comment: >
  
  Nature is otters holding hand and wolves bears tearing into antelope. You can still love animals while acknowledging that they’re dangerous.
context: Oh I can enjoy viewing animals from a distance but I know how brutal they can be. I think a lot of people who claim to be animal lovers are more pet lovers. >
  
  Very true. I’m an animal lover. Whenever I say that, people say “I love animals too!” and I’ll ask what their favourite animal is and they’ll say “dog” or something lol. They’re just pet lovers and think that that’s what I mean when it’s not. I’ve never had a pet. I love all animals. Cat or anteater, I’ll treat you with the same love. >
  
  Cats are pretty vicious if you are any smaller animal. Even dogs can be. When I was a kid my hamster escaped. My mom found only the head a few days later. She didn't tell me until I was older, but the only other animal in the house was my miniature dachshund. >
  
  Op thinks people don't know bears eat. >
  
  They might know that, but I bet they dont know Dolphins use severed fish heads to masturbate.... >
  
  Wut did God mean by this... >
  
  Dolphins are evil, man >
  
  Only if intelligence is evil. We do far worse because we can AND we know better... >
  
  I would say that humans are pretty evil by nature. its because we are making a consious desicision when we hurt others while most animals act more on instinct. >
  
  Yes but we also do charity work and care for the sick. Many people spend their lives to help or try and help others. With our collective efforts, with our team work and family care we have built amazing monuments and created amazing arts and sciences and everythibg else!
  Before man is a warrior he is a child. He is kept alive by the compassion of others. He is fed, washed and clothed by this compassion. Compassion therefore is human nature, not violence. Paraphrased the Dalai Lama. >
  
  I don't think I will take the word of a guy who claims his wisdom from reincarnation. >
  
  Okay, so... You deny that someone washed and fed and clothed you as a child?
  Before a warrior is a man he is a child.
  It takes a community to build and do literally everything humans have ever done. From medicine to sky scrapers everything is a collective effort. The community that supports any one individual is much larger than the minority of people who participate in violence. Less than 10% of people in most democracies will voluntarily enlist in armed forces. This force is much larger in our world than violence.
  Violence is simply more shocking and makes for good entertainment. It is actually rather rare. Who we are is monkies with strong community otherwise we would never get anything done.
  Even an army man, a soldier life depends on bakers and clothiers. No man is an island. >
  
  I think you can love animals and understand the brutality of nature at the same time. But I get where you’re coming from — whenever people talk about how beautiful nature is (which it certainly can be), they are certainly hyper-focusing on the positive. A lot of unimaginable, constant brutality out there. >
  
  
  I think you can love animals and understand the brutality of nature at the same time
  
  Tbf OP isn't saying you can't, rather that most don't >
  
  When someone says otters are cute for holding hands I like to point out that they also rape baby seals to death >
  
  So do humans, whats ur point? >
  
  Generally, we want to ignore where our food comes from because we've deviated from natural evolution by using our brains to farm animals efficiently. Most people don't want to think that the meat on their dinner plate was murdered by an intelligent predator (humans). The only difference between us and an animal is that we kill our food smarter and more efficiently... and even though there are humane methods for slaughter, the brutality in the cause of advancement and procreation is the same. >
  
  I’m not talking about humans killing for food. I’m talking about an alligator or a lion ripping an antelope apart. >
  
  Yes, exactly my point. Predators in nature rip animals apart for food... And humans instead can kill a pig with an air gun, mount the carcass on hooks and use industrialized blades to saw it in pieces in lieu of ripping it apart in the wild.
  Nature invented the concept, we've just improved upon it. That's just an example of one of the industry practices but it's not always humane... Just because we don't see the brutality doesn't mean that it doesn't exist. >
  
  You're exactly right.
  This phenomenon occurs because humans were just not made to ingest other animals as food in a way that animals are. Humans don't have claws and fangs  to rip animals apart with. They have to use implements to do this. 
  Humans GI tracts are not capable of ingesting fur the way animals do. And yes animals do eat some of the fur, feathers or scales while they are tearing into other animals. But doesn't bother a wild animal the way it would a human.
  Persons were designed with a higher level brain and opposable thumbs so they could design and make implements. 
  Some of us do want to believe that all creatures are equal and that People are not higher beings than any other animal. Most of us do not think that's the case. But some do. >
  
  You have not looked intot he laws I see. Legally a chicken can be kept in a 1x1x1 cage its whole life. Its the raising and mass production that lowers their quality of life. Not just the quick death. Most chickems kept to those standards (KFC famously) have their beaks and claws "surgically" removed so they don't self harm out of boredom or whatever mental illnesses chickens can have. Which is far more cruel than what a wild turkey deals with. >
  
