>

China sounds alot like Russia these days
I feel like they purposely wanted us to pop that balloon for some reason >

And that's why the government waited to do the popping over the ocean.
It was such a clear provocation, you never know what payload those balloons have.
Shooting them down over land could have consequences beyond wreckage landing on someone or something. >

After the Australian search for a radioactive capsule the size of a tick tack, it’s probably a good idea to avoid hitting that piñata with a missile over neighborhoods >

This is a good reason to recover the wreckage and to inspect it. If it contains some sort of dangerous weapons or nuclear poison, then this incident becomes much more serious. >

I mean it would be negligent to NOT shoot it down and inspect it. Over the ocean was a good call. Who knows what kind of zombie apocalypse they're trying to start here? >

The problem with biological warfare is that it eventually spreads to more than your intended target, and eventually gets back to you. >

According to my coworker. You only start biological warfare when you have the cure made already. 
But he's a real big conspiracy guy >

It makes sense from a logical standpoint. >

And it may very well be the most logical thing he has said since I've known him. >

Yeah, I know a few myself. Some of them could really get carried away. >

What’s going on with the other one over South America last I had heard???? >

Either they're really civilian research balloons which is still illegal because they didn't notify any country and they just fucking straped a bunch of metal to a balloon which could have ended crashing into a city, or they just sent a bunch others randomly to break a pattern that some "by mistake" ended passing both the US and Canada.
The one in south america passed Colombia and Venezuela. >

Thank you for sharing those links. Super insightful reads.
EDIT: I'll further add that I've watched a few "western" (One from south africa, one from the US, one from the UK) youtubers who live/lived in china and share their experiences as their main source of channel content. Firstly I'd point out that they suffer from youtube-disease and so much of their delivery and setup is unnecessarily hyperbolic. But after you digest a bit of their content and learn how to look past that, their videos give some really interesting views into the socio-cultural component of life where they were. They were foreigners of course so they may have, and probably were, subjected to a different level of scrutiny by gov't officials and authorities. But things such as cross country motorcycle trips, documentary style filming, drone flights, seemingly random video shots in unique places, all these things caused them to be placed under noticeably increased suspicion or so they claim. They said they had gotten phone calls from local police stations on more than a handful of occasions asking them about their business and lifestyles as well as requesting they make frequent check-ins with them to keep the police abreast of their activities. A few of those youtubers left China for those very reasons, stating they feared that incarceration was imminent. One of them even said a friend of his was arrested a few years back and he hasn't heard from him since.
Grain of salt of course. I can't speak to the truth or veracity of any of it. But if what you shared is true, it leads me to think they weren't far off in their assessments. >

Thanks. Interestingly, China has one of the most delayed domestic airlines in the world. Almost 50% of domestic flights are delayed because you have to fly through specific flight paths because most of the country is restricted by the military airspace. And if there is a “traffic jam” on those few corridors connecting major cities, the whole system gets set back. 
Traveling domestically in China sucks in general, especially as a foreigner since many hotels refuse to serve you. In fact, you can sometimes find entire towns will refuse you entry to hotels. Also, you need to give passport and travel details anywhere you go as a foreigner. 
It’s sad because one of the reasons I learned Chinese and traveled there was my middle school teacher’s stories. He took a bus all around China in the early 90s and talked about how amazing it was seeing places like Tibet in 1991. Now, you won’t even get permission to go there as a foreigner. >


“The U.S.’s use of force is a clear overreaction and a serious violation of international practice,” the ministry added, noting that Beijing reserves the right to make “further responses that are necessary.”

what the hell lol >

Isn't sending your equipment into the airspace of another nation without permission a serious violation of international practice? >

In international relations you just say things. You know it’s not true. You know the other country knows it’s not true. It doesn’t matter. The game is to play dumb, because a large number morons in your own population will believe you, and it’s important to keep appearances for them. 
For other examples see Russia, who says dumb things on purpose regularly for internal propaganda purposes. >

Thank you, was just about to mention this lil incident. I think we’ll give back the balloon the same way they gave us back our plane. In pieces. >

I doubt the US is going to give back anything. >

Would be funny if we just gave them back the balloon bits. >

Or just a popped regular balloon on a string >

A winnie the pooh ballon >

Thousands with pamphlets with comics criticizing Xi Jinping depicted as a bumbling mean Pooh. New editions every month or so. >

