>

Biden needs to get in front of this and say "yes, some documents were found in an old office. An independent investigation should take place to find out exactly what happened. I and my staff will fully cooperate to get the bottom of this. It's the right of the American people to know the truth. Nobody is above the law."
10 documents Biden's lawyers notified DOJ and the National Archive of and handed over. Verses 325 documents DOJ and the National Archive had to notify Trump's lawyers of and then Trump refused to return.
The only similarity here is that documents are involved. The amount of documents, cooperation with DOJ & Archive, and return of the documents is all different. >

From when he was VP. That means he’s had the documents for a decade. >

Having documents isn't the crime Trump is accused of. Refusing to return documents and obstructing efforts to retrieve documents is the crime Trump is accused of. >

I’m not talking about trump. I’m talking about Biden. How do you forget for a decade that you have classified documents just lying around? >

I know. My point is having the documents isn't a crime. There is no double standard here. Had Trump turned his documents over when the National Archive asked there wouldn't have been a raid at Mar-a-logo. >

Weird cause it would def be a crime if I brought my work home and there was big red letters saying secret on top >

“Makes available to an unauthorized person” bringing home classified documents is for sure in that category, you think hunter Biden has a TS clearance? >

I can even understand that Trump had documents.
It's the fact that he was so hellbent on not giving them back, wasn't cooperative, and lied about having them >

Let's not even give that much lee way here. I, personally, cannot understand why Trump had nuclear and CIA secrets at his private residence that had already had multiple security incidents during his presidency.
But who are we kidding. This is it. It's being talked about. Diversion successful I suppose. >

Watch the Republicans impeach Biden over this. Of course it won’t work but they’ll do it anyway. >

They will impeach him over the wrong ice cream choice. >

That's only an impeachable offense if the ice cream flavor happens to be seafood. >

Or mint chocolate chip. 
“I’m sorry Mr president that isn’t ice cream, it’s toothpaste.” >

Ok that’s offensive. >

Mint chocolate chip is objectively bad ice cream. It tastes like toothpaste. I mean if you like it we can still be friends but I think it’s pretty gross lol. >

That’s a controversial answer and I wish you luck on your future endeavors… >

If I have any! I didn’t realize this was such a hot button issue the internet is shredding me over it! 😆 >

Things like facts don't matter in MAGA world.
They still believe Obama stole 33,000 documents because they were moved to his Presidential Library. >

This is correct and mind you if they found 1 doc we would be having the same 24/7 Fox news cycle. >

Hilary had 6 whole emails SENT To (not from) her email server that potentially had classified markers.  They still talk about it. >

Yeah I know and they also shift positions on the topic when applied to Trump.
They have no position.  They have goals.  It is pointless to discuss the nuances because they are not interested.  It is a war to them and they operate that way. >

There is zero reason to think that any conservative is going to even acknowledge this fact let alone care even if they could absorb it into their demented perception of reality. >

Correct. Facts, details, nuance, etc. do not matter even a little bit. >

Biden’s team immediately contacted the National Archives and returned those documents. Trump was still arguing he had every right to possess said documents after he was no longer in office. Big difference. >

I've already seen a ton of MAGA dorks on twitter spewing shit about how "well, guess Trump is clear now" and other nonsense. It's absolutely amazing how little actual facts and truth means to those people. They're denser than a damn black hole. >

Reactionaries can only react. >

Sure there is.  Anyone with a functioning brain sees the difference.  Then there's Fox.  And republicans.  They won't see it that way.  And they will spend vast amounts of money convincing Americans that the two are the same.  Ugh. >

They’re reeeeing non stop at /r/conservative about this >

And banning anyone who disagrees with their narrative - even conservatives. It’s not about the facts, it’s not about the law. It’s about fueling the rage machine that empowers them. >

You are banned from /r/conservative >

I was banned years ago for quoting a Trump tweet in response to someone saying, ‘He never said that!’ r/conservative tolerates no inconvenient truths. >

You are double banned from /r/conservative. Keep going and they’ll make it a TRIPLE BAN 😡 >

Yeah, Biden's lawyers immediately contacted the proper channels and returned it.  Trump lied and stonewalled. >


There's a key difference between the classified documents found at a former Biden office and the ones Trump kept at Mar-a-Lago, national security expert says

"No there isn't," say people who don't read
Seriously, I looked at the comments section of the Fox News article reporting it and those folks were asking "well where was the FBI raid?" and "if Biden isn't charged then Trump shouldn't be charged." 
That Trump repeatedly refused official document requests and lied to the government about what he had doesn't seem to phase them. >

I just can't fucking stand how there ALWAYS seems to be similar shit that happens for Republicans to point to... Every goddamned thing a Republican does we find out later that a Democrat did too in some way. It's never as bad, but just the fact that we can never have a clear instance where someone was simply wrong and they were the only ones to do it. 
I'm so sick of the "both sides" b.s being validated in some way every day... >

How about this: both instances should be investigated thoroughly and fairly. Contents of the files, intentions on why they were kept, who had access to them, and level of cooperation with investigators should be taken into account. Let's not point fingers or both-sides this. They are individual cases and one doesn't excuse or condemn the other. >

This whole sub: excited and agreeing cheering >

I’m not really seeing that to be honest from this sub. >

A few documents found in a Washington, DC office doesn’t even compare to multiple boxes of of nuclear documents found at a Florida beach club in the hands of a guy who tried undermining Democracy and who’s now selling superhero cryptocurrency cards of himself. >

No shit. >

I swear these investigations into documents and laptops is just a smoke screen to try finding more of Hunter’s dick pics. >

Trump's being for sale, being the major difference. >

It doesn’t matter obviously. Nothing ever happened to Trump, despite all of this shit being found in his possession. I still can’t believe nothing ever happened of that. Just an embarrassment >

It’s literally still in court these things take time >

Do republicans/FoX news/NewsMAXX/OANN care? 
Nope. They will just read classified documents found. >

Biden- mistake on a few documents, dumb mistake but owned up to and no threat
Trump massive theft  attempt to hide repeated lies massive nat sec risk criminal action  against America treason  and multiple felonies 
Lock him up 
End of story >

Nuance isn’t something Republicans understand. >

Heard a few people suggest this was leaked by the DOJ to provide cover for Trump. Now begins the "whataboutism" and 'both-sidesism' and the Right screaming for Biden's head. >

