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text:
Brittany Campbell
August 7, 2019 4 min read
Closing out one of the most complicated sagas in LA Galaxy history, Cristian Pavon finally lands in LA.
CARSON, Calif. — In what can only be described as a long protracted negotiation, that had all the ups and downs of a major theme park's scariest roller coaster, the LA Galaxy have signed 23-year-old Argentine, Cristian Pavon, COG has learned (and the Galaxy officially announced on Thursday morning).
🎼 #BravoPavon pic.twitter.com/gM5BwlGHif
— LA Galaxy (@LAGalaxy) August 8, 2019
"Cristian is a young and dynamic attacking addition who has the talent to be one of the most effective offensive players in Major League Soccer," said LA Galaxy General Manager Dennis te Kloese. "He is a high-caliber player who will be a valuable piece to our roster moving forward. By providing him with a stable environment and a coach he knows well, we are confident that he can continue to grow and improve as a player within our club. We are extremely excited to add him to our squad and look forward to his contributions with the LA Galaxy."
The deal, a 6-month loan with the ability to extend for an additional one year, and then an option to buy after the 2020 season, was financed with Targeted Allocation Money. Meaning that Pavon will not occupy a designated player slot (the Galaxy already have all three spots accounted for) and that no other contract devices needed to be used.
But the Athletic's Paul Tenorio (subscription required) went even deeper with the explanation. Saying that the loan deal, until 2020, is a free loan with Pavon's salary fitting well underneath the TAM threshold. Should the Galaxy wish to keep him for the 2020 season, he'd likely take up a Designated Player spot and Boca would demand a $600,000 loan fee. Meanwhile, Pavon's salary would cross the $1-million mark, according to Tenorio.
"By providing him with a stable environment and a coach he knows well, we are confident that he can continue to grow and improve as a player within our club."
LA Galaxy general manager, dennis te kloese
With the players and MLS negotiating a Collective Bargaining Agreement this winter, there's a chance that another DP slot could be created by the owners. Or TAM could be completely eliminated and a higher salary cap might be added. The bottom line is that no one knows what the structure of the Salary Cap or the CBA will look like past this season. So the Galaxy will likely have options. And with both Zlatan Ibrahimovic and Romain Alessandrini seeing their contracts expire at the end of this year, the Galaxy could choose Pavon over either of them.
The final step for the Galaxy would be to purchase Pavon outright. But that purchase price, reportedly $20-million, is steep. But the Galaxy could negotiate a different deal by then with a lower transfer fee with Boca. There are simply so many variables between then and now that the money isn't a huge concern.
Before the deal was complete, however, The Galaxy moved midfielder Emmanuel Boateng in a trade with DC United that netted them $250K in TAM before then trading with Orlando City in a GAM for TAM deal. $200,000 in General Allocation Money was sent to Orland in return for $136,220 in TAM.
That stockpile of TAM then went to close the deal with Pavon. The only thing that needs to be cleaned up is to create an International roster slot before officially adding pavon to the roster. This can be done many different ways, but will probably mean Galaxy defender Diedie Traore will be sent on loan to the Galaxy's USL affiliate, LA Galaxy II, for the remainder of the season.
In the end, the Galaxy are getting a truly talented winger that should fill the massive hole at right midfield left by the injury to Romain Alessandrini.
Pavon's availability for this weekend's match against DC United (Sunday, 4:30 p.m. PT, FS1), however, will be impacted by his ability to quickly receive his International Transfer Certificate (ITC) and his P-1 Visa. Both of which were unlikely to be finalized until this deal was complete.
How high can Pavon rise? He's back on a club that wants him, and back under a coach who believes in him. The sky is the limit. But Pavon's first order of business will be to prove that his recent downturn in form was merely temporary and not a permanent sign of things to come.
Update: The Galaxy have officially announced the signing of Cristian Pavon as of Thursday morning. A press conference will be held later in the day. CoG will have coverage of that press conference right here.
Update: Added a quote from General Manager Dennis te Kloese.
Boca JuniorsCristian PavonLA GalaxyTransfer Window
Previous Skjelvik to Hammarby being discussed
Next Galaxy Notebook: Pavon excited to get going, time for a reunion, and Ibrahimovic critical
Producer/Co-Host
I've been covering the LA Galaxy since 2009 and am the Co-Creator, Producer, and Host of all the shows at CoG and this one time I was even published in the LA Times! Proud member of the North American Soccer Reporters (NASR). I grew up in SoCal and enjoy covering all things Galaxy related. It's where my focus is and where I feel like I can have the most impact on how people get their independent soccer coverage. In fact, that's why I started this site. To give unbiased news, opinion, and entertainment about the Galaxy. No one pays anyone on the site to do this. This is TRULY independent coverage and that's the way I want to keep it.

redpajama_set_name: RedPajamaCommonCrawl


The first great flood after the settlement of Miami county by white men was in the spring of 1847, which is still remembered by old settlers. Although there were several floods during the next quarter of a century, the high water in the Wabash, river did not reach the mark of 1847 until the flood of February, 1883. On Friday, February 2, 1883, there was a heavy fall of snow, which turned to rain late in the afternoon. The ground was frozen so that the water could not penetrate it, the temperature rose during the night and the snow melted, adding to the volume of water that was forced into the streams over the frozen ground. By eleven o'clock on Saturday morning the Wabash railroad tracks were under water and the channel of the river was filled with floating ice. Rain fell all day on Saturday and during the night it turned colder, the temperature on Sunday morning being only a few degrees above zero. When the people arose that morning they found the Strawtown pike under water from the bridge to the toll house, the Mississinewa pike was under water for a mile or more, and South Peru was inundated. Frank Henton and Lou Cole led a rescuing party to convey the people in boats to places of safety. The back water had extinguished the fires at the gas works and the people had to return to coal oil, and in some instances to candles, for their light. All along the river, on the high grounds, could be seen little herds of live stock and the intense cold added to the suffering of both man and beast.
