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Teaching Active Listening Skills to Aspergers Kids
Children with Aspergers generally don't have the innate ability to exchange eye contact or use appropriate facial expressions when interacting with others. This can make them seem odd when interacting with both adults and their peers. Some of the way they interact with others can cause teasing or other behaviors that cause the Aspergers child to feel lonely or left out of the conversations of others. Aspergers children often can tell that something is wrong with their interactions with others, and their self-esteem can suffer as a result.
My 11 yr old aspie is the same way...only has eye contact with those he's completely confortable with. Don't force him!!! Others will just need to be a little more understanding! Let it go!!!
I say let it go...explain to your neighbors that he cant help it...and if they dont understand tell them to move so someone that wants to understand might want to move in LOL
keep engouraging him and maybe it will happen in due time.I was not always engaged in full eye contact but i am better now with it then before.They have too see the light in your son and support him.My friends supported me when other people,my peers would not.
I agree with Tina. We should never have to apologize for our kids disability. Let them be uncomfortable because our kids live that way!!
I don't think you can "force" him. And more importantly, in some cases, the person is unable to concentrate on what's being said while making eye contact, it's too much sensory stimulation. I would work with your son on having him try to look in the speakers direction, if not in the eyes, explaining why most people expect that. And I would explain to the neighbors (if you have enough of a relationship that it matters) what's going on with your son, that's it's not personal or rudeness, and that perhaps addressing your son by name in the beginning of a greeting to be certain he's even heard them and giving him enough time (more than a typical person) to respond would be helpful.
What about "autism awareness"???? Sheesh, it's plastered everywhere and people still give up so easily with these kids. Force THEM to understand! He'll make eye contact when he's comfortable with it... and that may be never and that is FINE. He has a disorder and he will "hear" them the way that works for him... they need to not judge him as being rude or ignoring them. sorry - soap box. :)
My son makes eye contact when he can and often with me as he's comfortable, I'm his mum. If we are talking about deep or difficult stuff he has to look away and that's fine by me. I've found that now my son is older he's easier with eye contact when necessary, things like this have improved with age/confidence and a growing understanding of what others expect.
I have aspergers, and it's literally painful for me to look in people's eyes. Pppplease do not force him to do so
I guess I am fortunate that my son is able to make eye contact. He just doesn't understand it when we tell him to do things, has little empathy for anyone, etc. I actually had a doctor tell me that he isn't autistic because he does make eye contact. But the rest of the stuff is defintely aspergers.
Kids with ASD have to be taught to look at people.. through speech therapy, social skills training. Research has shown that they don't look at peoples faces because they don't read expressions well... ie. when someone is bored, not interested, annoyed, etc. There are numerous programs online that help kids learn and they will!
Cammie Henderson Burke hit the nail on the head. My 10 year old son has explained to me why he has trouble and though I understand, others don't. I feel it is their problem if they don't understand. He had a teacher get mad at him for not making eye contact even though she knows he has Aspergers Syndrome....that's what I don't understand.
My son has a hard time making eye contact with everyone including his father and I. I tell him everyday to look at me and look into my eyes and he immediately stops what he's doing at looks at me. I then ask him to repeat what I just said and he repeats it. It is the only way I can get him to make eye contact and process what I am saying and it works great. I've also told his teachers and karate teacher to do the same thing and for the most part doesn't need as much prompting to make eye contact and having him repeat something that was just explained to him helps him process it.
I know most people say don't force him, but with our son (16 now and looks everyone in the eyes) we would always pause and say 'look mommy in the eyes' using my two fingers pointing at my eyes as a visual cue and I would do it all the time, eventually he did without the cue. I learned this in a social skills group. The thing is, eye contact is very important and we had to teach him to keep his head up too to pay attention (think about cars backing up he doesn't notice, plowing through elderly and others in stores etc) Its very important to help your child learn to look someone in the eyes, as much as you slowly teach them facial expressions. The biggest help in our son's life was being in a social skills group, not to 'fix' him (he still has social quirks) but to help him understand and navigate. My son would not look at anyone in the eye, now he looks someone straight on, is in honors classes (if you can always keep them in classes with everyone else because they pick up on behaviors around them) and this is a child I was told by school he would never be functional in class. Trust me, when they are young the behaviors are extreme and if you dedicate to take the time, and teach those around him some compassion, he will be fine. Also, explain to neighbors why- have thick skin, not all people are understanding. Sometimes you do have to explain if you spend time with neighbors or family, you can't just expect them to know, but you also don't need to explain him to the world. It is a safety measure for those involved in his life to know it's a condition that causes certain things, not willful behavior.I have found most people understand once they know why he does things. I agree about not forcing eye contact but encouraging it, again it's more use of visual cue and tell him 'look at my eyes', over time he will do it on his own. With Asperger's it's a lot of repetition.
Our son taught himself to look at others foreheads; much less stimulating!
5 hours ago via mobile · Like
I asked Andrew why he couldn't look me in the eyes when I was talking to him and he said it was too loud and the loudness hurts! Of course this was before we knew he had Aspergers.
5 hours ago · Like
I've learned the forehead trick as well a long time ago, a teacher actually told me it, (thanks mrs.beetle)
For those that don't really understand the whole eye contact thing, at least for me it gives me that same feeling you get when you know your about to ride the scariest roller coaster ever, and its better for me just to look in the general direction of the person, then it is to try and withstand that feeling and still concentrate on what that person is saying and avoid the "fight or flight" feeling that'll develop quickly.
I've had people think i wasn't paying attention to them, I've had people say "I find it hard to trust someone who won't even look you in the face" (That one stung a bit) so I tend to repeat word for word the previous 5 minutes of conversation they've just told me if they do indeed think i'm not paying attention to them.
It's something they'll adapt to over time, and forcing them to do something like that, when it gives them the heebie-jeebies can only end in disaster and at least for me, just reinforced the fact that looking at peoples eyes is a generally bad idea.
But i'll tell you right now, If you have a kid with aspergers syndrome....encourage the positive aspects of it like wanting to absorb particular subjects and things, and just don't fret the little things...they really don't matter in the long run. as long as your supportive, a good parent and there for your child, the rest will fall into place i promise and they'll learn to adapt over time to those social awkwardness types of deals.
Aspies don't need eye contact to hear people out or retain the whole conversation. My son was allowed to read in one of his classes because he still heard everything and answered correctly every time the teacher called on him.
If your neighbors feel "ignored" they can test how much he heard or listened by asking him questions, maybe then they'll start understanding that they aren't being ignored :/
I see it as their problem not the child's.
But I did, for a while try to teach him to look at people by talking with him and tapping my nose tip when he started to look away, that brought his attention back to my face if not eye contact, but it did increase the amounts of times he makes eye contact when talking with people. It took a long time but now he looks at people at least half the time during a conversation without prompt, but it's more for their insecurities and being offended than his own benefit really
I taught myself and my son to look at people's noses or eyebrows. It's hard as an adult when you don't look at people so practicing this now for my son will make a big difference in his adult life.
about an hour ago via mobile · Like
As a person with aspergers i can tell you that most of you are wrong.
It is not in an aspergers childs best interest to ignore people they don't know/kids in the same class/people on the same street/neighbourhood, etc) as in ignoring them by not making eye contact. or ignoring everyday conversations. to live in a society, and to have friends to be able to get by in life. you need to adapt. for example when i reached 6-8th grade(swedish), teenagers started to get more mature conversations not just playing around. And that's when eye contact/ and starting conversations with new classmates was really important. though i didn't see the point in this and i was severely bullied by my entire school. because rumors of my strange behaviors and "meltdowns" because people in my eyes were targeting me for no reason. i was just disinterested in their conversations and avoided social interaction & eye contact all together. didn't see the point in it. Today (25years) im really socially awkward, really tense around crowds. and/or small groups.
"mingling" around with people is like a minefield. i think i would have benefited a lot from learning the importance of social interaction learning specifically WHY it's good to have and what negative influences it may have on my daily life/future social life: people see you as strange,outsider,misfit. You can't change the whole world to fit your child because the world is too big(sorry moms and dads out there! It's unrealistic ;) Your kids will always face new challenges and having the necessary social skills for it is KEY. building up self confidence, and getting them to cut down on solitude time to be more with friends(get them away from computers!) May teach them to see that social interaction has some good things in store even for them..
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Directed by Guy-Marc Hinant and Dominique Lohlé.
"Over 15 years ago, the Basel-based Fondation Paul Sacher, which preserves archives related to 20th century music, sent its best expert, musicologist Dr. Albi Rosenthal, to Henri Pousseur's home. Upon finding out the scope of documents Pousseur had kept, the musical antiquarian's eyes almost POPPED OUT! Pousseur's past, present and future archives are all donated to the Foundation: magnetic tapes, scores, correspondence, along with his most complex research work, the most obscure sound materials, the most random memos. For the fourth time, Henri leads the convoy en route to BaselŠ This film tells the tale of this last journey."


text:
Show 173: Jean Michel Jarre - Docklands London - 8 October 1988
There are several recordings of Jean Michel Jarre at Docklands - including an official release including excerpts of the concert, with edited tracks. There are also 2 different FM radio recordings I know of - both have very strange sound mixes with delay and so on - I can only assume this was an anti piracy measure at the time. Both would be fairly pointless trying to improve. But a listener to Live and Loud! also sent me an audience recording on CD, which he kindly sent to me for appraisal.