I fucking hope so. >

They found them and turned them in immediately. >

The difference is intent. In one case, documents were discovered and immediately turned over to the appropriate authorities, and they'll investigate how that happened. In another case, a large amount of documents were purposely taken, for what reasons we can $peculate, and after many, many requests from the authorities they finally had a judge sign off on a search warrant and conducted a raid. Of course if your a pootin cockholster or a supporter of one, you'd be incapable of understanding the ~~fine nuance~~ obvious differences between the two cases. >

Several key differences actually.  The first one is that the documents were locked up, so nobody else could see them, unlike the ones at Mar a Lago which anyone could access (and Mar a Lago is full of spies).  The next major difference is that Biden immediately handed over the documents to the National Archives as soon as they were found, unlike Trump who lied about having the documents for a long time and refused to return them when requested.  Trump broke many laws, whereas Biden did not.  The third major difference is that Biden only had 10 documents, whereas Trump had thousands.  The fourth major difference is that Biden likely left those documents there by accident and forgot about them.  Trump knowingly took thousands of documents illegally with the intent to sell them.
Of course, none of these facts will get in the way of Republicans being outraged about this and saying it's worse than what Trump did.  Republicans will lie, as is tradition. >

Of course there is… but the GOP base doesn’t care about nuance and facts and will equate the two as identical and equal. And it will be broadcasted by Hannity et al. >

One turned them in and opened an investigation immediately. 
The other is Trump. >

The key difference here is that it is actually plausible that Biden read the documents. There's no way in hell Trump had th3 capacity to understand anything in any formal document. >

I've heard that Biden didn't break the Espionage Act because the classified documents were returned immediately... 
but you guys can correct me. >

I've heard that Biden didn't do anything wrong because he declassified everything on day one with his President mind trick. 
/s >

I actually had people responding like as if they had a real comeback to this.
"Uhh no Biden can't just declassify documents with his mind, stupid blue cult!"
Like boy did your president not use the same talking point? >

I saw once where someone clearly joked that Obama had declassified with his mind, and the response was to ask for a source. Looking them up, they weren't kidding.
Yeesh. >

Biden declassified them with his Jedi mind trick anyway. >

I assume these were documents that Obama declassified with his mind before he left office, which were then planted by the FBI. >

I think ultimately the only crime here is Biden/his team never returned the documents once his VP term ended. So just have the investigation and dish out appropriate punishment.
Which is probably going to go like this:
“Hey so you kept this docs”
“Yes that’s our bad we just forgot about them. We didn’t intend to keep them”
“And you handed them over immediately when you found them?”
“Yes, again our bad sorry about that”
“Ok well you didn’t really mean to steal them, so we will recommend the lowest punishment”
“Which is?”
“Eh probably a small fine or something”
It’s a world of difference from what trump did. >

Part of me thinks the Biden admin is doing this on purpose to give DOJ excuse not to indict trump. They are trying to avoid more civil unrest. >

I agree, seems like a very tour of jail free card for the orange bastard. Convenient as hell. >

Of course the right may try to make something of this but they'll tread carefully if they have any sense. The dumbest among them will yell the loudest. That's their function >

I thought presidents could psychically declassify >

That difference won't matter to the extremists. I'm so sick of this game >

Oh right, we are on to the comparing phase >

Anything for daddy Joe >

My question - how lax is the security of classified documents at the Whitehouse? When I was in the Air Force, we had a strict chain of custody when using classified documents. Seems like the Whitehouse has a policy of “ bring them back if you feel like it. >

Apples to doughnuts. One lied about having them and needed to be raided. The other found them and notified the correct folks to properly return them. Of course MAGA folk won’t see the difference here, to them it’s okay for Trump to do this but it’s bad for Biden. >

Tell you what. Let's give each man one lashing for each document lost. Biden will have to sleep on his side for a while. Trump will die.
Oh well. >

Not only that, but when they were discovered it was self reported, they were not left laying around where they could be seen by anyone and used as trophies. But then again, Biden never took the step of declassifying them with his mind! >

looks like Buttigieg vs DeSantis 2024 >

I suppose it’s too much to hope that the 22% of Americans afflicted with uncontrollable “whataboutism” understand the meaning of “mens rea” >

Doesn’t matter. This will now be a talking point for the next two years. >

So basically Biden's team reported they had the documents and sent them back without a fuss. Meanwhile trump had documents, tried to lie about having the documents, and then fought sending them back. 
Also idk how much this matters but did Biden retain his privileges to see classified material after leaving office? I know presidents normally do (except for trump) but do VPs get to stay in the loop as well? That could be a key difference as trump did not have the authority to view those documents after leaving office and having his security clearance taken once he was no longer president. Biden may have retained his clearance which makes the case a little different in that regard as well. >

WTF there's only 1 similarity... classified documents discovered. Literally everything else is different!
Trump:

had over 300 classified and Top Secret documents
removed them after office
stored them in a pool house at a private club
lied about them
apparently copied and distributed some of them
refused to turn them over multiple times
lied again about the raid

Biden:

had 10 pages
stored at his U Penn office in DC
reported them as soon as they were discovered
handed them over the very next day without requiring an official request, subpoena, or FBI raid >

Ah, there's many differences. >

The differences don't matter to the maga crowd, the details don't matter. They already think this is worse than what happened with Trump. >

There is no difference in the documents. There is a difference in scale, intent, and response. And those are the factors that define Trump’s trouble. 
He had plenty of opportunities to simply correct the issue without legal trouble. He chose not to. Pretending the simple existence of documents itself is the problem is just a way to try to whitewash Trump’s actions. >

And Merrick Garland didn't waste a second. >

I hate how Democrats can never play the optics. >

Biden needs to get in front of this and say "yes, some documents were found in an old office. An independent investigation should take place to find out exactly what happened. I and my staff will fully cooperate to get the bottom of this. It's the right of the American people to know the truth. Nobody is above the law." >

He doesn't really need to do anything, it's been taken care of already. >

His aren’t for sale unlike the ones in Florida.  And New Jersey and where else they’ve been stashed. >

Which is? TLDR please >

Biden handed the documents over to the Archives and submitted them to the DoJ immediately when they were discovered. Trump lied about having the documents. Refused to return them. Lied about having returned them all. Demanded them all back. And continued to lie about their contents or importance. Then the GOP demanded that the DoJ be dissolved, as well as any other agency who helped them. Demanded Biden and the DoJ head be impeached. >