As frequently happens in such cases, there was something of a controversy among the old timers as to which was the highest flood, that of 1847 or the one of 1883. Jesse S. Zern, G. L. Dart, Coleman Henton and O. P. Webb maintained that the flood of 1847 was still entitled to recognition as the greatest in history, while James B. Fulwiler, J. D. Cox and Alexander Moss, the last named the most prominent colored man who ever lived Peru, insisted just as strenuously that the flood of 1883 broke all previous records. It appears that a mark had teen made on an elm tree near the bank of the river and on Sunday night, when the water was at its highest point, some young men took a boat and a lantern and went out to the tree to investigate. They claimed that the mark of 1847 was under water, but on Sunday morning ice was found hanging to the body of the tree about three inches below the mark, so that the advoicates of both, floods claimed a victory and the dispute was never settled to the entire satisfaction of all parties.
A relief committee was organized and those who had been drowned out of their homes were given aid until the waters subsided, or even longer where it was necessary. Notwithstanding the local distress, the people responded liberally to Governor Porter's call for aid for the flood sufferers along the Ohio river, where hundreds of families were rendered homeless. Mayor Graham issued a proclamation calling a meeting for Saturday, February 24th, for the purpose of taking steps to act in harmony with the governor's call. Charles H. Brownell stated the object of the meeting and moved the appointment of a committee to act with the general relief committee and the Indianapolis board of trade. Mr. Brownell was made chairman of the committee, the other members of which were James M. Brown, Charles A. Parsons, John Muhlfield and John L. Farrar.
This committee appealed to the charitably inclined people of the county and received a large quantity of supplies in the way of food, cast off clothing and other supplies, as well as some cash donations, all of which were forwarded without delay to the general relief committee at Indianapolis, or such other points as ordered.
Twice in the early part of the year 1904 the Wabash river broke over its banks and did considerable damage. On Friday, January 22, 1904, the river began rising rapidly and the floating ice threatened to carry the Union Traction bridge at the foot of Broadway from its abutments. The bridge was raised about fifteen inches with jackscrews and chained, and was thus saved from destruction. Armstrong's meadow in South Peru was under water on Saturday morning, though the trees in that suburb east of Broadway were not entirely submerged. The cut on the Chesapeake & Ohio Railroad at Converse was filled with water and traffic was for the time abandoned. A portion of the Pan Handle Railroad along Big Pipe creek was under water and the train service all through the Wabash valley was irregular for several days. In fact, this flood was general all over the state.
The second flood of 1904 began on Friday, the 1st day of April. On Saturday morning the east end of Peru was threatened with inundation and families began to move out of their houses. Much of the trouble in this section was caused by the Mississinewa river. The Chicago, Cincinnati & Louisville (now the Chesapeake & Ohio) Railroad, ran cars loaded with stone and scrap iron upon the bridge over the Wabash to prevent it from being carried away. The Union Traction bridge, at the foot of Broadway, was swept from its abutments by the torrent and demolished. No work was done at the Indiana Manufacturing Company on Saturday, because the water was about fifteen inches deep all over the first floor of the buildings.
Again a relief committee was organized to solicit and distribute aid. William Demuth, the treasurer of this committee, made his final report on February 24, 1905. stating that his reason for the delay was on account of some of the subscribers being "a little slow in paying their subscriptions." According to his report the amount collected by the committee was $1,031.25, all of which had been disbursed in aiding the flood victims except $5.80, which amount still remained in his hands.
But the floods of 1847, 1883 and 1904 all sink into insignificance when brought into comparison with the great flood of March, 1913. Rain began falling early on Sunday, March 23, 1913, and continued almost without intermission for more than thirty six hours. The Wabash river began rising early Monday morning, but no special alarm was felt until eight o'clock that evening, when the fire alarm whistles at the electric light station announced that the river had broken over its banks and that the pumping station of the city water works would soon be submerged. The daily papers had previously informed the people what the signal would mean and as soon as the whistle was heard the citizens hastened to fill every available vessel with water, thus providing themselves with a supply until the waters subsided. Before midnight the electric light station was forced to close by the flood and the city was plunged into darkness. At daybreak Tuesday morning the eastern part of South Peru was under water and as the river was still rising at the rate of several inches an hour the people living in the west end of the town became alarmed. On Monday afternoon the back water from Bloomfield creek, half a mile west of Broadway, covered the fields eastward nearly to Pike street, and when the flood from the Wabash and Mississinewa rivers broke over the Wallace road a few hours later it was only a question of minutes until the entire south side was submerged Many of the residents of South Peru saw what was coming and began their preparations for removal on Monday evening All that dark and dismal night they worked to save some of their belongings from the ravages of the rising waters.
Early Tuesday morning the members of the Peru Commercial Club saw the necessity for some measures of relief and a committee headed by Frank D. Butler was appointed by the president, J. T. Kaufman, to canvass the business district for subscriptions. The court house, the Dukes Hospital, the Masonic Temple, the high school building, and other places were made ready for the reception and care of those who were driven from their homes. A food distributing station was established in the public library and a number of private residences in the more elevated portions of the city were placed at the disposal of the relief committee as places of shelter for the refugees.
