As another brick in the wall, http://www.alecexposed.org/wiki/ALEC_Exposed is an interesting view of ALEC where vice presidential nominee Pence was a keynote...his record in his state was really awful and should be a cautionary tale to both moderates, liberals, and yes Lynn, Libertarians. Their radically vested agenda is set exemplified by 'stand your ground' which for the first time gave people permission to kill people without a direct threat to one's safety and these model laws have been found even in liberal Oregon.