Yeah no I definitely remember the Trump fiasco. I just hadn't heard of Biden having classified documents so yeah thank you. >

Also please note that Biden's documents were found in a locked office that he used while Vice President, and not in an open area of his private residence, as was the case with Trump. >

I bet the conservative house will still try to impeach him for it.
And yeah I thought the whole idea was Trump blatantly displayed illegal documents so biden should be fine if he kept them safe >

Another difference.  Biden has security clearance.  Trump does not. >

There is also a key similarity, that both men had classified documents in their private possession that they were not supposed to have. Until there is an investigation and the findings made public, there is no reason to give anyone a pass. >

It's a good thing an investigation is currently underway. >

While it is important that Biden cooperated as soon as his attorneys found the docs, they isn’t ALL-important.
We don’t yet know how those docs got to his personal office. Did he take th knowingly and willfully? If so, he committed exactly the kind of violation for which (cleared people like me) a prosecution  might occur.
Or, was a junior staffer packing thst box and stuffed those docs there mistakenly? If so, that person is at fault.
Worse, so are other people and processes that allowed highly classified docs to make their way out of the White House and to Biden’s post-VP office, whether on purpose or by accident. 
Regardless, this is a serious and potentially criminal situation that should not be dismissed as “not as bad as Trump”. >

It is nowhere nearly as bad as Trump.  
It’s lesser in degree
There was no subpoena that was ignored, but the documents were returned immediately without being asked.  
There is no obstruction. >

Investigate now. No one gets a pass. They are SCI documents and should have never been there >

They are investigating now. The AG tasked a trump appointed US Attorney with the case. >


Don't they have some sort of check-out and check-in process at the very least?

Yes they do, and there may be a paper trail from Biden showing he went through the process, much like Obama did when he left office or he may not have. That will remain to be seen. These documents were found, not being requested by NARA. >

Were there any nude pics of the White House interns? >

bonk >

Based on the difference in severity, I think Biden should be allowed to step down, after Trump is locked up. >

Both sides are the same but Trump is funny >

Both situations are VERY BAD. PERIOD. >

Haha. No. One was very bad. The other was an oops that was quickly corrected when discovered. >

Two sides of the same coin >

Yeah biden leaving 10 documents in his office and immediately giving them back is the same as trump taking over 300 documents to his resort in Florida and refusing to give them back. Fucking idiot >

No mustard stains >

Why is this an issue? He's the president!  Trump was no longer the president. >

If the documents were from his time as vice president then he had them while he wasn’t president >

Well… the closet had them. He hadn’t been in that office for years. >

Ah yes. It was the closets fault >

The conservatives are currently having a meltdown over this and pretending there aren't massive differences. I like how they gloss over the fact that TFG and his lawyers lied in response to a subpoena for the documents. Which is why they had to go and forcibly seize the documents. >

Trump mentioned raiding the White House looking for classified documents… >

The best analogy I've used...it's like you're leaving your job and walk out with a few company pens and a notebook in your backpack, the company is unaware, then a while later you realize and call up the company to return them.
VS. raiding the supply closet on your last day and filling up your backpack, the company contacting you demanding the stolen supplies they know you took, you denying it and telling them to F-off, they plead and knock at your front door asking for them back again, but you now say they were your pens/notebooks/etc all along and before you left the office you made a mental thought transfer in your head to your ownership, then the police raid your home and find all the company supplies with the company name printed on the side of them, and then you go on a rant to encourage the world to attack your office because they're corrupt and Joe Biden has a pen. >

sure there is >

Yeah, but what about those documents do THEY not want you to know? LouderWithCrowder and Elon both told me that those documents PROVE beyond a shadow of a doubt that Biden is HALF LOBSTER. Why is nobody talking about this?! Why are we getting cancelled for talking about it?! >

Not hearing too many people in here suggest that we punish everyone that mishandles classified information, whether intentionally or accidentally.  It’s kind of a prerequisite to obtaining a clearance that you agree to handle the documents properly and are subject to penalty (specific federal regs) upon mishandling. >

You know what the punishment is when its not intentional and not egregious? Clearance sanctions. Do you really think they can or should sanction the sitting president? >

My takeaway here is all media decided to not only wait until after midterms but also wait until the House Speaker was elected to post this scandal of which the documents were found November 2, 2022.
I bet dollars to donuts we would not see this if the Democratic Speaker was elected simply because all current media is being undermined by right-wing/far right-wing politics. >

Why would news outlets sit on this story for months? They reported it the moment they heard about it. >

Why would you waste your ammo? >

There is one key (d)ifference. >

You're a mo(r)on I see >

Yeah the difference is the double standard. >

Or...the fact that Biden didn't have top secret documents that can only be read in a SCIF. >

“Exactly what you’re supposed to” except for the part where they were taken in the first place. >

It won't matter. Garland is going to call it a wash and shut down Smith. >

My stance is the same as it was this entire time: mistakes happen. If there was no ill intent and no harm caused then it’s not a big deal.
I am neither a Biden or Trump supporter, but neither of these cases are a big deal.
I’d like to see 1/100 the energy that’s been expended on these documents directed towards looking at how both men’s family members are profiting off the presidency. >

I'd rather see all that energy funneled into prosecuting coup participants and the rest of the seditionists.
I don't particularly like a presidents family grifting, regardless of party.  But a group of traitors hell bent on overthrowing the government and democracy are a WHOLE lot more important.
Edit:  and the ringleader is walking around a free man after 2+ years, plus planning to run for president again so we can have coup 2.0. >

Do you acknowledge that Hunter Biden is profiting off of his fathers position?
That his positions on the board of Ukrainian and Chinese state connected companies has an effect on US foreign policy? >

Whether he is or not doesn't matter, he's not in an official government position. >

You’re serious?
Politicians family members can use their family members’ status to enrich themselves? That’s ok? >

Whether or not it's okay, it's a whole lot different than "special white house advisor" Ivanka using the position she wasn't qualified for to gain favorable business deals in foreign countries. You and I were paying her to grift.
Hunter is getting paid by whoever his employer is, not you and me. Joe needs to take care to follow ethics guidance and avoid impropriety with anything Hunter is involved with, but Hunter getting rich grifting isn't inherently my problem as long as he's not a government agent and Joe avoids special favors to whoever helps out his son.
Ivanka and Jared were official government agents, which was already a problem, and then they grifted, which was an extra problem because it was done on our dime. >