It sounded as you might expect a cassette recording at a large outdoor event might sound! Rather thin, overly bright at times, muffled at other times; the music levels were up and down, crowd noise and fireworks sometimes overtaking the music, wind noise. Lots of wind noise. Consequently I spent the longest time I've ever taken on a restoration, splitting the work over several months. Removing booming wind noise alone was a painstaking (and rather boring) manual process that took many hours - but was worth doing as it was very intrusive. It's not gone completely in places but you will not hear 95% of it and now get far more of the music.
Another thing I noticed in the original recording, which I'd forgotten when I attended the gig myself - there were long pauses sometimes between tracks. So I spared you 6.5 minutes altogether of audience noise and chatter taken from between tracks. Again, not gone completely - it just helps the concert flow better I think. Hopefully you won't always spot the edits!
For an outdoor audience recording I think this one has come up really well; I hope you enjoy it. But bear in mind with such variable sound quality, some tracks inevitably sound clearer now than others - sometimes the fireworks still get in the way and there are a couple of distorted drum hits during Ethnicolor which couldn't be fully fixed - but it is still a good improvement over the original recording I started with and well worth your time.
So sit back, turn it up...and if you want to recreate the wet and windy 2nd night instead, turn a desk fan on while spraying water onto your face. Job done. ;-)
If you would like to have separate, fully tagged 320kbps MP3s or lossless FLACs of the restoration, head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain these for a very small donation towards the site costs. Absolutely no obligation to do so of course - you can take the file on this page absolutely for free - but every single donation does go towards this site and domain/storage costs.
Either way, enjoy the show! And if you like this recording, PLEASE spread the news and share the page link to anyone you think might be interested. Many thanks.
Part 1:Industrial Revolution
Industrial Revolution: Overture
Industrial Revolution (part 1-3)
Equinoxe 5
Ethnicolor
Part 2: Swinging 60's
Computer Weekend
Magnetic Fields II
Oxygene 4
London Kid
Part 3: The 90's
Third Rendez-Vous
Tokyo Kid
Souvenir of China
Second Rendez-Vous
Fourth Rendez-Vous
Part 4: The Finale
The Emigrant
Labels: 1988, Jean Michel Jarre
Show 172 - Soft Cell - Live At Hammersmith Palais London - 8 March 1983
Soft Cell gig recordings from the early 80s are rarer than hens' teeth, it would seem, so I'm really pleased to finally be able to bring you a restoration of one, thanks to the original copy on cassette being sent to me by a listener.
This was a fairly clear but quiet and flat audience recording and I'm not convinced this was the complete gig - this is the only setlist I can find but the recording cuts off after Memorabilia with no "goodnight!" or anything, so I assume they played another track or 2 at least.
There were a few things that needed sorting out as best I can - there's a cut in "Insecure...Me?" which I've faded out and in, and Loving You, Hating Me cuts off rather abruptly and Bedsitter has the beginning chopped off - I guess this is where the tape was turned over back in 1983 - so I've tidied those up too. Also a weird couple of glitches which you won't hear now. And the usual tape dropouts on either the left or right channel that needed fixing. Once all those were done, I got to work on the sound quality with my EQ and other sound tools - far more clarity and "oomph" now, with everything more audible and clear.
For an audience recording I think this one sounds really good and I am sure all fans of Soft Cell will enjoy this one!
If you would like to have separate, fully tagged 320kbps MP3s or even lossless FLACs of the restoration, head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain these for a very small donation towards the site costs. Absolutely no obligation to do so of course but every single one does go towards this site, it's costs and the restorations.
Either way, enjoy the show! And if you like this recording, PLEASE spread the news to anyone you think might be interested. I now have a 1984 recording too but the only way I can gauge demand is on page hits and downloads, so please pass on this page link (not the download link) to others if you can! Many thanks.
Forever the Same
It's a Mug's Game
Insecure...Me?
Loving You, Hating Me
Bedsitter
The Art of Falling Apart
Labels: 1983, Soft Cell
Show 171 - OMD - Live At North Stage Theatre Glen Cove - 3 March 1982
A quick request. If you plan on downloading this and putting it on your YouTube channel or your own bootleg page - I don't mind. But a credit to this website where you found it, and a link back to this page would be really appreciated. It helps me gauge which artists are popular - ie more chance of other restorations coming. Don't just steal it and take the credit (yes you, "Motion and Heart" channel). Thanks.
So, another show from OMD - this time from their Architecture and Morality tour of 1981/82. This was a gig labeled as Washington DC 13 February 1982. The only trouble with that is they played Washington on 1 Marsh 1982. And they were in Belgium on 13 February. But as it turns out - this gig was neither of those. I am indebted to the rather excellent OMD Live site for providing the correct venue and date.
This was originally a rather muffled FM recording in mono and has needed a few things - pitch correction, fixing FM noise in places, distortion, some parts that were just overly loud...other parts that just had a very different sound quality to earlier parts... and that was all before I could try and make the recording sound clearer - there's a clip from the original recording in the intro to this one. Anyway, once all those things were fixed, out came the studio toys to make it clearer (that alone took several hours over several days and several listens). But it's a really good performance from Andy in particular - his voice is rather out of control at times on this one, and it makes a great listen.The last few tracks get a little distorted - mostly at the end of The New Stone Age - but I've minimised that as much as possible.
The recording is not quite complete, missing the Architecture and Morality track gig intro, and the last 3 encore songs: She's Leaving, Julia's Song and Stanlow. But it's still a great recording for your collections.
The Romance of the Telescope
Mystereality
The New Stone Age
Labels: 1982, OMD
The Future of This Website
This site was set up in 2014 in Blogger - which back then was a decent blogging software (Wordpress was another). It's fair to say that times have changed, and Blogger (owned by Google) hasn't really kept pace and is now seen as old hat.
On it's own, that isn't a huge issue for a site as simple as this. However, Google have decided to remove email notifications for anyone subscribing to this site - last time I looked there were approximately 1500 subscribers to Live and Loud! and Google should have been sending out regular emails when I update the site (I haven't even seen these so I don't know!) but that will end this month.
I have access to the email addresses of those who have kindly subscribed through the years and am looking into an alternative solution at the moment; maybe just a once a month message letting you know what the latest updates are. Anyone wishing to unsubscribe will of course be free to do - I certainly don't want to end up spamming anyone not interested.
But in the meantime, there may be a hiatus of a month or 2 until that gets started, so if you want to know the latest - bookmark the site, add it as a favourite, or whatever teh terminology is in your browser of choice - and call back again soon!
Bearing in mind the age of the website, early plans are also being put in motion to redesign the site and move it to a different platform and service altogether. That is more a medium term goal - more news on THAT as it develops; in the meantime, the next update in a week or so, should be all about music and a new live restoration!
Show 169 - Roxy Music - Live At Calderone Theatre Hempstead - 8 March 1976
A quick request. If you plan on downloading this and putting it on your YouTube channel or your own bootleg page - I don't mind. But a credit to this website where you found it, and a link back to this page would be really appreciated. It helps me gauge which artists are popular - ie more chance of other restorations coming. Don't just steal it and take the credit. Thanks.
This was an FM recording originally I think - and another of those I found online where the only copy was marked as a "remaster" by someone else from some point in the past. In truth, it was very loud and very muddy and was really tiring to listen to - so much so I had to strip all that out before I could listen to it all the way through to find and fix any faults.
I did that by spending an hour or so using a 30 band EQ which was like taking a clean, dry cloth to a misty window - lots more detail came out - drums, bass, guitar, keyboards, violin, sax, vocals, etc - all far clearer and you can now hear the quality of the band's playing shine through. And it would no longer give you a headache after a few minutes (with apologies to the original remaster-er if he's out there - I guess we have very different tastes).
Fortunately, after the EQ, there were only 1 or 2 small tape dropouts to fix and then I got to work with the studio tools. Noise had been generated by the previous loud mastering, so I gently removed most of that without affecting things much. The EQ had done most of the work, so a final run through with some mastering tools and the job was done.
Really pleased with how this sounds now - for any Roxy fans who have this gig already - try this one, I think (and hope) you will be very pleasantly surprised. You can now download this restored show exclusively for free, right HERE as one 320kbps MP3 file.
Either way, enjoy the show! Before you go - check out the other restored Roxy Music show HERE.
And finally... don't forget to SUBSCRIBE TO THE FREE NEWSLETTER so you never miss news on which new gigs are going to be restored and uploaded here; any news will be delivered to your inbox and I guarantee you no spam - and of course you unsubscribe at any time.
Sentimental Fool
The Thrill Of It All
Love Is The Drug
Bitter Sweet
Eddie Jobson Solo
Sea Breezes
Both Ends Burning
For Your Pleasure
Wild Weekend
Posted by Flip Martian at 10:08 No comments:
Labels: 1976, Roxy Music
Show 168 - Ultravox - Live At Ole Man Rivers New Orleans - 4 Oct 1980
A quick request. If you plan on downloading this and putting it on your YouTube channel or your own bootleg page - I don't mind. But a credit to this website where you found it, and a link back to this page would be really appreciated. It helps me gauge which artists are popular - ie more chance of other restorations coming. Don't just steal it and take the credit (yes you, "Ultravox Unofficial"). Thanks.
