Project Manager: {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Okay . Good afternoon again .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: So we should have our final meeting about the detail designed of {disfmarker} detail design of the product of the remote control . Um {vocalsound} So here is the agenda for today . Uh uh just going to go quickly through the minutes of the last last uh meeting then we have a p presentation of prototype of you two , sounds interesting . And we'll have um {vocalsound} presentation of evaluation crit criteria by ou our Marketing Experts . Then we'll have to go through finance evaluation of the of the cost of the thing and um hopefully uh we should fit the target o tw of twelve point five uh uh Euro . {vocalsound} Okay . So let's go . Uh if I go quickly through the minutes of the last meeting . {vocalsound} So we went through th uh w we took this following decisions . No L_C_D_ , no speech recognition technology , okay , we went through a b to a banana look and feel for the remote control . We went through the use of wheels and but buttons . {vocalsound} And also the use of a basis station for battery ch charging and uh also to um call the to call the mot mote remote control when it is lost . Okay . Um . Good . So guys let {gap} this uh wonderful thing .
Industrial Designer: Okay so we can go to the slides .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Oh yeah . Sorry . Um .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . Number three . Oh number two sorry .
Project Manager: Which is {gap} {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: So final design . Final design . Okay so Michael you can go ahead .
User Interface: Yeah so uh following our decision to uh make a yellow {disfmarker} well to make a banana
Project Manager: Yeah can you show it to the the camera maybe .
User Interface: remote {disfmarker} okay so we actually have a {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: You can pull it out first , maybe .
User Interface: We've {disfmarker} well first first of all we made a an attractive {vocalsound} base station uh with a banana leaf uh look and feel um and uh
Project Manager: Mm-hmm . {vocalsound}
User Interface: bana sit {disfmarker} the banana sits in there k you know nicely weighted so that it's not gonna tip over and um this is the remote itself , it's kind of it's it's ergonomic , it fits in the hand uh rather well . We've got the two uh {vocalsound} uh scroll wheels here which you know one on the the left for the uh volume and the one on the right for for the channel and uh underneath {vocalsound} we have the uh the turbo button which is in like a nice uh trigger position for you know for pressing quite naturally .
Project Manager: What's the use uh of the t turbo button already ?
User Interface: This is when you when you uh are scrolling the uh {disfmarker} through the channels you can tell it to to skip th past channels that you {disfmarker} quickly rather th
Project Manager: Ah yeah yeah an then you stop when you stop it stops .
User Interface: Yeah . Well when you stop scrolling the wheel it stops . But normally with uh {disfmarker} it will just uh s stay on each station briefly so you can see the the picture .
Industrial Designer: Uh {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Uh-huh .
Industrial Designer: And we we do have one more functionality . If you take the banana as such and uh you press the turbo button , so it switch ons the switch ons the T_V_ .
User Interface: The T_V_ yeah .
Project Manager: Which one ?
User Interface: The s the turbo button .
Industrial Designer: The turbo button .
Project Manager: Okay .
User Interface: So rather than having uh an extra button for um for the on off switch you just use the turbo button .
Industrial Designer: Additional button .
Marketing: What this button for ?
User Interface: This is a teletext button . So once you press that then you get teletext
Marketing: Okay .
User Interface: and you can use the the channel selector scroll wheel as uh {disfmarker}
Project Manager: To navigate it through th through teletext .
User Interface: To navigate yeah .
Marketing: But if you want to go to page seven hundred ?
Industrial Designer: That's right , that's right .
User Interface: Yeah .
Project Manager: {gap} with the wheel it's easy .
Marketing: How man
User Interface: Well then you can you you have like a little uh number selection thing , you press the {gap} the the teletext button uh to move between uh the fields and then you can just scroll the number back and forth so you have s you go {disfmarker} you scroll to seven and then zero zero and then you can uh {disfmarker}
Marketing: I don't understand it . Can you repeat it ? {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound} Well you can you can press press the teletext button
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
User Interface: and then you then you can you can f
Industrial Designer: So then then both the scroll buttons they are for teletext browsing .
Marketing: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: And you can tele
Marketing: Ah okay okay . Okay . Okay okay .
Industrial Designer: yeah ,
User Interface: Mm uh {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: once you press the teletext button then the scroll buttons they are more for teletext , they are no more for channel or vol volume .
Marketing: Okay . I see . I see . Okay . Okay .
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
User Interface: {vocalsound} And this is the uh the infrared uh port .
Industrial Designer: That's right .
User Interface: Also the top of the banana .
Project Manager: Excellent .
User Interface: So . And then we have
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
User Interface: in the uh in the base station we have the the button at the front for uh for calling the uh the banana .
Project Manager: Calling . Excellent .
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Project Manager: And the the leaves plays the roles of of antennas ?
User Interface: Actually they do .
Project Manager: Oh .
User Interface: That's that's yeah that's uh that's form and function in the one in the one uh object .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . So it always means , whatever the rays goes by they they get reflected and then you are having a better coverage .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: It's like antennas .
User Interface: Yeah . So .
Marketing: {gap}
User Interface: But yeah that's um that's just like {disfmarker} that's an attractive um base station .
Project Manager: Great . {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound} So .
Project Manager: So , what else ?
User Interface: Okay .
Industrial Designer: And for the power source we are having solar cells and rechargeable batteries and this and uh the basis station is going to have the input from the mm power line for for charging the batteries .
Marketing: {vocalsound} Is it really weight ? Is it light or {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: It is very light .
Project Manager: Yeah , they're light .
User Interface: It's it's uh it's about the weight of a banana .
Marketing: Okay .
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
Marketing: Okay .
User Interface: You know , to give you the correct look and feel .
Project Manager: {gap}
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Marketing: Ok
Industrial Designer: And we have put these different colours so that people don't mistake them mistake it as a banana .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: Otherwise it's you know a child comes and so {disfmarker}
Marketing: Okay . Yeah yeah yeah , I see . I under I understand .
User Interface: I think a child would try to eat it anyway , so maybe we should
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
User Interface: consider that . {gap} maybe health and safety aspects .
Project Manager: Ah yeah .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
User Interface: {gap}
Industrial Designer: Oh we didn't think of that yet . Yeah .
User Interface: Yeah .
Project Manager: So for the power source , apparently you still {disfmarker} you you want to use both solar cells and batteries .
Industrial Designer: Oh yeah that's right .
Project Manager: Uh you mean {disfmarker} okay . So {disfmarker}
User Interface: I don't really know if the solar cells are actually necessary any more if you have a recharging base station .
Project Manager: Yeah , where are going to {disfmarker} where are you are you going to place them ?
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm mm-hmm . It'll It'll be always at top somewhere at there .
User Interface: If I was gonna place them I'd put them on the on the top here since that's like uh the black bit
Project Manager: You have enough surface ? You {gap} {disfmarker}
User Interface: but yeah I don't I really don't think it's necessary to have the solar cells anymore .
Industrial Designer: Yeah because now we are having rechargeable batteries
Project Manager: Okay .
User Interface: Mm .
Industrial Designer: so that that is {gap} .
Project Manager: What will be the autonomy ? Roughly ?
User Interface: The what sorry ?
Project Manager: The autonomy . Autonomy .
User Interface: What do you mean ?
Project Manager: Uh I mean how long does i how how how long can it be held off a station ?
Marketing: How long the {disfmarker} how long the bit the batteries long .
User Interface: Ah . Ah . A long time .
Project Manager: Yeah . A long {disfmarker} {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound} No no no ,
Industrial Designer: Eight to ten eight to ten hours .
Marketing: {vocalsound}
User Interface: it can {disfmarker} it should be weeks .
Industrial Designer: N most {disfmarker} no most of the time it's not being used .
Project Manager: Yeah , so it's {disfmarker}
User Interface: Yeah but y people don't like to put it back in the base station all the time people leave wanna leave it on the couch so {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: So when when you are making it on {disfmarker}
Project Manager: It's used only when you {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Mm . Mm-hmm . No eight or eight or ten hours of working .
User Interface: Ah , okay .
Industrial Designer: If you are just leaving like that it'll be much longer .
User Interface: Okay .
Project Manager: Yeah . F weeks .
User Interface: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . That's right .
Project Manager: Right . Next slide ?
Industrial Designer: Yeah . And we are having the speakers regular chip for control . Pricing is {disfmarker} was a factor so that's why we have gone for a regular chip only not the advanced chip . And uh that's it .
Project Manager: Okay . {gap} Okay . Those really sounds very good .
Industrial Designer: That's right .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Nothing else to add ?
User Interface: It seems to be falling over .
Marketing: I l yeah .
Project Manager: Yeah .
Marketing: I like I like it . Maybe the the thing that convince me the less is the {vocalsound} the multifunctional buttons . Looks a bit {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: You want to have more functional buttons ?
Marketing: Looks a bit puzzled uh I dunno how to say {vocalsound} that .
Industrial Designer: You are not convinced .
Marketing: You {disfmarker} the the b the buttons change h h their function depending if y it's teletext or not {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Not not many , we we want to keep it simple . So that this button fo is for teletext which is usually also the case , that usually there is a teletext button and once you press that , the channel buttons , they baco become the scrolling buttons .
