comment: >
  
  Putin’s gaslighting is getting really tiresome. I wonder if he’s staying away from open windows…
context: Putin has to be severely desperate with the way oil prices are going. They were expecting a vastly different situation for 2023 and are getting absolutely annihilated on the front lines.  
  It's not a mystery why they have been trying to push Ukraine to 'let them win' through negotiations recently. >
  
  What about gas prices, in Europe they went from 300 EUR/mWh to 68 EUR. >
  
  Exactly, so Putin is losing out. He counted on a continued high price and dependence on it from the west to prevent more intervention on their part.
  He wants high prices. >
  
  Yes exactly. Also he cannot physically move the gas to the countries that will accept it (China/India) in the same kind of volume. So prices are down and volume is down. >
  
  The guy said Putin must be desperate due to gas prices, and you appeared to disagree so I thought I'd clarify >
  
  I wasn't disagreeing I was pointing out that the gas price drop was far more profound than the oil price drop (OP mentioned the oil drop, not gas). >
  
  Fair enough then, I was mistaken >
  
  Ok, no worries. >
  
  
  loss of territories
  
  Is a demand that violates the UN charter.
  Russia should be expelled. >
  
  You could at least make the case that Ukraine has as much right to the USSRs old seat on the security council. >
  
  Actually I feel like that right goes to... Kazakhstan. Kazakhstan was the last of the Soviet Republics, meaning they were the government that formally replaced the last vestige of the Soviet Union >
  
  Kazakhstan is currently an insular despotry not unlike Belarus except slightly less odious and marginally better tolerated by the populace on account of authoritarian leadership being traditional in the region. Still hardly a shining example of human rights and democracy. >
  
  Who is a shining example of human rights and democracy? >
  
  Norway pretty much >
  
  Sweden is pretty cool too. I’m a big fan of their Chef. >
  
  Isn’t Sweden home to the largest neo Nazi organizations >
  
  as a swed, i'd say probably, we got a lot more Nazi's than reasonable, and it's not helped by the goverments extremly shitty immigration policies, and due to the government basically creating "ghetto's" by placing a lot of immigrants in the same area you get what you always get if you have a lot of poor people in one place, a very unlawful community.
  the Nazi's of course say that it's the immigrants fault, "look how bad X area have become", when it's really governmental mismanagement, it's hard to adjust to a new society & culture when you're not a active part of it due to being placed with other immigrants, and basically only other immigrants.
  but in general all the nordic countries have a Nazi problem at some level, don't know if sweden is the worst one but i don't find it unlikely. >
  
  Ukraine: No....no I don't think we do. >
  
  But, if that is the benchmark to look for, Ukraine can merrily liberate Crimea, and Russia will have to accept the loss of territories for talks...
  Russia is slowly but inevitably losing this war. Dragging it out will only make it worse for them in the end...
  Slava Ukraini! >
  
  Peace talks are more for when things become static or one side admits some sort of defeat. Right now the war is still dynamic as the ukrainians are iirc on the offensive and russia isn't admitting defeat. >
  
  Facts are irrelevant to the situation, though. 
  Russia's condition for talks in the first place presumes the Ukraine to admit some sort of defeat, as things are far from static, no? >
  
  Russia must face utter defeat and financial ruin >
  
  Whilst I agree, I think its sad that it really has to come to that for these people to learn. A country made to suffer due to one person’s bloated ego and tainted mind. >
  
  You’re absolutely right.   The people of Russia have to rise up against him. Like they did in Romania and Egypt and Spain with Franco >
  
  I agree. However, despite remaining optimistic, I doubt that will be the case. Most anti-war protests have been “settled” by brutal oppression and mass incarceration, which is not something an average civilian wants, understandably so. Also regarding the civilians, a lot of people in Russia support the war due to being brainwashed by the state media. As a person living in an ex-soviet nation, I can see this phenomenon happen around me everyday and it is TERRIFYING how easy a grandma is made to believe that it is good to sacrifice her sons for a cause that is in truth utter bullshit. I do wish that you are right though, and people are able to stand up for themselves and for their country in the face of this tyrant. >
  
  I agree thank you >
  
  Putin's death will be celebrated by Billions. 
  That pos deserves the worst imaginable. >
  
  True, but I worry about one of the hardliners who advocate use of nukes taking power somehow. >
  
  Do you really think the aliens are going to let us blow ourselves up? >
  
  They watch us for entertainment. Nuclear holocaust will be an amazing series finale. >
  
