>

No, Iran supplies terror weapons and are scum and evil (also because of what they do to their own people), but they are not a war participant by doing so.
Consider all the weapons NATO (and more nations) supply to Ukraine. They don't become war participants because of those.
Russia makes the bet that Iran can produce drones faster than NATO can produce anti-air missiles. >

Honestly I think they’ll be able to do it cheaper with high volume computer assisted machine gun fire or computer guided anti drone electronic warfare weapons. 
Missiles are expensive but a tracked weapon that either doesn’t need reloading or costs a fraction of a missile is coming. >

cheapest is to kill the source, just need some long range, accurate missiles >

And most effective - I’d go for this option >

Just here to casually remind people that this naval anti-missile system called ‘goalkeeper’ exists.
And while it’d be very expensive to buy even just a few to use in major population centres, Ukraine effectively has a blank cheque from the entire planet to make sure that Russia stays behind its borders. 
But rockets are probably a better option in general. It means militaries who support Ukraine can use this opportunity to donate their ageing stock and replenish with brand-new munitions. >

Yeah Ukraine is basically becoming NATO's dumping ground for their outdated equipment so they can get new state-of-the-art tech themselves.
It's convenient that NATO's outdated equipment is still better than Russia's current equipment though. >

Just look at NATO stuff like the German Gepard. It was constantly modernized in regard of electronics but got pretty much phased out because NATO AA doctrine switched to missile systems against high value threats like modern era helicopters or jets with some auto cannon functionality on ifvs against Helis.  
Turns out, dedicated radar AA vehicles with auto cannons that have airburst capability are the perfect answer to drones. 
The basic idea of drones is twofold. First they are relatively cheap and stupid, second their price would allow them to overwhelm most missile systems that are more designed to deal with individual high threat weapon carriers or high yield missiles rather than a swarm of low yield targets. 
These auto cannon as systems are turning the cost efficiency back in favor of the defender. 
I bet developers like Rheinmetall with their mantis are salviating at the prospect of this turning longterm with NATO basically building a new iron dome. >

They're easy to counter if you have the systems in place to counter them, but they're so plentiful and cheap to produce that you're going to find a lot of places where they can still be used effectively. 
I'm also really interested to see about naval drones. Ukraine developed naval drones by rigging civilian jet skis with explosives and a piloting system but it was only like 10 boats or something. A proper naval drone swarm similar with higher yield explosives and hundreds of boats could be a serious threat to larger battleships. Imagine that in combination with a proper air strike. >

Anything involving more jet skis is automatically cooler. >

This puts the Miami vice theme in my head for some reason. >

Can the drones be targeted while in transit? Is that too logistically complicated to pull off at the moment? Would the result of that draw another country into the war? >

The Iranian drones are easy enough to shoot out of the sky with the right defences. Ukraine blasted them all last night. What Russia is banking on is that the missile to destroy it costs more than the drone.
It’s a pretty stupid plan, to be honest. >

I think what he meant by transit, and it's also what's on my mind is how are they getting from Iran to Russia?
Is it a ship or plane that can be ambushed before Russia takes possession? Would it cause Iran to officially enter the war? >

Russia and Iran have plane routes. Not to mention Russia is working on establishing a trade route with Iran through the Caspian Sea which directly links the two and bypasses sanctions. >

Step 1: NATO-funded pirates
Step 2: ???
Step 3: Memes? >

Aren't they called something else when they are hired to harass the other side in a war?
Edit: Yep, they wouldn't be pirates anymore, they would be Privateers. >

It's not a war. It's a special maritime operation. >

A special arghperation... >

How long before someone smokes too close to the drone factory? >

Israel is already handing out Marlboros. >

Boom !!! >

The takeaway:  Russia's supposedly formidable army has been reduced to cheap drones. >

That they import >

From Iran. >

Those drones seem to be doing what they were intended to do, I would not underestimate them just because they come from Iran. >

Ukraine should offer more money than Russia to buy said Drones. Game of Thrones this shit. >

That's like saying Russian should offer the US more money to buy their weapons. This is all a little more ideological than that. >

I don't know, I guess also, the US wouldn't want Iran getting money. I tried, there's a reason I don't run countries lol. >