This is an interesting and lively gig from the still relatively new Ultravox line up, who had released their first single, "Sleepwalk" and album "Vienna" a few months earlier, and were in America and Canada for several months before they they returned to the UK for a tour of larger venues starting in December.
Some interesting variations on well known songs, a few mistakes (especially in the first few songs) but overall a really strong performance all await... As well as Midge getting a bit stroppy with the house engineer over a lack of monitoring... You will also hear Billy Currie credited at the end as playing "lead keyboards, guitar and violin" - Billy was playing 2nd guitar on the song "Face To Face" (the jangly guitar line - that's him).
Firstly, as always with audience recordings, the ambient room reverb was partially removed to give me more sound to work on. Then, some rebalancing of the stereo image was required, and then I had to remove a really odd noise that appeared loudly in 1 of the first 3 songs, which took a while - completely gone now. After all that, it was onto the studio tools including EQ, to create more space between all the instruments, bring up the sound of the band and tighten up the sound.
Really pleased with how this sounds now - a must for any Ultravox fan, I would say (and I am one). You can now download this restored show exclusively for free, right HERE as one 320kbps MP3 file.
Or, if you would like to have separate, fully tagged MP3s or lossless FLACs, head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain these for a very small donation towards the site costs. Absolutely no obligation to do so of course. Either way, enjoy the show!
Also, check out all the OTHER restored Ultravox shows before you go!
Astradyne
New Europeans
Passing Strangers
Quiet Men
Western Promise
All Stood Still
Sleepwalk
Private Lives
King's Lead Hat
I am indebted on this occasion to someone referenced in the note accompanying the source files for this show simply as "RH", who originally taped this from the audience on the night. For an audience recording, it was far clearer than most (incidentally, you might see this same source elsewhere on British bootleg sites dated "10 April 1980" - that date is wrong, purely down to the American source tape being labeled "10/4/80" - Americans write the month first, not the day - it's definitely October 4, 1980).
Labels: 1980, Ultravox
Show 167 - Dire Straits - Live At Leeds Polytechnic - 30 Jan 1978
A rather wonderful snapshot of very early Dire Straits, in this soundboard recording taken from a date on the Talking Heads tour of the UK in early 1978, where Dire Straits were support band. The original bootleg I received was dated "31 January 1978" but every source online I found points to this gig actually being on the 30 January, so that's what I've gone with here.
Someone at some point had cleaned this up a little - there was little hiss and "Southbound Again" fades out before the end, with Eastbound Train fading in - but the recording was still unbalanced at times, and quite flat and dull, like most soundboards can be.
So I got to work on the stereo image, rebalanced that, then got to work improving clarity and punch with EQ and other studio tools. There is now "air" between the guys in the band, so you can hear everything much more clearly, and it sounds far clearer and, well just more "live" and exciting. A little final mastering and the work was done.
You can now download this restored show exclusively for free HERE as 1 MP3 file.
Or, if you would like to have separate tagged MP3s or FLACs, head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain these for a very small donation towards the site costs. Absolutely no obligation to do so of course. Either way, enjoy the show!
Southbound Again (fades out)
Eastbound Train
Down To The Waterline
Water Of Love
Setting Me Up
Me And My Friends
Real Girl
Sultans Of Swing
Labels: 1978, Dire Straits
Show 166 - Alison Moyet - Live At The Dominion Theatre London - 25 Nov 1984
A first appearance on Live and Loud! for Alison Moyet, in a restored FM recording taken from her first solo tour of the UK in November 1984.
This one was on a cassette sent in by a listener to Live and Loud! Once I'd transferred it, it was obvious there was quite a lot of damage on several songs; tape dropouts, wow and some bad flutter mainly. After a few days' work, it was far better and I could move onto removing the FM recording hiss and then EQ'ing and mastering.
In common with most FM recordings, this is not the full gig and is just under an hour's worth of her live set from the time, backed by a very proficient live band. It is now sounding excellent for the most part - only a few seconds of damage in a couple of songs are still audible.
Love Resurrection
Honey For The Bees
What Becomes Of The Broken Hearted?
Twisting The Knife
That Ole Devil Called Love
Winter Kills
That's The Way Love Is
All Cried Out
Labels: 1984, Alison Moyet
Show 165 - Gary Numan - Live At Manchester Apollo - 26 Sept 1979
Live recordings of Gary Numan from his first national tour in 1979 are few and far between - and those that exist in the public domain (all audience recordings) are very poor quality generally. But thanks to a few donations over the last year or so, I have been able to invest in better software, so I thought I'd have a go at repairing this one - not quite realising just how much time it would take up!
You can hear a snippet of what the BEST of the original recording sounded like in the intro to the show but this one took a lot of work. A brief list of things fixed for this one...All these things listed are now gone, as best as I can so, so don't worry.. ;-)
First thing I did was reduce the hall "reverb" - the show sounded like it was recorded from the back of the hall (or possibly from the toilet in the bar outside the hall...!) and the band were a long way away. It was hissy (of course). Recording levels were low. Bass distortion in places too. It was too fast and high pitched, there were odd gaps, tape dropouts so all the way through the volume was up and down on the left and right channels (not always at the same time), the sound COMPLETELY changing in quality for a couple of seconds...why? No idea...
There were also some random beeps part way through, which had nothing to do with the gig - I can only think whoever transferred this to digital format used demo software that inserted the beeps! There were also a whole bunch of scuffling banging noises - I think the tape recorder was being moved about during the first few songs and the mic was brushing something.
Sadly, the last part of "Bombers" is missing - I guess that's where the tape ran out and needed turning over. Some things I can't restore - rather than it just STOP as it did on the original, I faded it out and back in as it goes into Remember I Was Vapour. And finally - of course, being recorded from a tape recorder in a hall full of people in 1979, it was in mono.
Once all the above was worked on, only THEN did I get to EQ and use the sound improving tools to improve the sound. In all, this was probably the equivalent in man hours of several days work. Working on a show like this there will always be some compromise in the final EQ choices and it was never going to sound as clear as Living Ornaments 79 of course - or even the full Living Ornaments 80 from Manchester (that was originally a soundboard recording, so far clearer source material) but I think you now have an alternative 1979 live show which is finally listenable!
You can now download this restored show exclusively for free HERE as one 320 kbps MP3 file (some phones and tablets have issues downloading the MP3 from the host site so you may need to use a computer).
If you would like to have separate tagged MP3s or FLACs of this show and show your appreciation for the work put in on all these shows on the site, please head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain separated, tagged files these for a very small donation towards the site costs: a full set of MP3s for £2, or lossless FLACs for £5, ready for you to burn to CD if you wish. Absolutely no obligation to do so, of course. Either way, enjoy the show!
Airlane
Me! I Disconnect From You
You Are In My Vision
Something's In The House
Everyday I Die
We Are So Fragile
Remember I Was Vapour
The Dream Police
Down In The Park
My Shadow In Vain
Are "Friends" Electric?
2nd Encore
Labels: 1979, Gary Numan
Show 164 - Genesis - Live At Wembley Arena - 19 December 1981
A first appearance on Live and Loud! for Genesis, in a restored live audience recording taken from one of the last dates of their Abacab tour of 1981 at Wembley Arena.
Originally a vinyl triple album bootleg, the files I acquired were a direct transfer (in lossless FLAC format) from that. And pretty quiet. And noisy. And not the clearest recording I've ever heard, if I'm honest! I could write a small book on what I did with this one but I will spare you the gory details and summarise...
Vinyl crackle was very loud, recording level of the music was pretty low...crackle removed.
It was an audience recording from an arena, so lots of reverb...so that meant reducing the reverb ambience and ensuring the music levels were louder so I could work on them.
Recording levels were up and down all the way through...so I tried to increase the low levels as much as possible and even out the tape dropouts where they appear, without sounding like it was compressed or limited too much. It's now far better in that regard but not perfect. The perils of automatic recording levels back in the day, I guess. Ssssome pretty bad sssSSSibilance too in places...I did what I could to tone that down.
Eventually I had a sound file to get to work on, with EQ and other studio toys to clear up the muddy sound, bring out some details and dynamics where I could and generally make it a nicer listening experience.
Do be aware there is a long (and slightly rude) story from Phil Collins before 1 song - I left it in along with all his introductions as they're part of the gig experience - but I only mention it here to say there is part of it missing from the recording. At a guess, maybe this was where someone had to turn the tape over on the night, I don't know. There is also 1 track missing from the set - the last track ("I Know What I Like") wasn't included on the recording.
It will never sound like a crystal clear FM or soundboard recording but it's substantially more listenable - and enjoyable! - now. You can now download this restored show exclusively for free HERE as 1 (rather large - it's around 2 hours) MP3 file.
The Lamb Lies Down On Broadway
Dodo/Lurker
Abacab
The Carpet Crawlers
Me And Sarah Jane
No Reply At All
Cindy Louise (Firth of Fifth intro)
Firth Of Fifth
Man On The Corner
In The Cage/The Cinema Show/The Colony Of Slippermen
Turn It On Again
Drums duet
Los Endos
Labels: 1981, Genesis
Show 163 - Erasure - Live at Bedgebury Pinetum Cranbrook - 11 June 2011
"Holy Show Resurrection, Batman!"