I’m not a trump supporter and I agree that he is corrupt and should be punished. I supported both impeachments, especially January 6th.
But I’m trying to talk about Joe Biden, the current President. Please stop making everything about Trump. That lowers everyone’s standards. >

Okay. Hunter saying, "give me money and I'll tell my dad you're a good dude" does breach some ethics guidelines. But that's Hunter, a private citizen, breaching the guidelines. Not a government employee. As long as Joe isn't seen acting obviously biased towards anybody that Hunter has business with, it affects me zero, so I don't give a shit. Just like I didn't give a shit about Tiffany Trump, or Mary Trump, or Chelsea Clinton any of the others who probably all got some sweet book deals and favorable interviews and prioritized admissions to universities and societies because of their relationships. 
I do give a shit about Ivanka and Jared because I WAS PAYING THEM to grift. >

And to add that Jared wasn’t even cleared for security as per the secret service because the reality here is Jared is probably 10 times more dirty than Hunter. But the maga cult doesn’t care. They feel its equal if not worse for Hunter. On top of that its more than likely the orange stain sold said classified documents to Saudi Arabia and thats why jared received 2 billion dollars. And still, the maga cult doesn’t care. I will never understand their mindset. >

Hunter Biden would not get clearance >

This could be a problem if Democrats don't come out and condemn Biden like they did with Trump. Don't want to look like hypocrites. >

The way Biden handled it couldn't be more different than Trump. Saying Biden was wrong in having those would be good but also that him cooperating with the DoJ is good. >

Why do any government officials take classified documents anyway? It really jeopardizes national security. >

Honestly it could be any number of reasons. I worked for multiple companies and often took work home that the company didn't want getting into anyone's hands but employees and forgot I had them then realize years down the line they were in some paper pile in my house. Not a perfect comparison but just an example of how this shit happens. >

The difference is obvious. One crime was committed by the unspeakably awful and the other by the wonderfully righteous.
If only I could remember which was which... >

Is the difference that Biden can't be prosecuted because he's currently president? >

Is Biden actively fighting the request to return the documents,  like Trump
did?  ( Narrator:  No way in hell is biden doing illegal shit) >

And where were they "mishandled" in this case exactly?  
Imagine waking up bright and early just to hop on your burner account and immediately start shitposting misinformation. >

…Bidens are worse as Trump has had nothing happen?….
So confused by the back and forth by the media 😂 >

It's almost as if there are different media organizations with different standards and reporters...😜 >

I'm a little tired of doing this. Stop taking documents like this. >

There is zero evidence these were intentionally taken.  One packet of 10 documents was found in an old VP office.  They were discovered during a move.  The documents were handed over immediately.  Protocols were followed appropriately.
These sorts of things happen from time to time.  The only reason this is getting any attention is because of the real crimes TFG committed through lying and intentionally taking them.
Since you probably don't know much about how any of this works, you really don't need to be so exasperated over it. >

Anyone who is NOT a complete partisan should look to the law(s) at issue. What law has either supposedly violated and what are the elements? 
I suspect that neither turning them back over voluntarily nor the number of documents, is an element of the law but that remains to be seen. 
Explain your position in terms of the applicable Act or statute. 
Everything else seems like copium. >

The law is clear.  Trump is accused of lying about having taken documents and lying about having returned documents.
This was a packet of documents buried in a bunch of unclassified documents that, once found, was immediately turned over.  Record retention protocols were missed at some point for this one packet of documents that have been locked away for years.  It's standard procedure to determine how those documents missed the regular retention process.  An investigation will occur, they'll ask a couple of people, and that'll be that.  This is not the first time something like this has occurred.  It's under a much larger microscope though due to the egregious actions of 45. >

What law and where is “lying” listed as an element of the crime? I’m serious. I want to actually learn the real issue here. Are they both accused of violating the same law or are talking two different statutes/acts? >

Obstruction of justice?  Signed affidavits that there were no more documents then turned out no?
Biden is not accused of violating any crime.  Biden isn't accused of taking the documents.  
These are serious differences that are easily seen at a cursory glance. >

This is hilarious >

Rules for thee but not for me! >

He had them since he was VP over 6 years ago. He had no authority to declassify those documents. So yes. There is a little bit of a problem but democrats will do anything to compare it to trump. 
These were also stored at his “think tank”. Surprisingly. His think tank received MILLIONS for the CCP. 
Democrats will do anything to make it seem like Biden did a great thing by his lawyers reporting it “immediately”. Idk about you but “immediately” isn’t 6 years later. Weird >

Haha you’re trying so hard. They were forgotten in a closet. Stop acting. >

So classified documents “forgotten” in a closet. Seems legit. >

Yeah. It does. A small packet got forgotten and were in a box with a bunch of non classified documents. When discovered during a move, they were immediately returned according to protocol and through the proper procedures. That absolutely seems legit. >

Ah yes the key (D)ifferences >

Biden’s team immediately contacted the National Archives and returned those documents. Trump was still arguing he had every right to possess said documents after he was no longer in office. Big difference. >

How does saying “I’m sorry” make the crime ok? This is a delusional way to look at this issue. And this should not be simply compared to Trumps situation. “It’s not as bad as trumps scandal, so let’s brush it under the rug” >

We’ll for one, what Biden did is a security infraction not a crime. Him giving them back immediately once discovered lends to him not intentionally looking to harbor the material, unlike trump. >

Why is everything compared to Trump though >

Conservatives start up a false equivalence comparing an accidental security infraction to Trump's intentional crimes in a blatant attempt to muddy the waters and score political points.
People clarify that these two situations aren't comparable and demonstrate how ethical standards actually work when it comes to what Biden did as opposed to Trump.
u/Fragrant-Astronaut57:  "Why is everything compared to Trump though?" >

The commenter I replied to was the person to compare this to Trump initially. You can scroll up and look bud >

10 documents Biden's lawyers notified DOJ and the National Archive of and handed over. Verses 325 documents DOJ and the National Archive had to notify Trump's lawyers of and then Trump refused to return.
The only similarity here is that documents are involved. The amount of documents, cooperation with DOJ & Archive, and return of the documents is all different. >

I understand, but get ready for a bunch of “what about”. >

Of course, the Right will demand the two situations are treated equally. 
Anyone bothering to engage in this discussion needs to be clear about what crimes Trump is accused of. Having classified documents is a problem but not necessarily a crime. The criminal part of Trump's situation is that he refused to return the Documents. Trump's lawyers went so far as to sign official statements claiming the documents weren't in Trump's possession. >