I guess this can go on forever even if the Russians get kicked out. Probably need to have their own drone program striking inside Russia to get a ceasefire >

This is going to be another Afghanistan/Vietnam where the war is dragged out longer than it has to be, possibly for a decade, leading to gigantic amounts of losses, destroyed economies and suffering with absolutely nothing gained. NATO could end the war in a month, but since everyone is still afraid of Putin's nuke threats, Ukraine will have to bleed out, possibly being ruined permanently, because they are left alone to fend off Adolf Putler and his mafia. We can only hope he and his goons die off quicker than their missle piles. >

The best case scenario is that someone popular within the military/political sphere takes control and forces putin out, with said person being benevolent enough to stop the war and return the status quo. 
Worse case is Russia as a country is dissolved and the nukes are spread across black markets. >

Putin is taking out all potential competition. >

The Nazis tried that in London during WW2. It didn't work then and I hope that it fails again. >

It will fail, attempting to beat a population into submission never works. They just become more resilient, vengeful, resourceful people.
Ukraine will win this war, my only fear is that it may take years. The sooner somebody takes care of Putin, the sooner the war will end. Putin is reliant on victory in Ukraine to ensure his continued domestic dictatorship. >

Yep, you either annihilate thoroughly, destroying everything, or you leave them alone.
Walking anywhere in the middle just doesn't work. >

I mean we have a more modern example of such a hell in Sarajevo. 
We really have only seen this scale of conflict in Mosul, Raqqa, Kobani, and Aleppo which are more comparable to the liberation of Kherson and the possible future campaign to retake Mariupol. 
We need anti drone tech. I am full fucking luddite with this shit. Smash every drone that ever existed or will ever exist. I have talked to children who talked about being hunted by robots. Its only a matter of time before a quadrocopter drops a bomb onto a crowd as a terrorist attack with shit they bought from walmart and printed in their basement. >

I'm right there with you. Anti-Drone solutions are a necessity. I believe various organizations have been experimenting with different possibilities, but not many have been fruitful.
Me thinks modern air-burst munitions are the way to go. They already exist, but I feel like they're underutilized. >

There is promise in the vampire system which is currently in operation in Ukraine. >

Hmm, I wonder who's more vulnerable to drone strikes on vast swaths of static civilian infrastructure 🤔
Pretty dangerous game to be playing for someone who can't even defend their military installations >

Now i fully agree, but Ukraine cant hit russn infrastructure much, cant look like the bad guy. Just keep hitting military targets, defend,  ruaas will run out before the west. Is the west actively crying for a cease fire? Well... outside of ppl who are in pootins influence. >

Why would that be? There is plenty of infrastructure to be hit that it s directly related degrading Russia's military capabilities. Bridges that carry weapons and supplies, electricity to weapons factories, ... It would be waste of ammo to hit civilian infrastructure. >

In war its always a waste to attack civilians.  This isn't the fkn 1600's... >

Sounds like Iran should be held accountable >

We should start sanctioning Iran!!!! >

Fuck, we aren’t? >

It was a joke Iran is very sanctioned and has been for decades. Before this war they were probably the most sanctioned country. 
They play games with making nukes as a negotiating tactic to get them losened now and again. >

Yet the sanctions are for the nuclear program.  Ironic... >

Russia seems committed to finding new and creative ways to stay in the headlines and prevent public interest in the West from waning, which is really their only chance to win. 
Their management of this war has been disastrous on pretty much every level >

Maybe retool a single European lawn-mover factory to produce a couple of thousand cheap knockoffs every month and donate them to Ukraine to see if that makes Russia reconsider its stupid plan?
First month they could be launched with nothing but confetti and party balloons as payload to make a subtle point? >

Issue is the Ukrainians aren't hitting Russian targets. They're hitting their own land temporarily held by Russians. Putin doesn't give a shit if more of Ukraine gets destroyed. >

Bruh, they hit airports with jet planes in Russia far away enought to also be in range of Moscow.
They hit gas stations and refinery, ammo depots (pretty fireworks I might say) and command post (we are already in the 5-6° commander death by missile/artillery/drone strike) while in and out of Russia territory.
Also the buildings might be a thing but the guns and ammo that might hold outweighs the future NATO and Europe rebuilding plan, at this point it doesn't matter much, it just be a larger number on a check that future Russia will have to pay. 
It's true that he doesn't care. But he cares about IMARS changing the public opinion (/s he only cares about the obligarcs and military not fucking with him). >