The flood reached its height on Wednesday morning at about 2:30 o'clock. On Tuesday morning all of South Peru, eastern Peru as far west as Wabash street, all of Elmwood and North Peru were flooded, and on Broadway the waters had reached above Second street. They continued to rise rapidly and about 11 o'clock the Broadway bridge went out, carrying with it the bridge of the Union Traction Company immediately below it.
In the meantime the Associated Charities, under Mrs. E. W. Shirk, had begun the work of dispensing sandwiches at the court house, for many people who had left or been driven from their homes found it impossible to return to them and were in need of food. This work of feeding the people continued for weeks, or until normal living and working conditions were partially restored. Thousands of all classes, at one time or another, had to avail themselves of the food here prepared.
By noon the water had crossed Broadway north of Sixth street and people living west of Broadway on Third and other streets, who had felt secure, inasmuch as the water had not risen quite to Third street from the river, were surprised to see the flood pouring in upon them from the north, the waters, as it were, having executed a flank movement and attacked them in the rear. By 3 o'clock in the afternoon, all the streets of the city were practically submerged, with the exception of perhaps a block or less each way from the junction of Main and Broadway, which proved to be the highest point in the business district. There were only a few isolated points in the city which, like this, remained dry throughout the trying time. The Smith hill, on east Fifth street, was one of these places and hundreds of people were housed there, but on Fifth street only a few blocks west there were ten feet of water. The western part of the city did not suffer as much as the eastern. For half a mile east on Main street the water was six feet deep and flooded the homes, while on West Main it was perhaps not more than two feet deep and invaded but few of the dwellings. Late on Wednesday afternoon the waters began to recede and by Thursday morning had fallen sufficiently for many people to wade out in rubber boots and make their way to the court house to assist in the work of relief. Thousands of people had been cared for there the night before.
When the eastern part of South Peru became inundated on Monday night there were but few boats about the city. That night a few others were secured from people in the vicinity of Peoria. Among them was one owned and manned by Sam Bundy, a Miami Indian. It was about sixteen feet long and four feet wide, with a flat bottom, and well calculated to ride safely over the turbulent waters. With this craft Bundy saved 162 persons. About 11 A. M. on Tuesday nineteen boats came from Lake Manitou at Rochester, in charge of Clinton Ervine, and a few hours later forty three more came from the same place, with a squad of skilled rowers under the leadership of the Knight brothers. Colonel Gignillat, commandant at Culver Academy sent one hundred boats manned by the Culver cadets. Seventy boats, including two launches, came from the Winona Agricultural College, with forty students of that institution as the life saving crews. Three life boats with their crews were sent down from the United States life saving station at Michigan City and on Friday these boats established the first ferry to South Peru, which place had been cut off from the city for three days. All through the city, over the flooded streets, went the boats rescuing people from perilous situations or carrying supplies to those marooned in their homes. Without them the suffering would have been much greater and no doubt many lives were saved by the prompt action of the boatmen.
No railroad trains could reach the city for several days, a portion of the Lake Erie & Western bridge was carried away, there was but one telephone line open to Indianapolis. the Western Union had one telegraph wire open to Chicago, interurban traffic was abandoned, some of the cars being left standing in the flood, and for a time Peru was cut off from the rest of the world, especially on the south. On the north side the relief trains could come within a mile or two of the city and the boats did the rest.
South Bend has the honor of being the first city to render aid to the stricken Peruvians. It was quickly followed, however, by Rochester, Goshen, Elkhart, Valparaiso, Plymouth, Gary, Madison, Wisconsin, and Kalamazoo, Michigan, as well as a number of smaller places on the north, all of which hurried supplies to the flooded city. On Wednesday an express train arrived from Chicago bearing two hundred mattresses, three hundred blankets, three hundred comforts and other supplies from the Chamber of Commerce of that city. The Bradley Knitting Company, of Delavan, Wisconsin, sent a number of knit caps and sweater coats. As soon as communication could be established on the south Amboy, Converse, Kokomo, Marion, Muncie and numerous other places extended a helping hand. Most of these towns had extended aid to South Peru while the flood was at its height. It is told of Albert Conradt, of Kokomo, but formerly of Peru, that when he was informed of the situation in his native town, he promptly replied: "Go ahead and get what the people will need at once and rush the stuff to them. Be quick about it and you may go as high as $5,000, which I will advance and run my chances of getting it refunded to me by the people of Kokomo."
At a meeting held in the court house on Thursday morning the follow. ing committees were appointed to carry on the relief work in a systematic manner: Executive, Frank D Butler, Lieutenant Governor O'Neill, R. A. Edwards and Rev. A. M. Bailey; Medical aid, Drs. L. O. Malsbury, John E. Yarling and John H. Spooner; Finances, Joseph H. Shirk and Milton Kraus; Law and order, Mayor J. J. Kreutzer, Sheriff Frank Hostetler and Prosecuting Attorney H. C. Phelps; Publicity, J. Ross Woodring, Thomas Walsh, James Costin, Omer Holman and other Peru editors; Food supply, R. H. Bouslog, Joseph Bergman, Fred Ream, C. A. Holden and Ed. Ream; Bedding and clothing, Dr. C. E. Redmon, Charles It. Hughes, John W. Volpert and Albert Gallahan; Boats, C. Y. Andrews, W. S. Mercer and Timothy Dunn; Sanitation of court house, Frank K. McElheny and Spencer Hammer; Transportation, Andrew Stehle and H. P. Loveland; Labor Bureau, It. J. Loveland and Harry Crites. Trouble committee, C. Y. Andrews, chairman.
A commissary department was established in the Grand Army room in the court house and a clothing supply room in the assembly apartment of the county superintendent's office. Mercer hall was also utilized as a food depot.
