
On one hand we have the promise of a crackdown on crime and on the other we have the promise of "weekend prisons" and offenders released early because of overcrowding in prisons. The honest citizen is as much a victim of the namby-pamby liberals as from the criminals themselves. This so-called crackdown on crime will fail whilst our society has no stomach for appropriate punishment, whilst the state and society are seen as being responsible for criminal behaviour rather than the individuals, and whilst the probability of being apprehended is so low. The failure of policing and the courts is more than adequately demonstrated by repeat offenders; how can it be that criminals are allowed to offend time and time again?
The total lack of discipline seen in many families today is the root of our problems. For a number of generations now children have been brought up with the idea that they can do what they want when they want, with no thought for anybody else and with no threat of smacking in the home and two fingers to their teachers at school. The liberal anti-smacking brigade have spawned total selfishness and a complete disregard to others. Add to that that the police turn a blind eye to basic offences like parking/cycling on the pavement, dropping litter or urinating in a public place. From small beginnings major social problems have grown, we are now reaping the rewards of a total lack of control and discipline. There is no respect for other people any more.
Deb, Manchester, England
I agree with zero tolerance - innocent citizens should not live in fear, just to make sure criminals are getting the full benefit of the doubt.
But Wendy makes an important point: While we are removing the rights from parents and schools to effectively discipline children, we are currently raising the fifteen years' time batch of criminals - children with no regard for rules, including the ones that make our lives safe. The proof is already around us.
A policeman walking his beat was a great deterrent when I was a teenager. Many times they would stop us and question what we were doing. Walking the beat, they got to know the families in the neighbourhood, and if we got into trouble, our parents would know about it before we got home.
Ray S, New York, NY US
Graham Lally, UK
The answer is an easy one: if someone gets caught mugging or any other of these so-called street crimes then they should be given a proper punishment. Not a slap on the wrists and sent on a nature excursion. Without proper deterrents street crime will continue to rise and rise.
When are people going to wake up? For goodness' sake, what depths do we have to descend to before something gets done without the namby-pamby liberal brigade whining on and trying to grind their imaginary axes? Please.
Richard Gregory, UK
Mr Blunkett's grandiose declaration of a crackdown on crime suggests that our home secretary's knowledge of British social history is, in some areas, wanting. Over a thousand years ago the Saxons "cracked down on crime" by forming a rudimentary policing system which was later modified and expanded by the newly arrived Normans. In 1742, in the face of a burgeoning crime wave, London's Bow Street runners were introduced in another attempt to crack down on crime, but criminals continued to have things pretty much their own way, until 1828 when the then Home Secretary, Robert Peel, announced - yep, you've guessed it - a crackdown on crime. Interestingly, Peel's solution, the founding of the Metropolitan Police, was received with mixed feelings: many people felt that Peel's more stringent methods of policing were an infringement of social and civil liberties. Does that ring a loud and very recent bell?
Moving on: five years ago, our then newly-elected government trumpeted its avowed intention to be "Tough on crime and tough on the causes of crime." Years pass while we wait with baited breath to see the result. Nothing happens - or to be more accurate, crime figures soar. Suddenly, the present home secretary lumbers into action and lugubriously proclaims - albeit with the pioneering air of one who has just discovered the secret of the universe - that he intends to crack down on crime. Oh come on Mr Blunkett, Mr Blair et al. Stop wasting time telling voters what you think they want to hear. Words mean nothing. JUST GET ON WITH IT!
I fell victim to London street muggers in the early 80s. So I know first-hand what victims have to go through in England on a daily basis.
In my view there are essentially three aspects of a solution to the problem. Firstly, a policy of zero-tolerance has to be enforced, meaning increased policing and longer jail-sentences. Secondly, hard-labour camps have to be set-up for convicted felons. There is no such thing as a free lunch, a culture of hard work has to be innoculated into convicted felons. Thirdly, social assistance, be it counselling, further training to find employment, or assistance in setting up an own business should be extended to convicted criminals.
As a black male in Shadwell, east London, I do not feel safe. We have a big Bangladeshi gang problem, a big black gang problem and a big white gang problem. A few visible police officers will stop people mugging - a rather simple solution which seems to have evaded our elected representatives who seem to have forgotten their job is to serve the people, not make knee-jerk reactions to win an election. Stop throwing money where it is not needed and throw it at the worst crime area in the UK.
Take a journey from Kent into central London by road and see the menacing gangs of youths hanging round on the streets, defacing the fences, walls and sides of people's houses with graffiti, scratching shop windows and bus windows. Or by rail, face gangs of youths trampling all over the seats and again vandalising with impunity.
And so it goes on and on, and seemingly a blind eye is turned. There are "more important" crimes to deal with, we're told. And so the youths, spoiling for attention, now turn to mugging and other street crime. We shouldn't be surprised. We should've started tackling youth crime some years ago. At least we seem to be starting now. As David Blunkett has said recently, there must be no "untouchables". People who deliberately violate the law must expect to be caught and pay the price.
Rod Garr, US (ex-Brit)
I remember, back in the 1970s, being warned about walking down Brick Lane in London and wondering why this situation was tolerated by the authorities! Well, it may have taken 30 years to address the problem, but better late than never, I guess!
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