and all the while another debate went on : there was this invention , this new web , this new energy , this new more like a poison than anything , this unseen but nonetheless felt thing , untried as yet on someone this size ( or as the birds thought of it , someone of this scopescope of being , as a science , philosophy and religion , was in fact established by the birds , and for many an eon formed the core of religion/philosophy in these parts ) : should they use it on him , the host , angel , ex-god , now , in these parts ?