I’m with you. Context for sure, but I’ve been in so many discussions where some just pick and choose sound bites. It’s impossible to have a discussion with some around facts, how things may be different.  I am just spent. >

Just repeat:
Having documents isn't the crime Trump is accused of. Refusing to return documents and obstructing efforts to retrieve documents is the crime Trump is accused of. >

And it is still unknown who Trump and his people shared them with or sold them to.  And who influenced, guided, or ordered them to keep and distribute the files.  And that's on top of "storing" them in a complete insecure location.
The hole blown in our national security and intelligence infrastructure will cost billions and decades to repair, but we can't talk about that, because, when it comes to intelligence operations, even talking about that will make the hole bigger.
Treason. Inarguably. >

I think there is reasonable doubt. My reasoning is trump is not the kind of guy to clean up and pack everything away! My God I don't think he's probably ever done a days work in his entire life. He's one of the wealthy elite and that kind of thing is far beneath someone of his status. Some flunky moving service with illegals who couldn't read? Probably secret service or security watching so they didn't steal shit. I love it biden did it now so it's ok lol >

Party Of Personal Responsibility(TM), everyone!
Among other, horrifying, ridiculousness. >

Things like facts don't matter in MAGA world.
They still believe Obama stole 33,000 documents because they were moved to his Presidential Library. >

This is correct and mind you if they found 1 doc we would be having the same 24/7 Fox news cycle. >

Hilary had 6 whole emails SENT To (not from) her email server that potentially had classified markers.  They still talk about it. >

Yeah I know and they also shift positions on the topic when applied to Trump.
They have no position.  They have goals.  It is pointless to discuss the nuances because they are not interested.  It is a war to them and they operate that way. >


They have no position.  They have goals.

That is a very good line >

Watch the Republicans impeach Biden over this. Of course it won’t work but they’ll do it anyway. >

They will impeach him over the wrong ice cream choice. >

Well obviously liking ice cream means you have dementia.
/s >

That joke reminded me of this. >

I totally forgot about that. It is a bit juvenile but hey I guess being the president has some perks. >

Of all the things Trump did  while in office, I don't begrudge him getting an extra scope of ice cream.  Although I do think the fact that he decided to essentially low-key brag about it was telling. >

I've already seen a ton of MAGA dorks on twitter spewing shit about how "well, guess Trump is clear now" and other nonsense. It's absolutely amazing how little facts and truth mean to those people. They're denser than a damn black hole. >

They have to still be putting lead in everything in deep red areas. Only explanation for their increasingly psycho behavior >

That and republican politicians attack on public schooling. They played the long game >

I can even understand that Trump had documents.
It's the fact that he was so hellbent on not giving them back, wasn't cooperative, and lied about having them >

Let's not even give that much lee way here. I, personally, cannot understand why Trump had nuclear and CIA secrets at his private residence that had already had multiple security incidents during his presidency.
But who are we kidding. This is it. It's being talked about. Diversion successful I suppose. >

Yeah, very true. 
Those cannot be brushed under the rug. They will of course, but they shouldn't be >

Yeah, Biden's lawyers immediately contacted the proper channels and returned it.  Trump lied and stonewalled. >

There is zero reason to think that any conservative is going to even acknowledge this fact let alone care even if they could absorb it into their demented perception of reality. >

Correct. Facts, details, nuance, etc. do not matter even a little bit. >

Not when George Santos invented gravity. >


There's a key difference between the classified documents found at a former Biden office and the ones Trump kept at Mar-a-Lago, national security expert says

"No there isn't," say people who don't read
Seriously, I looked at the comments section of the Fox News article reporting it and those folks were asking "well where was the FBI raid?" and "if Biden isn't charged then Trump shouldn't be charged." 
That Trump repeatedly refused official document requests and lied to the government about what he had doesn't seem to phase them. >

Truth and facts don’t matter to these people >

Indeed.
Heard Jordan Klepper interview a Trump supporter who believed Trump was still actually in charge of the US military.
Klepper asked him if that means Trump was responsible for the pullout of Afghanistan.
Dude hesitated and then said "no."
So he believes Trump runs the military but can't be blamed for the chaos of the military pullout of Afghanistan.
These people embrace cognitive dissonance. Internal contradiction and counterfactuality are their friends. >

If you can't tell the difference between accidentally leaving classified documents in an unused office from 2017 and willingly stealing classified documents then lying about it, you might be a Republican. >

Biden- mistake on a few documents, dumb mistake but owned up to and no threat
Trump massive theft  attempt to hide repeated lies massive nat sec risk criminal action  against America treason  and multiple felonies 
Lock him up 
End of story >

How about this: both instances should be investigated thoroughly and fairly. Contents of the files, intentions on why they were kept, who had access to them, and level of cooperation with investigators should be taken into account. Let's not point fingers or both-sides this. They are individual cases and one doesn't excuse or condemn the other. >

This whole sub: excited and agreeing cheering >

I’m not really seeing that to be honest from this sub. >

Probably because most people on this sub know that is already the status quo. Do you think that appropriate intelligence services are going to be informed of this and carry on as if nothing happened? 
They’ll investigate, context will be discovered, and nothing is likely to happen because Biden isn’t some shady asshole. Based on every GOP allegation of scandal anyone can remember this will turn out to be someone being willingly ignorant and obtuse about well established laws and procedures and in the end it will be overwhelmingly likely that the “outrage” here is entirely for the sake of headlines. >

Sure there is.  Anyone with a functioning brain sees the difference.  Then there's Fox.  And republicans.  They won't see it that way.  And they will spend vast amounts of money convincing Americans that the two are the same.  Ugh. >

They’re reeeeing non stop at /r/conservative about this >

And banning anyone who disagrees with their narrative - even conservatives. It’s not about the facts, it’s not about the law. It’s about fueling the rage machine that empowers them. >

You are banned from /r/conservative >

I was banned years ago for quoting a Trump tweet in response to someone saying, ‘He never said that!’ r/conservative tolerates no inconvenient truths. >

You are double banned from /r/conservative. Keep going and they’ll make it a TRIPLE BAN 😡 >

My question - how lax is the security of classified documents at the Whitehouse? When I was in the Air Force, we had a strict chain of custody when using classified documents. Seems like the Whitehouse has a policy of “ bring them back if you feel like it. >