Altogether the relief committee received cash subscriptions amounting to nearly $60,000. Of this $27,500 came from the Red Cross society; $5,000 from the State of Indiana; about $20,000 from local subscriptions, and the balance from miscellaneous sources. Of course, this does not include the value of food, clothing, bedding and other miscellaneous supplies, which ran into thousands of dollars.
During the flood exaggerated reports of the loss of life were circulated. Eleven lives were sacrificed, the total dead being Mrs. Lou Stumm, Miss Delight Shields, Mrs. James Hossman, Roma, or "Red" Mays, Benjamin York, Peter Kellogg, Bert Smith, Adam Betts, Omer Friend, Harry F. Gintner and his daughter Anna. Mrs. Stumm, wife of Dr. Stumm, of South Peru, was rescued from a tree, where she had remained for many hours, and later was drowned on Spring street. Miss Shields was in a boat with a Miss Hesser and Frank McNalla, when the boat was capsized. Her body was found near the mouth of Little Pipe creek. Roma Mays, a Chesapeake & Ohio Railroad conductor, was one of the heroes of the flood. For many hours prior to his death he had been engaged in the work of rescuing people with a boat. While bearing Mrs. Hossman to a place of safety on Wednesday the boat was capsized in twenty feet of water about fifty yards west of the South Peru school house and both were drowned. The body of Benjamin York, a man about seventy five years of age and a veteran of the Civil war, was found upon a dresser at his home alter the waters went down. The clothing on the upper part of his body was not wet and it is supposed he died of exposure. Adam Betts and Bert Smith were drowned near the Chute & Butler piano factory. The bodies of Mr. Gintner and his daughter were not found until late Saturday afternoon, when they were discovered in the old canal near the north end of the Wayne street bridge, about one hundred feet from their home. It is supposed they were trying to reach the bridge when they were caught by the current and drowned. Peter Kellogg and Omer Friend were drowned at the Lake Erie & Western Railroad bridge while engaged in stretching a rope for the ferry.
A volume could be written upon the conditions that prevailed in Peru during and immediately after the flood. On Wednesday about twenty members of the sanitary corps of the Indiana National Guard, under Captain H. G. Chittick, came to aid in protecting property and improving sanitary conditions. They remained until April 10th and rendered valuable service in policing the city and aiding in the work of rescue. The law and order committee was assisted materially by the action of the saloon keepers, who voluntarily closed their places of business until the worst was past. The free employment bureau, under the control of the labor committee, found work for over six hundred people during the ten days of its existence. Ernest P. Bicknell, national director of the Red Cross, Dr. De Valain, a United States health officer, Frank Tucker, of the state pure food commission, and Miss Kagel and Thompson, two Red Cross nurses of Chicago, came to assist in restoring sanitary conditions and all worked together to that end.
A Peru newspaper, published a few days after the flood, gives the following estimate of the principal losses, but it is only an estimate: Indiana Manufacturing Company, $250,000; the Hagenbeck & Wallace shows, the winter quarters of which were flooded, $150,000; Broadway merchants, $325,000; Miami county, $100,000; other factories, $100,000; Central Union Telephone Company, $65,000; Wabash Railroad, $20,000; Lake Erie & Western, $25,000; Chesapeake & Ohio, $35,000; the three interurban companies, $50,000. Probably 1,000 homes sustained damages to the amount of $500 or more each, and the total loss caused by the flood reached $2,000,000.
"Peru displays more gameness and talks less about it than most cities one can find with about 15,000 inhabitants. She takes her good and bad medicine alike and, although the dose may be unusually bitter at times, she makes no wry faces to indicate that she prefers the good medicine to the bad.
"It was only a few months ago, during the disastrous floods of March, that the word was circulated to the outside world that Peru had been literally wiped off the map by the torrents that surged down the valley of the Wabash. The town was all but submerged, only a. very small portion of the business district being above water. Other cities in Indiana were suffering from similar disasters, but it was conceded generally that, with few exceptions, the damage left in the wake of the waters of the Wabash was more extensive than it was in other cities.
"The people of Peru saw their homes wiped out in a few brief hours, for the water passed over the town with alarming swiftness. Others more fortunate watched the murky waters invade their houses, ruining, in many cases, the belongings that had been procured as a result of years of toil and thrift, and bitterest sight of all to them was to see the flood submerge the business district, bringing ruin to that section of the city of which every citizen was proud.
"The water receded, leaving in its path what seemed to be a hopeless task. Houses were overturned or washed from their foundations. Every building was covered inside and outside with a coating of mud. Furniture fell to pieces when it was lifted from the spot where the flood had left it. Thousands of dollars' worth of mercantile stock was ruined, and there was no money to buy the new goods after they had been procured. Industries that formed the skeleton of the city's business life were damaged, seemingly beyond repair. Everywhere there was ruin, and had it not been for a spirit of gameness Peru would have lost that part of her population that was free to move.
"Having read accounts of the disastrous flood in Peru and having heard from all sides of the amount of damage to property, many persons in other cities have cause to believe that Peru is now a disabled community. Nothing could be farther from the truth. The fact is that it is difficult to find traces of the flood, although only a few months have elapsed since water was covering the town. The same bravery that was displayed by the citizens at the crest of the flood has been evident since in their efforts to upbuild the city. The business interests of the town cooperated to renovate the ruined stocks, and the citizens cooperated in repairing homes and in cleaning their neighbors' premises. The result has been that Peru has eliminated practically all traces of the flood in the residence districts, and were it not for the condition of a few bridges that were washed away it would be difficult for the stranger to realize that the city had ever been visited by such a calamity."