Early fans of Live and Loud! may remember an earlier version of this show when Live and Loud! was solely available via internet radio. For various reasons, the show wasn't made available afterwards, or repeated. And wasn't added to the archive (that's this site) when that was set up in 2014.
So it's been lost forever. Until now...
I found it recently in an old set of files and knowing there was interest in hearing an Erasure live show, I could have just uploaded the file, created this page and said "job done". But I didn't - I went back to the show and got to work on it again. 8 years later, I think I'm a bit better at this - and I certainly have better software at my disposal, to make it sound better than it did when I originally did it back in 2013. So that's what I did. And it sounds much better now.
The new version of this full length show is now available to download exclusively for free HERE as 1 MP3 file.
Fingers & Thumbs (Cold Summer's Day)
Heavenly Action
Push Me Shove Me
Victim Of Love
Chains Of Love
Drama!
Blue Savannah
Knocking On Your Door
Who Needs Love Like That
Oh L'Amour
A Little Respect
Posted by Flip Martian at 03:17 1 comment:
Labels: 2011, Erasure
Show 162 - The Human League - Live At Bar 2 Sheffield - 12 June 1978
The first live recording made of The Human League for you this time, done at their second ever gig. It recently came to light on YouTube, marked as their first ever show - and wikipedia lists it as such - but according to Martyn Ware (and he would know) and other sources, it is, in fact, their second. The first gig was also at Psalter Lane Art College but several months earlier - on 16 February 1978. Even so, it's pretty wonderful it's now in the public domain after so long.
The original of this was recorded on a reel to reel tape recorder in a bar, with people milling about talking, getting drinks in, etc - the quality is pretty noisy and not very clear - partly due to THIS version being from a copy of a copy, in mono, and put on YouTube. The guy who originally recorded this still has his stereo original and plans to remaster it himself one day, so this is the best available at the moment.
For those who are interested in such things, I reduced the room ambience, tape hiss, fixed as many dropouts and changes in volume as I could, then got to work with EQ and other studio toys to bring some clarity back and expand the mono sound a little.
Featuring early versions of some songs that would appear on Reproduction, both sides of their first single Being Boiled, and a couple of tracks that would be consigned to history and remain unreleased at the time, this is a fascinating listen, recorded just days before Being Boiled was finally released by Fast Product. While it was never going to be a crystal clear listen, I hope you enjoy this new version.
Or, if you would like to have separate tagged MP3s or FLACs, head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain these for a very small donation towards the site costs.Either way, enjoy the show.
Year Of The Jet Packs
Dance Like A Star
Disco Disaster
The Word Before Last
The Path Of Least Resistance
Circus Of Death
Blind Youth
My special thanks to Paul Forshaw for allowing me to incorporate his cover design in mine (so much better than I would have done) and also to Peter Needham, who's photos from the gig appear in the cover design and below.
Show 161 - The Passions - Live In Amersfoort - 14 July 1981
A debut to Live and Loud! from The Passions. This show was sent in by a listener - but I can't find the emails telling me who! If it was you, reply to my last email to you and I'll sort you out with separated copies! Thanks.
I'm guessing this was originally broadcast by Dutch FM radio. It was mainly good soundwise except for some tape dropouts and volume dips. And many cases of really bad sibilance. All of these I have tried to fix as well as I could, before then EQing the recording to have it sounding as good as possible. It is crystal clear now, so I hope you enjoy it.
Unfortunately the final song, The Swimmer, does fade out quite early - well, on the recording I was given, it just gets cut off, but I applied a fade, so the ending doesn't come as a shock!
Or, if you would like to have separate tagged MP3s or FLACs, head on over to the Donations tab to see how you can obtain these for a very small donation towards the site costs.
I Radiate
Bachelor Girls
Oh No, It's You
(Don't Talk To Me) I'm Shy
Into Night
Alice's Song
I'm In Love With A German Film Star
The Swimmer
Labels: 1981, The Passions
Show 160 - Duran Duran - Live at The Greek Theatre Los Angeles - 27th July 1982
Another show generously donated by a listener to Live and Loud! He got in touch and asked if I could do something with this show - while I already have a 1982 show from Duran Duran on the archive (here), this one is a bit special, so it's well worth posting up on here.
It's from the last night of the USA leg of their Rio tour and features a version of Anyone Out There you might not have heard before! As an audience recording it wasn't in great shape and unfortunately Hold Back The Rain (a favourite of mine) isn't complete. But I worked on the recording a lot to improve the sound quality and now it gives you more of the feeling of being there at the venue, watching them play. You even get the annoying jerk talking next to you for part of the gig...sorry about that!
And as so often, the sound in the first track isn't quite as good as the rest - sound engineer not quite getting the sound mix right for a few minutes, probably - but after that it warms up nicely.
Last Chance On The Stairway
Hungry Like The Wolf
Sound Of Thunder
[Waiting For The] Nightboat
New Religion
Hold Back The Rain
Careless Memories
Encores
Anyone Out There
Labels: 1982, Duran Duran
Show 159: Gary Numan - Live At The Ritz Theatre New York - 26 Oct 1982
Yes, this gig has been done before...but when a friend of mine and listener to Live and Loud! got in touch with a different recording of this show, I took a listen and decided it was WELL worth working on, and replacing the older version with this. Show 88, with over 2200 downloads - and the most popular Gary Numan show I've done so far - is now offline and replaced by this one.
In 1982 Gary Numan spent a year in the USA. While he was there, he went on tour with a unique band; Chris Slade on drums, Pino Palladino on bass, Rob Dean from Japan on guitar and keyboards, Roger Mason and John Webb on keyboards. Recordings of this tour are few and far between - and usually pretty awful quality. Somebody somewhere might still have the original recording the copy I received was taken from - but they ain't sharing if they do! In any case, I doubt without some restoration work it would sound this good...this is the best available recording from that tour being shared out to the world.
It still needed a fair bit of work but was in better basic shape than the source for the previous version was. So after removing hall reverb, lots of studio magic and some final EQ and tweaking...here it is.
This is My House
I, Assassin
Remind Me to Smile
Music for Chameleons
She's Got Claws
Every Day I Die
White Boys and Heroes
War Songs
We Take Mystery (To Bed)
This Wreckage
We Are Glass
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text:
Author: Fran Larkins
LWV-VA Radio Interview on "New Voting Maps in Virginia"
January 8, 2022 Fran Larkins
"New Voting Maps in Virginia" – 30-minute Radio Conversation with WEHC's Teresa Keller and Peggy Layne (LWV-Montgomery Co.) and Chris DeRosa, Co-Coordinator, LWV-VA Redistricting Committee. Aired January 5 and will air again Sunday, January 9 at 2 p.m. Tune in to www.wehcfm.com.
Supreme Court of Virginia Hearing on Redistricting Maps: Part II
December 17, 2021 Fran Larkins
On Friday, December 17, the Supreme Court of Virginia (SCoVA) held the second and final scheduled virtual public hearing on the redistricting maps proposed by the Court's Special Masters. As at the first hearing on Wednesday, all seven Justices could be seen in the courtroom and the two Special Masters were also listening. Sixty-six individuals registered and 51 actually spoke at this final hearing bringing the total for the two days to over 100 members of the public that provided input.
Robert N. Barnette, Jr., President of the Virginia State Conference of the NAACP, was first to speak. "It is particularly important that the Court hear and consider the views of Black communities and other communities of color who have long been disenfranchised, discriminated against, and excluded from meaningful participation in Virginia's redistricting process." He expressed concern that the Special Masters used American Community Survey (ACS) data in analyzing whether Black voters would have the ability to elect candidates of choice in specific districts. "ACS data routinely and often significantly undercounts Black voting age population." The NAACP recommended the Special Masters "use 2020 Census data when determining Black voters' ability to elect candidates of choice under their proposed redistricting plans." He suggested it is unclear if the Special Masters analyzed the precincts to determine how they would have performed in past elections. "The Special Masters must conduct a precinct reconstruction analysis and publicize this analysis, including which elections were used in conducting this analysis." He also asked that additional public hearings be held on any revised versions of the initial Special Masters maps before their adoption by the Court. NOTE: Barnette's time expired but the NAACP's full written comments and recommended maps of Black communities of interest are available on the SCoVA Redistricting Information web page.
Testifying later in the hearing, Phillip Thompson, Executive Director of the National Black Nonpartisan Redistricting Organization, said he understands it's a difficult process but overall the NBNRO "believes this is a decent job." He mentioned opportunity districts, especially for the Senate. He agreed, however, with Barnette that Black population data should be looked at again and analyzed more deeply to make sure of the opportunities for minorities. In addition, the NBNRO does not support looking at incumbent addresses, but they are concerned that four Senators have been paired including African Americans, Sen. Lionell Spruill and Sen. Louise Lucas. Similar to testimony on Wednesday, several other members of the public expressed concern about the packing of Black voters into CD4.
Five speakers briefly mentioned concern about the impact of the redistricting on women incumbents. Two asked that SCoVA continue to ignore incumbent addresses.
The larger focus for the afternoon was on the various regions of the Commonwealth with the majority of testimony on central Virginia. More attention than previously, however, was given to Hampton Roads and Northern Virginia. U.S. Congressman Morgan Griffith of the 9th District also spoke about the importance of Salem and west Roanoke County being in the 9th Congressional District.