Right? When I was in the Navy there were plenty of documents, including our notes from classes, that we weren't allowed to remove from a secure building. To study for tests we had to go into the building after hours. >

A few documents found in a Washington, DC office doesn’t even compare to multiple boxes of nuclear documents found at a Florida beach club in the hands of a guy who tried undermining Democracy and who’s now selling superhero cryptocurrency cards of himself. >

Apples to doughnuts. One lied about having them and needed to be raided. The other found them and notified the correct folks to properly return them. Of course MAGA folk won’t see the difference here, to them it’s okay for Trump to do this but it’s bad for Biden. >

is it that biden didnt have uhaul trucks filled with boxes driven to his private residence, lie about it, then refuse to turn the documents over when subpeonaed?  then lie about it some more?  was it that or something different? >

This is like the difference between discovering someone's Toyota on the back of your property and immediately calling the police and stealing someone's Ferrari and then hiding it for over a year from the owner while showing it off to your buddies.
The media will "both sides" us to death about it of course. Politico has already launched their first equivocation piece. >

It doesn’t matter obviously. Nothing ever happened to Trump, despite all of this shit being found in his possession. I still can’t believe nothing ever happened of that. Just an embarrassment >

It’s literally still in court these things take time >

No shit. >

Heard a few people suggest this was leaked by the DOJ to provide cover for Trump. Now begins the "whataboutism" and 'both-sidesism' and the Right screaming for Biden's head. >

WTF there's only 1 similarity... classified documents discovered. Literally everything else is different!
Trump:

had over 300 classified and Top Secret documents
removed them after office
stored them in a pool house at a private club
lied about them
apparently copied and distributed some of them
refused to turn them over multiple times
lied again about the raid

Biden:

had 10 pages
stored at his U Penn office in DC
reported them as soon as they were discovered
handed them over the very next day without requiring an official request, subpoena, or FBI raid >

The documents were maintained outside a secure facility for a period not less than 6 years... that's a problem for the crowd who was going "It doesn't matter if he declassified them or not, just removing them was a crime!!"
People can't have it both ways, and I'll say the same thing to the right wingers who argued "It's basically the same as an overdue library book." Well, if you believe that, then Biden is in the clear too. >

The main things I want to know right now: what document storage and tracking process failed/broke down to allow these documents to be removed from wherever they were supposed to be stored without anybody flagging that there was a failure to return them?  And who could have conceivably stumbled upon these documents during the 6 years they were stored in that office?
It is definitely the fact that, somehow, these documents laid around for 6 years without anybody realizing something as high as TS/SCI was out of place, that concerns me most.  I have no doubts that nothing untoward was done with these documents in the interim.  It's the process that failed to flag them as missing that is starting to worry me most. >

I checked Fox News’ reporting on this. As expected, it’s on their website’s homepage as big news. The article focuses on drawing parallels to the Trump situation and making it sound as serious as possible, glossing over any of the MASSIVE differences in how these situations were handled. 
Sounds like Biden messed up. Ok. He also handled it ethically and gracefully. That matters too. 
The GOP is not just unethical. The way they react to this is symptomatic of a systematic effort to punish ethical behavior. Make a mistake? You did the thing, it’s as bad as if you did it maliciously. In fact, you were stupid for doing it properly because now we know about it. There’s no such thing as “ethics” to them, it’s just inconveniences and weakness. They actively work to dismantle and devalue the mere concept of ethics.
The GOP is a systemic threat to civilized society. >

Biden: under 12 documents, found and returned immediately, didn't try to cover up or hide, in an office.
Trump: over 300, nuclear secrets, tried to hide several times, asked to return and refused, found in his home.
Not saying Bidens off the hook but there's a clear difference. >

Do we actually know what Trump had were nuke secrets and codes? My understanding of this whole thing is that when it was initially reported some talking head or comedian sent a tweet that said something like “I bet those documents contain nuke codes”. And the next thing the media ran with “Trump has nuke codes in his estate” >

It's illegal to have them, period.
Turning them over vs. not turning them over once discovered is a separate issue. >

The groupthink in this thread is nuts LMAO, I spent 10 minutes reading through looking for someone to say this 😂. They both did something wrong period 🤣 >

I swear these investigations into documents and laptops is just a smoke screen to try finding more of Hunter’s dick pics. >

Do republicans/FoX news/NewsMAXX/OANN care? 
Nope. They will just read classified documents found. >

Nuance isn’t something Republicans understand. >

The difference is intent. In one case, documents were discovered and immediately turned over to the appropriate authorities, and they'll investigate how that happened. In another case, a large amount of documents were purposely taken, for what reasons we can $peculate, and after many, many requests from the authorities they finally had a judge sign off on a search warrant and conducted a raid. Of course if your a pootin cockholster or a supporter of one, you'd be incapable of understanding the ~~fine nuance~~ obvious differences between the two cases. >

Tell you what. Let's give each man one lashing for each document lost. Biden will have to sleep on his side for a while. Trump will die.
Oh well. >

The key difference here is that it is actually plausible that Biden read the documents. There's no way in hell Trump had th3 capacity to understand anything in any formal document. >

The Foxlighters will be "both sides" bullshitting about this forever.  They don't want truth or honesty.  The Republican Party is the party of criminals and morons, that's the base, they know it, that's why they pander to you, criminals and morons.  You can choose a better life. >

Anyone who can’t see the obvious difference between this and Trump stealing and hiding boxes of documents, and then lying about having them is just a bad faith actor, or a complete simpleton. >

They found them and turned them in immediately. >

Not only that, but when they were discovered it was self reported, they were not left laying around where they could be seen by anyone and used as trophies. But then again, Biden never took the step of declassifying them with his mind! >

One turned them in and opened an investigation immediately. 
The other is Trump. >

Trump followers, conservative media (and many) Republicans don’t care about the details.  They will latch on to the whataboutism and both sides arguments to soften the treasonous actions of the previous president stealing state secrets. >

Several key differences actually.  The first one is that the documents were locked up, so nobody else could see them, unlike the ones at Mar a Lago which anyone could access (and Mar a Lago is full of spies).  The next major difference is that Biden immediately handed over the documents to the National Archives as soon as they were found, unlike Trump who lied about having the documents for a long time and refused to return them when requested.  Trump broke many laws, whereas Biden did not.  The third major difference is that Biden only had 10 documents, whereas Trump had thousands.  The fourth major difference is that Biden likely left those documents there by accident and forgot about them.  Trump knowingly took thousands of documents illegally with the intent to sell them.
Of course, none of these facts will get in the way of Republicans being outraged about this and saying it's worse than what Trump did.  Republicans will lie, as is tradition. >

