comment: >
  
  
  No need to start a war over this.
  
  Said no warpig ever.
context: Ryan McBeth did a great YouTube short on this today.
  If you are worried about "spy balloons" but you have TikTok on your phone, you need to give your head a shake. >
  
  I really don't think anyone fits that description tbh.
  ​
  Edit: Oh how wrong I was. >
  
  Lol my dad legit hates China and has TikTok. Uhhhh >
  
  Dad doesnt use TikTok but hates china. Why do all our dads hate China? I mean fuck the CCP but it seems our dads were hating china before it was cool >
  
  They were probably around to see stuff like Tiananmen Square being aired live. >
  
  Shitting on the Chinese Communist Party is not the same as shitting on Chinese people. It's important to not conflate these two things. In fact supporting the CCP is kind of antithetical to supporting Chinese people since there has been no institution in the world responsible for more death and suffering of the Chinese people than the CCP. >
  
  For sure.  The US government was better aligned with China's interests than the other powers of UK, Netherlands, and France around the 1900s up through WWII and helping to liberate them from the Japanese.  Some of that was driven by white Christian missionaries, but it was positive in China's favor nonetheless. Domestic sentiment was bad and racist, but diplomatically the US wasn't the biggest actor in the century of humiliation.  There was  also significant blame tossed around between US politicians about who was responsible for China going communist and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake. >
  
  
  and viewing it as a massive geopolitical mistake.
  
  well, they weren't wrong about that >
  
  Guess they forgot to tell the US their balloon drifted off course across the Pacific Ocean. Nothing suspicious about that, no sir. >
  
  If it really is a weather balloon, the answer is "Why bother?"
  It's one of those weird things where if it's a spy balloon, of course they wouldn't tell the US, and if it's a weather balloon of course they wouldn't tell the US, and for two completely different reasons. >
  
  Given that weather balloons are still commonly used by basically every country it seems to me that occams razor says its a weather balloon, not a spy balloon. >
  
  Yeah, but normally weather balloons don't drift across the ocean. They typically live a few hours and stay relatively in the same \~125 mile circle. This one drifted some 7,000 miles and based on recorded crossings of the ocean in a balloon, might have been in the air for a few days? >
  
  Also I don't think they are usually this large right? >
  
  A weather balloon has something about the size of a box of cereal with a few sensors and a transmitter in it. 
  This thing has something the size of a couple of school busses. >
  
  Most spy balloons are there to collect weather data...amongst other things >
  
  Weather is of great importance for military operations.
  The Nazis even setup secret weather stations in Greenland, Soviet Russia and Canada in order to collect weather readings. 
  Also, the the National Weather Service just freely hands out weather data. Any country can just pull that from the website. It's public. >
  
  The sun gives away periscopes more than radar. >
  
  What like it just hands them out for free? Damn. >
  
  Well, yeah, Radar has to fill out requisitions in accordance with Army regulations. >
  
  Plus he has to answer why a MASH unit would need periscopes in the first place. >
  
  I'm curious what a balloon can do that a satellite can't, in terms of military information gathering. >
  
  Linger over an area for significant periods of time. >
  
  some satellites can stay over the same area as long as they choose... they are called geostationary... they can be maneuvered to park over a chosen target for as short or long a time as their operators want >
  
  Yes and they very expensive, a balloon less so >
  
  yes... but expense is not really the issue at hand is it? the chinese and the russians have had satellites dedicated to spying on every square inch of the continent for decades and not once in my 54 years have i heard anyone call for shooting them down or taking any action at all to "protect" the country from them >
  
  CCP must not be aware of US citizen's unique distrust of weather balloons.
  Might as well have claimed it's actually a grassy knoll. >
  
  That was my first thought too, as hilarious as it is for them to go with the classic “it’s just a weather balloon” excuse, they have no idea that makes so many more people here believe it’s 10x more likely to be a spy balloon now. Guess they hadn’t gathered that intel yet. >
  
  I think my question is did it get to Montana through Canadian airspace or did it take us multiple states to recognize it was there? These things are generally easily detectable so how did it get 3 states in from the Pacific before anyone saw it? >
  
  It flew over the Aleutians, Alaska, then Canada. That area is pretty empty, and it was at a much higher altitude than planes normally fly. It was at about 63000 feet, which is near the service ceiling of an F-22. >
  
  Service ceiling is such a weird metric because that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate at. Above 50,000ft crew are required to wear pressure suits. I’m unsure the F-22 has such pressure suits, though I could be wrong.
  Downvotes: Give me proof that F-22s fly at 60,000ft on a regular basis and I'll eat a sock. Ya'll dumbasses can't fucking read. >
  