Marketing: And the volume button will will become {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: It's up to you , means .
Project Manager: Well in fact b both will be {disfmarker} could be useful , navigating through teletext .
Industrial Designer: Now that {disfmarker} Means let's say this this can move the the larger digits and this can move the smaller digits .
User Interface: Or can move between positions in the in the number .
Industrial Designer: That's right .
Project Manager: Yeah .
Marketing: And what about people who want to use digits ? Butto real buttons ?
Project Manager: Wow .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . So there was there was a constraint that the surface area which we have on this banana on one side because of the shape .
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: So we are targeting a segment which is which is just very trendy kind of thing , they they don't care about the buttons any more . And anyway {disfmarker}
Marketing: Okay . Because have you thought about configuration and all this kind of uh stuff ?
User Interface: It's all automatic .
Marketing: It's all automatic .
User Interface: Yep .
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound} Okay . {vocalsound} Okay yeah it's fine .
Project Manager: Very good uh yeah {disfmarker}
Marketing: W we are living in a wonderful world . {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} you th yeah .
User Interface: Uh . {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Bananas everywhere .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Okay , so {disfmarker} {vocalsound}
Marketing: Automatically configure {gap} . {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: So we have to go through now evaluations .
Industrial Designer: Evalua yeah .
Marketing: Yeah .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} So your slides are ready ?
Marketing: S
Project Manager: Uh you're four I think .
Marketing: Yeah .
Project Manager: So this is one , which one is this one ?
Marketing: Yeah .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound}
Marketing: Okay . I {vocalsound} I const I constructed a a list of criteria based on the on the general user requirements . And each criteria is {vocalsound} will be evaluated it's uh logical criteria so we must users must say i if it's true or is {disfmarker} or if it's false in a in a scale ranging from zero to seven .
Industrial Designer: Why this strange factor of seven ?
Marketing: Because i I'm sorry . Sorry .
Industrial Designer: Usually I have seen that scales are from one to ten .
Marketing: Ah yeah . It's from {disfmarker} sorry , it's from one to seven . It's from from one to seven sorry . Because it should be an even it should be an even uh scale ,
Industrial Designer: Okay .
Project Manager: Num number {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Okay . Mm-hmm .
Marketing: and five is too short and nine is too long .
Industrial Designer: Okay .
Marketing: {vocalsound} I'm a I I'm {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Okay fine , got the idea .
Project Manager: So to have {disfmarker} in order to have enough granularity {disfmarker}
Marketing: Sorry ?
Project Manager: it's in order to have enough granularity in the evaluation .
Marketing: Yeah yeah .
Industrial Designer: Okay .
Marketing: The variance is mi it's is minimal .
Project Manager: Okay .
Industrial Designer: Okay , okay , great .
Marketing: I'm um answering your question .
Industrial Designer: Okay . Yeah yeah .
Marketing: Okay .
Industrial Designer: Go ahead .
Marketing: {vocalsound} And that's the criteria I I found more useful . I think I sh I {vocalsound} I could write the criteria in the on the whiteboard ?
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm . Sure .
Marketing: And we all four could range
Industrial Designer: Okay . Yeah yeah . Yeah .
Marketing: could evaluate the {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Okay .
Marketing: {gap}
Industrial Designer: So you can say fancy , handy . Handy .
Marketing: Okay let's let's evaluate if it's fancy or {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Yeah , it's fancy , according to me .
Marketing: Seven but {disfmarker} {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Yeah , six .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: S seven .
Industrial Designer: Seven . Seven by me .
Project Manager: Six .
Marketing: I would say seven .
Industrial Designer: Okay .
Marketing: It's quite fancy .
Industrial Designer: So you can add seven plus six plus seven plus {disfmarker}
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: No , wait .
User Interface: Yeah uh five .
Project Manager: What do you say seven ? Five ?
Industrial Designer: Five .
User Interface: Five , maybe maybe maybe six it's it's I guess it's {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Okay , six point five .
User Interface: yeah .
Project Manager: Handy ?
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: Again I'll give seven .
Project Manager: Seven .
User Interface: I'd give it a six like I'd I think it's probably more handy than my current remote , 'cause of the scroll wheels
Marketing: Six .
Industrial Designer: Yep .
User Interface: but maybe loses the point for not having you know the extra buttons when you reall if you do need them for some reason but you know you can always use your other remote .
Project Manager: So seven , seven ,
Industrial Designer: Seven for me .
Project Manager: six ,
User Interface: Yeah .
Marketing: Six .
Project Manager: six point five . Functional . {vocalsound} {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: I'll give five .
Project Manager: Four .
Marketing: I would say {disfmarker} {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: {gap}
User Interface: Well it depends when you say functional , do you mean it does what we want it to do , or d does what it does , you know , can it make you coffee ?
Marketing: Everything ar
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Uh for a remote control , does he have all the {gap}
User Interface: You know .
Marketing: Mm everything {disfmarker}
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah . Yeah . {gap}
Project Manager: you could expect .
Marketing: It's compared to the all
Industrial Designer: That's right .
Marketing: remote controls .
User Interface: That's before {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: That's right . The standards . What is available in the market off the shelf .
User Interface: Yeah . I have to say four .
Marketing: Actually I don't know what are the r the real specification of a of a universal remote contro
User Interface: Well it's not a universal remote . Remember we're focus we're supposed to focus just on T_V_s .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} We {disfmarker}
Marketing: Ah it's not an univer but it's for all kind of T_V_s ?
Project Manager: Yeah .
User Interface: Well all T_V_s but only T_ {disfmarker} only T_V_s I guess .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} So it's universal but for T_V_s . {vocalsound} So s uh four ?
Marketing: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: Five .
Project Manager: Five ?
User Interface: Four .
Project Manager: Four .
Marketing: Four . Four .
Industrial Designer: So four point two ?
User Interface: Just four .
Project Manager: Four .
Industrial Designer: {gap} four . {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound} Obviously there are some outliers so {disfmarker}
Marketing: So four ?
Project Manager: {vocalsound} {vocalsound} Okay cool ? Cool device .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: There I'll give it seven .
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
Marketing: It means cool features , like new features actually .
Industrial Designer: That's right .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Which {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: For a T_V_ the most important feature which I felt was the locator which is a cool feature . And then the scroll buttons are again cool features . We don't have L_C_D_ for it but that we decided we don't want to have .
Project Manager: Yeah . Seven .
Marketing: I would say five .
User Interface: I'll say five .
Project Manager: Six .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm . Seven .
Project Manager: Plus six , I say {disfmarker} I said seven .
User Interface: Yeah .
Project Manager: So it's six .
User Interface: S yeah .
Marketing: You said seven ? {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Yeah .
User Interface: 'Cause it's five five seven seven so {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Okay .
User Interface: Uh , okay , definitely easy to use .
Industrial Designer: Definitely seven .
User Interface: Seven .
Project Manager: Seven . Seven . And you ? Outl you are not lik outlier .
Marketing: Five . {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Seven {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay okay okay okay .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Okay .
Marketing: Sorry , I have them {disfmarker}
User Interface: Alright , now here's the sixty million Dollar question ,
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
User Interface: well , twenty five twenty five Euro question .
Project Manager: Of course I'll buy the {gap} banana . {gap}
User Interface: What do you what do you guys reckon ?
Marketing: {vocalsound} Of cour Of course the most difficult question for the end . {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Well {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: I'll say five .
User Interface: Hmm .
Industrial Designer: I'll say five .
Project Manager: Twenty five Euros . {vocalsound} Cheap .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Marketing: I find it quite cheap {vocalsound} actually .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Marketing: I dunno . If i i it depends , if you live in in Switzerland or you live in {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Yeah , so the target price is for all Europe , or only for rich countries ? {vocalsound} It's more targeting U_K_ or {disfmarker}
Marketing: I don't know . Wha the initial specifications were for the whole all Europe or {disfmarker}
User Interface: {vocalsound} Uh {disfmarker}
Project Manager: So this is selling costs , not production costs .
User Interface: Yeah . Yeah .
Marketing: Yeah this is the the initial specifications .
Project Manager: Yeah yeah sure . Um {disfmarker} Five .
Marketing: I would say six . It's quite cheap actually .
User Interface: I'd say two .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Aw , should be nice in your {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Why ?
User Interface: {vocalsound} I don't want a banana on my {vocalsound} living room table , a banana remote .
Marketing: {gap}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} No but it's really handy actually if you see .
User Interface: It is handy , it's handy , but it it's terrible .
Industrial Designer: It's it's so handy . And then {disfmarker}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} It's kitsch .
Industrial Designer: Anyb anybody who comes here {vocalsound} {disfmarker} anybody who comes to your home he'll at least ask once what is this .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah . Yeah , but it's not a positive thing .
Industrial Designer: It's a very positive thing if you see like that {vocalsound} .
User Interface: Well , you know , it's it's handy , it's ergonomic , but it's a banana .
Project Manager: Well , don't forget well , don't for don't forget who we're targeting also who are f f who are wh
Industrial Designer: Youngsters .
Project Manager: yeah , youngst youngst
User Interface: Yeah but it says I , I would buy this , so .