  I mean, I disagree, some “live laugh love,” people might, but from my experience most outdoorsmen and nature enthusiasts 100% understand the brutality of nature. Personally, the absolute uncaring savagery of the animal world IS the reason I appreciate and love animals so much, specifically dogs. For over a thousand years these creatures have stood by us in the face of every natural danger, and we likely would have suffered far more without them. Now they may be a cute little lap ornament, but we owe them a lot. >
  
  Yeah I think this opinion is fair. I reckon a lot of people who tell you they love animals are probably thinking of fluffy cats and pandas. They're the kind of people who want the zookeepers to break up the gorilla fight.
  They're probably not thinking of those videos where the monitor lizard slowly rips out a deer's intestines, or crows pecking the eyes from baby lambs. But then again, if that's what you love about animals you're probably a little weird. 
  I think a lot of the animal lovers you're referring to do understand how brutal nature can be, but choose to focus on the cute fluffy side. That's the kind of animal lover I think I am anyway. >
  
  Please dont assume what others think and know. That is wildly unfair. >
  
  Bold of you to assume this. >
  
  I did not assume anything. The first paragraph of your comment is an assumption about who "we" are. Us plant eaters and animal lovers... But I have a lot going on in my head and it is bold to assume everyone is one way or another about just about anything. >
  
  You're reading too much into it. >
  
  Most people who claim they're love people/humans have no idea how brutal humans are >
  
  LMAO my thoughts exactly >
  
  So should I just stop loving my family because of how brutal humans can be? >
  
  Did I ever say in my post you shouldn’t love or can’t love animals? I literally nature is beautiful and you should respect it. I’m saying people who claim to love animals don’t know how brutal nature is and often times these people are pet lovers. Not animal lovers. They don’t love rattlesnacks or sharks or alligators or cockroaches. >
  
  I love animals and nature, and i am aware of the dangers/nature of nature(lol) I simply find it interesting. >
  
  It seems that you are the one who realized this recently and you think we were like you, we all knew this from the beginning >
  
  I need you to accept that people can both understand the danger in animals and still find them cute.
  Can you do that for me? >
  
  Can versus do. They can be that but they’re often not. >
  
  You don't know people's minds.  You don't get to make that claim for others. >
  
  I'm not allowed to like puppies because bears in the wild eat antelopes? >
  
  the post is moreso saying that a lot of people dont really understand the brutality of nature and mostly just think about it from a pets pespective. >
  
  And people who talk about the brutality of nature have little to no education in the topic. The tooth and shell theory has been dead since the 50's. Mutualistic relations are far more common in nature. >
  
  Imo nature is beautiful because of its balance, animals get killed by other animals while others make families and form bonds, nature is everything in its purest form and we should respect both sides of it. >
  
  Yes but mutualism is the main driver of evolution since the KT event. Flowering plants, bees and fungi that interract with roots have been the most successful in terms of evolution in this period. Not predation. >
  
  What mutualism are you talking about? Spiders hunt insects and dissolve their preys from the inside out. Venus fly traps literally dissolve their preys alive. Praying mantis eat their mates and rip their heads off. Lions and tigers look for the sick and weak prey. The list goes on and on. Where is the mutualism. I don’t hear any biologists denying survival of the fittest >
  
  Fittest does not mean gore my friend. It means that which is better suited for the environment. Sparrows are "equally evolved" as hawks as both survive and thrive. One could reasonably say sparrows ar emore successful as they have larger numbers and much larger genetic diversity.
  Bees and flowers are a mutualism that is responsable for 80% of our foods, foods grown and evolved to live along side us. Flowing plants are easily the most diverse and successful group of organisms.
  Fungi have relations with plants that "trade" soil nutrients for sugars and vitamins. Popularized the term "wood wide web"
  Plants often use phermones to attract allies to do work for them. From soil life to wasps. Plants often attract predators this way to prevent being overrun by aphids.
  Ants "farm" a fungus that breaks down the foods they bring back to their nests they don't actually eat much else (they do like sugar tho).
  The plants we grow for agriculture exist with us in a mutualistic relationship. We keep them alive and propagate them and they sustain us. You know... Like all fruit in the wild. Fruit is a method of spreading seeds in a mutualistic way. 
  Your gut bacteria are responsable for the majority of your digestion. It is also how some animals can digest insoluble fiber.
  Birds often form relations with larger aninals and perform "cleaning services". There are even some fish eho play that role in the rivers of the amazon. The fish from ahark tale is a fun rendition of that kind of fish.
  Lichen is a symbiotic relationship between a fungus and an algae. Any lichen is actually multiple organisms living in one structure.
  Sponges are just collections of single celled life. They are not actually made of organs or tissues.
  Corals often have relationships with fish (remember finding nemo?).
  Moss rarely grows without a fungus anywhere that is not directly next to a stream. Probably because it has "no true roots".
  I could go on all day. >
  
