>

It was dozens of violations per child, not hundreds of kids. Just kids clocking in a bit late every day a lot.
For those of you who didn't read the article, the actual fine was $172,750 with 90% of it being suspended for the restaurant to "adhere to a settlement agreement and commit no additional violations."  The issues cited in the article involve teenagers below the age of 18.  Some of the violations related to the employment of a single teen, including "62 of the violations attributed to one worker" over the course of a year. >

“Commit no additional violations.” What, if they kept violating the law the state would just be like “well I already fined them a lot so I don’t care.” >

If they get caught with more violations, then the punishment would cost an extra $155,475 and the restaurant owners would actually be on the hook for all that money. >

Why defer it? Why wait? They broke the law hundreds of times. >

This allows them to more easily prevent future violations, oddly enough. The fact of the matter is, that $172,000 fine may have been seen as alright. Each time they violate the law they're only risking $250, which could easily be offset by the labor.
Now, a single future violation is risking 150 grand. >


Each time they violate the law they're only risking $250, which could easily be offset by the labor.

I think you misinterpret what they are being fined for. According to the article, it was for allowing or scheduling under-age workers too many hours. It's not that they weren't paying them.
You could argue that the labor cost of a younger worker is less. But it's not $250 less. >

It's worth $250 to get a teenager to fill a shift versus shutting down for the day when they can't find anyone else. 
This removes that incentive. >

We must not have read the same article because the one I read didn't suggest this was what was happening at all. You're making a lot of assumptions based off extremely limited information.
There are lots of business with lots more egregious labor violations that you could be or should be getting mad about. This one got caught and fined and they even have to create PSAs about it. Would your preference be to see the owners drug out into the street and shot? >

Not the person you responded to, but my take is that after 691 violations, even if its all from one individual, you shouldn't be operating a business at all. I will admit, over scheduling a teen is not as bad as the headline seems to imply, but the general feeling is that business owners get off light for their crimes. If I was caught with 691 charges for basically anything I doubt I'd get a break of any kind. >

That depends what they are and the circumstances, not all crimes are equal weirdly enough, sure 691 counts of murder wouldn't look good on you, but 691 counts of littering due to a hole in your bin, they might cut you some slack >

So $25 per violation? That seems low... >

Saw, headline, opened calculator, came here, and found my comment >

We could probably find some highschoolers to do these calculations for a lesser cost. >

Middle schoolers would probably do it for less, just sayin. >

Ah, so I wasn't the only one who had to start working right after finishing elementary school!
Can confirm about the cheapness of getting kids to do the work! I spent summers doing heavy labor at the horse racing track, started at $50 per week, but repairing those lottery machines at the gas station I had to do for free and year round too.
Dad realized it was easier to teach me to do the work for him than do it himself. >

I thought your story was gonna end by saying you learned how to skim money off the lottery machines and now you're comfortably retired >

Actually, dad did figure out how to print winning lottery tickets and cash them without getting caught, and explained to me in detail how to do it, but then explained that we weren't going to do that because we'd need an accomplice and the only buddy he had was sure to get greedy, demand too much too often, and get us all caught.  
Naw, I escaped with a combination of deception and a McJob. Convinced my dad it was his own idea to send me away to live with a cousin so I could start college early. Cousin demanded $2000 up front to take me in, dad said I could leave when I came up with that on my own, so I got a real job as soon as I legally could and saved every penny of my $4.95 an hour.  
Starved a lot to do it though, because I was only allowed to eat food from the kitchen at home when I was actually at home. By the next year I had scurvy. Buddy noticed and forced me to eat an entire bag of oranges to cure it.  
Ya know, sometimes I don't realize how neglected I was growing up until I get into telling one of these stories. >

Holy shit. Are you okay? >

Better than dad!  
Many years later, after his third wife left him, he demanded I come home and take care of him in his old age. For free, obviously. Insisted I abandon my stepsons, who very much needed me at the time.  
I laughed. I had the fun of quoting all his worst lines back at him, like "That sounds like a personal problem" or "Gee, you should really hire someone to take care of that for you."  
He doesn't even get a shitty nursing home unless he arranges for one on his own. I've disowned him, only associate with other "black sheep" family members.  
Turns out nobody in the family had any idea what had been going on at the time, but they sure know now!  
And sometimes, for Christmas, dad gets hung up on. But only if someone is stupid enough to loan him their phone, because I'm good at using that Block button! On Facebook, on email, blocked dad on everything!  
According to family reports, he's been going absolutely bananas obsessing over my refusal to speak to him. Reached out to everyone in the family who might remotely be willing to let him watch their kids open presents Christmas morning like the good old days.   
Entire family, black sheep and overly religious sides together, are conspiring to prevent him from contact with any kids, as obviously he can't be trusted to treat them decently, so no happy Christmases for him ever again! 
Something about revenge being a dish best served cold. :) >

I am very proud of you. Surviving all that is a gauntlet and to thrive on the other side takes just as much work. I hope you and your family continue to flourish. >

How will the Belchers ever recover? >

Luckily for them there are practically no limits (for non-hazardous industries) on how old your own kids have to be to work, or how much they work as long as they still go to school. >

Checks out. Started working full time for my parents when I was 12 in NJ. Hey, I made manager at 14, though >

Who were you managing? >

Myself. For several years, I've basically been in complete charge of pretty much everything in my life. >