Marketing: Actually maybe {disfmarker}
Project Manager: No {disfmarker} well {disfmarker} yeah {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} if you would be young .
Marketing: Yeah {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Not telling that you are young . Li li like a teenager for instance .
User Interface: {vocalsound} No , it's I . I would buy {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Okay you're you're crazy teenager and you like fun things .
Industrial Designer: You want to flaunt .
Project Manager: Yeah .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: You {disfmarker} with your girlfriend or something .
Project Manager: Yeah , you want to show the beautiful banana you have . {gap}
User Interface: S s
Industrial Designer: Or might be it does some other kind of thing but {disfmarker}
User Interface: Still I I'd say two . I don't think I {disfmarker} at any stage in my life I would want a banana remote control , really .
Industrial Designer: Uh yeah , crazy .
Project Manager: Okay so you s you give {disfmarker}
User Interface: I can say , maybe there is a market for it , I dunno .
Project Manager: oh yeah yeah I know I know .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: So you say two .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah .
Industrial Designer: I say five .
Project Manager: F I d I say five . You say ?
Marketing: I change the question . {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} So what's the new question ?
Industrial Designer: And you have saved it ?
Marketing: So yeah upload the {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: You'll have to reload .
Project Manager: Uh yeah , I think so . {vocalsound}
User Interface: Okay , so , it depends if uh {disfmarker}
Marketing: Yeah it's two different situations . If you really need an universal remote control or if you would change your remote control for a n for a new one .
Project Manager: Yeah that's two different question .
User Interface: If I had t if I had to spend twenty five Euro , if that was like my limit , maybe I would buy it . Because the other twenty five Euro remote controls are probably gonna look
Project Manager: Ugly .
User Interface: worse than a banana . {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: They're not going to be as {disfmarker} And they they might not be a as easy as this {disfmarker}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
User Interface: And it {disfmarker} yeah this is gonna f you know handy to use .
Industrial Designer: yeah . Yeah .
Marketing: So ? What now ? What range ?
Project Manager: I stick to five .
Industrial Designer: S
User Interface: Although it still has it still has the word of course at the beginning {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: I go slightly up . Six .
Marketing: Six .
User Interface: so I dunno . Um .
Project Manager: W we have six , five {disfmarker}
User Interface: {vocalsound} I'd give it I'd give it a
Project Manager: Three {vocalsound}
User Interface: I give it a four now .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound} Six ? Six ?
Project Manager: So we are six , five , four {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Six , five , four .
Marketing: Six , so it's uh five point five , or less .
Project Manager: Yeah . So {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Okay .
Project Manager: So and last question , will I change my rem change my remote control from Mando banana . Um , zero . No uh we can't . {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: So one .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Marketing: Actually yeah , I {disfmarker} we {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Well if {gap} .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah .
Project Manager: No uh let's say I'll put two .
User Interface: I'd say three , I mean my remote control is kinda {disfmarker} at home is pretty terrible . If it was {disfmarker} change my remote control of my D_V_D_ player for a Mando banana then I would be more inclined to
Project Manager: It's for the T_V_ .
User Interface: but uh {disfmarker} 'cause it's really bad but uh {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
User Interface: I'd say a three . {gap}
Industrial Designer: I'll still give it five . Yeah .
Marketing: Five ?
Project Manager: Two three five two three fi and two .
Marketing: {gap} You are romantic , really .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} So it's somewhere three point five I think .
Marketing: {vocalsound} I would say two .
Project Manager: So it's r Yeah , three point five . {vocalsound}
Marketing: Who is the outlier ?
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Marketing: Wh wh {vocalsound} you said five ?
Project Manager: {vocalsound} No no you say five , he is the outlier .
Industrial Designer: No I said five .
Project Manager: Okay just just do a sum .
Marketing: I don't know if {vocalsound} it's a {disfmarker}
User Interface: It's not very promising but you know we're not young trendsetters . {vocalsound}
Marketing: No because there are more {disfmarker} yeah , we shouldn't sum like that .
Project Manager: Well maybe we should we should uh have a look globally glob
Marketing: Because the the last two questions is much more important than the rest actually .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
Marketing: Otherwise we wouldn't {disfmarker} we will not sell .
User Interface: Is there some some formula you're using that says you have to sum them up ?
Marketing: Uh no I didn't {gap} anything . {vocalsound} {vocalsound}
User Interface: Well just leave it at that then .
Project Manager: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: Oops .
Project Manager: So maybe maybe w we can we should stick to general feeling . We can had uh have a {disfmarker} out of these numbers , which which is that well we should go for it .
Marketing: Yeah , the uh {disfmarker} Yeah .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Problem with connectors ? {vocalsound}
Marketing: Do you want me to sum
User Interface: No .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah it's it's funny . {vocalsound}
Marketing: o I think it's not {disfmarker}
User Interface: I think it it kind of you just lose information if you sum it , so .
Project Manager: Okay . So let's move uh let's move on .
Industrial Designer: Yeah , sure .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Okay , {gap} now now we have to mm to estimate {vocalsound} uh the cost okay . So I prepare an Excel sh uh an Excel sheet . Um well we are going to calculate the production costs . We should we should be below twelve point five . So I already uh put some pu some numbers here , okay . We are going to go through {vocalsound} {disfmarker} so this is the number the mm number of components we need for this thing . So it appears that there were things that we didn't thought about . Uh and also things that I uh I d I forget to uh to put like solar cells .
User Interface: Well we decided against the solar cells so {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
Project Manager: Oh yeah finally we say no .
Industrial Designer: Solar cells , yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah , we said no to that .
Project Manager: Okay so let's let's go let's go let go through all the lines . So hand dynamo . This something we didn't thought about . But {disfmarker}
User Interface: You mean , charging it by shaking the banana .
Project Manager: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: I think rechargeable batteries will take care of the power thing .
Project Manager: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Project Manager: Okay so we we stick to battery , one .
Industrial Designer: To bring the cost {disfmarker} Yeah .
Project Manager: No kinetic also . I don't I don't see the difference between kinetic and dynamo .
User Interface: Well maybe dynamo is like you have to actually {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Ah you have to {disfmarker} ah okay I see so kinetic is really uh shaking the banana .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Marketing: S
User Interface: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Crazy . Okay . So those banana is falling . Let's go ahead . So we we st only have one for battery . Uh then for electronics um so I didn't put anything for the {gap} .
Industrial Designer: So we have the regular chip on the print , which is one .
Project Manager: Yeah . Yeah .
Industrial Designer: And that's it .
Project Manager: Okay . No {disfmarker} so we hin
Industrial Designer: And we have sample speaker .
Project Manager: Yeah so one .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . Yeah . {gap} the cost of that is very high .
Project Manager: Ooh ye ye ye the cost is increasing . So we are {disfmarker}
User Interface: Well actually that that {disfmarker} no that sample speaker is not {disfmarker} we we're not using that , we're just using the the very beep {disfmarker} simple beep ,
Project Manager: The beep .
User Interface: that s that sample thing is like the voice recording and everything .
Industrial Designer: Uh-huh .
Project Manager: That's what {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm .
Project Manager: Okay so I'll remove it .
User Interface: So {disfmarker} Yeah .
Project Manager: S
User Interface: I say that {disfmarker} Yeah .
Project Manager: So don't we need a {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: And we have sev
Project Manager: Oh there is no listing for r radio frequency thing .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Project Manager: So {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: So we we'll put some extras , if there is something .
Project Manager: Yeah maybe . We'll see later .
User Interface: Mm .
Project Manager: Okay so in {disfmarker} for the case um {vocalsound} I put single curved .
Industrial Designer: Okay . To reduce the cost , it's okay .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Well , wait a second ,
Project Manager: Because we have two things .
User Interface: no , it's it's double curved , it's got a c , it's uh {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Oh it's got all the directions
Project Manager: No .
Industrial Designer: so don't worry . {vocalsound}
User Interface: Well d yeah it's monotonic {vocalsound} but
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: It's got a {gap} direction . {vocalsound}
User Interface: it's got {disfmarker} but if you hold it if you hold it that way that's two curved , one on this side , one on that side , but they're opposite sides .
Project Manager: Well . What a {disfmarker} what i if I put one here .
User Interface: This is actually {disfmarker} I mean this probably
Marketing: Actually what's the differen
User Interface: this probably actually costs more than three
Project Manager: Yeah so let's put one here in the {gap} then instead of single
User Interface: if you {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Okay . Okay .
Project Manager: oka all right .
User Interface: Yeah .
Project Manager: So we stick to plastic , it cost nothing .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . That's right .
User Interface: Well {gap} {disfmarker} no didn't we say we wanted to do a rubber {disfmarker}
Project Manager: No , it's too {disfmarker} no .
User Interface: {gap} if you drop it ?
Marketing: {vocalsound} Too expensive .
Project Manager: It's too expensive . We're already at eleven .
User Interface: Well when {disfmarker} okay . Well we we'll come back we'll come back and see if we can fit it in .
Project Manager: Okay so I put rubber one . Okay so special colour , yellow .
User Interface: Yeah .