  Well yeah because most people.care far more about another human, especially.children than chickens >
  
  Yes, hence they are not "animal lovers". >
  
  You can love people and animals.... >
  
  Wut? Yeah of course you can. Would you concider putting a living being through that machine as 'loving them'? >
  
  Loving something doesnt mean you love all things of that category. Someone slaughtering chickens may not have much regard for them but that doesnt mean that person doesnt have say a dog that they love very much. >
  
  Then you're not an 'animal lover' are you? You're a 'dog lover'.
  But most likely that person is not even a 'dog lover'. Most likely he only loves that dog because he has a personal connection with it. Making the 'animal lover' claim completely irrelevant. >
  
  Dogs are animals. Like ive said you can love an animal, it doesnt mean you love them all. I love my family, my sons, my partner, some of.my friends. There all animals. Do i love the guy next door? No i dont. But i love other people, so i should love him yeah? Anyone that says they love all animals is full of shit. You know why? Because WE are animals. You love the pedophile thats been raping kids? Doubt it. >
  
  Saying you love all animals except that one specific rapist? Yeah, I'd say you're still an animal lover. Saying you love all animals except all chickens? No, I'd say you're not an animal lover.
  Hitler thought pretty highly of specific races of humanity while trying to exterminate others. I wouldn't directly call him a 'lover of humanity'. >
  
  Thats not all.then is.it? Ok then let me rephrase. You love all animals. You love the human animals that commit rape, murder, genocide? You cannot say you love all animals then cherry pick. Thats why i said you can proccess chickens for a living and still love your dog for example. 
  In regards to Hitler i think youll find is his own warped way of viewing the world he loved humanity very much. >
  
  You don't think that cat lovers understand how brutal they can be. I have seen what they do to mice just because of their hunting instinct not for food or survival. I still love them.
  Human beings eat meat regularly. That is brutal too. We still love humans. I would say most people are intelligent enough to understand the brutality of animal nature but still love their pets.
  Your post is just patronising. Just because people don't want to think about how brutal nature is doesn't mean they don't understand it. >
  
  We love humans? >
  
  Well I love my husband, parents, sisters and friends. >
  
  Why friend shaped if not friend? >
  
  Dont pet the bear! >
  
  some pretty hardcore retardation in this post NGL  
  pretty sure OP has just learnt about these things today, thanks for sharing mate but most people actually do understand 'damn nature you scary' and it has absolubtly no relvance to anything else in your post.....noone out here thinking the world is eutopia..... > >
  
  I love animals, why they are so brutal is also why I love them. I used to love nature documentaries and watching a predator catch its prey as a kid. >
  
  i dont see the point... animal lovers just think life is precious, and animals gotta do what they gotta do, they dont think bears are running on honey nuts and berries, they know. Its just we humans have a choice and concious of how too treat animals (At least in countries that are well off). They like too embrace the good side, imagine everytime an american talks about how proud he is of his country you, judge him because they also dropped the sun on asia twice... no one has a "beautified" sense for nature, they just embrace what they like... >
  
  Beara only really hunt in the spring and fall in my country. Most of the year they do only eat nuts and berries, more because they are lazy than not. When its time to put on fattho they are dangerous af. Also if you see one early spring or mid winter they are hungry and dgaf about you. >
  
  Most people who say they live animals just love pets lol
  Hence why they still eat animals lol >
  
  This makes me think of people who say things like "I wish I could go to that zoo, open up all of those cages and free those poor animals".
  Apparently they missed the nature show that showed... how brutal nature is. >
  
  There's a zoo in Germany where a wild buzzard snuck into a vulture aviary and refused to leave. They kept capturing and releasing it but it always came back. >
  
  I feel like this isn't an opinion, it's just two separate thoughts that don't have anything to do with each other.
  I'm an animal lover, and I'm also a fisherman and hunter. People can love nature and animals and not want to be constantly exposed to the brutality of it all. >
  
  The stupid people are the ones that try to ‘pet’ dangerous animals in the wild thinking nothing will happen to them or others who raise a wild animal from birth thinking that animal will never turn on them . Most people can appreciate the beauty of such animals understanding the danger >
  
  That I can agree with. Wild animals are wild! Im not sure this is most people tho. >
  
  You don't think an animal's natural, simple, instinctual way of life is beautiful?  I always thought it'd be mentally liberating to be an animal.
  Yes nature is brutal.  So are slaughterhouses.  Animals eat animals.  Us included.  That is the way of life. >
  