For the second day, a large number of people spoke about the problems with the fragmentation of central Virginia. They were against the break-up of their "Communities of Interest (COIs)" related to the movement of Congressional District 7 from the Richmond suburbs and central Virginia to Prince William and Stafford Counties in Northern Virginia.
Western Chesterfield would move from the 7th Congressional District to the 5th. Western Henrico and Goochland Counties, also formerly in the 7th, would move to the 1st District. This time, however, an estimated 18 speakers from Henrico, Chesterfield and Goochland Counties added they felt their concerns were addressed by "the Farkas map." This map was submitted to SCoVA by the Elias Law Group following the hearing Wednesday. The firm represents "James Farkas, a Virginia voter who successfully challenged the General Assembly's unconstitutional racial gerrymander of the congressional map following the last census." [The "Farkas map" was later questioned by Steven Thomas, another member of the public, who cautioned against the map as a Democratic gerrymander.]
Other speakers from the immediate Richmond area included Rusty Tutton of Midlothian in Chesterfield who felt the Special Masters' maps were generally fair and equitable but did not treat the greater Richmond area fairly. Representatives wouldn't be able to spend much time in their districts because they are so large and far flung. He held up maps to the camera, which can be viewed on pages 1801-1806 of the "Public Comments" section of SCoVA's "Redistricting Information" web page.
Steve Baker of Arlington thanked the Special Masters for their dedication to compactness and their efforts to keep COIs together. He then spoke of the natural boundaries that the Special Masters missed when drawing the Congressional Districts. The coastal tidewater region reaches to Henrico County. CD 4 could be extended to Suffolk which is truly southside. It would be better to leave eastern Henrico in CD1 and western in CD5 which has more in common with Chesterfield.
Phyllis Tessieri did not support the Special Masters' maps because "they risk dampening democracy rather than strengthening it. Minorities are underrepresented now and see few people that look like them as representatives."
Three speakers expressed concern that Albemarle County is divided between two Congressional Districts in the proposed maps – the 5th and the 10th. Brandon Turner said the maps are more compact but need reworking to give communities of interest the same respect in all regions of the Commonwealth.
Theresa Hepier lives in the Redfields development one mile outside Charlottesville and asked that Redfields be included in House District 54. The Special Masters maps have placed her community in HD55. She also mentioned she was lucky to have a job where she can take time to testify because good representation is important to her.
Amelia County Supervisor Roger Scott was concerned about the separation of Amelia County from the greater Richmond metro area as they have more in common with Richmond than Lynchburg and southside Virginia. Amelia County is not considered "rural" by the USDA and has a higher income level than the rest of proposed CD5. His comments were echoed by Lauren Whittington and Helen Warriner-Burke who asked that Amelia voters be put back where they belong in the capital region.
Amy Huml said "Putting Louisa County in Congressional District 1 would combine communities with little in common and would make services more difficult for citizens.
Patricia Ranney added, "Splitting of Louisa County seems arbitrary and causes problems with medical care." Melvin Burruss said the Special Masters maps don't fairly deliver representation to the black population in Louisa County by separating heavily black areas and precincts.
Jennifer Heinz of Locust Grove in Orange County spoke against moving Orange County from CD7 to CD10 with Loudoun County. "Orange has nothing in common with Loudoun County." Several additional Locust Grove residents were also concerned that Orange County is split into two House of Delegates districts and "it is better to align them with Culpeper and Madison." Joseph Freeland suggested if the county must be divided that the split be based on the Board of Supervisors proposed voting districts with 1 and 3 in HD62 and 2,4, and 5 in HD63.
Ankit Jain of Vienna requested bringing population from Fairfax into Senate District 32 to provide for a stronger Asian opportunity district and removing Brambleton from S32 to unite that community. He suggested protecting minority interests is more important than "nesting" districts. Jain also asked that SCoVA order revised maps that address the many public comments.
Aaron Yohai is chair of the Braddock District Democratic Committee in Fairfax. He recommended the Special Masters move Wakefield in Annandale from HD15 to HD14 to unify the common zip code and school attendance. He also asked that Kings Park West be united under one Delegate and one Senator. " Burke Center is another COI that is haphazardly divided but could easily be fixed to increase the quality of representation by swapping Robinson and Fairview precincts."
Ted Bloechle of Tyson's Corner submitted recommended changes to three areas of the Special Masters' maps which are available through the SCoVA "Redistricting Information" page. His proposal in Northern Virginia, based on feedback from Mount Vernon citizens, would shift the 8th Congressional District south; in central Virginia he would avoid the split in Albemarle County by moving it and Charlottesville wholly into the 10th District; and in Hampton Roads, he would move Chesapeake and Northeast Norfolk into Congressional District 2 and the portion of the 2nd beyond the Great Dismal Swamp into the 3rd.
Genie McCreery asked, "Please keep Mt. Vernon together. The Special Masters' maps split Mt. Vernon and couples it with Springfield." Cathy Hosek of the Mt. Vernon Council of Citizens Associations testified that McCreery and Ted Bloechle "nailed it!" They have just finished their magisterial redistricting and Springfield was not considered part of their Community of Interest.
Fran Larkins extended thanks to SCoVA and the Special Masters for keeping the city of Fredericksburg whole in all three maps; for recognizing the "Greater Fredericksburg" community of interest in the new compact S27; and for not dividing her community in HD65. She also asked they continue to ignore incumbent addresses.
Steven Thomas of Fairfax and long-time resident of Spotsylvania expressed concerns about splitting up of the Fredericksburg region "at the altar of Northern Virginia." He suggested putting Loudoun and Prince William Counties in the 7th Congressional District but Stafford County and Fredericksburg together with the Piedmont counties in the 10th. Thomas also cautioned against the Elias group map as a Democratic gerrymander.
Andria McClellan, Norfolk City Council member, asked that Congressional District 2 be reconsidered to include part of Norfolk. Adding part of Norfolk to CD2 and returning Suffolk and the Isle of Wight to Congressional District 3 would keep the military community in Norfolk and Virginia Beach together and strengthen minority representation.
Brian Budenholzer of Virginia Beach concurred with Councilwoman McClellan and added the proposed CD2 is not compact or contiguous. Hampton Roads has been split and Norfolk and Virginia Beach communities of interest have the same concern.
Jacob Levy of Norfolk, a third-year law student at Georgetown, agreed because it "better preserves communities of interest which strengthens minority representation and improves compactness and contiguity."
Maurice Hawkins, U.S. Air Force veteran, and John Gadzinski, a Navy veteran, both spoke of the importance to the military community of keeping Virginia Beach and Norfolk together. "They have much in common economically and environmentally."
Victoria Nicholls of Chesapeake lives in the Greenbrier area on the border with Virginia Beach. Her problem is they have been moved into Portsmouth in SD19 when they should be with Virginia Beach in SD18. "They have nothing in common with Portsmouth!"
U.S. Congressman Morgan Griffith of the 9th District spoke about the importance of keeping Salem and west Roanoke County in the 9th. "While the population of the Roanoke Valley requires it be divided in some fashion, the Special Masters lack an understanding of the region. Many of my constituents are shocked that Salem and west Roanoke County are out and Bedford is now in the 9th. Bedford is in the Lynchburg MSA and it's community of interest is oriented east towards Lynchburg and not toward Roanoke. It is also east of the Blue Ridge and not part of the Appalachian region."
"The Special Masters also mistakenly believe the cities of Salem and Roanoke must be together. They don't. The two cities have vastly different histories. Salem was founded in 1802 and became a city in 1969 to prevent being annexed out of existence by Roanoke City. The Virginia annexation moratorium was created by delegates representing Salem and west Roanoke County to prevent encroachment by Roanoke City. In a hotly contested race in 2010, one of the major issues was "Could or should Salem be a part of the 9th?" A majority of the voters said "Yes." SCoVA should respect the will of the voters who said Salem and west Roanoke County should be in the 9th Congressional District."
William Pace, mayor of Chatham, testified that Senate District 9 is good but they should consider adding Hurt to House District 48. Hurt and Chatham are both in Pittsylvania County. "The 5th CD is not perfect, but with the primary in March, time is not on our side so it should be left as is."
Unique Perspectives
Salaar Khan
Prelaw student at William and Mary, is the son of immigrants and politically active. He felt communities should be based on cultures rather than county lines and districts should be independent based on voters not candidates. New communities should be engaged – the disenfranchised, young people, the disabled, and Muslim
Andre Tolleris of Richmond spoke up for proportional voting based on the percentage of vote share. We now create inequity with lines around regions that exist only on maps. Political lines allow manipulation of votes.
Supreme Court of Virginia Hearing on Redistricting Maps: Part I
On December 15, the Supreme Court of Virginia held the first of two virtual public hearings on the redistricting maps proposed by the Court's Special Masters. All seven Justices attended and Chief Justice Donald Lemons announced that the two Special Masters, Sean P. Trende and Bernard N. Grofman were also watching.
Fifty-one individuals testified of the 64 persons who had registered. The majority of those who spoke pointed out problems with the fragmentation of central Virginia and the break-up of their "Communities of Interest (COIs)." Many of their concerns were related to the movement of Congressional District 7 from the Richmond suburbs to Prince William and Stafford Counties in Northern Virginia. Ruth Dale Tutton of Chesterfield spoke of the "vibrant community around Richmond" and added, the maps are "shattering districts with not one word about COIs."
