>

Unions have their downside in that they protect the laziest, most useless workers who are a dead weight in the workplace. But it's the only leverage workers have so better to hold our nose and embrace the positive aspects.
I certainly hope so. Moving to a union-represented company has increased my pay by 25%, and got me full medical benefits. I only pay $50 a month for my union dues. >

Union dues seem to be the biggest argument I hear from my family about why unions don't work. You're literally making more money than what the dues cost in just a couple of hours at best and you're getting more benefits from your job than before... and job protections.
But nooooo, unions are bad!! We don't need them in this era!! /s for good measure, but that's what I hear from the fam and they're being dead serious. >

A better one is "my union is corrupt/does nothing/waste of due money". Then when you ask if they've ever voted, attended a meeting, contacted their rep, it's an obvious "no". 
Like jeez, maybe if they attended a meeting they'd see what their dues are being spent on and what their union is doing. >

It works much the same as democracy. If you don't participate, you're giving up your primary means to influence how things are. >

It’s also important there’s a balance of power.  Too much lower to management is bad, and too much power on the Union side can lead to bad as well.  When there’s equal footing that’s when things work out best. >

Too much power on the union side? Just make a union for union members. >

That actually exist. I just found out myself the other day >

Unions led to the biggest growth of the working class in history.  Education doubled, and the right lost its grip on middle America. Enter the southern strategy, Reaganism, the Contract on America, the Bush dynasty and whatever the gargantuan fuck the historians will decide the word is for TFG and his orbiters. >

i think "gargantuan fuck" sums it up nicely. >

I just wish there was an easier way for service industry workers to unionize from corporate chains to the bar on the corner. >

The reason why unions are so important is in the cases of billions of dollars of capital negotiating as a single unit (corporations), while labor negotiates as individuals.  The labor/capital curves end up looking like the supply/demand curves of a monopoly.  Unions are one solution to this problem, the other being breaking up giant companies.  When mom and pop places hire people, they have to compete with all the other mom and pop places in their industry the same way workers compete against other workers.  Imagine if the gardening department and menswear department of Walmart had to compete against each other for retail workers.  Both wages would rise.
So unions hired by corporations are more likely to have fairer wages, and tiny businesses hiring individuals are also more likely to have fairer wages. >

Boomers were hugely pro-union...until they got out of the workforce and it was somebody else's job. >

Once your livelihood shifts from working wages to owning capital it's hard for people not to become more right wing.
Nowadays, less and less people are ever in a position  to own capital to passively earn income and will be a wage slaves forever.
So now people are not "becoming more conservative with age". >

Exactly this, but also I think the peachy harmlessness of capitalism is waning in its facade; people are seeing the darker side of it to much greater effect than through most of the post war 20th century.  The lack of ethics have become rampant and brazenly rubbed in people’s faces. >

This is great news because unionizing is the biggest uphill slog it's been in four decades. Labor laws and their enforcement have become more and more stacked against labor. Kids coming into the shitheap we call the modern economy are finally seeing the realities of the system. (Interestingly, unions only represented a little more than 30% of workers at their absolute peak.) >

As a Millennial, it's always frustrated me how so many of my generation just seem desperate to be in the system instead of ready and willing to suffer a bit in order to fix the system.
But I get it. So many of us walked out of college into a financial disaster we had nothing to do with, saddled with loads of student debt when we did everything we were supposed to do. I'm approaching 40 and I would say I really only found financial stability around 35. My parents had it at 20 doing nothing but housepainting and homebuilding. No college at all between them.
Still, I'd rather suffer a bit to fix the system, and I'm glad to see Gen Z getting that. I hope financial reality doesn't scare them "straight" like it did so many of my generation, though. >

Unions are essential for guaranteed fair wage and wage growth. The scales have been tipped for the last 40 years in corporations favor that have done everything to steal from the workers (pensions, benefits)and give to their friends.My conservative father in law constantly says unions stifle innovation and makes it harder to invest in growth. I told him how about invest in the workforce and stop paying CEOs and executives 400x the salary of the their employees. It’s the same speak that conservatives have used to demonized anything that pushes back on their flawed narrative. I’m older but I’m with Gen Z and they shouldn’t have to keep towing the line. >