After the flood had subsided the Union Traction Company rebuilt its bridge at the foot of Broadway within a reasonable time. The wagon bridge at Kelly avenue, west of the city, was rebuilt late in the summer was not completed for more than a year after the flood. This long delay or early in the autumn of 1913, but the new wagon bridge at Broadway was due in a great measure to litigation following injunction proceedings. A drainage engineer had been employed as an expert by private interests and the city to make a survey and report on the advisability of dredging, building levees and removing obstructions, with a view to preventing, or at least mitigating, destruction by future floods. Two factions quickly developed one which wanted a new bridge "right away" and another which insisted upon waiting until the engineer had made his investigation and recommendations as to the kind of bridge, the number and location of piers, and the feasibility of widening and deepening the channel of the river. In the course of the discussion it was recalled that the Wabash was "navigable" at Peru - theoretically so at least - and that under a recent decision of the supreme court the stream was under the supervision and control of the general government. Consequently, those who wanted delay in the construction of the bridge, after being beaten in the circuit court by the "right away" element, appealed to the war department, which for a time did interpose and laid down certain restrictions as to the kind of a bridge that should be constructed. Congress was then appealed to and a bill was passed by that body authorizing the county to proceed, and the construction of the bridge was begun toward the close of the year 1913.


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Q: How to remove border on ul li last child I have set the border on :after pseudo element on every li.

.menu_bottom ul li{
    float: left;
    color: #00a0dc;
    list-style-type: none;
    position: relative;
}
.menu_bottom ul li a{
    text-decoration: none;
    text-transform: uppercase;
    color: #00a0dc;
    padding: 5px 12px;
}
.menu_bottom ul li:after{
    content: "";
    border-right: 1px solid #00a0dc;
    position: absolute;
    right: 0px;
    top: 3px;
    height: 11px;
}
.menu_bottom ul li:after:last-child{
    border: none;
}

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Don't know how to remove border on last child. Used :after:last-child but it doesn't work.

A: Use :not() pseudo-class selector to avoid the last child.

.menu_bottom ul li{
    float: left;
    color: #00a0dc;
    list-style-type: none;
    position: relative;
}
.menu_bottom ul li a{
    text-decoration: none;
    text-transform: uppercase;
    color: #00a0dc;
    padding: 5px 12px;
}
.menu_bottom ul li:not(:last-child):after{
    content: "";
    border-right: 1px solid #00a0dc;
    position: absolute;
    right: 0px;
    top: 3px;
    height: 11px;
}

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A: Change:
.menu_bottom ul li:after:last-child {

To:
.menu_bottom ul li:last-child:after {

.menu_bottom ul li{
    float: left;
    color: #00a0dc;
    list-style-type: none;
    position: relative;
}
.menu_bottom ul li a{
    text-decoration: none;
    text-transform: uppercase;
    color: #00a0dc;
    padding: 5px 12px;
}
.menu_bottom ul li:after{
    content: "";
    border-right: 1px solid #00a0dc;
    position: absolute;
    right: 0px;
    top: 3px;
    height: 11px;
}
.menu_bottom ul li:last-child:after{
    border: none;
}

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about us

our services

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A highly proverbial Sliders Reboot/Continuation question on canon!
Sliders Bboard → Sliders Bboard → A highly proverbial Sliders Reboot/Continuation question on canon!
1 Topic by Grizzlor 2020-04-27 20:29:37 (edited by Grizzlor 2020-04-27 20:30:38)
Topic: A highly proverbial Sliders Reboot/Continuation question on canon!
We've likely gone through this before, but I've come up with 5 critical points in the history of the series from which you might declare, everything after this is just plain trash and won't count. The assumption being that a project, such as the one Jerry O'Connell and John Rhys-Davies have spoken about, could not possibly be written as a continuation of The Seer, or can it? For me at least, the primary pieces of continuity over the years, for fans, deals mainly with the cast changes. Arturo is killed off, but was it the Wrong one? Wade is captured by Kromaggs, sent to a breeding camp (disgusting), then put in a jar. Quinn is merged with "Mallory" and never heard from again. But even he gets this nonsensical backstory of being an foster child from another dimension. That story creates Colin Mallory, who eventually gets turned into atoms. Along the way, we pick up Maggie, Mallory, and Diana Davis, do you wish to keep them around? Last but not least, there are story lines that either went unresolved, such as Logan St. Clare, or were distorting horribly by later writers, such as "smarter Quinn" giving sliding to Kromaggs or the Kromaggs themselves becoming a race of lame Nazi's from the Planet of the Apes. So I found the moments in time where you could "return to," in a sense, or maybe you scrap it all and write a new series that reintroduces Quinn, Arturo, Rembrandt, etc.
Re: A highly proverbial Sliders Reboot/Continuation question on canon!
Keep nothing. Save everything!
Sliders Redux | Story by Temporal Flux
Wade Welles is a dreamer who failed to find direction outside reviewing gadgets for websites. Rembrandt Brown is a coffee bar manager who failed to stay a superstar. Professor Arturo is a genius who failed to find recognition for his brilliance. And Quinn Mallory is a tax accountant who failed to create anti-gravity -- but 25 years after giving up, he realizes that he discovered something else instead...
SLIDERS: four misfits on the adventure of a lifetime.
The Opening
We begin with the original footage of Quinn (Jerry O'Connell) in 1994.
He opened something in his basement, he's not sure what. He may have also knocked out the power.
Cut to: 25 years later.
Quinn (Jerry O'Connell) is a tax accountant.