  Service ceiling is the highest altitude that a plane can operate. Not all planes. But that plane. Different planes have different ceilings. You can’t say “that’s not the highest altitude aircraft actually operate” as that’s an irrelevant statement because that’s not what a service ceiling is. 
  For example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000. >
  
  I never said it can’t operate at the service ceiling, I said it doesn’t actually fly at the service ceiling, as in usual, everyday flight. I thought that was clear from my wording but somehow people are straw-manning that I claimed it can’t go that high. The FA-18 and F-16 have a service ceiling in the 50s, F-15 in the 60s as well, but they typically operate in the 20s-30s, sometimes cruising in the 40s. This information is first-hand from pilots of those aircraft.
  
  For example a cessna 172 has a ceiling around 14,000. You aren’t getting it to 50,000.
  
  Another straw man. I never said the plane could go higher than its service ceiling. The 172 has a ceiling of 14,000ft. How often do you see them flying around at 14,000ft? Practically never. Hell, the engine would struggle to get air that high without a supercharger. 172s are usually hanging out below 5,000, occasionally cruising over 5,000 but rarely above 7,000\~8,000.
  My point, since no one has any reading comprehension here: "service ceiling" != average, daily operating altitude. Real life isn't a min-max video game where you push a plane to whatever maximum metric is listed in Wikipedia. Real life has much more context that you mouthbreathers can't wrap your smooth brains around. >
  
  Couple of things. Lots of people are saying it's a spy balloon because we use satellites for weather now. 
  Actually, there are 900 weather balloons that get sent up each day to collect data and build models. 92 of these are launched by the U.S. This daily occurrence is very coordinated for the most part. 
  So while it's a plausible excuse from China, the fact that they didn't happen to mention it sooner,  seems like a pretty big red flag to me.
  It's probably a spy thing. >
  
  Isn’t China claiming it was a private company that released it?  If that were the case, would the Chinese government even know it was off course? >
  
  A 100% private company in China? >
  
  That’s exactly what I would say if I had a spy balloon. >
  
  My question is, how did US know it’s from China? They didn’t bring it down. It also doesn’t have any Chinese character on it. >
  
  It says “Made in China” at the bottom lol >
  
  yeah, but our balloons say "made in china" on them too, right? >
  
  If it's a civilian balloon yeah. >
  
  So nice of China to be concerned about our weather. >
  
  I’d think this explanation would be more plausible if they warned us in advance that it drifted off course. >
  
  Probably never expected it to travel over the mainland USA, and with tensions as they are now they most likely didn’t want to lose face. Like we have no idea if it is even powered right now, it could literally be nonfunctional and just floating by itself leaving the Chinese with no way to track it themselves. I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily, and there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t (it’s not even fast so you can’t even collect intel quickly, and whoever it is spying on will be forewarned about it). Not to mention how provocative sending a balloon directly into US airspace would be.
  Edit: Real glad people just downvote instead of actually responding with an argument >
  
  
  I just doubt that it’s an spy balloon at all simply because you can’t control where a balloon goes easily,
  
  
  
  Steering control can be done by change altitude
  
  
  If it's high enough it doesn't need ot be anywhere near as precise, steering wise, to get what it's looking for.
  
  
  
  there’s not much a balloon can do that a satellite can’t
  
  It can provide persistent coverage over a location.  The reason why the US has routine P-8 and U-2 flights off the coast of China is to provide persistent coverage satellites cannot. >
  
  
  Steering control can be done by change altitude
  
  Interesting - how does one go about planning such a trip? >
  
  I mean, you can use other balloons who may be transmitting data, expected patterns, or even other public weather information.
  Remember they aren't looking to land these things in airstrips, the higher you are the greater field of view and some of these are higher than U-2s. >
  
  Well now we know they aren't trying to learn anything. >
  
  For anyone who is interested, China's government has a long military/civilian fusion program where everything in the civilian sphere is to be modify for military use. >
  
  Looks like they just shot one down over Montana. >
  
  @realnewsnobullshit on Instagram about 10 minutes ago. Nothing yet confirmed >
  
  My attitude towards this statement is the same as what I feel when I hear about random Americans arrested while "vacationing" in North Korea. Oh sure, you don't work for the CIA...you just happen to vacationing in North Korea! In the winter!!!
  In any case, both sides know what's what. No need to start a war over this.