{{Alright, so, no more throat stage. *poof*<br/><br/>As for the other change: I agree that letting preds take 20 would be overkill. I was mistaken when I said: "for prodigious preds, the only hope would be a natural 20." As was pointed out, such would also be the case for prey of equal strength to the pred (or two preds of equal strength). And that doesn't seem quite right.<br/><br/>Lowering it to 15 is a good compromise. The pred is essentially taking 10 with a +5 inherent bonus. That gives an equal-strength prey a 25% chance of escape, which is low but not hopeless.}}<br/><br/><br/>{{With these changes, I believe that vore will be balanced with other forms of fighting. Swallowing a foe removes them from the combat and puts them into a "super pin" where they take continuous damage. This is a very powerful combat maneuver. (compare to the normal pin maneuver which only immobilizes the target for one round) The reasons it isn't overpowered are: it requires the pred to buy several feats, expose itself to AoOs by starting grapples, make 3+ successful rolls before dealing any damage, and become a glaring target for all of the prey's allies. These are significant drawbacks.<br/><br/>Geno, Heshaar and Rihyan can doom foes by swallowing them, but this is in line with the power that an ECL 10 character ought to have. With just one full attack action, a weapon-master like Sashi can dish out a tremendous amount of immediate destruction. A spell-caster can turn the tide of battle with a single standard action. Devourers, in contrast, need many rounds to accomplish their goal. What vore lacks in speed, it makes up for with potency.<br/><br/>Look at it this way: if I made a villain with Geno's or Rihyan's exact stats and it managed to swallow Sen, there is a good chance that the goblin would be unable to escape and would die. But, just the same, if I made a villain with Sashi's stats and it made full attack actions against the goblin, there is an equally good--probably even higher--chance that poor Sen would end up meeting Nahrung. Those are two different types of danger, but the magnitude of risk is about the same in either case. An ECL 10 character of any class is a dangerous adversary.}}<br/><br/><br/>{{On the topic of interior AC, I agree that it is too low. My original plan was that preds would take advantage of the Strong Stomach feat, which can be purchased multiple times and grants +3 to stomach AC. But, admittedly, this is a rather inelegant solution; few characters actually have spare slots to spend on the feat.<br/><br/>So let's give all characters an +5 inherent bonus to stomach AC, similar to the +5 inherent bonus they have when resisting stomach escape. When combined with the -4 grappling penalty to attacks that prey already have while in the stomach, this bonus will make a cutting escape difficult even when the pred has no natural armor or vore feats.}}<br/><br/><br/>{{On the topic of the Devourer class: This class has a +3/4 Base Attack Bonus only because it originally had a +(1/2 level) bonus to vore. Since I later scrapped that bonus, there really is no reason anymore for them not to have the BAB of fighters, barbarians, paladins and other melee tanks. So, starting now, the Devourer has +1/+1 BAB.<br/><br/>I've decided to scrap the Satiation ability. It would work better as a feat or a spell, not a class ability. To replace it, Devourers now have a bonus to their interior AC equal to one half of their level, rounded up. "Interior AC" applies to attacks by ingested or swallowed prey.}}<br/><br/><br/>{{<span style="text-decoration: underline">Summary of System Changes:</span><br/>*No more throat stage<br/>*escaping a stomach is DC 15+pred's vore bonus<br/>*Stomach AC is 15+natural armor<br/>*Devourers lose Satiation, gain +1/+1 BAB and +(1/2 level) bonus to interior AC}}<br/><br/><br/><br/><br/><br/><<Round 7: coming soon>>