  The odds on lizard supremacy vs mammal survival are insane. >
  
  Give it a while after humanity's extinction, and you'll have squids and octopi battling over turf using paint >
  
  Prophetic. >
  
  How? Ukraine has regained part of those territories already, so he's not in a position to demand such a thing.
  Oh well, I guess more Russian soldiers will die then. >
  
  "Must accept territories for dialogue"
  Ok then, no dialogue. Ukraine will just keep kicking their ass.
  It's like that scene in my cousin Vinny:
  
  Vinny Gambini : I understand you played a game of pool with Lisa for $200, which she won. I'm here to collect.
  J.T. : How 'bout if I just kick your ass?
  Vinny Gambini : Oh, a counter-offer. That's what we lawyers - I'm a lawyer - we lawyers call that a counter-offer. This is a tough decision here. Get my ass kicked or collect $200. Let me think... I could use a good ass-kickin', I'll be very honest with you... nah, I think I'll just go with the two hundred.
  J.T. : Over my dead body.
  Vinny Gambini : You like to renegotiate as you go along, don't you? Well, here's my counter-offer... Do I have to kill you? What if I were just to kick the ever-loving shit out of you?
  J.T. : In your dreams.
  Vinny Gambini : Oh, no, no... in reality. If I was to kick the shit out of you, do I get the money?
  J.T. : [in disbelief]  You kick the shit out of me.
  Vinny Gambini : Yeah.
  J.T. : Yeah. You get the money.
  Vinny Gambini : So, here are my options. Option A: I get my ass kicked, or Option B: I kick your ass and collect the 200. I think I'm gonna go with Option B: Kickin' your ass and collecting $200.
  Just replace Vinny with Ukraine and J.T. with Russia. >
  
  One of the greatest movies ever >
  
  Yes it appears Putin Khan needs to see battlefield realities. He seems to be ignoring the momentum. No easy answer here except to keep fighting a brutal war to expel the invaders. >
  
  This is like the south demanding they keep antitem after they lost the war. You didn't win, losers don't get to make demands. >
  
  Yeah. I think Muscovy needs their Antietam or Gettysburg-type loss to finally accept defeat. I think Ukraine is again producing another such moment at Bakhmut, and also gave Putin Khan a chance at Kherson city, Kharkiv city, and Kyiv. It's shitty in this case but some people need a few hard lessons before reality sinks in. >
  
  A hard lesson like a Wagner sledgehammer. >
  
  Not what I meant. I don't think there is much learning going on there. To me that's gone wrong, a murderer pedagogue out of ideas, if ever there was one. >
  
  I guess operation “hold out until Putin dies” will continue then. 🤷🏻‍♂️ >
  
  And then someone even more psychotic takes his place... >
  
  Possibly, but right now Zelensky believes that the probable replacements are likely to discontinue the war, and I have to believe that he and his intelligence apparatus know better than I do. >
  
  
  The Kremlin noted that Putin spoke about the "Destructive role of the West", which is "Pumping Ukraine with weapons".
  
  The best thing about this news is that on the same day Turkish BMC Kirpi,sent for Ukraine, were spotted in Romania >
  
  Putin must fuck off already. >
  
  No they don't. >
  
  Recent reporting shows they don't really support the war. But, they still support Putin, they support Russia, and they support their own Army.
  Another way of putting it is that they might not support the war. But many aren't totally against the war and some volunteer to rejoin the army.
  And even if they aren't volunteering, a surprising many Russians aren't even against Putin.
  That's the surprising thing that will make the Ukraine invasion go on much longer, even in spite of the seemingly obvious logic that huge numbers of troops dying should turn Russian internal opinion against Putin. It doesn't, at least not to the amount we would expect. >
  
  It's kind of sad when you consider the Russian population was just stsrting to recover the losses they sustained in WW2. Is Putin going to let an entire generation of his young men die again? >
  
  Fragile, fragile ego on that one. New territorial realities about to set in for Putin when he cedes half a km all the way along the border with Ukraine for a demilitarized zone after losing his ass and further widening the population crisis his country is facing. >
  
  It's a part of the russian negotiations play book. 
  1. Make a ridiculous demand for something you have no claim over.
  2. Threaten war/violence unless your demands are met.
  3. Somebody in the west will capitulate a 1/3 of what you're asking for to keep the peace.
  4. Now you have something you didn't own nor had any claim to in the first place. >
  
  The problem Russia is having is Ukraine seems perfectly content to go the violence route at this time. >
  
  Yeah, russia is a one trick poney and their trick falls apart if the opposition is capable of fighting back and winning. >
  