Western Chesterfield would move from the 7th Congressional District to the 5th. Western Henrico, also formerly in the 7th, would move to the 1st District. The movement of CD7 also meant that Goochland and Louisa counties were placed in the 1st Congressional District. Speakers said their rural areas belong with the larger western Richmond suburbs and not with Coastal Virginia counties which make up the 1st. It also doesn't meet the guidelines for compactness. They were also concerned that they will lose all current elected representatives and dividing the county will necessitate building relationships with multiple new representatives.
In another region, Jose Feliciano, former Virginia Redistricting Commission member from Spotsylvania Co. apologized that this hard work is falling to the Justices because of the failure of the Commission. Speaking as a resident of Spotsylvania County, he said the County has nothing in common with Northern Virginia and doesn't want to be part of it. Matthew Kuser, also of northern Spotsylvania County said they have nothing in common with Prince William County and vote more like Louisa.
Several speakers (women and men) spoke of the disproportionate impact of the redistricting on women representatives. Melissa Dart of Henrico pointed out that of 11 Congressional Districts, the proposed maps weaken the three districts represented by women while supporting the eight districts represented by men. Dr. Kim Gower, a professor at Virginia Commonwealth University, said, "powerful women are being shoved to the side." She warned it could "become a huge social justice nightmare." Except for the concern about the possible loss of women as representatives, there were no other mentions of specific incumbents.
Monica Hutchinson and Harold Cothern, both Western Henrico residents, expressed concerns about unnecessarily shifting black voters from the 7th which could result in packing the 4th Congressional District. Ms. Hutchinson also said it "is not OK to minimize Hispanic community voice and power." She pointed out that materials are still provided only in English with no support for language minorities. Lois Maiden-McCray, speaking for the National Black Nonpartisan Redistricting Organization (NBNRO), supported the proposed maps and applauded the transparency of the process. "The proposed maps give minorities increased opportunity." She also pointed out that the NBNRO has Spanish redistricting training on their channel.
Charles Kromkowski of the University of Virginia Department of Politics advised there is a problem with the prison adjusted data as it does not include racial and ethnic data. "This could create problems with the Voting Rights Act." He also pointed out that the draft plans need "benchmarking" for comparison.
Testimony from Legislators –
Senator Richard Stuart was the only Virginia legislator to speak at Wednesday's hearing. He explained "the Northern Neck is a distinct geographic area with very distinct communities of interest which face special challenges due to its isolation by the rivers and its rural nature. It is the Northernmost peninsula in Virginia on the Eastern side of Virginia bounded by two rivers and the Chesapeake Bay: the Potomac on the North and the Rappahannock on the South, and yet, the Special Masters cut it into three different districts." He pointed out that "the true boundaries of the Northern Neck run from the top of Northumberland and Lancaster counties, where it meets the Chesapeake Bay all the way to Eastern Stafford County."
Jeffrey Wice, counsel to the House Democratic Caucus submitted two maps for consideration, one preferred version developed prior to the release of the Special Master's maps and a second providing adjustments to the proposed SM maps which minimize "unnecessary changes to existing maps." NOTE: These and other maps submitted by the public and others in response to the Special Master maps are available through the Court's Redistricting Information page.
Crystal Vanuch, Chair of the Stafford County Board of Supervisors and Supervisor for the Rock Hill District testified that urban development is restricted in western Stafford County because of its proximity to Quantico Marine Corps Base. By using Quantico and Aquia Creek as boundary lines for SD27 and HD64, they are putting a rural part of the county with Prince William County. A solution would be to use Route 610 as the boundary line instead of Aquia Creek.
Gary Hodnett, mayor of Hurt, advocated for his community to remain with Pittsylvania County in Del. Adams' District 48.
Roderick Williams, County Attorney for Frederick County, thanked the Special Masters for not splitting the county and asked for adjustments to the House District boundaries in order to conform with their new magisterial districts and precincts.
Testimony from College students – Russell Swartz of Henrico County opposed the breaking up of "communities of interest" in the Richmond area. A sophomore at Virginia Tech, he advocated for "Keep central Virginia strong!" He felt the weakening of central Virginia is "killing youth engagement." Madeline Doane of Campus Vote Project asked the Special Masters to not split college campuses in the proposed CD4 and CD1 She spoke of particular concerns about the House district around Virginia Commonwealth University.
Positive comments on the maps, Special Masters, and Justices –
Cathy Lowe, former mayor of Abingdon appreciated that they kept Washington County and Bristol together. The proposed Senate District 6 is good though it's hard losing a House District due to population decline.
Carl Anderson of Hampton commended the Court, "Do not let the naysayers dissuade you from implementing outstanding maps." "Once you start tinkering around the edges, it never ends." He also said, "Your methods should be the new gold standard for other states."
Josiah Toepfer of Falls Church thanked the Special Masters for a good job done. He sees improvement with the geographic boundaries significantly different. He has concerns about female representation, but felt it is up to the voters. He also commented, "different views within a district are extremely important for our democratic society."
Chris DeRosa, a long-time resident of Arlington and volunteer for fair maps, thanked the Justices and Special Masters for their work. The Arlington maps make sense, are compact, and reflect communities of interest. Transparency is a win for democracy.
Liz White, Director of OneVirginia2021, thanked the Justices and Special Masters for working hard to engage the public. "This is the most transparent process Virginia has ever seen." She also reminded the Special Masters of the metrics for success: compact and competitive, accurately representing partisan balance, respect communities of interest and municipal boundaries, and provide opportunities for minority representation.
Dr. Kim Gower, VCU professor thanked the behind the scenes administrative staff as well.
As the hearing concluded at 3:37 p.m., Justice Lemons encouraged citizens who were unable to sign up to speak at the hearings to email the Court with their concerns at
All public comment, including written comments, must be submitted by 1:00 pm on December 20, 2021.
SCoVA Posts Draft Maps and Invitation to Hearings
December 8, 2021 Fran Larkins
On December 8, the Supreme Court of Virginia (SCoVA) announced that the proposed maps prepared by the Court's Special Masters Sean P. Trende and Bernard N. Grofman have been posted on the Court's public website. The press release also encouraged the public to comment on the draft maps at public hearings which will be held virtually on December 15 and 17.
The three draft redistricting maps include a single map for the Virginia House of Delegates, a single map for the Senate of Virginia, and a single map for Virginia's representatives to the United States House of Representatives. There are PDF versions and "interactive" versions which allow users to comment directly on the maps. The Special Masters' written report which accompanied the maps indicated they "have worked together to develop any plan" and the maps "reflect a true join effort on our part."
Their 53-page report further described their approach. "We carefully drew districts that met constitutional and statutory population requirements. In doing so, we minimized county and city splits, while respecting natural boundaries and communities of interest ("COIs") to the extent possible. We attempted to draw compact districts, although equal population requirements and Virginia's geography often conspired to limit our ability to do so."
The report provides more specific details on their methodology and choices for location of Congressional, State Senate and House districts. They instituted "nesting" by carving Senate districts out of the U.S. House districts and then drew the House of Delegates districts out of Senate districts. "Overlapping jurisdictions helps ensure communities of interest that underlay the House of Delegates districts have multiple layers of representation."
In addition, their report explained –
"The Statutory Criteria make no mention of protecting incumbents. We therefore maintained ignorance about the residences of incumbents." They plan on "maintaining that ignorance . . . unless otherwise instructed by the Court."
To avoid possible scrutiny and questions from the Supreme Court of the U.S., they drew districts without race as the predominant interest. They believe they have provided "maps that do at least as well or better as the current map in terms of creating districts where the minority community has a realistic opportunity to elect a candidate of choice."
They carefully reviewed the communities of interest submitted by Virginia's residents to the Virginia Redistricting Commission. They also reviewed data from Representable, a nonprofit organization that allows individuals to draw their communities of interest and attempted to incorporate COIs where ever possible. They broadened the definition of COI to include "shared broadcast and print media, transport infrastructure and institutions such as schools and churches" which were part of a U.S. Supreme Court list. They also were "mindful of the Blue Ridge Mountains as an important geographic divider in Virginia' history." They acknowledged there may be other communities of interest of which they're not aware and "look forward to receiving the commentary of this Court and of the public to help improve the map in this regard."
They felt by adhering to the statutory criteria, "We minimize the risk of any undue favoritism toward either party. It would be difficult to draw gerrymanders under these constraints had we wanted to." Once the maps were drawn, they examined the political data in their totality using several different measures. "No single measure is perfect but all we have examined lead to similar conclusions that the maps we drew were neutrally drawn." A footnote referred to the legal judgement as to whether any map satisfies the constitutional requirement not to "unduly favor or disfavor any political party" as one that must be made by SCoVA.
They opted to retain the traditional numbering of the districts to facilitate public comment, but left open the possibility of renumbering the districts in a sensible manner.
In the December 8 press release, the Court also announced that two virtual public hearings will be held December 15 and 17 from 1 – 4 p.m. to receive public comment on the proposed plans.
