Clojure's n00b attraction problem
Now this is exactly the sort of thing we should be taking issue with (from the comments):> A true noob should probably install java, download clojure and clojure-contrib, run the repl, and stay there for couple 2-3 weeks. No IDE, no web app dev, just functional and concurrent programming with clojure in a REPL. They'll be much better off in the long run because they'll either give up (and save time) or learn something truly outside their comfort zone (and understand the benefit of getting setup for real development).When teaching someone a programming language, your first goal should always be to get them to the point where they've made something real in a domain they understand. Then, they can bootstrap that domain knowledge, and its application within the new language, and use it to "grow into" the rest of the language.The best thing for Clojure would be something that lets you write web-apps (or games, or visualizations like Processing...) in it two minutes after clicking "Download"—because those users would be able to say they've done something in Clojure, be able to say they're sure of their knowledge (because if they weren't, the program wouldn't have worked, would it?) and be able to proceed to learn more with confidence. The worst thing would be to download Clojure and be stuck at a REPL invoking (defproto) to overload String methods with no goal in sight—because that kind of knowledge doesn't stick, and won't get you anywhere.