Unions should be automatic. They should have their dues be tax refundable 100%. And voting should happen every 3-4 months. >

I'm in Australia. My union dues are indeed tax deductable. It's not automatic, but I was taught how to sign up to my union as a part of my degree. It's pretty much expected. >

Please, please keep it up 🙏 >

Good for them. Unions are good. >

Good, unions desperately need young blood in them these days >

Good, they should be. They watched their gen x parents be drained to the core and abused by big business while profit motive destroyed the world. They should want to burn it all down and I for one can not wait. >

I'd much rather they voted and worked to bring about a social democracy instead of 'burning it all down' >

The 'It' I was referring to is end stage exploitative capitalism not the whole system. >

Oh I gotcha, then we're in agreement >

Pro-union, pro-health, pro-human rights, pro-education, pro-LGBTQ, pro-environment, anti-capitalist, anti-corruption, anti-authoritarian...Gen Z is pretty much "the most X" of all these things. If they get motivated enough, they could end up becoming the new Greatest Generation. >

Good. Maybe the tide will finally turn towards workers. Organizing is the only way it will happen. >

We need a Union controlled economy fr >

Besides the generation who went to a literal war over it… can’t believe they didn’t teach that in school. I wonder why >

Good. Millennial here. I support you! >

God my generation rocks. We’re the first generation that wasn’t born in the ‘fuck around’ century and has to live in the ‘find out’ century. I sure hope we are the most pro union, most pro choice, and most anti-neoliberal generation since all we’ve seen is it fuck us and everyone around us over. >

I hope they manage to keep it up, rather than succumbing the the boomer infection like my fellow millennials have. >

Millennials and gen z have basically identical politics. >

No mining Tilium until we get concessions. 
So say we all. >

Funny my dad has been an HR director his entire life. He’s fought unions since before I was born. >

This is a positive trend - curious if it holds over the years to come. Whilst I never personally want to join a union again, their upsides are undeniable for a working society. >

Good! >

My union work paid about twice as much, came with more benefits, more flexible hours, and I didn't have to work through half my breaks. 
No competition. >

Gee I wonder why,
Maybe because underpayment and companies abusing their rights as employers have forced employees who need to work to live (a lot paycheck to paycheck) to fight back? >

Good job Gen Z. There is hope after all. >

Have fun storming the castle! >

Counter view: a union will level the wages, bad performers get more and the top performers won’t get paid what they deserve. The fact is 20% of the people working at a job do 80% of the work. if you are a top performer a union only rewards the bad bunch, and the high performers stop to bother. >

That isn't really supported by the data though. Especially considering companies rarely reward hard work with excellent raises - as proven by the fact that in most cases the best way to get a raise is to get a new job. >

But if wages are set by the union and generally available, maybe people won't jump companies for higher wages anymore.  In fact it will be the employees with the most years of experience that will get the higher salaries.  Now companies won't have to worry as much about their most experienced workers because they might have to start over on seniority if they ever try to move... >

They're easy to mock, but gen Z is awesome. >

Dont forget that they are also the laziest. >

Based on what metric >

The one created by boomers >

Gen Z is pissed off and rightly so! Death to the boomers ! >

Yet they vote for an anti union president. Good jobby. >


Yet they vote for an anti union president.

Do you think if they were given a choice, they'd vote anti-union. The electoral college fucking sucks, plain and simple, especially when it drives all the campaign focus to swing states and do nothing "Isn't the flag just so cool?" centrism. >

low bar to clear for the us but take what you can get etc >

About time someone got a clue. I could never figure out why so many of my peers were so ignorant about unions. I can't stand apathetic people. If we don't organize, you can bet the corporate bosses will organize against us. >