  Ive heard outdoorsmen and huntsmen say similar things. Its tranquility through simplicity. I only go mushroom hunting so I wouldn'tknow. >
  
  Can we please stop with posts that are phrased like this? It’s literally not an opinion. An opinion is something like “I like x more than y” not “I think most people are blank”. OP doesn’t know most people who claim they’re animal lovers. Not even close. This is a purely anecdotal rant based on highly limited experiences >
  
  They have this notion of animal kingdom like a Disney movie, I allways laugh when they use words like rape when referring to animals being inseminated, like they actually believe that animals are capable of giving conscent, or that they even have this concept? Did this people ever seen cats in heat? I did and if that shit isn't gang rape it seems like it a lot, there is no conscent between animals, I'm sorry to burst the bubble but is a fact. >
  
  Do we? Do we really? Please do go on about what "we" think. >
  
  Dude you need to.chill >
  
  Zero chill 24/7 >
  
  r/natureismetal >
  
  Also that's my favourite part of being a zoo keeper... sheltered people... they say the darndest things.
  Comedy gold on a daily basis. >
  
  I’m in an interesting boat. I’m absolutely fascinated by insects, but have a phobia that won’t let me get anywhere near them lol >
  
  You can love animals and understand that some kill others for food.
  Also the bear was killing a moose at the wedding. >
  
  I like animals, and part of that is the brutality they have.
  You can like something, and it rips deer open with its claws, I still like bears tho.
  Dogs can be trained or abused into a lot of brutality, but it's a beloved pet in a massive amount of people's homes so I don't think behaviour on the negative end is what people care about till they get hurt. >
  
  People are still endlessly worse >
  
  I absolutely agree. >
  
  You didn't mention inter species rape and killing for fun >
  
  I know how dangerous they can be but I still think those killer creatures are beautiful animals. I can’t watch videos where lions and hyenas go at it. Knowing it happens is one thing but watching is another. >
  
  yeah you are vastly underestimating the amount of people who do, indeed, understand this. >
  
  I mean, do you count animal preservationist in on this as well? Because I know that there are people out there who have a beautified view of nature, but there are also plenty of animal lovers who know and work with wild life, they see the nitty and gritty and still love animals. >
  
  I think you’ve still got some learning and understanding to do when it comes to animals. >
  
  I don't understand what you're getting at. Genuinely confused here. Are you saying that because animals kill other animals, quite brutally by human standards, that animal lovers can't love them? Like, what? You think everyone who says they like animals think they survive on air? Maybe they have animal versions of grocery stores where they buy cruelty free items with their animal currency? 
  Can we not like camp fires because fires can burn down houses, kill thousands of acres of forest, and/or kill people in horrific ways? My dude, I have cats. Don't tell me I don't understand how cruel animals can be. I've been attacked by dogs. Don't tell me that I can't love my dogs now because of bad run ins.
  This is just fucking bizarre logic. Of course you're not going to see gore on instagram or other platforms. Not many places allow people to post such things. >
  
  Nope. I’m an animal lover and appreciate all aspects of nature (of course that’s required of me for the field I wish to pursue). Nature is brutal, sometimes even cruel, but I can appreciate it. I don’t really appreciate when that logic is applied to people and the mistreatment of our environment and animals “cause nature is bad.” >
  
  See, I call myself an animal lover for this reason, and I love nature because of it's duality. Nature is brutal and beautiful at the same time, and that is what makes it perfect and unique. What I especially like to think about is how much we as humans have retained our most brutal animal urges such as greed, lust, etc while also advacing.
  You are mistaking animal/nature lovers for hippies on instagram. I agree with you so much on that, and I mostly agree with your post. I just don't like the name you have used to classify this group of mentally challenged people.
  You have my upvote >
  
  So you cling to the exciting stuff on the discovery channel, thats nice. Its also a bias tho. Ive seen just as mamy videos of animals being bros. You know how news says if it bleed it leads? Yeah, lol.
  Did you know mutualism is a more common relationahip in nature than predator prey? Also there are more detrivores than herbivores and more herbivores than carnivores.
  There are also commensal or neutral relationahips between species, where neither harms the other nor directly benefits eachother.
  Nature is wild but Joe Rogan is wrong. People see what they want to see and that I agree. >
  
  Is this an opinion or just an assumption? >
  
  Yeah, I agree with that. Nature IS beautiful, but that doesn't mean it's safe. It's basically "don't judge a book by its cover" all over again >
  
  I think you mean puppie lovers and cat lovers, whose unrealistic and anthropocentric views are far from love. 
  True animal lovers do know how brutal nature is, and they respect nature as it is, no matter how cruel it is. That's life. Animals must be respected for what they need, not for what humans feel.