Project Manager: Uh for the interface we have {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: We don't have any push buttons .
User Interface: No , we have two push buttons .
Project Manager: We have three .
Industrial Designer: No that is a scroll wheel itself , it'll be put in that .
User Interface: Huh .
Project Manager: No no . We have two scroll , and we have three push buttons .
Industrial Designer: Ah okay , okay .
User Interface: Uh .
Industrial Designer: Okay , okay .
Project Manager: {vocalsound} And {disfmarker}
User Interface: Okay it's gonna have to be plastic .
Marketing: Actually whe whe when you wrote regular chip you should put two , because there is another chip here .
Project Manager: No it's {gap} no chip . This is just radio frequency {gap} . Th This is no chip .
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Marketing: Yeah but
Industrial Designer: No . There's no chip there .
Marketing: you need {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: It just emits the signal .
Project Manager: It's just {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: And the receiver accepts it and that's it .
Project Manager: Yeah .
Marketing: Fo i it does nothing actually ?
Project Manager: No . Just {disfmarker} only {gap} .
Industrial Designer: Just se sends the signal , that's it .
User Interface: It's a recharger thing and uh {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Okay w we didn't think a thought about uh integrated scroll wheel push buttons .
User Interface: Well I actually did um think about it myself {vocalsound} but I thought you know {disfmarker} because you could potentially you know you could be pushing it down as you scroll it for a {disfmarker} instead of a turbo button
Project Manager: Yeah ,
User Interface: but you know the turbo button does add that extra class .
Project Manager: so {disfmarker} Yeah .
User Interface: You know . So I mean if we're if we're over budget then maybe we could we could rethink that .
Project Manager: Okay . So no L_C_D_ , so for {disfmarker} we have no button supplements , right ?
Industrial Designer: Yep . No .
Project Manager: Uh {vocalsound} well in fact could we could not we consider this button as a button supplement because {disfmarker} oh no , these are these are for colours , co and special forms , special colours and special materials .
User Interface: Yeah . No we're not {disfmarker}
Project Manager: So {disfmarker}
User Interface: we don't need anything special for the buttons .
Project Manager: Okay so we are over budget .
Industrial Designer: Yeah . So first thing which we should take care of is ,
User Interface: Make it plastic instead of rubber .
Industrial Designer: instead of rubber , let it be plastic .
Project Manager: Yeah .
User Interface: And then we're basically o on budget except for you know ten cents .
Industrial Designer: And uh that much money will be required for the base station , which is not there .
Project Manager: Yeah .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah .
Project Manager: So mayb in fact n we have to put two here
Marketing: {gap}
Project Manager: because it cost nothing .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah well pl the base station is made out of m many units of {vocalsound} plastic .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Yeah .
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: That's right .
Project Manager: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: So might be ninety centimes for the the remaining things which {disfmarker} the cord and everything which'll go {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Exactly exactly so we have margin for that stuff .
User Interface: Does that include charging circuitry and everything ? {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: That's right .
Project Manager: Yeah maybe . Okay good . Wha
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Project Manager: Excellent .
User Interface: So what do we do with the extra profits ?
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Um we'll invest in R_ and D_ .
User Interface: Okay .
Marketing: {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound} The next fruit .
Project Manager: Yeah . So well we're under the the the cost . So we can go to {disfmarker} through to project evaluation . {vocalsound}
Marketing: Okay so now we have a product which nobody would would buy . Would {disfmarker} yeah , would buy .
Project Manager: Sorry ?
User Interface: No we have a product which none of us would buy . {vocalsound}
Marketing: Yeah because th th the evaluation project {disfmarker}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Which is different . Which is different . None of us will buy it .
User Interface: No it's people in in in Milan and uh in Paris that are gonna buy it .
Marketing: Ah would buy , yeah .
User Interface: We're n
Marketing: Massively , yeah .
User Interface: yeah . We're not in Milan or Paris .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Marketing: Yeah . Okay . Uh you have been in Milan a couple of times , so .
Project Manager: This is a battery . {vocalsound}
User Interface: Actually there were a lot of {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound} And you said the lowest {gap} .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: This is what we {disfmarker} which you can mm {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: S Detachable battery .
Project Manager: It did {disfmarker} yeah .
User Interface: That's 'cause I'm sick of Milan .
Marketing: Yeah , for the batteries {disfmarker}
Project Manager: Extra battery , yeah .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound} Okay so um {vocalsound} project process .
Project Manager: Exac {vocalsound} Well in fact I I did not know {vocalsound} I didn't know really what to say here .
Marketing: {vocalsound}
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} If uh if you have any ideas of what we can we can say . So I don't I don't I don't understand what what they mean by satisfaction um and for and for example .
User Interface: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Should it be more like um like a status of of the {disfmarker} these meetings in fact .
User Interface: {gap} Yeah .
Project Manager: Yeah well in fact uh we we use a little bit the white board and the digital pen , not that much .
User Interface: I dunno I think we had a fair bit of creativity .
Project Manager: Oh yeah it's really creative .
User Interface: {vocalsound} And uh but I think one thing we m missed out of this whole process was a um {vocalsound} like a focus group with the actual people we're targeting .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound}
User Interface: We needed some of these kind of young trendsetters to come in and play with the banana and you know see if they
Project Manager: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: They like that .
User Interface: see if they like it .
Project Manager: Yeah maybe we should go through , yeah an uh evaluation .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
User Interface: Because yeah the evaluation for us is is kind of pointless .
Industrial Designer: Biased .
Project Manager: So maybe you should we should do a kinda evaluation {vocalsound} in the streets like asking to young peoples well , do you like to have a banana as a remote control .
User Interface: Yeah . Because it it would also be interesting to uh you to know find out if we have a market in really young children as well , to see you know how to how to market this thing .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: Yeah .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
User Interface: 'Cause you know if {disfmarker} well I mean maybe you don't wanna give all your kids their own remote because they'll be changing the channel all the time but you know maybe in some households where there is you know a T_V_ for each kid , then you know , banana remote control could be fun for them as well .
Project Manager: Mm-hmm .
User Interface: Might have to draw a face on it . So but I think that's something we need to to work on next time is really finding out more about the target market .
Project Manager: Yep . Any any new ideas we could uh we could investigate next time ? Dunno , oranges ?
Industrial Designer: Yeah . The cost of the thing can be made more than might be . Because I think it's just the optimal , what we have done for the cost which we are looking forward to .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Yeah . I think there are ways we could maybe simplify the {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: Interface .
User Interface: Well just the the the circuit board that we're using inside ,
Marketing: Mm-hmm .
User Interface: I'm not sure really how complicated our um
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
User Interface: our needs are . I mean all we have is two push buttons and two scrollers , do we really need an integrated circuit to
Project Manager: Hmm .
User Interface: you know to process that .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm . Mm-hmm .
Marketing: So more general remote control instead of just focusing on uh on T_V_ .
Industrial Designer: That's right .
Marketing: The complexity shouldn't be much higher .
Industrial Designer: Yeah .
Marketing: For {disfmarker} you said if it good for D_V_D_ then I would {disfmarker}
User Interface: And also fo you know for mood lighting and and stuff , that would be rather cool . I think that's actually something that should be in version two , is the ability to you know to control things other than the T_V_
Industrial Designer: Integrate .
User Interface: and not just electronic equipment but you know the whole environment of the room .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
Marketing: {gap}
Project Manager: Okay . {vocalsound} Very good . {vocalsound} So {disfmarker}
Industrial Designer: So {disfmarker} What else ?
Project Manager: Well done . I think we we can go
Industrial Designer: Okay . Home ?
Project Manager: home .
Industrial Designer: {vocalsound} Happily satisfied . {vocalsound}
Marketing: {vocalsound}
Project Manager: {vocalsound} Yeah . Maybe maybe we can hassle the the production department to to make a a real prototype that we can use at home to to evaluate .
Industrial Designer: Mm-hmm .
Project Manager: {gap} Okay so thanks very much .
User Interface: Yep .
Project Manager: Bye .
User Interface: {vocalsound} Okay .
Industrial Designer: Thank you .
User Interface: Thank you .
Marketing: Bye .


Grad A: Why ?
Grad D: Um .
Grad E: I 'm known . I {disfmarker}
Grad A: No , cuz she already told me it , before she told you .
Grad E: No , she told me a long time ago . She told me {disfmarker} she told me like two weeks ago .
Grad A: Oh , well , it doesn't matter what time .
Grad B: OK . You know how to toggle the display width {pause} function {disfmarker}
Grad A: Well maybe she hadn't just started transcribing me yet .
Grad D: Wow .
Grad A: Anyway .
Grad D: What is it ?
Grad E: Let me explain something to you .
Grad D: Um ,
Grad E: My laugh is better than yours .
Grad D: there .
Grad A: I beg to differ .
Grad B: Yo .
Grad D: Um , OK .
Grad A: But you have to say something genuinely funny before you 'll get an example .
Grad E: Yeah .
Grad D: The thing is I don't know how to get to the next page . Here .
Grad E: No . You should be {disfmarker} at least be self - satisfied enough to laugh at your own jokes .
Grad D: Actually I thought {disfmarker}
Grad A: No , it 's a different laugh .