Thank goodness >

Oh, how the tables have turned from 90s rhetoric, which was complete BS >

Make a giant workers union political party please >

Someone point this millennial at the asses I gotta kick into gear. >

There are plenty of our fellow millenials who are anti union unfortunately >

I mean…obviously >

The most pro-union generation so far. >

don't get me wrong I am all for unions but this just seems so strange as a millennial. I went to college and was told 2 years in the same job means you aren't progressing. You need to move on to a better job and more pay. Trying to create a union at my job wouldn't help me at all. I'm not even really sure if unions work or make sense in office jobs where your department is 3 people though. I guess I just can't imagine working for starbucks forever. Even if it paid $50-60k a year >

I think it is encouraging that Gen Z has become politically active and involved in government decisions that will impact their lives more than the over 60 age group of voters.  It's their future. >

UAW Local 160 pride >

“Now back in my day…” >

The GOP is so doomed. 
If we can hold off coup attempt 2024 they're going to be a footnote for decades >

I can understand some of the boomers, genX, and early millennials hesitations with unions -- they were seen as being run by the mob or other criminal cliques, as well as a general playground for corruption. What unions lacked back in those days were strong checks and balances. Fast forward 30+ years and now we have those checks and balances in place (generally speaking, you can never fully eliminate corruption). >

Yes! Let’s join! >

Coincidentally the most pro-lazy, anti-work generation too, funny that isn’t it. >

"The Kids Are Alright"
-a rep from generation X >

Unions suck. They increase costs to companies that often get passed on to consumers. The. They give higher wages to select groups of workers, which is u fair. Not to mention the economic deadweight loss of union admin costs, extra admin costs to companies to deal with unions, plus many more. 
I’m starting a new job soon that has many of the benefits unions ask for and a good salary. I didn’t get it by being part of a union, but by developing my own human capital. Unions were necessary in the early 1900s. They have no place in the 21sf century. People need to learn to negotiate on their own merit. It pisses me off that some products I buy cost more because of unions, and that they contribute to overall cost economic inefficiency. >

One big issue that with unions that people are starting to realize is that they're fundamentally anti-democratic. Given the right-wing takeover of the media, we need to be careful to keep Gen Z from generalizing that outlook.
Like a union is a group of people who subordinate individual interests in an attempt to exert power over their opponents, and that kind of mindset can lead to dangerous outcomes if it gets channeled into groups based around religion or race or gender. Just in the past few years we've seen the rise of White Student Unions, attempting to promote racial interests...I wouldn't be surprised if other similar things start popping up. >


One big issue that with unions that people are starting to realize is that they're fundamentally anti-democratic. 

How are unions anti-democratic, when everyone in charge of the union is elected to their positions? >

Not all unions. That's actually one of the causes of the UAW corruption scandal. The lower levels at the plants are elected by the membership, but the higher levels are elected by the elected levels below them, or are appointed. The natural result of this is a self-selecting "in group" that is insulated from what the actual members want and can't be voted out easily. In order to get rid of the top leadership, several levels below them need voted out first over a long period. >

No surprise here. Kids now are lazy. >

Union support is not synonymous with lazy. >

Pro self worth shit activists though fucking look terribly unappealing lol but well done for the hard work you have my distant support very distant support. >

Why does union membership keep falling? It’s almost like they are cutting deals with management for higher pay and fewer workers. >

No, that's not it at all. Here's a decent article on the topic. 
Tl;dr:

Employers were able to defeat unions so effectively because, over the years, labor law had become heavily tilted against workers and toward employers. >

So the solution is making the defeat even larger? >

I don't understand what you mean. 
The solution is to restrengthen unions to give workers the collective bargaining power they deserve.
The alternative, where workers don't have the backing of a union and are consistently being taken advantage of by the employer, is not tenable. >

They lost collective bargaining power, according to you, when they had far more workers. New union members would merely be new people for employers to exploit. >

Are you implying employers exploit union members more than non union members? I'm not really understanding the claim here.
You asked why union membership was falling, and I explained it was largely due to anti-union legislation. Therefore the solution is pro-union legislation. 
What exactly is the issue with that claim? >

Do you think maybe our balance of trade is involved in union membership plummeting? >

Yes. As was mentioned in the article I linked. >

Okay. Do you think there are any laws requiring companies to offshore?