Begun, the Drone Wars have. >

Drone warfare. I can only imagine how humans will further weaponize drones by the end of this war. Fuck Putin for accelerating this timeline. >

The U.S. is developing laser weapons to defend against drones. The future is now. >

That would be cheaper in the long run probably >

But in the mean-time we should be sending C-RAMs galore. >

They might be useful for very critical infrastructure like power plants because they don't cover a lot of area like normal AA >

I’ve been saying this for months, the Vulcan air defense system is the correct weapon to use against the Iranian drones. They need hundreds of these and they’re in storage all over the place. They shoot 20mm rounds and are dirt cheap. >


is the correct weapon to use against the Iranian drones

M163 VADS is designed for small cover ground force defence, not to defend against entire borders. You would need thousands of these lined against 2300km Russia Ukraine border. >

You'd just need them around the cities, right? Not the whole border? Not an expert here at all. >

I suppose two can play that game... >

Aside from shooting the drones, can the base in Russia where they take off be attacked? That's how most flying objects like airplanes and larger missiles are dealt with. Turn off the spigot and the water stops, right. >

They take off from the back of a truck though. A truck disguised to look like one hauling a standard shipping container. >

Wow that's actually impressive. I assumed they needed airstrips or something >

Give Ukraine everything >

(American here) Ukraine is asking for cluster bombs, and I think we should hold off on that. But otherwise yes, give Ukraine everything.
Every 1$ to Ukraine is 100$ saved in defense. The best possible value for dollar. But more importantly Ukraine is right and Russia is attempting a genocide. It is always right to defend the victims and stand against genocide 🇺🇦 >

What is the issue with cluster bombs? >

A small percentage of the bomblets don't explode. Children pick up and set them off. Its still happening in Vietnam and Cambodia half a century later
Most countries (not the US or Russia) have signed the Oslo Convention banning then >

Russia is already using them anyway so that is still going to be an issue either way.
Plus they are quite effective, having them might save a lot of Ukrainian lives too, specifically soldiers. >

That is all correct. But we have so many better alternatives. The US is withholding long range missiles and tons of old Abrams in storage. Send those first before we resort to custer bombs.
The calculus of justifying atrocities is a dark path >

I'm still a big fan of giving the Ukrainians the A-10s they asked for. They did their homework on them, give it to them >

Doesn't the US have a new laser systems on some of their destroyers that they've been testing to counteract this exact issue? Other than wanting to keep the best stuff in reserve for them is there a reason why giving some of these isn't an option? >

Ukraine’s winning with our old weapons that we didn’t use because we haven’t started or finished any wars in over a decade. China took note and hasn’t invaded Taiwan. I think they took the American’s support to not want war as a weakness that it simply wasn’t. >

Can't Israel just bomb the shit out of any drone factories? >

They recently did, in Syria where they assemble them. >

Good, good, now keep doing it. If Israel can’t find all the factories and drones continue to be covertly produced, then just bomb the ports/airports so they can’t be exported. >

Russia in it's mind: "we will overwhelm them with an onslaught of drones to wear out their resources"
Russia in reality: "what the hell??? why is our economy going down the shitter even faster??? tf" >

This war definitely showed that NATO needs an economical way to deal with cheap one time use UAVs like the Shahed. >

Fat lot of good that will do. Ukraine shoots down all the drones. Putin won't learn. Russia military will lose some more then. >

How the “great” Russian army has been reduced from a “formidable” fighting force to resulting to desperation tactics and spinning it in such a way that it makes them sound intelligent. Bunch of clowns. >

Gerpard go brrrrr >

They have ZSU-23-4s as well. Those would work great as drone killers. >

The amount of drone footage coming out of the war is staggering, really. It's crazy how practical they have been for both sides >

Hmm.. now if someone managed to block Iran from sending Russia drones, that would make a real difference. >

Well yeah, it's all they have left since they're getting held in place with every other option.  Slava Ukrani >

