comment: >
  
  Computers are nowhere near humans at the current state.  Case in point:
  
  Moravec's paradox
  "Figuring out" how to use an arbitrary object to accomplish obscure goals.
context: Agreed, I just find that many people are adamant in saying that an intelligent robot would not be conscious. While to me it kinda makes sense to say equal intelligence, equal consciousness. Although of course impossible to prove >
  
  Okay, so you agree that humans aren’t necessarily meat computers? They might be, but there’s also a strong possibility they’re not. The evidence is simply inconclusive.
  I also don’t think your intelligence argument holds up. They’re plenty of computers that are far more intelligent than humans, yet still are clearly not conscious. >
  
  Someone else made a good point disproving my thing about intelligence so yes I agree.
  I still maintain that consciousness must be built into the hardware of the human brain somehow. And if that exact somehow is to be understood, what is stopping us from building something that is conscious. >
  
  Yes, we are meat computers, but we don't know how to reproduce the programming and learning capability our brains have.  It is far beyond what a computer is currently capable of, not to mention instincts that we don't have clear understanding how that gets programmed.  
  Our brains are supercomputers.  
  Robots could be programmed to have negative stimulus that mimics pain, and likely would if they want them to be truly functional.  Pain is an important sensation that allows us to keep ourselves self.  There's a condition called congenital insensitivity to pain (CIPA) that is rather horrific.  The people with it don't feel pain, which seems great on the surface, but they usually do severe damage to themselves in childhood because of it and have to work very hard to keep themselves safe because they don't get the sensory input of when something is wrong. >
  
  I would argue that we don’t understand computer intelligence in the same way we don’t understand our own. The basis of modern AI is to give it a set of basic guidelines and let it “learn” on its own. The way it arrives at its final state is largely a mystery to the creator.
  As for other things such as instincts, that I would agree are uniquely human, I don’t thinks those are requirements for being conscious or “alive”. I could similarly name things that are unique only to the experience of robots. Imagine a world where robots walk around saying “those humans will never be like us because they’ve never experienced [weird robot thing]”
  Also I know I use the robot analogy a lot, but what if we meet aliens that are made of gold and mercury instead of carbon and water. Many would agree that intelligent  aliens could be considered “alive” what makes that alien different than a robot and different from us >
  
  Consciousness is different and more difficult to quantify and we have yet to create something that is capable of consciousness.  
  We understand computer intelligence because we literally program it.  Even when it is learning, it is using given programming to learn.  It's not really a mystery. >
  
  It’s not really a mystery in the same sense we kinda know how a brain learns things, stores information, etc. 
  If humans are conscious, and an intelligent alien made of silicon is conscious, then why not make the extra step and say that a robot that has the exact same mental capacity is also conscious? It’s three different mechanisms that all achieve the same thing
  If humans are true meat computers, why would any other being of equal computational intelligence not be conscious? >
  
  
  It’s not really a mystery in the same sense we kinda know how a brain learns things, stores information, etc.
  
  We kinda know this.  We have ideas, and we have knowledge of where things usually are, but we also have no idea how it happens.  And how some people can re-route functions when an area dies.  Much of the brain is still really a mystery to us.  
  
  If humans are conscious, and an intelligent alien made of silicon is conscious, then why not make the extra step and say that a robot that has the exact same mental capacity is also conscious? It’s three different mechanisms that all achieve the same thing
  
  Does it have the same capacity though?  Can it operate outside of programmed parameters?  Does it recognize and give value to a sense of self? Does it fear death?  Capacity isn't the marker of consciousness, it's how that brain works.
  Because consciousness does not equal intelligence.  There are many people who are severely cognitively disabled who are still conscious. >
  
  idk how to quote things on mobile pretend I did
  “Does it have the same capacity though?  Can it operate outside of programmed parameters?  Does it recognize and give value to a sense of self? Does it fear death?  Capacity isn't the marker of consciousness, it's how that brain works.”
  Assume yes for all these questions.
  The cognitively impaired people still being conscious is a great point, perhaps consciousness is not a function of intelligence. Yet I maintain that because the brain is nothing more than physical matter, the same mechanism that makes us conscious can be replicated to make another entity conscious. In essence, consciousness is a result of the physical makeup of our brain, if we were to understand the construction of the brain perfectly, we could construct something that is conscious >
  
  
  Assume yes for all these questions.
  
  Why would you assume yes?  Nothing is currently capable of doing that.  If it could, then it could be more of a discussion.  
  
  The cognitively impaired people still being conscious is a great point, perhaps consciousness is not a function of intelligence. Yet I maintain that because the brain is nothing more than physical matter, the same mechanism that makes us conscious can be replicated to make another entity conscious. In essence, consciousness is a result of the physical makeup of our brain, if we were to understand the construction of the brain perfectly, we could construct something that is conscious
  
  Maybe, maybe not.  But we are a very long way from that kind of understanding of the brain. >
  
  Of course all of this is extremely hypothetical science fiction. But I do believe it may be eventually possible
  Also, assume all those answers are yes for the exact reason that other wise it makes the discussion boring. It’s within reason that such an alien would answer yes to all those questions, so why not assume so and really force us to set the boundaries on what makes something conscious >
  
  If it's hypothetical science fiction, then sure it would be considered alive and conscious.  
  I don't know if you ever watched Battlestar Galactica (the newer one).  Cylons were meat machines.  In the terminator series, Skynet initiated war out of fear from its own survival. Those things all had consciousness.  
  But in the real world, we are still very far away from it and people don't think about it like that because it is so far outside our capability. >
  
  Haven’t seen either of those no.
  And yes I agree, society is really bad at talking about this topic because it sounds so outlandish and silly. I think in many years if we perfect AI, understand the brain better etc, it would be a more interesting discussion as people would have more experience dealing with things that seem human in a way that makes them want to connect with it.
  I mean hell Siri sounds extremely robotic and people still treat it like a human, say endearing things to it and all that, in a way doesn’t Siri feel like a person when you use it? Imagine that but with actually near perfect technology, I think society in general would be very confused as to what to think about them >
  
  I'm not saying you're wrong...but I don't think you can be confident that you're right.
  Here's the thing about subjective experience: it's unobservable by anyone else. We don't know what causes subjective experience, and it is impossible to do science to it. Not just physically impossible, but logically impossible. We can get some sense based on what people report and what is happening in their brain at the time, but we can never make any actual certain observations. Which means that once the "I'm human and they're human, so I'm going to assume that their experience is like mine" assumption goes out the window, we're stuck.
  Now, I think that the uncertainty is a good argument for treating any future appears-to-be-conscious computers as having inherent worth and moral weight. But don't mistake uncertainty for certainty. >
  
  I agree I can not be confident I am right, but I think that many people are confident in disagreeing with me when they should not be.
  You seem to be on the same page as me honestly, if such computers were to come, I agree there’d be no way to know if they had a true consciousness. But also, there’s no way to know that the person right next to you is truly conscious the same way you are. It’s just the assumption that the person next to is the same as you are is an easier one to make