Honestly China's reaction seems rather extensive for a civil balloon. >

that's what i was thinking. if we entertained the idea that it was a civilian ballon then why should they care about it being shot down. >

But also why the fuck would you use a balloon? Aren’t those big? We found it pretty quickly. And don’t they have satellites now? This whole situation is weird and confusing and I can’t bring myself to have an opinion. >

Some experts on BBC surmised this could have just been to see how the US would react. And/or also as a way to show the US that they can send a balloon into American airspace. It's interesting that this happens just before Anthony Blinken was apparently supposed to go to Beijing. Though now China is claiming they never made such an invitation or some usual crap they say over these things. >

Seems to be that it's more of a test of our air defences at that altitude. Meaning, when we would spot it, how we would respond, etc. If I'm not mistaken, that's the altitude some of their long range missiles fly at. >

Using a never before seen spy balloon as a proxy for a missile attack is a strange experimental setup but I guess they could learn something from it. >

Weather balloons were used extensively in the Manhattan project and for almost every nuclear test thereafter >

Closest thing we have to a magical sky crane >

No flight plan, no fore notice, and no communication until it was spotted. They violated airspace and say it's an overreaction? >

It's so stupid I'm wondering if they really did say that
Officials can't be that dumb right? What kinda move is this? They trying to save face in front of their people or something?
Edit: lol its funny reading so many completely different theories being spoken like they're facts
We're all so full of shit aren't we?  Lmao >

If there's anything that Chinese politicians have no shortage of, it's audacity. They make critical statements any time any democratically-elected politician in any country recognises Taiwan, they condemn governments for not denying people's right to protest in their own country, they freaked their fucking shit when the Nobel Committee awarded the Nobel Peace Prize to a Chinese pro democracy writer etc. 
Basically they expect the same amount of respect and authority from the entire world that they force from their citizens in their own country with an authoritarian hand, and they will make it known every time they feel that they've received anything less. >

I feel like those statements aren't targeting the outside world, it's for the people living inside the bubble. >

Sorry to burst your bubble China! >

After the Christchurch (New Zealand) earthquake the Chinese Government asked that families of Chinese victims receive more compensation than other nationalities because... Chinese people usually have only one child and therefore more precious.
Yeah, and why is that then? >

I’m not an expert here but I’m pretty sure there are plenty of Chinese people. Like they might not be multiplying as much as they used to, but there’s a more than adequate stockpile. >

China is hurtling headlong toward a (self-manufactured) demographic crisis. The result of the one-child policy being in place for so long is that very soon, most of the country will be retired and supported by a relatively small younger generation.
Not that it has anything to do with the CC shooting etc. Just something I’ve been thinking about. >

To preface, I have literally no idea what I'm talking about. But part of me wonders if it's not a good thing that China's young people will not be so easily disposable and used. They currently are treated like they have no value. Their workforce is currently horrifying because you have so many people willing to work for next to nothing. Maybe when it's lesser, they'll have more bargaining power and can get higher wages, better working conditions, etc. >

China plays mind games like my nephew. 
He is also just 3. Pretty dumb. >

China says no you. >

Then throws itself around on the ground >

Ugh, here comes the kicking, screaming, crying, and making a scene in the middle of the mall. >


… and making a scene in the middle of the mall.

In the middle of Tianmen Square. >

Where absolutely nothing happened. >

Nothing happened there and you will go to jail if you ask about it. /sarcasm >

Let one of our allies float a balloon over China's airspace then >

ah, but then it would be called a "provocation." >

We need to send a Winnie the Pooh blimp. >

Get the Macy's Parade people on the phone now! >

Oh bother. >

There, there piglet. >

I'm feeling a rumbly in my tumbly >

Time for something sweet! >

"Why won't you let us flagrantly violate your airspace with our surveillance tech? That's such an overreaction to protect your territory from our spying QQ" >

My question is, If Norad saw this coming since it left China air space, then who is responsible for letting it cross literally our entire country prior to shooting it down afterward? >

The best thing to assume in these circumstances is that arguably the world’s largest and most capable intelligence and military forces both agreed “let it do its thing”. Clearly there’s a reason why. If they’d thought it was a threat, it wouldn’t have made it two centimetres into US airspace. Sorry, it wouldn’t have made it 0.7874016 inches into US airspace. >