  I find it funny that the official stance being that Russia won WW2 and didnt need help from anyone (minus the 11 billion in 1940s money in aid from the US) , but are fucking around and finding out that a lend lease type system doesn't fuck around when you put it in the hands of a capable,  determined defender. >
  
  The USSR of that time was a much different beast, with an absurd production capability and a lot of non-Russian states contributing. Now they can't even make their own tanks, much less crew them. >
  
  And tell me, what region of the USSR was the industrial powerhouse? As well as where most lf the grain was grown?  Right. Ukraine. >
  
  Surely the same must be said for Russia. How much loss of territory is Russia willing to accept? >
  
  Watch him go nuts when Crimea goes back to being Ukrainian territory >
  
  Crimea always was Ukrainian territory, just occupied, temporarily. >
  
  Hurry up and die, you bloated puss-bag. >
  
  He can dictate whatever he likes, it changes nothing. Short of nuking Ukraine into oblivion, his war is doomed to fail and has already set him back decades in every conceivable way.
  Such stupid pointless posturing. >
  
  The realities that needs to be acknowledged is that Russia leaves Ukraine before there can be peace.. >
  
  Russia needs to accept it's loses and pull out of Ukraine. >
  
  Not gonna happen, Putin's ego wouldn't handle this >
  
  Putin's fragile ego will cost Russia even more. >
  
  "Ukraine must accept our claims so we can get time to rearm for the third attempt" - Translation >
  
  In the words of Tyrion Lannister “you do realize we are losing?!”
  You make demands when winning not when being slowly strangled on the world stage. >
  
  How about no and fuck off! >
  
  This is like me playing as The Empire in Total War Warhammer and Bretonnia is like "you better let me take this mountain pass or else ill send waves of peasants to die" >
  
  Russia should accept loss of unrecognised illegal annexation of Ukrainian territory for dialogue, anyone with sense tells Putin. >
  
  Russian warship.... >
  
  Meanwhile, young Russian men are being sacrificed by the hundreds daily. Imagine the thousands and thousands of aggrieved families who are not allowed to grieve properly, are not allowed to express their rightful anger. A human life degraded to brutality then death or invalidity. >
  
  I feel especially bad for the ones that dont want to fight. >
  
  Maybe other nations should invade parts of Russia and take what they want; if they want peace they can then give up that land, lol. >
  
  Better put. We are getting our asses kicked. Therefore, Ukraine must admit defeat so we look like we won. Russian mindset. >
  
  Never going to happen. He knows this, it's just his way of trying to make Ukraine look like the bad guys. Everything Russia does is so fucking transparent how can anyone buy his bullshit? They are getting their asses kicked by the fucking B team what chance do they have if the UN actually decided to do something none. It would be a massive joke if not for all the suffering this despotic clown is causing. Why the hell haven't we just killed this chuckle-duck and been done with it by now. >
  
  Killing might trigger nukes, and the next guy up might not end the war anyways even if the nukes don't fly.  Only way out is through. >
  
  In other words, Putin refuses to engage in peace talks. >
  
  And so Erdo has learned not to make himself a clown by buying into BS Russian propoganda. >
  
  This guy… “so give us what we want and then we can talk about what you won’t get.” Insulting is all it is. >
  
  Well sure...why not. If a squatter occupies part of your house, then in order to keep the rest of it, you have to let them stay. Makes perfect sense. What a jackass. >
  
  "We invaded fair and square!" >
  
  Funny how Russia is the one screaming about peace talks but they won't give up anything to get those peace talks. 
  Not to mention Ukraine is damn smart for not accepting any ceasefires or "peace talks" unless Russia leaves the country. All Russia wants is time to get their troops rearmed before the talks will mysteriously fall apart and a renewed offensive starts. >
  
  Why? Why does Ukraine have to accept losing territory? >
  
  If I were Ukraine I’d agree. Parts of Russia should be taken over. Russia is just goin’ to have to deal with that loss. >
  
  V. Putin - Go F..k Yourself. >
  
  It's the internet.  You can say firetruck. >
  
  Whew! >
  
  Unless ofc Russia can't hold said territories.  Imagine Ukraine taking Russian territory then making a similar demand. >
  
  I wish Putin would hurry up and die. >
  
  Nope, Russia should get out of Ukraine. >
  
  Why should Ukraine accept the loss of their own territories?  There's no negotiating with terrorists like VV Putin. >
  
  Putin and Trump have a similar playbook. Deny everything and insert own reality. Even though this statement is absurd to us, it helps his own propaganda machine. >
  