No in-person public hearings are scheduled, but members of the public, including elected officials, are invited to attend the virtual hearings and provide live comments virtually. There will be an option just to view the hearings, but in order to offer public comment, participants must notify the Clerk of Court by sending an email at least 24 hours in advance to
and indicating which of the dates they prefer. Further detailed instructions are on the press release and members of the public will be emailed instructions on what to expect and how to participate. The email should include the requestor's name and email address, and where they reside in the Commonwealth.
The Court also encouraged the public to continue to submit written comments to
and to comment on the maps proposed by the Special Masters directly on the interactive maps on the Court's website. Written comments must be submitted by 1 p.m. on December 20, 2021 in order to be reviewed by the Court or its Special Masters.
SCoVA Rejects 1 Republican Nominee for Special Master, Seeks More Names
November 12, 2021 Fran Larkins
The judges of the Supreme Court of Virginia (SCOVA) told the Republican leadership of the General Assembly to submit the names of three more nominees to serve as a Republican special master to redraw the state's districts after rejecting one nominee and raising "concerns" about the other two. In its order issued Friday, November 12, the court told party leaders to submit at least three new names by Monday November 15. The court also instructed Democratic leaders to submit at least one additional name after one of their nominees had expressed a reservation about the requirement that the "two Special Masters shall work together to develop any plan to submit to be submitted to the Court."
The Order also further addressed the role and requirements for Special Masters. "Although the Special Master candidates are to be nominated by legislative leaders of a particular political party, the nominees will serve as officers of the Court in a quasi-judicial capacity. Consequently, the Special Masters must be neutral and must not act as advocates or representatives of any political party. Before being appointed, the Special Masters must warrant that they have no 'conflicts of interest,' Code 30-399(F), that precludes them from prudently exercising independent judgement, dispassionately follow the Court's instructions, and objectively applying the governing decision-making criteria."
In addition, the Order stated that "The Special Masters appointed by this Court will not be permitted to consult with any political parties, partisan organizations, outside experts, or any other person or entity except for their personal support staff and individuals specifically authorized by this Court."
The actions by the court were in response to letters from the General Assembly's Democratic leadership, Senate Majority Leader Dick Saslaw, (November 8) and House Speaker Eileen Filler-Corn (November 10), who sought disqualification of all three of the Republican nominees. Republican leaders had submitted their response on November 10, 2021.
The court's order specifically disqualified Thomas Bryan, a statistician who had been paid a $20,000 consulting fee by the Virginia Senate Republican Caucus in September. The order said Bryan had disclosed the arrangement during the selection process, and the court concluded that it represented a conflict. The court also expressed concerns about the other two GOP nominees, Adam Kinkaid, executive director of the National Republican Redistricting Trust, and Adam Foltz, who has done redistricting work for Republicans in other states. The court did not disclose which of the Democratic nominees had expressed reservations about serving.
Supreme Court of Virginia Announces Nominees for Special Master
November 4, 2021 Fran Larkins
On November 4, the Supreme Court of Virginia announced the six nominees for Special Master which were submitted by the Democratic and Republican leaders of the House and Senate. The House and Senate caucuses coordinated and nominated the same three people to serve as special master. The following are excerpts from the information available in full on the new SCoVA "Redistricting Information" web page.
The nominees for special master from the Democratic Caucuses are –
Dr. Bernard Grofman, Ph.D. – "Dr. Grofman is the Jack W. Peltason Endowed Chair, Distinguished Professor of Political Science and Adjunct Professor of Economics at the University of California, Irvine. He has extensive experience serving as a court-appointed special master for drawing both state legislative and congressional maps, including in Virginia, having served as special master to courts in drawing Virginia congressional districts in 2015 and House of Delegates districts in 2018. He has a degree in mathematics and a Ph.D. in political science from the University of Chicago."
Dr. Nathaniel Persily, Ph.D. – "Dr. Persily is the James B. McClatchy Professor of Law at Stanford Law School. He has extensive experience serving as a court-appointed special master for drawing both state legislative and congressional maps in numerous states across the country. He is most recently the author of Solutions to Polarization (Cambridge, 2015), a scholarly book addressing the problem of political polarization."
Dr. Bruce Cain, Ph.D. – "Dr. Cain is the Charles Louis Ducommun Professor in the School of Humanities and Sciences at Stanford University, and Senior Fellow at the Woods Institute for the Environment and at Stanford University, and Senior Fellow at the Woods Institute for the Environment an at the Stanford Institute for Economic Policy Research. He served as a court-appointed special master to draw state legislative districts in Arizona in 2002 and has served as a redistricting consultant to a number of government agencies, including the Attorney General of Maryland."
The Republican Caucuses nominated –
Thomas Bryan – "Mr. Bryan is an applied demographic research professional who holds a Masters in Management and Information Systems from George Washington University and a Masters in Urban Studies with a focus on Demography and Statistics from Portland State University. He previously worked as a statistician in the United States Census Bureau during the 2000 cycle where he developed small area population and housing unit estimates. He founded his own demographic analysis consulting firm in 2001 (BryanGeoDemographics) and has provided advanced analytic expertise to more than 150 bipartisan clients over the last two decades, including litigation support and expert witness services in many state and local redistricting cases."
Adam Kincaid – "Mr. Kincaid holds a Masters of Public Policy from the University of Georgia. He previously worked as Redistricting Coordinator for the National Republican Congressional Committee following the 2010 Census, and currently serves as Executive Director of the National Republican Redistricting Trust and Fair Lines America where he advocates for fair maps constructed using traditional redistricting criteria."
Adam Foltz – "Mr. Foltz has extensive experience in the mechanics of redistricting at the state level, having served as the primary redistricting map drawer for the Wisconsin State Assembly Republican Caucus during the 2011-12 cycle. During his eight-year tenure as Policy Advisor to Wisconsin Sente Majority Leader Scott Fitzgerald, he also gained relevant experience in preparing the state's legal defense against challenges to adopted maps. He now works as a Legislative Analyst for the Texas Legislative Council, where he is working with a bipartisan group of Members to draft new maps."
In his letter to SCoVA submitting the nominees, Senate Majority Leader Richard Saslaw also called on the Court to maintain maximum transparency and public access. A commenting system with online viewing like what he suggested has already been implemented. Senator Saslaw also "proposed the special masters request public hearings in at least four regions of the Commonwealth to afford an opportunity for public comment on those proposed maps." The Senate Democratic Caucus also "respectfully requested that the Court adopt a formal briefing schedule that will allow the majority and minority leadership in the General Assembly, and other individuals or organizations, to lay their concerns before the Court and respond to each other's arguments in a timely and orderly fashion."
The new "Redistricting Information" page instructs the public, including elected officials, to participate in the Court's redistricting deliberations through submission of written comments to the Clerk of the Supreme Court of Virginia and reference the "Rules and Procedures for Implementing the Requirements of Article II, Section 6-A." Comments must be sent to
. All public comments will be available for viewing online and several have already been posted. The page will also include Court orders.
Commission Stalled on Congressional District Maps!
October 20, 2021 Fran Larkins
The problem of "partisan fairness" was again front and center at the Virginia Redistricting Commission meeting on Wednesday, October 20. After Monday's meeting where lack of a quorum prevented conducting business and voting, the agenda provided time for additional public comments and then turned to a presentation of Congressional district maps.
Del. Marcus Simon (D-Falls Church) began by offering map #349 submitted by Katherine Kline, a member of the public. "I like the way it configured Northern Virginia and it did get us close to what Senator Barker and others feel is a fair outcome." There were concerns, however, that it had been called a Democratic gerrymander. This was followed by the revised C1 maps from the Democratic (C1-B) and Republican map drawers (C1-A). The co-chairs had asked them to consider public comments and have another try at the maps.
As each team provided the data on the partisan make-up of the districts, the problem of comparing "apples to apples" was frequently raised and the "math" of the opposing party was frequently challenged. There were several unsuccessful attempts by Sen. George Barker (D-Alexandria) to negotiate with numbers that he had run. Sen. Barker also reminded the commissioners that there have been many changes in Virginia's maps over the last decade and the districts aren't locked in for the next decade. The definition of "fair" was clearly in the eye of the beholder.
The map drawers then presented their newest congressional district maps – the Democratic team's B5 (#423) and the Republican team's A5 (#422). They had been directed by the co-chairs to produce the "fairest maps." Democratic team Ken Strasma and Zach Coomes said that they used map #315 which had been submitted by citizen Joel Galloway as their "footprint." Strasma said because there was no clear consensus about 'partisan fairness' they analyzed election results from 2012-2018 in which Virginia swung back and forth in different years." They calculated if a congressional district is likely to be stronger or weaker compared to any year. They determined 50.5% was the 'tipping point'. They explained their analyses through graphs and shared a memorandum. Dr. Kareem Crayton said that map B5 is "politically fair, slightly higher for Democrats than Republicans, but only slightly higher."
Republican team map drawer John Morgan followed with map A5 (#422) which he said was based on a map Sen. McDougle submitted earlier. Sen. Simon suggested it "is essentially the Tom Davis map [Jason Torshinsky/National Republican Redistricting Trust] that was submitted earlier but that was denied by Republican attorney Bryan Tyson.
Citizen commissioner Sean Kumar then pointed out, "We have 30 minutes left today and a hearing scheduled Friday with no maps to really look at. We're seeing 5-5-1 maps that probably aren't going to pass and 5-4-2 maps that probably aren't going to pass. We still don't have any consensus as to what kind of data we should be using to assess the makeup of those maps. We need to do that before we continue."