I fucking hope so. >

Of course the right may try to make something of this but they'll tread carefully if they have any sense. The dumbest among them will yell the loudest. That's their function >

That difference won't matter to the extremists. I'm so sick of this game >

The conservatives are currently having a meltdown over this and pretending there aren't massive differences. I like how they gloss over the fact that TFG and his lawyers lied in response to a subpoena for the documents. Which is why they had to go and forcibly seize the documents. >

Of course there is… but the GOP base doesn’t care about nuance and facts and will equate the two as identical and equal. And it will be broadcasted by Hannity et al. >

I suppose it’s too much to hope that the 22% of Americans afflicted with uncontrollable “whataboutism” understand the meaning of “mens rea” >

Doesn’t matter. This will now be a talking point for the next two years. >

So basically Biden's team reported they had the documents and sent them back without a fuss. Meanwhile trump had documents, tried to lie about having the documents, and then fought sending them back. 
Also idk how much this matters but did Biden retain his privileges to see classified material after leaving office? I know presidents normally do (except for trump) but do VPs get to stay in the loop as well? That could be a key difference as trump did not have the authority to view those documents after leaving office and having his security clearance taken once he was no longer president. Biden may have retained his clearance which makes the case a little different in that regard as well. >

One guy forgot to tip, then went back and gave the waiter cash.
The other guy dined and dashed, then went back that night and shot the waiter and took their shift earnings.
But BoTh PaRtIeS amiright? >

Trumps take:
A- See, see. Everyone does it.  It’s normal.
B- Crazy sleepy Joe is stealing documents.  Lock him up.  This is illegal.  You can’t take documents.
Oh, what about the the ones I took?  That’s different. >

Lol the republicans are going to milk this one... >

Yeah, we know. 
One is boxes that were stolen and sold for 3.5 billion, one is someone misplacing a few files that were immediately turned over. >

Anyone with half a brain can see why it’s different. It won’t stop the right using their favorite tactic, whataboutism >

“Classified documents are routinely misplaced”
What the wha?!? Why is no one talking about this? >

Other key differences would include that the documents belonged in the office at the time they were acquired and returning them just fell between the cracks, compared to Trump literally filling boxes on his way out of the white house. >

one word: obstruction.
But the Trump cult doesn't know what that means. It's over one syllable. >

Biden facepalm has entered the chat.
This will be the gift to trump that keeps on giving. While completely different from a legal perspective, the republicans are already spinning this as much worse since the president can declassify documents while the vice president cannot. Ugh. Two years of false equivalencies, whataboutism, and 🐂💩.  I am sincerely bummed at this incompetence by Biden's team. >

The big difference is that the president's lawyers just discovered them and
turned them over immediately Obviously, Biden didn't know, it's not like he
"stole" them which is what TFG did. And they are cooperating, trying
to get to the bottom of how this happened which must have been a long time ago.
Those who inexplicably still support TFG are attempting to say it's exactly the
same as what he did >

I heard the Marmalade Moses of Mar-a-Lago claims it's worse because President Biden can actually read. >

Biden didn't lie and contacted the archives to return them.
If Trump returned the files in February when the archives asked for them back, nobody would have even known they were taken. >

Is it maybe, uh, that that they weren’t fucking stolen? >

I've heard that Biden didn't break the Espionage Act because the classified documents were returned immediately... 
but you guys can correct me. >

I've heard that Biden didn't do anything wrong because he declassified everything on day one with his President mind trick. 
/s >

I actually had people responding like as if they had a real comeback to this.
"Uhh no Biden can't just declassify documents with his mind, stupid blue cult!"
Like boy did your president not use the same talking point? >

I saw once where someone clearly joked that Obama had declassified with his mind, and the response was to ask for a source. Looking them up, they weren't kidding.
Yeesh. >

Trump's being for sale, being the major difference. >

Biden declassified them with his Jedi mind trick anyway. >

The differences don't matter to the maga crowd, the details don't matter. They already think this is worse than what happened with Trump. >

The best analogy I've used...it's like you're leaving your job and walk out with a few company pens and a notebook in your backpack, the company is unaware, then a while later you realize and call up the company to return them.
VS. raiding the supply closet on your last day and filling up your backpack, the company contacting you demanding the stolen supplies they know you took, you denying it and telling them to F-off, they plead and knock at your front door asking for them back again, but you now say they were your pens/notebooks/etc all along and before you left the office you made a mental thought transfer in your head to your ownership, then the police raid your home and find all the company supplies with the company name printed on the side of them, and then you go on a rant to encourage the world to attack your office because they're corrupt and Joe Biden has a pen. >

Obama declassified them. He thought about it and they were declassified. No worries. >

I thought presidents could psychically declassify >

"When is the FBI going to raid the many homes of Joe Biden, perhaps even the White House?"
Oh yes, finding classified documents in the White House, what a huge scandal that would be.  🙄 >

How do these docs get misplaced? I get hounded for my overdue library book >

Breaking news Joe Biden and Jeffrey Dahmer both eat meat! >

I was rather taken aback by the line "Classified documents are routinely misplaced."  
Are they?   That's a little concerning.  
Maybe someone should write an article about that, then. >

Part of the problem is that the US government is super trigger happy in classifying stuff because it makes it easier to punish people for leaking info they don't want to get out for political reasons rather than actual security. So yeah especially at the lower classification levels like "secret" document handling is not taking super seriously. >

I don't need them compared, I just need results if what they did was a crime. I don't want the mainstream media doing this garbage because it just furthers MAGA people: "They're downplaying Biden and trying to stir up drama over Trump!" Sure as shit they are! If either one did a crime, punish them. Otherwise stop comparing these old farts and acting like the American people give a damn. Also, I'm not a centrist, I voted for Biden. If my vote went to a criminal, I apologize in advance. I wanted Bernie. >

This won’t matter at all. The conservatives will use this to void out what Trump did. >

It’s so stupid they even have to clarify this >

It doesn't matter what the difference is this is the new Benghazi for them.  I'm fucking done with this country. >

It still needs to be looked into regardless of President Biden's intent. While the situations are not equal by any means, this does need to be investigated. Do we need to make process changes? How are all of these documents (from any person) missing and no one is aware? How many other documents are being held by still other people with access to them? >