Grad D: There .
Grad A: Ooh , wow !
Grad D: How weird .
Grad E: Oh ! Holy mackerel .
Grad A: Wow . Whoa !
Grad D: What ? ! Oh . OK . I wasn't even doing anything . {vocalsound} OK .
Grad A: Uh .
Grad E: Eva 's got a laptop , she 's trying to show it off .
Grad D: That was r actually Robert 's idea . But anyhow . Um
Professor F: O K . So , here we are .
Grad E: Once again .
Professor F: Once again , right , together . Um , so we haven't had a meeting for a while , and {disfmarker} and probably won't have one next week , I think a number of people are gone . Um , so Robert , why don't you bring us up to date on where we are with EDU ?
Grad B: Um , uh in a {disfmarker} in a smaller group we had uh , talked and decided about continuation of the data collection . So Fey 's time with us is almost officially over , and she brought us some thirty subjects and , t collected the data , and ten dialogues have been transcribed and can be looked at . If you 're interested in that , talk to me . Um , and we found another uh , cogsci student who 's interested in playing wizard for us . Here we 're gonna make it a little bit more complicated for the subjects , uh this round . She 's actually suggested to look um , at the psychology department students , because they have to partake in two experiments in order to fulfill some requirements . So they have to be subjected , {vocalsound} {comment} before they can actually graduate . And um , we want to design it so that they really have to think about having some time , two days , for example , to plan certain things and figure out which can be done at what time , and , um , sort of package the whole thing in a {disfmarker} in a re in a few more complicated um , structure . That 's for the data collection . As for SmartKom , I 'm {disfmarker} the last SmartKom meeting I mentioned that we have some problems with the synthesis , which as of this morning should be resolved . And , so ,
Professor F: Good .
Grad B: " should be " means they aren't yet , but {disfmarker} but I think I have the info now that I need . Plus , Johno and I are meeting tomorrow , so maybe uh uh , when tomorrow is over , we 're done . And ha n hav we 'll never have to look at it again Maybe it 'll take some more time , to be realistic , but at least we 're {disfmarker} we 're seeing the end of the tunnel there . That was that . Um , the uh , uh I don't think we need to discuss the formalism that 'll be done officially s once we 're done . Um , something happened , in {disfmarker} on Eva 's side with the PRM that we 're gonna look at today , and um , we have a visitor from Bruchsal from the International University . Andreas , I think you 've met everyone except Nancy .
Grad A: Sorry . Hi . Hi .
Grad C: Yeah .
Grad B: Hi . Hi .
Grad A: So when you said " Andreas " I thought you were talking about Stolcke .
Grad B: And , um ,
Grad A: Now I know that we aren't , OK .
Grad B: Andy , you actually go by Andy , right ? Oh , OK .
Grad C: Yeah .
Grad B: Eh {disfmarker}
Grad C: Cuz there is another Andreas around ,
Grad A: Hmm .
Grad C: so , to avoid some confusion .
Grad B: That will be {pause} Reuter ? Oh , OK .
Grad C: Yeah .
Grad B: So my scientific director of the EML is also the dean of the International University , one of his many occupations that just contributes to the fact that he is very occupied . And , um , the {disfmarker} um , he @ @ might tell us a little bit about what he 's actually doing , and why it is s somewhat related , and {disfmarker} by uh using maybe some of the same technologies that we are using . And um . Was that enough of an update ?
Professor F: I think so .
Grad B: In what order shall we proceed ?
Grad D: OK .
Grad B: Maybe you have your on - line {disfmarker}
Grad D: Uh , yeah , sure . Um , so , I 've be just been looking at , um , Ack ! What are you doing ? Yeah . OK . Um , I 've been looking at the PRM stuff . Um , so , this is , sort of like the latest thing I have on it , and I sorta constructed a couple of classes . Like , a user class , a site class , and {disfmarker} and you know , a time , a route , and then {disfmarker} and a query class . And I tried to simplify it down a little bit , so that I can actually um , look at it more . It 's the same paper that I gave to Jerry last time . Um , so basically I took out a lot of stuff , a lot of the decision nodes , and then tried to {disfmarker} The red lines on the , um , graph are the um , relations between the different um , classes . Like , a user has like , a query , and then , also has , you know um , reference slots to its preferences , um , the special needs and , you know , money , and the user interest . And so this is more or less similar to the flat Bayes - net that I have , you know , with the input nodes and all that . And {disfmarker} So I tried to construct the dependency models , and a lot of these stuff I got from the flat Bayes - net , and what they depend on , and it turns out , you know , the CPT 's are really big , if I do that , so I tried to see how I can do , um {disfmarker} put in the computational nodes in between . And what that would look like in a PRM . And so I ended up making several classes {disfmarker} Actually , you know , a class of {disfmarker} with different attributes that are the intermediate nodes , and one of them is like , time affordability money affordability , site availability , and the travel compatibility . And so some of these classes are {disfmarker} s some of these attributes only depend on stuff from , say , the user , or s f just from , I don't know , like the site . S like , um , these here , it 's only like , user , but , if you look at travel compatibility for each of these factors , you need to look at a pair of , you know , what the um , preference of the user is versus , you know , what type of an event it is , or you know , which form of transportation the user has and whether , you know , the onsite parking matters to the user , in that case . And that makes the scenario a little different in a PRM , because , um , then you have one - user objects and potentially you can have many different sites in {disfmarker} in mind . And so for each of the site you 'll come up with this rating , of travel compatibility . And , they all depend on the same users , but different sites , and that makes a {disfmarker} I 'm tr I w I wa have been trying to see whether the PRM would make it more efficient if we do inferencing like that . And so , I guess you end up having fewer number of nodes than in a flat Bayes - net , cuz otherwise you would {disfmarker} c well , it 's probably the same . But um , No , you would definitely have {disfmarker} be able to re - use , like , {vocalsound} um , all the user stuff , and not {disfmarker} not having to recompute a lot of the stuff , because it 's all from the user side . So if you changed sites , you {disfmarker} you can , you know , save some work on that . But , you know , in the case where , it depends on both the user and the site , then I 'm still having a hard time trying to see how um , using the PRM will help . Um , so anyhow , using those intermediate nodes then , this {disfmarker} this would be the class that represent the intermediate nodes . And that would {disfmarker} basically it 's just another class in the model , with , you know , references to the user and the site and the time . And then , after you group them together this {disfmarker} no the dependencies would {disfmarker} of the queries would be reduced to this . And so , you know , it 's easier to specify the CPT and all . Um , so I think that 's about as far as I 've gone on the PRM stuff .
Professor F: Well
Grad D: Right .
Professor F: No . So y you didn't yet tell us what the output is .
Grad D: The output .
Professor F: So what decisions does this make ?
Grad D: OK . So it only makes two decisions , in this model . And one is basically how desirable a site is meaning , um , how good it matches the needs of a user . And the other is the mode of the visit , whether th It 's the EVA decision . Um , so , instead of um , {vocalsound} doing a lot of , you know , computation about , you know , which one site it wants of {disfmarker} the user wants to visit , I 'll come {disfmarker} well , try to come up with like , sort of a list of sites . And for each site , you know , where {disfmarker} h how {disfmarker} how well it fits , and basically a rating of how well it fits and what to do with it . So . Anything else I missed ?
Professor F: So that was pretty quick . She 's ac uh uh Eva 's got a little write - up on it that uh , probably gives the {disfmarker} the details to anybody who needs them . Um , so the {disfmarker} You {disfmarker} you didn't look at all yet to see if there 's anybody has a implementation .
Grad D: No , not yet , um {disfmarker}
Professor F: OK . So one {disfmarker} so one of the questions , you know , about these P R Ms is
Grad D: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: uh , we aren't gonna build our own interpreter , so if {disfmarker} if we can't find one , then we uh , go off and do something else and wait until s one appears . Uh , so one of the things that Eva 's gonna do over the next few weeks is see if we can track that down . Uh , the people at Stanford write papers as if they had one , but , um , we 'll see . So w Anyway . So that 's a {disfmarker} a major open issue . If there is an interpreter , it looks like you know , what Eva 's got should run and we should be able to actually um , try to solve , you know , the problems , to actually take the data , and do it . Uh , and we 'll see . Uh , I actually think it is cleaner , and the ability to instantiate , you know , instance of people and sites and stuff , um , will help in the expression . Whether the inference gets any faster or not I don't know . Uh , it wouldn't surprise me if it {disfmarker} if it doesn't .
Grad D: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: You know , it 's the same kind of information . I think there are things that you can express this way which you can't express in a normal belief - net , uh , without going to some incredible hacking of {disfmarker} sort of rebuilding it on the fly . I mean , the notion of instantiating your el elements from the ontology and stuff fits this very nicely and doesn't fit very well into the extended belief - net . So that was one of the main reasons for doing it . Um . I don't know . So , uh , people who have thought about the problem , like Robert i it looked to me like if {comment} Eva were able to come up with a {vocalsound} you know , value for each of a number of uh , sites plus its EVA thing , that a travel planner should be able to take it from there . And {disfmarker} you know , with some other information about how much time the person has and whatever , and then plan a route .