His great claim to fame: he devised an algorithm that would allow accountants to process returns in five minutes but require human beings to perform the calculations, raising productivity by 2,405 per cent while making layoffs impossible.
Quinn's next customers are Wade (Sabrina Lloyd) and Arturo (John Rhys-Davies), neither of whom are happy to see him.
Wade is irritated that Quinn kissed her 25 years ago and then acted like he didn't remember it.
Arturo is angry that Quinn humiliated him in class 25 years ago.
Quinn has no memory of these events or of September 27, 1994.
Wade goes from irritated to angry.
WADE: "Were women just playthings to you? Did you have some sick bet with Hurley? Were you laughing it up in the lounge later? Probably jumping up and down on that broken sofa like two 12 year old boys!"
Arturo is outraged at Quinn's profession.
He says that Quinn allowed one failure to take away his passion for science.
ARTURO: "You could have changed the very nature of mathematics and engineering and quantum mechanics, but instead, you sit here filling out forms! You appall me!"
The phone rings. Quinn answers it, listens, then hangs up. He looks blank and lost.
ARTURO: "What the devil is the matter with you now?"
QUINN: "My mom had a stroke. She's dead."
Wade and Arturo stare at Quinn, unnerved. A long silence.
ARTURO: "But perhaps I'm being too hard on you."
WADE: "Yeah, I mean, I barely remember working at Doppler's."
Cut to a blur of funeral arrangements, Wade and Arturo shamefully assisting Quinn.
Later, Quinn is cleaning out his old house alone.
As he reviews his abandoned sports equipment, his dusty blackboard and his worktables, the coils, the anti-gravity apparatus, we see Wade and Arturo going about their lives.
Arturo writes science study guides for high school students after losing his job at Berkeley.
Wade is a bored tech journalist reviewing smart speakers and self-warming coffee mugs.
She does most of her work at Brownie's, a jazz-themed coffee bar owned and run by Rembrandt (Cleavant Derricks).
Rembrandt is adrift, longing for the fame of the Spinning Topps, competent at running his business but only ever truly coming alive on open mic nights when he sings.
Quinn uncovers his old VHS cassettes and a VHS player.
He plays some of his journals made as a 20-year-old and then he finds a new tape, clean and untouched.
It shows himself describing opening a gateway. Quinn has no recollection of this journal, and he notes that he is also older in this video.
The VHS journal describes a series of revisions to the anti-gravity equipment. Quinn makes them on his machine.
He opens a gateway.
He is transported to a world where social media was bought up by government surveillance agencies and he is hunted when he attempts to use cash to buy a newspaper. He barely escapes in the return vortex.
Quinn calls Wade and Arturo, eager to explain his discovery and that he thinks his double may have insulted Wade and Arturo all those years ago.
Wade and Arturo arrive at the Mallory house. Wade realizes she left her laptop at the coffee shop and phones Rembrandt.
Rembrandt agrees to drive it over.
Quinn opens the vortex to show Wade and Arturo. They are astonished.
Quinn plays them the VHS journals. They watch some of them, although sections are overrun with static and they leave the tape playing.
Wade is eager to explore the multiverse.
Quinn widens the vortex to allow them all to step in.
They enter and disappear.
The overpowered vortex rises through the house and accidentally ensnares a visiting Rembrandt.
The four sliders land on a world where the Russians rule America.
The timer is damaged, forcing them to slide randomly or risk being trapped for 29.7 years.
The search for home begins.
We go back to Quinn's empty basement one more time and see the VHS cassette still playing and reaching a final segment.
A segment where Quinn, who looks about 26 - 27, describing the wonder of the multiverse, the infinite possibilities out there, and his hope that his double will see them all.
And then, on the SLIDERS website, we have some bonus content courtesy of Transmodiar:
We have an additional segment from the VHS cassette where this 27 year old Quinn says that the multiverse is at war.
His friends are dead and his world is gone.
A slider died to bring Quinn back from quantum limbo.
This Quinn has one last move left.
He will alter universal constants in the multiverse so that attempting anti-gravity will no longer open a gateway.
This will retroactively rip sliding out of existence, out of history, out of reality.
It will as be as though no person ever invented sliding.
There will be no more Kromaggs. No more Zercurvians. No more Reticulans. No more Prototronics. No more Gieger Applied Research.
No more sliders.
Everyone will live the lives they would have led had sliding never been created.
But Quinn knows himself too well; he knows that a double will create sliding eventually by altering the localized vibrational frequencies of the planet
It might be a decade, maybe two -- but at some point, Quinn Mallory will create sliding.
He has planted the solution on one Earth in advance of the reset. His own Earth. It will survive.
And he wishes his future self all the very best and hopes that Quinn, Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo will slide again and get it right this time.
I'm on #TeamReboot. Get a whole new group of sliders. Take the concept, leave the rest. Let the past die. Kill it, if you have to.
Jerry, Sabrina, Cleavant and John could always play the parents of the new Quinn, Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo.
5 Reply by Slide Override 2020-04-28 12:12:23 (edited by Slide Override 2020-04-28 12:24:30)
Slide Override
A complete Reboot is needed at this point. Fresh actors, keep the core concept of the show, and have a tightly scripted joint into the multiverse.
Edit: Just to clarify, I mean a day one reboot. New actors playing the original characters.
It depends on what's happening:
Is Jerry instrumental in getting it done? If so, I think Jerry is going to want to star in it. He's going to want to be Quinn. Making him Quinn's dad wouldn't be enough for him. Maybe you make him Arturo? I don't know if that works. I think in that case, you do what Halloween did, what Terminator did, and what Jurassic Park did - the sequels didn't necessarily happen. You pick up with the four sliders who have been sliding for 20 years or they've settled somewhere. The Pilot happened but the rest of the adventures aren't important or didn't happen.