It's embarrassing for Biden because they shouldn't have been lying around but they took proactive steps when it was discovered. I'm not going to completely let Biden off the hook for this one because it is very careless. Consequences would be much greater if he weren't one of the select few that have that type of clearance and can basically get away with this level of carelessness. >

A lot of spin and damage control being done here lol.
This'll probably end up being Biden being used as collateral damage in an effort to block Trump from being the republican candidate again >

Aside from Biden cooperating, it's also only 10 documents. Itw probably a few folders with things in it.
It's not boxes of documents >

Oh yeah, nuance is really going to help.
/s >

The think tank worked with Foreign relations and new info from CNN mentions that documents with SCI clearance had info on Britain, Iran, Ukraine. So Biden was not a VP at that time- so why did he take those sensitive documents regarding intelligence on foreign countries to his think tank? - A question that needs a solid answer. >

If it wasn't for the Trump documents fiasco, would this have even been news? >

They are different, but both point to one fact: The US government does not have an effective system in place for keeping track of where classified documents are stored and who has possession of them. >

If what I heard is correct, the biggest difference is that Biden took home classified documents as VP, while Trump took them home while he was President.  This is a rather large difference, if true. >

Trump calling in the FBI to raid the White House to look for classified documents.  THAT’S WHERE THEY’RE SUPPOSED TO BE DONALD. Jfc this guy. >

Ignore this, it's to distract from the fact that Trump stole nuclear documents and refused to return them. It's a distraction. >

ITT: It’s not bad because Biden corrected the mistake and if you think otherwise you don’t have a brain.
I like politicians that don’t mishandle classified documents. This isn’t by any means a dealbreaker for my vote. But it’s not a good look. It can and will be compared to the Trump violations of presidential records act even if not the same caliber of crime. When mistakes like this are made criticism is inevitable. >

Biden needs to take the Keir Starmer approach. Say in public that he'll step down if he's found to have done anything wrong. Puts him back in control of the story and gives him the moral high ground again. >

I assume these were documents that Obama declassified with his mind before he left office, which were then planted by the FBI. >

We don't really know that the documents were improperly removed. That may be the case, but it is possible (likely, to my biased mind) that he or his team legally had the materials while he was VP and failed to properly handle them before he left office. 
With the last guy, we do know for a fact the materials were improperly removed just days before he left office. >

It depends on the level of classification which we don't know yet in the case of Biden.
In the case of Trump, it involved documents which are not allowed outside a SCIF - Sensitive Compartmented Information Facility.
If that applies to the Biden documents as well, then yeah, the base crime is the same, absent the confounding factors in the Trump case. >

Yes, a lot depends on the facts. >

I think ultimately the only crime here is Biden/his team never returned the documents once his VP term ended. So just have the investigation and dish out appropriate punishment.
Which is probably going to go like this:
“Hey so you kept this docs”
“Yes that’s our bad we just forgot about them. We didn’t intend to keep them”
“And you handed them over immediately when you found them?”
“Yes, again our bad sorry about that”
“Ok well you didn’t really mean to steal them, so we will recommend the lowest punishment”
“Which is?”
“Eh probably a small fine or something”
It’s a world of difference from what trump did. >

There is no difference in the documents. There is a difference in scale, intent, and response. And those are the factors that define Trump’s trouble. 
He had plenty of opportunities to simply correct the issue without legal trouble. He chose not to. Pretending the simple existence of documents itself is the problem is just a way to try to whitewash Trump’s actions. >

Another difference.  Biden has security clearance.  Trump does not. >

The DOJ gave Trump a chance to return the documents he had, no harm no foul. It only escalated to a criminal case when he lied to the government and refused to return them. >

We’ll never be able to properly convey to Trump supporters the difference here, and therefore I don’t really care if they run with this new talking point of Biden being just as clueless or malicious. 
What matters is that the proper authorities punish Trump for what is clearly a more serious violation. Legit do not care if the Right thinks it’s “fair” or not, considering they themselves are willfully ignorant to the details. Keep prosecuting Trump and keep on moving. >

Yes forgotten docs that have been sitting undisturbed for 6 years, opposed to highly sensitive docs that are thrown around the room. I can guarantee more than a hundred people have seen the docs TRE45ON stole. I would also bet he has copied and shared. He also stated he had turned them all over, twice. >

This is the biggest nothing-burger in the world and the media is desperate to make it into something. Biden's team found documents, contacted the proper authorities, and returned them. It's done. Case closed.
In Trump's case they knew he had them, they knew what they were, they asked for them, he wouldn't give them to them, they asked again, he said no, they had to get a warrant, then they had to find them, then he said they weren't classified because he used to be president, then he engaged in a drawn out legal battle with his hand picked team of judges, etc, etc, etc, and it is still going on. 
Trump would have been a nothing burger as well if he said "whoopie daisy, here they are, sorry about that." >

Ah, there's many differences. >

Part of me thinks the Biden admin is doing this on purpose to give DOJ excuse not to indict trump. They are trying to avoid more civil unrest. >

How would this give the DOJ an excuse not to indict trump? Wouldn’t just mean Trump and Biden should be Indicted? >

Which is? TLDR please
Edit: kind redditors have explained the situation and I appreciate them. Thank you everyone who responded about what happened, it's honestly really nice to hear peoples' takes on how this relatively tiny slight compares to the Trump fiasco.
Edit 2: apparently I need to say this because I keep getting downvoted: I wanted a TLDR because I've been reading articles for classroom research all day and I'm tired of it, this isn't some "gotcha" against biden, anyone with a brain can see that he is far more honorable than trump. >

Biden handed the documents over to the Archives and submitted them to the DoJ immediately when they were discovered. Trump lied about having the documents. Refused to return them. Lied about having returned them all. Demanded them all back. And continued to lie about their contents or importance. Then the GOP demanded that the DoJ be dissolved, as well as any other agency who helped them. Demanded Biden and the DoJ head be impeached. >

Yeah no I definitely remember the Trump fiasco. I just hadn't heard of Biden having classified documents so yeah thank you. >

Also please note that Biden's documents were found in a locked office that he used while Vice President, and not in an open area of his private residence, as was the case with Trump. >

I bet the conservative house will still try to impeach him for it.
And yeah I thought the whole idea was Trump blatantly displayed illegal documents so biden should be fine if he kept them safe >

I hate how Democrats can never play the optics.