Grad B: Um - hmm , um , {vocalsound} well , first of all uh , uh , great looks , mu much cleaner , nnn , nnn , Certain {disfmarker} certain beauty in it , so , um , if beauty is truth , then , uh we 're in good shape . But , the um , as , uh , mentioned before we probably should look at t the details . So if you have a write - up then uh , I 'd love to read it
Grad D: Mm - hmm .
Grad B: and uh {disfmarker} because , um , i Can you go all the way back to the {disfmarker} the very top ?
Grad D: Yeah .
Grad B: Um , {vocalsound} uh these {disfmarker} @ @ {comment} these {disfmarker} w w when these are instantiated they take on the same values ? that we had before ?
Grad D: I can't really see the whole thing .
Grad B: or are they {disfmarker} have they changed , in a sense ?
Grad D: Well I think I basically leave them to similar things .
Grad B: Uh - huh .
Grad D: Some of the things might {disfmarker} that might be different , maybe like {disfmarker} are that the hours for the site .
Grad B: Hmm .
Grad D: And , eventually I meant that to mean whether they 're open at this hour or not .
Grad B: Uh - huh .
Grad D: And status would be , you know , more or less like , whether they 're under construction , and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker} or stuff like that .
Grad B: And the , uh , other question I would have is that presumably , from the way the Stanford people talk about it , you can put the probabilities also on the relations . If {disfmarker}
Grad D: Which is the structural uncertainty ?
Professor F: Yeah . Yeah , I {disfmarker} that 's {disfmarker} That I think was actually in the previous {disfmarker} the Ubenth stuff . I don't remember whether they carried that over to this or not ,
Grad A: Mmm .
Professor F: uh , structural uncertainty .
Grad B: It 's sort of in the definition or {disfmarker} in the {disfmarker} in Daphne 's definition of a PRM is that classes and relations ,
Professor F: OK .
Grad B: and you 're gonna have CPT 's over the classes and their relations .
Professor F: Alright .
Grad B: More uncertainty , or {disfmarker} or {disfmarker}
Professor F: Uh ,
Grad B: I should say .
Grad D: I remember them learning when , you know , you don't know the structure for sure ,
Professor F: Yeah .
Grad D: but I don't remember reading how you specify
Grad B: Yeah , that would be exactly my question .
Professor F: Right .
Grad D: wh to start with . Yeah .
Grad B: Well {disfmarker}
Grad D: Yeah .
Professor F: Yeah . So , uh , the {disfmarker} the plan is {disfmarker} is when Daphne gets back , we 'll get in touch and supposedly , um , we 'll actually get s deep {disfmarker} seriously connected to {disfmarker} to their work and
Grad B: Yep .
Professor F: somebody 'll {disfmarker} Uh , you know {disfmarker} If it 's a group meeting once a week probably someone 'll go down and , whatever . So , we 'll actually figure all this out .
Grad B: OK . OK . Then I think the w {vocalsound} long term perspective is {disfmarker} is pretty clear . We get rocking and rolling on this again , once we get a package , if , when , and how , then this becomes foregrounded
Grad D: Mm - hmm .
Grad B: profiled , focused , again .
Grad E: Designated ?
Grad A: Of course .
Grad B: And um , until then we 'll come up with a something that 's {disfmarker} @ @ {comment} that 's way more complicated for you . Right ?
Grad D: OK .
Grad B: Because this was laughingly easy , right ?
Grad D: Actually I had to take out a lot of the complicated stuff , cuz I {disfmarker} I made it really complicated in the beginning , and Jerry was like , {vocalsound} " this is just too much " .
Professor F: Yeah . So , um , you could , from this , go on and say suppose there 's a group of people traveling together and you wanted to plan something that somehow , with some Pareto optimal uh , {vocalsound} uh , thing for {disfmarker}
Grad A: That 's good . That 's definitely a job for artificial intelligence .
Professor F: uh , or {disfmarker}
Grad A: Except for humans can't really solve it either , so .
Grad B: Well that 's not {disfmarker} not even something humans {disfmarker} yeah .
Professor F: Right . Right . Well that 's the {disfmarker} that would {disfmarker} that would be a {disfmarker} uh , you could sell it , as a {disfmarker}
Grad A: Yeah .
Professor F: OK , eh you don't have to fight about this , just give your preferences to the {disfmarker}
Grad A: And then you can blame the computer .
Professor F: w Exactly .
Grad A: So .
Grad B: Hmm . But what does it {disfmarker} uh {disfmarker} Would a pote potential result be to {disfmarker} to split up and never talk to each other again ? You know .
Grad A: That should be one of them .
Grad B: Yeah .
Professor F: Yeah . Right .
Grad E: That 'd be nice .
Grad A: Mmm .
Professor F: Anyway . So . So there i there are some {disfmarker} some u uh , you know , uh , elaborations of this that you could try to put in to this structure , but I don't think it 's worth it now . Because we 're gonna see what {disfmarker} what else uh {disfmarker} what else we 're gonna do . Anyway . But uh , it 's good , yeah and {disfmarker} and there were a couple other ideas of {disfmarker} of uh , things for Eva to look at in {disfmarker} in the interim .
Grad B: Good . Then , we can move on and see what Andreas has got out his sleeve . Or Andy , for that matter ?
Grad C: OK . So uh , uh , well , thanks for having me here , first of all . Um , so maybe just a {disfmarker} a little background on {disfmarker} on my visit . So , uh , I 'm not really involved in any project , that 's uh {disfmarker} that 's relevant to you uh , a at the moment , uh , the {disfmarker} the reason is really for me uh , to have an opportunity to talk to some other researchers in the field . And {disfmarker} and so I 'll just n sort of give you a real quick introduction to what I 'm working on , and um , I just hope that you have some comments or , maybe you 're interested in it to find out more , and {disfmarker} and so I 'll be uh , happy to talk to you and {disfmarker} and uh , I 'd also like to find out some more and {disfmarker} and maybe I 'll just walk around the office and and then {disfmarker} and ask some {disfmarker} some questions , uh , in a couple days . So I 'll be here for uh , tomorrow and then uh , the remainder of uh , next week . OK , so , um , what I started looking at , uh , to begin with is just uh , content management systems uh , i i in general . So um , uh what 's uh {disfmarker} Sort of the state of the art there is to um {disfmarker} uh you have a bunch of {disfmarker} of uh documents or learning units or learning objects , um , and you store meta - data uh , associate to them . So there 's some international standards like the I - triple - E , uh {disfmarker} There 's an I - triple - E , LON standard , and um , these fields are pretty straightforward , you have uh author information , you have uh , size information , format information and so on . Uh , but they 're two uh fields that are um , more interesting . One is uh you store keywords associated with the uh {disfmarker} with the document , and one is uh , you have sort of a , um , well , what is the document about ? So it 's some sort of taxonomic uh , ordering of {disfmarker} of the {disfmarker} of the units . Now , if you sort of put on your semantic glasses , uh you say , well that 's not all that easy , because there 's an implicit um , uh , assumption behind that is that uh , all the users of this system share the same interpretation of the keyword and the same interpretation of uh , whichever taxonomy is used , and uh , I think that 's a {disfmarker} that 's a very {disfmarker} that 's a key point of these systems and they sort of always brush over this real quickly without really elaborating much of that and uh {disfmarker} As a matter of fact , the only thing that m apparently really works out so far are library ordering codes , which are very , very coarse grain , so you have some like , science , biology , and then {disfmarker} But that 's really all that we have at the moment . So I think there 's a huge , um , uh need for improvement there . Now , what this uh {disfmarker} a standard like this would give us is we could um , sort of uh with a search engine just query uh , different repositories all over the world . But we can't really {disfmarker} Um , so what I 'm {disfmarker} what I try to do is um , to have um , uh {disfmarker} So . So the scenario is the following , you you 're working on some sort of project and you encounter a certain problem . Now , what {disfmarker} what we have at our university quite a bit is that uh , students um , try to u program a certain assignment , for example , they always run into the same problems , uh , and they always come running to us , and they 'll say why 's it not {disfmarker} it 's not working , and we always give out the same answer , so we thought , well , it 'd be nice to have a system that could sort of take care of this , and so , what I want to build is basically a {disfmarker} a smart F A Q system . Now , what you uh need to do here is you need to provide some context information which is more elaborate than " I 'm looking for this and this and this keyword . " So . And I think that I don't need to tell you this . I 'm {disfmarker} I 'm sure you have the same {disfmarker} when {disfmarker} when somebody utters a sentence in a certain , uh , context it , and {disfmarker} and the same sentence in another context makes a huge difference . So , I want to be able to model information like , um , so in the {disfmarker} in the context of {disfmarker} in the context of developing distributed systems , of a at a computer science school , um , what kind of software is the person using , which homework assignment is he or she working on at the moment , um , maybe what 's the background of that student 's um , which um , which error message was encountered . So this sort of information I think should be transmitted , uh , when a certain document is retrieved . Now , um , basically giving this um {disfmarker} Uh so we somehow need to have a formalized um , way of writing this down basically , and that 's where the shared interpretation of {disfmarker} of certain terms and keywords comes in again . And , using this and some {disfmarker} some