comment: >
  
  Negligence maybe,but homicidle intent not seeing it.
context: Video: Illinois paramedics charged after patient, strapped face-down, dies
  
  Title really burying the lede there >
  
  And the patient >
  
  Hey oh! >
  
  According to the coroner’s autopsy report, Moore died of “compressional and positional asphyxia due to prone facedown restraint on a paramedic transportation cot/stretcher by tightened straps across back and lower body in the setting of lethargy and underlying chronic alcoholism.” >
  
  Jesus Christ… I’m sure it gets tiring to deal with addicts day in, day out, but if you’re at the point of not treating them professionally, with compassion… it’s time to find a new line of work. >
  
  My buddy is EMS in Tacoma. Literally all he does is respond to homeless camps for drug related calls. He's getting out of it soon because he signed up to help people, not deal with violent crackheads 14 hours a day. >
  
  Likely shit pay as well. >
  
  I was mortified when I realized what my EMT buddies were being paid, even with overtime, in Oklahoma. That job was burning them all out because in order to get ahead they absolutely had to work overtime each week. They’ve all switched to much better careers at this point fortunately. 
  What I’m describing above is depressing, but then you think about what exactly they dealt with under these conditions on a day to day basis and it definitely becomes straight up evil that they are so underpaid in my opinion. Dead children, crackheads, grieving family members, morbidly obese and or mentally ill hoarders, Covid exposure during the height of the lockdown, and much much more. Nursing definitely sounds like a career that burns you out too, but I guess atleast their pay keeps you from being absolutely paycheck to paycheck.
  Sorry for the long rant. I think EMTs and Paramedics don’t get as much public appreciation as Fire or Police and they should. >
  
  $9.50 in Florida 🙃
  Entry level county owned not private circa 2016 >
  
  For anyone that didn't read the article, he died of positional asphyxiation. Probably because they strapped him facedown. Also, considering their comments during the whole thing, they probably shouldn't have been paramedics. Being a medical professional requires a lot of patient empathy, and when you're that far gone, you need to find a new career. >
  
  maybe we should hire folks at better than 13 dollars an hour pay :) >
  
  Pretty sure fuckheads are gonna stay fuckheads, no matter how much you pay them. Paying this woman $30 an hour wouldn't increase her compassion at all >
  
  Hes suggesting the low pay attracts characters like these two, and if we were to raise the pay it would attract better candidates who wouldn't do what these two did >
  
  The two paramedics that were charged were probably pissed that their more experienced but less paid co-worker recently quit, upping their workload. >
  
  Bye Felicia >
  
  Understood_that_reference.jpg >
  
  I'm no expert, and I am cynical as hell. IMO, this is an overcharge, no way this is 1st degree murder. This is how they let people go, just like Kyle Rittenhouse.
  It's a lesser homicide, negligence, not pre-planned intentional murder, and the jury will see that and come back not guilty. They do the same for cops and other city insiders. >
  
  Read #2:
  
  (a) A person who kills an individual without lawful justification commits first degree murder if, in performing the acts which cause the death:
  
  (1) he or she either intends to kill or do great bodily harm to that individual or another, or knows that such acts will cause death to that individual or another; or
  
  (2) he or she knows that such acts create a strong probability of death or great bodily harm to that individual or another; or
  
  (3) he or she, acting alone or with one or more participants, commits or attempts to commit a forcible felony other than second degree murder, and in the course of or in furtherance of such crime or flight therefrom, he or she or another participant causes the death of a person. >
  
  Man after reading how they treated him they deserve it.
  No compassion or professionalism.  Strapping him face down? Wtf >
  
  reprehensible behavior by both of these "providers" and I hope they lose their state cards and spend a long time in jail. absolutely no excuse for this. I've been a paramedic for a long time and even for the 3am drunk patient call, they're still another person and there is NEVER justification for what they did. It's negligence, carelessness, and murder. >
  
  As a paramedic, I'm quite okay with them getting charged! 
  Cruel Bullshit like this literally kills people and is why EMS has no respect within the medical community. >
  
  Pretty typical when it comes to how the fields of health and law enforcement treat addicts. >
  
  It's hard to hire patient, empathetic, professional people to go through hell for $13/hr.
  It's also important to be able to fire people who are burnt out or don't have the right mindset, knowing that you can find quality workers to replace them if needed. >
  
  No way a 1st degree charge is gonna stick. >
  
  Keep in mind that every state has their own statutes covering homicide and the 'premeditated = first degree murder' rule of thumb doesn't apply everywhere - Here's Illinois' statute covering first degree murder:
  
  (a) A person who kills an individual without lawful justification commits first degree murder if, in performing the acts which cause the death:
  (1) he or she either intends to kill or do great bodily harm to that individual or another, or knows that such acts will cause death to that individual or another; or
  (2) he or she knows that such acts create a strong probability of death or great bodily harm to that individual or another; or
  (3) he or she, acting alone or with one or more participants, commits or attempts to commit a forcible felony other than second degree murder, and in the course of or in furtherance of such crime or flight therefrom, he or she or another participant causes the death of a person. 
  
  Emphasis mine - The prosecution will likely argue that the accused, being trained paramedics, were aware of the dangers of positional asphyxiation and why restraining someone in a prone position such as they did can lead to death in the restrained person. >
  
  this is what i was thinking as well. they're going to hit them with the worst charge they can and probably plea deal it down from there.
  fuck these two, though. my god. horrible patient "care." when helping train others in EMS, this is something that i have ZERO tolerance for. >
  
  They strapped him down face first so he couldnt breathe properly
  Quote from the article - these paramedics didnt care about their patient
  Finley is heard yelling at Moore to get up and walk out to the ambulance. “You’re gonna have to walk ‘cause we ain’t carrying you!” she says. “I am seriously not in the mood for this dumb sh*t.” >
  
  ...Why you should follow procedure when possible even when you've had it up to here with what you have to put up with on the job. >
  
  Family needs to hire a lawyer. >
  
  It makes most sense as a civil case. Probably against the hospital as well as the paramedics. >
  
  Paramedics and their employer. They'll drop whatever their policy limits are immediately.