I'm a school counselor and am in charge of making permits for the high school I work at. Let me tell you, this shit happens a lot. Like, almost every single student I work with I already know is a child labor violation. When I get a permit request, I tell the students the hours they can work and in what days, I list them for the employer to see before they sign their part of the permit, and then I go over grades and school attendance requirements. Here's the thing though, these aren't violations of them hiring 11 year olds or making kids work til midnight on a school night, this is stuff like kids working 5 hours vs 3 on a school night (3 is the limit for 15 year olds in CA). This happens to every kid because truth be told, what employer needs a 3 hour shift and what student wants to go in for 40 bucks?
I tell the students very clearly: if you are being denied breaks or ever working longer than you want to, come back and see me and I'll take care of it. Even if it's within the legal hours, schools in CA reserve the right to make the limits more stringent than the CA law so if something doesn't work for you, or your grades drop, I'd like request a talk. I imagine that's way more helpful than a random hour amount. >

Dude, good on you, and an important lesson on rules.
Understanding the difference between taking advantage of rules vs. being taken advantage of by rules + the ways you can react to each...that can't be learned from theory, it's gotta be real world. You are teaching them something truly useful. >

Aww, I appreciate you saying that. That's very kind of you. >

Reading that it honestly looks like the system is working, and working as intended. No abuse going on, just labor violations, and not particularly egregious ones. A fine that the owners are unlikely to forget, but small enough that the business will just barely be able to afford it. Plus the kids get to keep earning some extra money (save it for college/trade school kiddos) for themselves. Public awareness is also raised to other businesses to not make the same mistakes. >

People are freaking out, but honestly this is spot on. They're not using 8 year olds in the mines here. They did break rules, but I don't think they should be out of business because a 16 year old worked too many hours.
Edit: I should say that I do think they should be punished and I'm not saying the amount they were fined is perfect, but I also don't think they should be crucified if the violations are what the actual body of the article suggests. >

Ironically the restaurant is called "The Quarry" >

Should have been "over 600 labor violations at "The Quarry"." >

"Maine Business 'The Quarry.'" Now we're click baiting like pros. >

This is the main reason why it was a policy at every restaurant I ever worked at/ ran that you don't hire anyone under 18, ever.  It's is laughably easy to violate labor laws when minors are involved. >

It was $172k but they suspended $155k of it as long as they don't do it again >

I think each shift counts as a violation. 62 violation were attributed to one worker in one year, so probably a 15 year old bussing tables on the weekend and during vacation weeks. The headline sounds more scandalous than it is imo. >

So? They made more money that that each shift. If the punishment is a fine that’s less than the profit of the crime, it’s just the government getting a cut >

Child labor laws exist for a reason and a 15 year old bussing tables for 2 months are not that reason.
They should be fined for it, but let's not act like they're forcing preteens to slave away for no pay. >


but let's not act like they're forcing preteens to slave away for no pay.

Yeah, I gotta get outa this comments section. Soon as I got big enough to be anything like useful, my childhood nickname got changed to Free Labor.  
By the time I escaped from my dad at 16yo, I had acquired many useful skills so I could cover for him at various jobs, and was ridiculously strong from years of heavy farm labor.   
Also terribly maladjusted. First time a fast food manager scolded me for making a mistake, I flinched and "jokingly" begged her not to hit me. Was honest to goodness surprised when she didn't even punish me, much less hit me. She was just bringing the mistake to my attention so I could learn from it. >

Okay? Sorry you got exploited >

Yeah debating the contents of it aside,that comment reeks of “I was assaulted as a form of discipline as a child so children today should also get the belt” >

Curious about underage and alcohol .. did they overlook other possible transgressions? >

Maine and West Virginia have the lowest minimum ages to be allowed to work in bars and serve alcohol; Maine is 17, West Virginia is 16.
In most states, the common minimum seems to be 18. >


... The state DOL found 78 violations involved five employees who were younger than 16 and working without a permit, with 62 of the violations attributed to one worker between Aug. 30, 2020, and July 20, 2021.

I guess you Missed that part >

I was just saying that underage can legally serve in Maine, NOT that THIS bar in particular wasn't violating said law. >

Actually, they can even bus and stock bars but not serve at 15. There does need to be someone over 21 in charge. Source - work in seasonal Maine restaurant management and hire a ton of minors. Yes, I pay attention to the laws anf get work permits as needed. >

To all the folks complaining about the amount of the fine: Read. The. Article. >

To anyone still too lazy to read it:

The bar and restaurant was cited in July for a total of 691 child labor law violations involving about a dozen workers, with the total penalty being $172,750. The state DOL, however, agreed to suspend $155,475 of the penalty if the owners of The Quarry Tap Room adhere to a settlement agreement and commit no additional violations. >

It’s also relevant to note these violations were for letting minors work a hour or even a few extra minutes of over time more than legally allowed, or outside the legally allowed hours. It’s probably not what comes into your head when you think child labor violations. They weren’t exactly abusing the kids, they were just unaware of all the exact requirements for high school kids. I’m sure they are well aware now and it’ll never happen again, which should be the goal of fines, not just to cause as damage as possible. >

Lol. I’m from Maine and this didn’t even make local headlines for the most part. Here and there, but here Reddit is “Maine’s doing this!”  
No we’re not. It’s one place and no one ever goes to that small town. Sad thing, but let’s stay in the headlines for good stuff >

Also from Maine. That number is insane to me personally. Where the hell do pwople live with that many children in one area? Maybe Near Bangor or Southern Maine but that is a huge number…