uh , knowledge about the domain I think you can do some {disfmarker} some simple inferences . Like you know that when somebody 's working about {disfmarker} uh , working on {disfmarker} on servlets for example , he 's using Java , cuz servlets are used {disfmarker} are written in Java . So some {disfmarker} some inferences like that , now , um , u using this you can infer more information , and you could then match this to the meta - data of um {disfmarker} off the documents you 're {disfmarker} you 're searching against . So , uh what I wanna do is basically have some sort of um {disfmarker} given these inputs , and then I can compute how many documents match , and use this as a metric in the search . Now , what I plan to do is I want to uh sort of do a uh {disfmarker} uh {pause} try to improve the quality of the search results , and I want to do this by having a depth uh , um , um {disfmarker} steepest descent approach . So if I knew which operating system the person was working on , would this improve my search result ? And {disfmarker} and having uh , uh a symbolic formalized model of this I could simply compute that , and find out which um {disfmarker} which questions are worth um , asking . And that 's what I then propagate back to the user , and {disfmarker} and sort of try to optimize the search in this way . Now , the big problem that I 'm facing right now is um , it 's fairly easy to hack up a system uh quickly , that {disfmarker} that works in the small domain , but the problem is obviously the scalability . And uh uh , so Robert was mentioning uh , earlier today is that uh , Microsoft for example with their printer set up program has a Bayesian network , which does exactly this , but there you face a problem that these are very hard to extend . And so , uh what I 'm {disfmarker} What I try to do is basically try to model this uh , in a way that you could really combine uh , knowledge from very different sources , and {disfmarker} and um , sort of looking into some of the ideas that the semantic web community uh , came up with . Trying to {disfmarker} to have uh , an approach how to integrate s uh certain uh {disfmarker} representation of certain concepts and also some computational rules , um , what you can do with those . Um . What I 'm also looking into is a probabilistic approach into this because document retrievals is a very fuzzy procedure , so it 's probably not that easy to simply have a symbolic uh , computational model . That {disfmarker} that probably isn't expressive enough . So . So that 's another thing , um , which I think you 're also uh , uh looking into right now . And then um , uh sort of as an add - on to this whole idea , um , uh that would be now , depending on what the search engine or the content repository {disfmarker} depending on which {disfmarker} um , uh , which uh , rules and which ontologies it {disfmarker} it uses , or basically its view of the world , uh you can get very different results . So it might ma make a lot of sense to actually query a lot of different search engines . And there you could have an idea where you actually have sort of a {disfmarker} a peer to peer approach , where we 're all sort of carrying around our individual bookshelves , and um , if you have a question about a homework , it 's {disfmarker} probably makes sense to ask somebody who 's in your class with you , sort of the guru in the certain area , rather than going to some Yahoo - like uh , search engine . So these are some of the {disfmarker} just in a nutshell , some of the ideas . And I think a lot of the {disfmarker} even though it 's a {disfmarker} it 's a very different domain , but I think a lot of the , um , issues are {disfmarker} are fairly similar . So . OK .
Grad A: And so some of the {disfmarker} I don't know how much you know about the larger Heidelberg project , I {disfmarker} Are you {disfmarker}
Grad C: Uh I know , yeah I know abou about it .
Grad A: So it seems like a lot of {disfmarker} some of the issues are the same . It 's like , um , you know , the c context - based factors that influence how you interpret ,
Grad C: Mm - hmm . Mm - hmm .
Grad A: um , s how to interpret . In {disfmarker} in this case , infer in in knowing {disfmarker} wanting to know what kinds of things to ask . We - we 've kind of talked about that , but we haven't worried too much about that end of the discourse .
Grad B: Mm - hmm .
Grad A: But maybe you guys had that in the previous models .
Grad B: Well , in a {disfmarker} in one {disfmarker} t one s mmm , small difference in a {disfmarker} in a way , is that he doesn't have to come up with an answer , but he wants to point to the places w w
Grad A: Documents that have the answers .
Grad C: Yeah , so . So I 'm {disfmarker} I 'm not {disfmarker} I 'm not building an expert {disfmarker}
Grad A: Mm - hmm .
Grad C: Uh , I want to build a smart librarian , basically
Grad A: Right . Right .
Grad C: that can point you to the right reference . I don't wanna compute the answer , so it 's a little bit easier for me .
Grad B: Well . Uh , you have to s still m understand what the content says about itself , and then match it to what you think the informational needs {disfmarker}
Grad A: Mm - hmm .
Grad C: Mm - hmm .
Grad A: So you also don't have to figure out what the content is . You 're just taking the keywords as a topic text , as {disfmarker}
Grad C: I {disfmarker} I assume that {disfmarker} that the there will be learning systems that {disfmarker} that tag their {disfmarker} their content .
Grad A: OK . Right .
Grad C: And um , um , m @ @ and basically what I {disfmarker} what I envision is that you {disfmarker} rather than just supplying a bunch of keywords you could basically {disfmarker} for {disfmarker} for an FAQ for example you could state sort of like a logic condition , when this document applies . So " this document explains how to set up your uh , mail account on Linux " or something like this .
Grad A: Mm - hmm .
Grad C: So . So something {disfmarker} something very specific that you can then {disfmarker} But the {disfmarker} I think that the key point with these uh , learning systems is that uh , a learning system is only as good as uh the amount of content it {disfmarker} it carries .
Grad A: Mmm , mm - hmm .
Grad C: You can have the best learning system with the best search interface , if there 's no content inside of it , it 's not very useful . So I think ultimately because um , uh developing these {disfmarker} these rules and these inference uh {disfmarker} inferences I think is very costly , so um , uh I think you must be able to reuse some {disfmarker} some existing um , domain {disfmarker} domain information , or {disfmarker} or {disfmarker} or ontologies that {disfmarker} that uh other people wrote and then try to integrate them , and then also search the entire web basically , rather than just the small uh , content management system .
Grad A: OK . Mm - hmm .
Grad C: So I think that 's {disfmarker} that 's crucial for {disfmarker} for the success of {disfmarker} or @ @ {disfmarker}
Grad A: So , you 're not {disfmarker} I guess I 'm trying to figure out how {disfmarker} how it maps to the kinds of things that we 've talked about in this group , and , actually associated groups ,
Grad C: Mm - hmm .
Grad A: cuz some of us do pretty detailed linguistic analyses , and I 'm guessing that you {disfmarker} you won't be doing that ? OK .
Grad C: No .
Grad A: Just checking . So , {vocalsound} OK .
Grad B: Hmm .
Grad C: No .
Grad A: So , you take the query , and {disfmarker} and {disfmarker}
Professor F: On the other hand , uh , FrameNet could well be useful . So do you know the FrameNet story ?
Grad C: Um , yeah . Uh , not {disfmarker} not too much ,
Professor F: OK .
Grad C: but uh ,
Professor F: Oh . Th - that 's another thing you might wanna look into while you 're here .
Grad C: I have a rough overview .
Professor F: Because , um , you know , the standard story is that keyworks {disfmarker} keywords evoke frames , and the frames may well give you additional keywords or uh , if you know that {disfmarker} that {disfmarker} that a {disfmarker} a bunch of keywords uh , indicate a frame , then you can find documents that actually have the whole frame , rather th than just uh , individual {disfmarker}
Grad C: Mmm . Mmm .
Professor F: So there 's a lot of stuff , and people are looking at that . Most of the work here is just trying to get the frames right . There 's linguists and stuff and there 's a lot of it and they 're {disfmarker} they 're busily working away . But there are some application efforts trying to exploit it . And this looks t it seems to be that this is a place where you might be able to do that .
Grad C: Yeah . Yeah . Yeah . I 'm sure I could learn a lot about um , yeah , just how to {disfmarker} how to come up with these structures ,
Grad A: Mmm .
Grad C: cuz it 's {disfmarker} it 's very easy to whip up something quickly , but it maybe then makes sense to {disfmarker} to me , but not to anybody else , and {disfmarker} and if we want to share and integrate things , they must {disfmarker} well , they must be well designed really .
Grad B: Remember the uh , Prashant story ?
Professor F: Right .
Grad B: The absolutely no {disfmarker} no linguistic background person that the IU sent over here .
Professor F: Right .
Grad B: And Andreas and I tried to come up wi or we had come up actually with a eh {disfmarker} with him working on an interface for FrameNet , as it was back then , that would p do some of the work for this machine ,
Professor F: Right . Yeah .
Grad B: which uh , never got done because Prashant found a happy occupation
Professor F: W yeah , I know , I mean it {disfmarker} it {disfmarker} he {disfmarker} w he did w what {disfmarker} what he did was much more s sensible for him .
Grad B: which in the {disfmarker} Absolutely . Yeah .
Professor F: I think uh ,
Grad B: But so {disfmarker} I 'm just saying , the uh , we had that idea
Professor F: you know {disfmarker} Yeah . The idea was there . Yeah , OK .
Grad B: uh to {disfmarker} to exploit FrameNet there as well .
Professor F: Yeah .
Grad A: Hmm .
Grad B: And um .
Professor F: Yeah , actually you guys never {disfmarker}
Grad B: And Srini 's doing information extraction also , right ?