  Maybe Ukraine doesn’t want to talk. They just want to kick ass. >
  
  How about “No.” Does no work for you? >
  
  Ukraine response : piss off >
  
  If you want me to leave your house, you must first sign over the deed. >
  
  Why would they concede the territories? That would only encourage further aggression by Russia. >
  
  Did you hear something? Was that a dog barking? I thought I heard something. Oh, well, I guess it was nothing. Nothing important anyway. >
  
  Loss of Russian territory is acceptable >
  
  If Ukraine get the whole black sea, 20% of Russia territory and let me see mm Sint Petersburgs too.
  Let's start with that dicktator >
  
  For peace we ask you to stop attacking us while we invade you.  Also.... I triple stamped your double stamp. >
  
  Putin is again talking out of his ass, forgetting to say he invaded Ukraine illegally hoping that the EU and the USA would be stupid enough like in the past to do nothing about it. It failed and his army is failing badly and now is talking tough as if he is winning. The more tough his statements are the more Putin is losing and his life would be in more danger than ever. All it takes is one guy, on one day with a sharp shooter aiming at his head. >
  
  Russia must accept defeat and force Putin to step down. >
  
  "Now, let's not fight over who stole what from whom. Just let me keep your TV and we can call the whole thing off."
  "And don't worry, I promise not to take any more of your stuff. Scout's honor." >
  
  Putin is in no position to make such demands. >
  
  Guess there won’t be any dialogue, huh? >
  
  Crimea is Ukraine. >
  
  Literally they are asking for a truce for 36 hrs and this at the same time. He's lost his mind >
  
  The plea of a desperate man! Give them nothing….but take from them EVERYTHING! >
  
  There’s nothing like being in a Putin state of mind- asking for a cease fire and territories?   Keep it up and get out of Ukraine 🇺🇦 >
  
  Ooooor, they can just keep kicking your ass. 🤷🏼‍♀️ >
  
  New territorial reality to even begin dialogue.. What if Ukraine recaptures their own territory and then accepts? >
  
  "Ukraine must accept loss of territories for dialogue"
  I don't think Ukraine has anything against Russia losing some territory. >
  
  Hey!  Give us back those territories you stole from us after we stole them from you! >
  
  100% chance that the warriors of Ukraine prove that statement false. >
  
  Why is turkey part of Nato?  They seem really unsavory in terms of foreign relations, between syria, armenia, cyprus, russia… >
  
  Ah the old 'finder keepers, losers weepers' rule.
  I got this guy's.  What ever you say bounces off of me, and sticks to you. >
  
  You want dialogue?  Then say hello to my little friend! >
  
  Quickly you must accept the loss of your territories before you regain control of your territories! >
  
  I hope this licenses the Chinese to invade Vladivostok while the Russians are on their asses. >
  
  “In order for us to end this war and negotiate peace, you must surrender and give us exactly what we started the war for in the first place.” >
  
  Ukraine responds that for dialogue to begin, Russia must eat an entire bag of dicks. >
  
  Fantasy land that Russia has been in for awhile now. >
  
  Maybe Russia should accept its getting beaten like a Stalinist out of sight of the securitat >
  
  "Putin must accept loss of territories for dialogue". <-- fixed it >
  
  I will share an opinion which is likely not popular. I think peace is ultimately what everyone wants. Although Ukraine has been progressing, things aren't really moving as of now. Ceding Crimea for peace while Russia leaves other regions seems like the best possible outcome. It would be very hard to recapture Crimea for Ukraine, it's almost entirely all russian population and they've possesed it since 2014 now already. The play could be giving up Crimea, joining NATO and start the rebuilding process meanwhile Russia will eat shit with their sanctions and low energy prices and can never touch Ukraine again.
  If Ukraine won't compromise one bit, then this is going to be a long war, many years, and they would always depend on U.S. to supply. If for example the Republicans win next election, Ukraine might not get the support they need to keep the war going. If they can end it now and officially declare Crimea Russians, that's a small price to pay for ultimate peace. >
  
  If it were you, would you give up your arm to a compulsive liar if they promised to stop trying to hack you up with a machete if you did? >
  
  No keep fighting.. fight harder pussies need to use full force time to fuk up the Russians made them leave the territory >
  
  More like, Ukraine must accept loss of territory for Putins head to remain attached to his body. >
  
  Dude trying so hard to save face. >
  
  Appeasement.  Got it. >
  
  Then there will be no dialogue >
  
  Turkey is turning into a joke. >
  
  You can’t lose forever little man >
  
  Putin and everyone else that agree with him on that, should accept two things:
  1. Such hard case of schizophrenia and madness is not curable 
  2. Pistol with one bullet to the head make everyone happier >
  