If Jerry isn't involved, I think you do a full reboot. Get the original four to do cameos (like in Ghostbusters 2016) but no other attachment. But, and it comes down to this, doing a full reboot of Sliders is needlessly expensive. If you're going to do a story about people going from universe to universe, Sliders as a brand has too much baggage and not enough cultural power. You don't have to deal with rights or fans. Make Coasters with Danny, Jake, Annabel, and Dr. Whitman. Change enough not to get sued and you can do whatever you want.
7 Reply by Transmodiar 2020-04-28 16:25:50
I have no interest in a continuation for personal reasons. Ib knows why.
Transmodiar has told me that it's not appropriate for me to discuss his inner thinking in this forum, so I'm going to leave that to him -- but I will confess that for my own personal reasons, I too am okay with SLIDERS not coming back. SLIDERS was an intensely personal trauma for me that I worked through on my own intensely personal terms. When the Professor died, I was 10 and it was like seeing my own father die. Everything in my life since then has been a reaction to the death of Professor Arturo and when I brought him back to life in "Slide Effects" and later again in SLIDERS REBORN, something changed in me -- for the better, I think. If SLIDERS came back, I would be starting that journey again -- albeit on a parallel track.
However. I would like SLIDERS to come back for the fans, for Temporal Flux, for Slider_Quinn21 and for Informant and SLIDERS should come back for the people who miss it rather than stay away for the people who don't, if that makes any sense. And it is for the people who want it back that I would like Quinn to be played by Corey Fogelmanis (geekboy Farkle on GIRL MEETS WORLD), Wade to be played by Isabel May (hyperactive Katie on ALEXA AND KATIE), Rembrandt to be played by Levar Burton (you know who he is) and Arturo to be played by David Warner (look him up).
Oddly enough my father did die of a stomach aneurysm between the 3rd and 4th season.
Seems like a lot of you would be interested in what I'm working on.
For each person, the question comes down to why do you love Sliders? Is it the characters? The actors? The overall concept? The writing? Is it the brand? (which includes everything - especially the name).
I think the brand is important because it draws in people. The fond memory is there labeled as Sliders; and millions of people watched Sliders on Fox. There is pop culture that can keep it alive in people too (as I've noted on this board several times, that little blue vortex still occasionally pops up in shows sending people to other dimensions; and I don't believe that to be a coincidence).
To give an example of why I feel brand is important, I would cite the original Knight Rider vs Viper. Both shows feature a man and his super car fighting crime. Both shows can be considered successful - Viper lasted for four seasons on network and in syndication - Viper made people some money. But how many of you even remembered Viper until I brought it up now? I bet you've remembered Knight Rider more despite its failed reboots that didn't respect the brand.
I'm really not interested in some other show that evokes a legally distinct echo of what I've loved. It would be extremely hard to capture my heart as a fan; that space is already filled. I would only be left comparing the pretender to what I loved; and it would likely never live up to that memory. The same can be true of a total brand reboot; but at least the brand is there to draw you in and give it a chance.
I would note an exception in Orville, though; and I was initially repulsed by the idea. The only reason I tried it was because of the creators involved, and they didn't disappoint.
So, what would I like to see with Sliders? A continuation with new characters that play in the same multiverse as the original series. It could retain the brand; give the new show room to live and breathe; and leave the door open to occasionally visit the memories as more than a subtle wink. It would be part of the family and not a stranger at the door.
12 Reply by pilight 2020-04-29 09:37:10
What would I like to see with Sliders? A continuation with new characters that play in the same multiverse as the original series. It could retain the brand; give the new show room to live and breath; and leave the door open to occasionally visit the memories as more than a subtle wink. It would be part of the family and not a stranger at the door.
The genius of Sliders is that everything is potentially part of their multi-verse. So, yeah, a reboot could run across any or all of the old Sliders either together or separately. They could revisit the world with living flames or Caffeine World or Einstein World or whatever.
I remember VIPER and caught myself thinking about it recently because it was the first time I ever saw Canadian national treasure Keegan Connor Tracy onscreen and she keeps popping up in Vancouver-filmed TV shows although she's been directing more lately.
But this really just deepens TF's point: VIPER is obscure whereas KNIGHT RIDER is *the* brand for artificial intelligence in cars and SLIDERS could be *the* brand for parallel universes. I mean, it's not going to be PARALLELS or THE BUILDING. I enjoyed FRINGE a lot, but that was a paranormal procedural in the vein of THE X-FILES despite its parallel universe premise.
STAR TREK (2009) did something neat where you weren't asked to accept new actors as William Shatner's Captain Kirk, Leonard Nimoy's Mr. Spock. You were asked to accept Chris Pine as Jim, a reckless cadet who might someday become James T. Kirk. You were introduced to the troubled Spock who might grow into the science officer and cultural icon that is Mr. Spock. So maybe Corey Fogelmanis, Isabel May, Michael B. Jordan and Julian Sands are not replacing Jerry, Sabrina, Cleavant and John in this rebootquel but playing younger versions who were born at a later date and perhaps discover sliding at a younger age -- and in the Season 1 finale, they encounter the older versions of themselves.
14 Reply by Slider_Quinn21 2020-04-29 11:09:08 (edited by Slider_Quinn21 2020-04-29 12:10:06)
Yeah I was going to say the same thing. They've already established that time moves differently on different worlds and that people can be the same person and look differently. It can be a complete reboot in every way and still be part of the continuity.