Motions were made and votes taken on 5-5-1 and 5-4-2 maps and they both failed along partisan lines. It then became clearer that the Commission wouldn't be able to reach consensus by the public hearing scheduled for Friday, October 22. It was also less hopeful that their next meeting on Monday, October 25 would clear the way for them to submit a Congressional district map to the General Assembly. Comments from individual commissioners included:
"I'm not a quitter. We owe it to the people of the Commonwealth to fight this out until the end."
"The structure of this Commission made building consensus almost impossible."
"Let's come back after the election to see if it's skewed one way or the other."
"The bureaucracy and unfortunate partisanship of the Commission wins, and we're done."
"I don't see the point of going round and round. The definition of insanity is to do the same thing again and again and expecting different outcomes."
"We can't agree, but the maps are already much better than the maps I've seen before."
"Even though the Amendment is deeply flawed, we'll see what the Court does."
In the end, the public hearing scheduled for Friday, October 22 and the Monday, October 25 Commission meeting were canceled. The Commission, however, left the door open should two commissioners (one Democrat and one Republican) be able to work together to resolve the "partisan fairness" issue. Del. Simon made a motion to adjourn to reconvene upon the joint call of the two-co-chairs and the motion passed unanimously. If there should be a successful bi-partisan resolution of how to "fairly" allocate the number of congressional districts by party, another Commission meeting will be called, and public hearing scheduled.
PUBLIC COMMENTS AND MORE COMPLETE DETAILS ON THE COMMISSION MEETING FOLLOW –
C1 Congressional District Map and Partisan Fairness
The Virginia Redistricting Commission met Monday, October 18 but, without a quorum present, no business could be conducted, or votes taken. The meeting instead began with comments, many negative, from fifteen citizens who were concerned about the impact on their communities of the Commission's C1 map.
The commissioners then took advantage of the "down time" to be outspoken about their views. Their "no holds barred" comments included strong criticism of the other party's intentions. They began with Del. Marcus Simon's (D-Falls Church) accusations that the Republican maps may have been "actually drawn by the National Republican Redistricting Trust (NRRT). Sen. Bill Stanley (R-Chatham) then criticized Del. Simon for making an "accusation like collusion" just because two out of eleven districts are identical. Sen. Stanley suggested he could "make the accusation that this Delegate (Simon) was put on this Commission to 'blow it up' since he was opposed to this Commission." When the charged atmosphere ebbed, Del. Margaret Ransone (R-Kinsale) expressed hope that "we get the train back on the tracks."
After Del. Ransone's call to start talking about maps, the discussion turned to how to adjust for partisan fairness. Both counsels agreed the U.S. Supreme Court will not hear cases on partisan gerrymandering and there is no Virginia case law to guide the Commission. They presented their analyses of Commission map C1 with Democrat Dr. Kareem Crayton calculating that C1 includes five Republican districts, five Democratic, and one leaning Democratic. Crayton also said, "we should hopefully all be able to agree that when a majority of the people of Virginia express a preference for a political party, the map should at least reflect a majority of seats for that party." He also presented a report from the National Conference of State Legislators (NCSL) on criteria for partisan fairness in other states.
The Republican lawyers had prepared a memorandum which was available to the commissioners shortly before their meeting. Counsels Chris Bartolomucci and Bryan Tyson gave their opinion that map C1, if adopted, would not violate Virginia statute because Virginia Code does not expressly demand "proportional representation" – awarding the two major political parties a number of congressional districts proportional to their share of the vote in statewide elections.
Sen. Ryan McDougle (R-Mechanicsville) pointed out, "When we come back on Wednesday, we will have to come to consensus on what the language means as we go through the other criteria." In response to a question about how to direct the map drawers to resolve some of the citizen comments about map C1, Del. Simon suggested "nothing stops us from sending an email to the co-chairs and staff asking for things for the next meeting."
This next meeting of the Commission will be Wednesday, October 20 at 8 a.m. There is also a virtual public hearing scheduled for Friday, October 22, but a decision on whether to move ahead with that hearing will be decided Wednesday when there is a quorum.
"Hail Mary" Proposal Results in One Draft Map of Congressional Districts
When the Virginia Redistricting Commission next came together on Thursday, October 14, presiding Co-chair Greta Harris announced that the Commission would be moving on to Congressional maps. The co-chairs had met and given instructions for staff to start with Districts 3 and 4 which were drawn by the courts and then proceed to three districts in the Southwest and Southside; three districts in Northern Virginia; and two districts in the middle of the state. Initially, the Republican and Democrat map drawers each reviewed maps that had been posted on the Commission web site the previous evening. They later also incorporated maps for a few missing regions so that the entire state could be viewed.
Their discussion included whether Districts 3 and 4 were the best starting point. The counsels advised those two maps "represent the safest route to compliance with the Voting Rights Act because they were drawn by the Special Master and blessed by the federal courts." Both map drawers focused on compactness, and this created its own set of issues. Did the more east/west alignment of the proposed districts benefit the Republicans and hint at gerrymandering? Should districts cross mountains to be more compact or run lengthwise through the valleys on either side of the mountain?
Several commissioners also reminded everyone that there is still uncertainty about "partisan fairness" and unduly favoring one party or the other. Co-chair Harris asked "what is a reasonable goal for a Congressional District given population changes and recent election results. What is fair balance? This is the most sensitive direction we can give." Citizen commissioner James Abrenio wanted to know, "How are other commissions treating this? What does the public think?"
As the meeting drew to a close, a "Hail Mary" proposal by Democrat counsel Dr. Kareem Crayton paved the way for the Commission to post one map for public comments. "Let's agree about Districts 3 and 4 and we would accept, for the moment, John Morgan's (Republican) District 4 and District 5 and "our" District 2 and District 7." Republican counsel Bryan Tyson said he largely agreed. "If we want one map, use the three districts Zach [Coomes] drew in Northern Virginia, John's [Morgan] Southwest, Zach's 2 and 7, and agree on Districts 3 and 4. John's District 1 could also work." Dr. Crayton added, "It would be helpful to hear what people think about the configurations."
The combined map was posted Thursday evening on the Commission website as #364, C1 Statewide. The next meeting of the Commission will be Monday, October 18 at 8 a.m. Your comments on the map can be posted online and your views on "partisan fairness" and whether districts should cross mountains should be submitted via the Comments Form on the Commission web site. You can also send emails to the Commission at
. The deadline to sign up to speak virtually at Monday's meeting is Sunday, October 17 at noon.
Commission Prepares to Draw Congressional Maps
At its previous meeting, on Friday, October 8, the Virginia Redistricting Commission was unable to reach a compromise on how to proceed with redrawing of the House and Senate legislative maps. The meeting ended abruptly when three citizen commissioners, including Co-chair Greta Harris, walked out of the room. It was unclear at that time how the Commission would move forward.
Many questions were addressed at the scheduled Commission meeting on Monday, October 11. Both co-chairs were in attendance, but it was held virtually so there were no votes taken. Commissioners instead concentrated on listening to legal counsel and discussion of options for the next in-person Commission meeting which will be Thursday, October 14 at 8 a.m.
October 11 was the Constitutionally mandated deadline to send maps to the General Assembly but both lawyers for the Commission indicated a formal notice was not required. One could be helpful, however, in moving the process along to the Supreme Court of Virginia (SCoVA) if the Commission votes it is their intent to no longer attempt to pass a set of House and Senate maps.
Dr. Kareem Crayton, Democratic counsel, also advised against revisiting the "starting date" which was decided previously as August 26, and which set the deadline of October 25 for Congressional maps. "Now we've chosen, it would raise more questions about why we made decision in first place. You don't want to open another question." Republican counsel Chris Bartolomucci agreed, and citizen commissioner Sean Kumar said, "It could get really messy to revisit it at this point. The reality is if it's over, let's put SCoVA on notice."
This will be considered further Thursday along with the Commission's first attempt at redrawing of Congressional District maps which are due to the General Assembly by October 25. Proposals for how to begin map drawing ranged from starting with "viable" citizen maps to using the current maps for Districts 3 and 4 which have already been "blessed by the courts." The Commission will need to decide on whether and how to use the map drawers. Division of Legislative Services (DLS) could assist but they would require very explicit decisions and instructions. DLS attorney Meg Lamb cautioned, "DLS is uncomfortable with being a partisan referee."
As Monday's meeting drew to a close, Del. Les Adams (R-Chatham) requested that legal counsel address the status of Co-chair Harris' membership on the Commission. He felt it important to clarify whether Harris officially resigned before any votes are taken Thursday. After considerable discussion among the commissioners, Del. Adams said he would "take Harris' word on what her intention was but it's a legal matter and a very reasonable request." Several commissioners followed, expressing their personal frustrations at the "fundamental lack of trust and suspicion of motives" on the Commission. Co-chair Babichenko suggested "We didn't have an opportunity to get to know each other because of COVID."


This week I got to spend a few days with my friend Codrina. We only knew eachother from flickr and tumblr but I feel like I know her better then some of my daily friends..
vai, mi-a ieșit cocoașa în poza de la Tarnița! :)) tu Ștefania, îs așa faine toate, îmi plac de numa!
hihi, I've been following her tumblr for a long time :) it's cute that you two become friends and actually met!