  Ruzzia must accept loss of Kherson & that many of it’s illegally occupied territories will be liberated too. >
  
  Guess Putin's gonna be accepting the loss of the rest of his military, then. >
  
  Let’s put this into perspective: China decides to take Siberia back… Russia must accept this loss of territory! >
  
  To introduce Putin to reality, 
  suggest the peace conference takes place aboard the Moskva :-)
  Or in Kherson, since Russia said that is their territory :-) >
  
  He's still gonna be demanding territorial consesions when the Ukrainians take Moscow. >
  
  The loss in Putin future is his life! >
  
  Evil must get full lose, or it will return >
  
  They'll wait you out Putin, you Hitler wannabe >
  
  Russia must accept loss and get out of Ukraine for dialogue. >
  
  Russia must accept loss of territory for dialogue. >
  
  Putin needs to accept that he can SUCK OUR BALLS. >
  
  Russia must accept loss of war for dialogue, World tells Putin >
  
  Notice how it's not for peace. Just for dialogue >
  
  one of those r/agedlikemilk comments in the making. Waiting for Ukraine to kick out Russia and start taking Russian territory.... >
  
  So Ukraine should accept total defeat in return for the talks that may or may not result in a peace treaty? This is despite the fact that Ukraine is still in the fight and is seemingly gaining strength, while Russia is, potentially, looking at having to full mobilise its population, a politically unpopular outcome and one that the Russian economy can't sustain for an extended period of time. I mean, that seems like wishful thinking on Putin's part. But assume Ukraine want to entertain this idea, what, if anything, is Russia bringing to the table? What will Russia use to buy peace? What is Russia going to give up to see the end of the war? Nothing. So I fail to see how it is in Ukraine's best interests to negotiate at this time. Putin is trying to frame surrender talks as a negotiation, then blaming Ukraine for prolonging the war. It's political theatre for his supporters both at home and abroad, and nothing else. >
  
  I find it funny that Russia doesn't understand that you can't make demands when they're losing.
  Badly. >
  
  But Ukraine has not lost any territories. There are only partially occupied territories, where RuZZia is losing ground.
  None of RuZZian arguments make any sense. Dialog with RuZZia just saws confusion and creates false hope.
  The only way to deal with RuZZia is strength and military defeat. That is the only way that RuZZia and RuZZians understand. >
  
  "It's not fair, we were supposed to win this war in two days! You have to at least give us SOMETHING for our trouble!"
  No, you friggin' psychos...
  Nobody owes you a damn thing.
  Nobody owes Vladdy his infamous note in the history books.
  Nobody has to give you their land for no damn reason.
  Just fuck off. That is how this ends. When you fuck off. >
  
  Or, or, and hear me out, they don’t do that and instead just keep kicking your ass. >
  
  I wonder if Erdogan if offered the same deal would accept those conditions? Would he be willing to give up the Kurdish regions of Turkey to establish a free Kurdistan for peace with the Kurds. Would he be willing to give up territory to Greece for an end to hostilities? >
  
  Not a correct comparison. Turkey as a whole has internationally recognized borders, Russia has invaded another country. >
  
  I’m sorry you missed my point, would he give up territory as a condition of dialogue. Is he any different than Zelensky or any other leader when confronted by an invasion of his territory. Ukraine has Internationally recognized borders that have been invaded and the invader says loss of your territory are a condition for talks. >
  
  Yeah, I don't think he would give up North Cyprus and allow Cyprus to become an independent country away from Greece or Turkey. >
  
  This is the best tl;dr I could make, original reduced by 67%. (I'm a bot)
  
  
  On Thursday, 5 January, Russian President Vladimir Putin said in a telephone conversation with Recep Tayyip Erdo?an, President of Turkey, that Russia is open to dialogue over Ukraine, but Kyiv must take into account "New territorial realities".
  The Kremlin noted that Putin spoke about the "Destructive role of the West", which is "Pumping Ukraine with weapons".
  Erdo?an's press office said the Turkish president had offered Putin to back up calls for peace and talks with a unilateral ceasefire announcement and a "Vision of a just solution".
  
  
  Extended Summary | FAQ | Feedback | Top keywords: Putin^#1 Erdo?an^#2 President^#3 conversation^#4 Russia^#5 >
  
  Erdy is just another SS, vision of a just solution indeed. There is nothing just about siding with the Devil