Professor F: Right .
Grad B: with that FrameNet base .
Grad C: Mmm .
Professor F: Yeah .
Grad B: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: So you {disfmarker} you guys never sent anybody else from I U .
Grad C: Except {disfmarker} except Prashant ?
Professor F: You were y no {disfmarker} Yeah .
Grad C: Um ,
Professor F: Uh , this was supposedly an exchange program , and {disfmarker} I {disfmarker} we {disfmarker} you know , it 's fine . We don't care , but it just {disfmarker} I 'm a little surprised that uh , Andreas didn't come up with anyone else he wanted to send .
Grad A: Hmm .
Grad C: Uh I don't know , I mean the uh {disfmarker}
Professor F: Alright . I mean I had forgotten a I {disfmarker} To be honest with you , I 'd totally forgotten we had a program .
Grad B: Uh it 's in the program ?
Grad C: Uh I {disfmarker} I think it 's {disfmarker} it 's really the lack of students uh , at IU at the moment .
Professor F: Yeah . Yeah . No , no . There was a whole co There was a little contract signed . It was {disfmarker} Yeah .
Grad C: Yeah , yeah . I think it 's ju it 's more the lack of {disfmarker} of students , really , and w we have all these sponsors that are always sort of eager to get some teams .
Professor F: Yeah , I know .
Grad A: Mmm .
Professor F: Right .
Grad C: But {disfmarker}
Professor F: Right .
Grad C: Well I mean if {disfmarker} if I were a student , I 'd love to come here , rather than work for some German {vocalsound} {nonvocalsound} company , or {disfmarker}
Professor F: Yeah . Right .
Grad B: You are being recorded right now , so beware .
Professor F: Oh , right !
Grad C: Well , I didn't say anybody to {disfmarker} anything to offend {disfmarker} well , except for the sponsors maybe , but {disfmarker}
Professor F: Right . Anyway . Right . So I thi tha that 's {disfmarker} that 's one of the things that might be worth looking into while you 're here .
Grad C: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: Uh , unfortunately , Srini , who is heavily involved in DAML and all this sort of stuff is himself out of town .
Grad C: Mm - hmm . Well I 'll go to the uh , Semantic Web Workshop , uh , in two weeks .
Professor F: Right , and {disfmarker} Yeah , for {disfmarker} for some reason he 's not doing that .
Grad A: Yeah . Well , he had other things to do .
Professor F: I don't know why he @ @ {disfmarker} oh , I , who knows ?
Grad A: The uh {disfmarker}
Professor F: Anyway , s yeah , you 'll see {disfmarker} you 'll certainly see a lot of the people there .
Grad A: The other person I thought of is Dan Gildea ? because he did some work on topic spotting
Professor F: Yeah . St - statistical stuff . That would be a very good idea .
Grad A: w um , which is , I mean , you {disfmarker} I mean . I don't {disfmarker} Depending on how well you wanna integrate with that end ,
Grad C: Mm - hmm .
Grad A: you know , like , taking the data and fig you said the learning systems that figure out {disfmarker} We {disfmarker} There 's someone in ICSI who actually has been working on {disfmarker} has worked on that kinda stuff , and he 's worked with frame net , so you could talk to him about , you know , both of those things at once .
Grad C: Mm - hmm . Mm - hmm .
Grad A: So . And he just finished writing a draft of his thesis . So . I u {vocalsound} Dan Gildea , GILDEA .
Grad C: So , uh , who is that again ?
Grad A: And , he 's in one of the rooms on the fifth floor and stuff ,
Grad B: Who ? I can take you to his office .
Grad A: and {disfmarker}
Grad B: It 's just around the corner .
Grad C: OK , great .
Grad A: Hmm . Well , if you fal solve the problem , {vocalsound} hope you can do one for us too .
Professor F: Alright , was there anything else for this ? One of these times soon we 're gonna hear about construal .
Grad B: Yeah . I 'm sure . I have um {disfmarker} I think it was November two thousand three or some {disfmarker} No . Wh - I had something in my calendar .
Professor F: Oh , OK . Right .
Grad B: Um ,
Grad E: Wait a second . That 's a long way away .
Professor F: Good thinking !
Grad B: Uh well , maybe I can {disfmarker} I can bribe my way out of this . So . So I did some double checking and it seems like spring break in two thousand {vocalsound} one .
Grad A: Talk about changing the topic .
Grad B: No .
Professor F: Well , no , but he 's {disfmarker} he 's {disfmarker} he 's {disfmarker} he 's {disfmarker} as you said , he 's , like the state legislature , he 's trying to offer us bribes .
Grad A: At least this is a private meeting . Right , exactly , OK , that 's the link .
Grad B: This uh {disfmarker} Oh , they refused the budget again ? Is it {disfmarker} so about CITRIS ? Yeah , still nothing .
Professor F: Uh , this {disfmarker} this {disfmarker} this {disfmarker} t the s we 're , uh , involved in a literally three hundred million dollar uh , program . Uh , with the State of California . And , the State of California is now a month and a half behind its legis its legally required date to approve a budget . So the budget has not been approved . And two days ago {disfmarker} There 's two l you know , so , two branches of legislature . One branch approved it ,
Grad C: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: and , um , yesterdayday {comment} there was this uh {disfmarker} uh I thought that the other branch would just approve it , but now there 's actually a little back sliding to people who {disfmarker} who approved it got flak from there , eh anyway . So , um {disfmarker} Oh ! I have to tell you a wonderful story about this , OK ? And then we 'll go . So , I {disfmarker} it turns out I wound up having lunch today with a guy named Tom Kalil . KILL {disfmarker} KALIL . And , uh , he now works at Berkeley . In fact he 's hired to run a lot of CITRIS , even though we don't have the money they {disfmarker} So they 've been hiring people right and left , so , uh , they think the money 's coming . So {disfmarker} and he was , I think , the chief staffer to Clinton on technology matters . He was in the White House , I don't remember what he was saying . A anyway , like that . And , is now doing all the politics for CITRIS , but also , has a uh , a lot of interest in uh , actually doing things for society , so digital divide and stuff like that . So that 's s interesting to me but maybe not to you . But the really interesting thing was , he st he s he s said something about , you know I 'm interested in things that have high social multiplier , something that is of great social value . He said , " for example " , this was his only example , " if you had a adult literacy program that was as good as an individual tutor , and as compelling as a video game , then that would have a huge social impact " . I said , " Oh great ! That 's a good problem to work on . " Anyway . So it was nice that uh , he 's got this view , of A , that 's what you should try to do , and B , uh , language would be a good way to do it .
Grad A: Mmm . Definitely .
Professor F: So that 's {disfmarker} So anyway , that 's the end of the story .
Grad A: But for adults and not for the children .
Professor F: This was {disfmarker} Yeah . I didn't push him on the ch on the child thing ,
Grad A: Uh - huh .
Professor F: but , uh , you know , a again , if {disfmarker} if you {disfmarker} if you
Grad A: Oh .
Professor F: um , and this was {disfmarker} this was literacy , which actually is somewhat different problem .
Grad A: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: Maybe easier . I don't know . So this is reading , rather than teaching {disfmarker} Another project we started on , and {disfmarker} and didn't get funded for was , uh , to try to build an automatic tutoring program , for kids whose first language wasn't English . Which is like half the school population in California . Something like that ,
Grad A: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: isn't it ? Yeah . So , enormous problem in California , and the idea was if we 're so smart about language understanding and speech understanding , couldn't we build {vocalsound} uh , programs that would be tutors for the kids . We think we could . Anyway . So {disfmarker} so {disfmarker} But this is a slightly different problem ,
Grad A: Mm - hmm .
Professor F: and um , I know none of us have the spare time to look at it right now , but it i it 's {disfmarker} it 's interesting and I may um , talk to him some more about is em somebody already doing this , and stuff like that . So anyway , that was {disfmarker} that was today 's little story .
Grad E: Hmm .
Grad B: OK . So I {disfmarker} I did manage to get {disfmarker} pull my head out of the sling by sidetracking into CITRIS ,
Professor F: No , no .
Grad B: but uh or {disfmarker} a temporarily putting it out of the sling
Professor F: Right .
Grad B: but , I {disfmarker} I 'll volunteer to put it right back in by stating that I am n uh among some other things in the process of writing up stuff that we have been discussing at our daily meetings ,
Professor F: Yeah .
Grad B: and also revising , thanks for all the comments , the c the original construal proposal . And , if I put one and one together , I may end up with a number that 's greater than one and that I {disfmarker} I can potentially present once you get back .
Grad A: Greater than two ?
Professor F: You 're good .
Grad B: Nnn . {comment} s sometimes , you know the sum is not uh less than the {disfmarker}
Grad A: Uh , right , right .
Professor F: Right . Right . Anyway . Yeah , so {disfmarker} OK , so that 'd be great , but I 'd {disfmarker} I think it 's {disfmarker} it 's time again , right ?
Grad B: Absolutely . Yeah .
Professor F: Yeah . OK .
Grad B: But um , and hopefully all sidetracking um , other things will have disappeared , soon .
Professor F: Good . Yep . Done ?