Kind of assumed Russia has been stockpiling drones for when the weather warms up once it became known the Iranian drones they were using had a severely reduced range in the cold. 
They're probably preparing to attempt to use those troop surges with coordinated drone strikes. 
It would be funny if people started talking about building a wall around Russia made of anti-air and drone batteries and that the idea came from Donald Trump.  
It'd kind of have a similar feel as the secret train with Lenin sent by Germany in an attempt to destabilize Russia backfiring. >

maybe Ukraine needs drones to reply in kind?
Drones inflicting pain on Russia as the Russian drones are doing in Ukraine could make Putin think again???...or maybe not >

War is starting to feel weird like when you say a word a hundred times and it loses its meaning. These people are trying to murder each other, I don't know why any news about how they're doing it would be controversial. I actually think we need to figure out a way to stop nuclear powers from doing whatever they want other than MAD. >

Good luck with that. America is floating Ukraine a lot of chips in the high stakes game of international poker. And Ukraine already has shown they have the capacity and willingness to strike military targets within Russia. Russia wanted to be the Soviet Union... Looks like they're jumping ahead to the part where it collapses. >

They're really betting on Ukraine not attacking Russia and frankly I think that will happen before Ukraine let's itself just get killed. >

Russia still has nukes. We still are all playing with fire and it’s scary. I support Ukraine though the people there did nothing wrong. >

This war is gonna be the marathon, not the sprint.
The faster we jam that into our skulls, greater our chance of victory. Ukraine still doesn't have as much artillery ammo as it would be optimal, and Raytheon supposedly had difficulties making rockets due to tight labor market. The proper reaction is to commander economy and people a little bit. Build new arms factories, private or public. Introduce work duty for key industries etc.
Large war = large cost. One way or another. >

The problem with drones and exhausting Ukrainian air defenses is that drones can be managed with older AA technology.  You dont need a patriot system to shoot these down, you don't even need a missile.
Old school anti air artillery is more than enough.  Restart flak production and make a few ZSU units to cover cities and drones become far less concerning and way less expensive to deal with. >

Just hit the factory they’re made in. That’s the best defence. >

So, Iran? >

If the shoe fits. >

A protractored attack? What's their angle? >

Seems they're quite obtuse. >

That's not right. >

C'mon CIA step up
Just offer Iran double what Russia pays for the drones, then give them to Ukraine >

I think Iran is more in this as a "Fuck America" move than a money making scheme. >

Russia get out of the Ukraine 🇺🇦 >

The Russia Ukraine conflict is going to destroy Iran. >

When Russia put the recent general in charge did anybody not think this would happen?  He is known for this type of warfare >

Ukraines friends.need to keep incrasing Air Defence systems. Thirty Patriots could defrnd all the Power plants.  Give Ukraine long range missiles to help stretch Russias logistics. >

So you mean that alleged purchase of 2600 Shahed drones wasn’t just bullshit. Quelle surprise. >

We have only seen a tiny glimpse into what drone warfare can be, and I'm not looking forward to the full picture. >

German word of the day is Flakpanzer Gepard >

The problem as I understand it is that the drones cost less than $10,000 a pop and the counter measures cost way more. Plus its assumed by some that Russia will be rolling out its own drones as well. Essentially even if Putin lost every inch of Ukraine he could reign terror on Ukraine indefinitely on the cheap. In a pile of countless scenarios this was one I read regarding if Ukraine recaptured all land, but Putin stayed in power. 
Under this scenario Ukraine lacks the ability to go beyond its borders to stop the drones and Putin can simply burn Ukraine's civilian infrastructure and people until he gets some sort of concession to call the war a win to his people. >

And the only costs will be protracted sanctions, thousands of dead Russian soldiers, and an ever-mounting number of war crimes. >

Russia is also planing on using old soviet biplanes converted into being suicide drones. >

The reality is that drone battles is going to be a thing in the immediate future. So the Western world might as well try to figure out effective countermeasures NOW, and test them in Ukraine. Doing it now is easier than doing it later. >

Feels like the Kremlin is feeling the pressure of the 24. February approximating. >

At this point we might as well include Iran in these titles. Iran is fighting against Ukraine too. Let them get what's coming as well.