That and the US gets to publicly humiliate them.. as in, “we’re so not worried about your balloon we’re just gonna let it parade around for a few days, and say its yours to make YOU look like the asshole.” The technology that the military has would have absolutely destroyed it within miliseconds if it were deemed a real, viable threat IMO. >

Hey, we get to brag that one of our Raptors finally got to shoot down a foreign military aircraft. Over our own airspace for that matter!
The fact that the first confirmed aerial kill was a glorified weather balloon with cameras on it, I’d call it a win. >

Maybe also the highest air to air kill ever >

Not technically air, but an F-15 took out a satellite >

What the fuck. That's crazy. >

So if I'm understanding this right, they modified a surface to air missle, which has controls, right?
Then they made it an air to orbit missle launched from the jet?
And flight ceiling of 350 miles means it can operate up to 350 miles in the air? Which means you can hit roughly, assuming density is consistent of launches, 25% of Low Earth Orbit satellites? >

Alright, $20 to the guy who called it that they sent it up partially just to complain when it got shot down. >

You won't see me being against that. >

Remember that time China was caught spying on US submarine radars and Airbases in Australia then denied it as an overreaction only for Australian high flying surveillance aircraft to release a detailed tracking map of it only collecting 'Research' in Australia's economic zone near US defence installations? >

Kind of like how these "meteorological" balloons keep going over Taiwan. >

Could even really be meteorological balloons. You want detailed weather data when you plan an invasion by sea and air. >

We invaded your airspace, didn’t tell you at all that our balloon is going “off course,” you shoot it down in the name of national security, “wtf, bro!?”
This was for meteorological purposes…. >

Please help me make the world make sense. How does someone say something like that with a straight face. >

Chinese state media, diplomats, and ministry of foreign affairs exist first and foremost to carry the party line, and like every other branch of the government, regardless of what they actually do and how well or badly they do it, they need to always do what makes Xi and the standing politburo happy.
Consequently, you will get these ridiculous, over the top, totally see-through responses that change on a dime.  To do this sort of job, you can't have any personal shame or sense of dignity, because saving facd for the state will always come first.
A few months ago, Zhao Lijian, the foreign minister, was asked a question on the protests.  He stood there for over a minute, looking lost, shuffling papers, and then moved onto the next question.  Seems after years of bellicose crap, he couldn't justify it anymore.
He's since been replaced with a woman who owns property in San Francisco, and whose daughter lives in the US.  lol. >


whose daughter lived in the US

I can understand people buying foreign property due to their current real estate problem. But this? Lol. So unpatriotic. >

Xi's daughter went to Harvard... It's a running joke back in China how all these CCP senior officials talk about how despicable the West is, then send their kids abroad to study, buy property, and even get permanent residency. >

Doesn't every dictator that constantly bitches and complains about "the West" always send their kids to get educated in the US or Europe? >

Yep, because their own countries tend to be really dangerous and restrictive - even for them.  It’s not just the rulers, too, it’s pretty much all of the upper class.
Most frighteningly for the rich, their banking systems aren’t secure at all and rulers can just take all their money if they see fit - and so they tend to store their money in our banks too… >

Let’s fly a balloon over china see how they respond. >


“The U.S.’s use of force is a clear overreaction and a serious violation of international practice,” the ministry added, noting that Beijing reserves the right to make “further responses that are necessary.”

Sending surveillance balloons into other countries' airspace is a serious violation of international practices >


Sending surveillance balloons into other countries' airspace is a serious violation of international practices

Ask the Koreans what happened when they accidentally entered Soviet airspace. The Chinese needs another reminder. >

These are the same people who crashed a fighter jet into a US aircraft in international airspace, forcing it to land and seizing the aircraft and personnel?
China can fuck off with its 'over reaction' bullshit. >

Wait what was this? >

God damn >

This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 73%. (I'm a bot)


China condemned the U.S. military's decision on Saturday to shoot down a suspected Chinese surveillance balloon that flew over the U.S. last week.
"China strongly disapproves of and protests against the U.S. attack on a civilian unmanned airship by force," the Chinese Foreign Ministry said in a statement on Sunday morning, per the South China Morning Post.
US works to recover debris, intel from downed Chinese 'spy' balloon Biden says he ordered US military to shoot down Chinese 'spy' balloon 'as soon as possible'.


Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: balloon^#1 US^#2 Chinese^#3 China^#4 down^#5 >

Fair enough to bring it down safely, even if it was just a weather balloon.  3 airports had to be closed.  It was the size of 3 schoolbusses.
US civilian airspace was interfered with.  People are not happy. >


It was the size of 3 schoolbusses.

The equipment hanging from it was the size of 3 schoolbuses. The actual balloon was MUCH larger. >

Come into United States airspace without permission? 
Get shot down. 
Nothing personal they’d likely do the same. So would Russia. 
You can’t do shit like that. >

Next time you launch a harmless scientific giant balloon that carries all kinds of tech underneath....maybe let the public know about the project?
Which university/company and department? Who's in charge/contact information? What's the goal of the research? Surely there's a website with more information? >

Yawn. Typical Chinese bullshit as usual. So predictable. The world knows it the situation was reversed China would have shot them down in two seconds flat and sent a few dozen jets over Taiwan ( just out of spite) and ratcheted up their nationalistic propaganda about sovereignty and violation blah blah blah. >

Its so boring. They use the same rhetoric as Russia. Deny, downplay, redirect so that they’re the victims. >

It's the old communist playbook on propaganda and various forms of bullshit. It never really worked, but they think it does. >

The target audience is their own domestic people. What looks to be bullshit to a western audience may make perfect sense to a chinese national that doesn't have access to the full breadth of information that the western audience has. >

I'm curious as to why the Chinese govt is bothered about what happens to private civilian property that violated foreign airspace. Surely it's a private matter. >

They’re not. They’re playing games, as usual, like the bag of assholes they are. >

So the balloon should have just been left to drift out to sea and over land again until it eventually fell onto either something or nothing, but potentially killing people?
Basically, the Chinese satellite end of life approach? 
You would think China would just say thank you for taking out this out of control balloon before it did damage, apologise and promise to be more careful in the future, then offer to compensate for the costs incurred by the USA due to China's mistake? >

We all know that if the US had a “weather balloon” flying over China, the CCP would not only immediately shoot it down unsafely over land but then follow up by busing in people to “not attack” the US embassy. Because you know… the CCP is rational and reasonable /s >

Don't forget that they'd make endless and hysterical threats, final warnings, and demand apologies from Biden in person. 
The CCP is such a clown show. >

Warning WORKING COPY Final FINAL R2 final COPY Final FINAL Use this one!FINAL.docx >

I love it when China, Russia and North Korea bitch about consequences for their actions, it's like watching the bully run to the teacher to complain about someone punching back. Pathetic. >

Problem is, like at school, the teachers tend to do nothing to the bully but try to restrict the freedom of the victim.
Until one of the victims pust the bully in the hospital, then all hell brakes lose. >

I'm confused. Who are the teachers in this analogy? 
I don’t think there is anyone who can tell the US what to do and what not to do. >

“The U.S.’s use of force is a clear overreaction and a serious violation of international practice,” the ministry added, noting that Beijing reserves the right to make “further responses that are necessary.”
What a load of BS.  You know what else is a "violation of international practice"?
Flying an aircraft over another countries air space without prior approval.  If things are as China says it begs the question, why did they not inform the US govt as soon as they knew the balloon had "gone rogue" due to forces beyond their control?
China got caught with their pants down and now they are trying to bluster their way out of the situation be shifting blame (or attempting to). >

Also to mention we had to shut down 3 airports for safety concerns of this thing flying over them. We have every right to shoot down something interfering in our airspace like this. >

Don't send crap into our airspace & it won't be any problems >

Shut the fuck up China god damn. >

US should fly a Winnie the Pooh hanging from a balloon  over China just like in the Disney movie >

This is just brilliant. Can we get one shaped Pooh’s head stuck in the honey jar? >

Pretty sure we can just leverage it from the macys thanksgiving day parade. >

"Yes, this is a matter of national security. Now fork over the Winnie the Pooh balloon."
- Some US Air Force General >

I feel confident this wouldn’t be the oddest thing commandeered as a matter of national security >

MI5 once demanded a horde of rubber duckies be handed over by every manufacturer… just to see if they could. They later gave these rubber duckies to the British public in a free for all, and paid the full amount it would’ve cost to buy them. >

Ok so when did they know their balloon was off course and did they notify countries after? If not, well you gotta pay for your own stupidity. >

Damn, I can’t believe my neighbor beat me over the head with a bat, all I did was walk into his house, such an overreaction.
You violated our airspace without notice. Did you think it wasn’t gonna get shot down?