15 Reply by Slide Override 2020-04-29 12:05:57
Despite the fear of the last sentence, everything you mentioned before is exactly why I want a total reboot.
Continuing with the reboot-recast-continuation mode -- something TF said that really hit home with me is how a legally dissimilar show about parallel universes could never replace SLIDERS. And he's right: the willful differences would remove SLIDERS' strengths (even if this legally dissimilar production would have its own merits).
The appeal of SLIDERS to me is the characters (and yes, the actors) who are perfectly suited to each other in their contrasts. You have youth in Quinn and Wade and age in Rembrandt and Arturo. You have revolution in Quinn and Wade and conservatism in Rembrandt and Arturo. You have science in Quinn and Arturo and art in Rembrandt and Wade. You have academics in Quinn and Arturo and blue collar workers in Wade and Rembrandt. You have mathematical brilliance in Quinn and Arturo and emotional genius in Wade and Rembrandt. And what makes SLIDERS function best is that each episode is set in its own continuity of a separate parallel universe. You have the versatility of an anthology with the intense relatability of the characters; every demographic is addressed by at least ONE of the four sliders.
So, in a reboot, I'd like to see Quinn and Wade as teenagers and I don't mean as RIVERDALE teenagers but as the teenagers who play children on Disney shows like GIRL MEETS WORLD and LIV AND MADDIE -- and we could have a Rembrandt and Arturo played by actors in their 50s. I think an even larger age gap between Quinn & Wade and Rembrandt & Arturo would emphasize the strengths of the show and the specific strengths that cannot be imitated by any other parallel universe show that would have to file off the serial numbers.
Also important and legally distinct: the sliders are not agents of a government organization or employed by some tech conglomerate or some black ops force. They are essentially four misfits thrown together by circumstance, essentially four homeless people, so I would also emphasize that further: Quinn is a homeless kid who assembled a makeshift lab in a Doppler storage locker and sleeps in the staff lounge and Wade is a juvenile delinquent on probation for shoplifting whereas Rembrandt and Arturo are more stable adults (but not that much more stable).
So, ideally, a reboot would focus on all the things that make SLIDERS so distinct that any other show attempting to do the same would be sued for infringement. From a scripting standpoint, I think a rebooted SLIDERS should do remakes of the existing episodes but updated accordingly. A world where the Russians won the Cold War can be adjusted to the Russians having co-opted American elections and covertly controlling America. A world where the Summer of Love never ended can delve into drug culture gone out of control like Jerry O'Connell's "Narcotica" comic. Versions of "Please Press One" and "Map of the Mind" that are actually good.
And we could still have the rebooted cast meet the original cast to establish that the new actors are playing younger versions of the originals like STAR TREK (2009).
I'd like to see different genres in the show. Originally, the show had a very tight formula of the sliders entering a dystopian world, saddling up with the local resistance, toppling the dominate regime and leaving. I'd love to see that again, but I'd also like to see the office comedy episode, the mumblecore episode, the cyberpunk episode, the mockmentary episode, the reality TV episode, the superhero episode, the crime procedural episode, the romcom episode, the game show episode, the bedroom farce episode, the filmed-live episode, the found footage episode and constantly be unsure as to what SLIDERS is going to be each week.
And I think TF has really hit on something. What could a SLIDERS reboot do that no other show could without Torme and Weiss' lawyers going after it?
Geez, a complete reboot was not one of the choices!! Ha ha, I posted this poll because I've been rewatching on Comet TV. At first, I figured everything after Vancouver ought to go. However, Season 3, granted full of movie rip-offs, was not that bad, prior to The Exodus. There were good stories, and as I watch now, for the first time in at least a decade, I can better appreciate dialogue, directing, things like that. The characters remained true to their cores. The Rickman episodes after The Exodus were utter garbage, with The Other Slide of Darkness being one of the worst. The Smarter Quinn giving Kromaggs Sliding tech was so unbelievable stupid, I never got over that. Season 4 and 5 had a lot of good science fiction scripts, but Wade raped, Earthprime conquered, and Quinn being adopted, no, no no!!! So my pick was The Exodus, which for many fans, was the jump the shark moment. I can't tell you how many times I read or get told that someone stopped watching after JRD left the show.
Geez, a complete reboot was not one of the choices!! Ha ha, I posted this poll because I've been rewatching on Comet TV. At first, I figured everything after Vancouver ought to go. However, Season 3, granted full of movie rip-offs, was not that bad, prior to The Exodus.
Oh, stuff it. Your thread's getting activity and responses. You'll take what you're given! ;-)
Slider_Quinn21 wrote:
Is Jerry instrumental in getting it done? If so, I think Jerry is going to want to star in it. He's going to want to be Quinn. Making him Quinn's dad wouldn't be enough for him.
And Jerry can stuff it too! He's lucky to be allowed to eat at the crafts services table. His film career was a joke. His daytime TV ambitions have been a wash. He couldn't even get THE MUNSTERS to series. His big TV show, CARTER, produces 10 episodes a year. If he's allowed to play Michael Mallory for a few months of mortgage payments for a few days of work, he'll take it. He's learned not to be a diva and accepted his self-made lot as a working class TV actor.
But in terms of the rollback -- Torme told me in 2000 that he wanted to roll the show back to "The Guardian" with his "Slide Effects" script. But when writing it in 2011, I picked "As Time Goes By" because I feel that once SLIDERS left Vancouver, it lost its visual identity. It lost the indie-film look of the show. It lost the washed out, grounded, gray tone of Vancouver as San Francisco. It lost the fiction of being set in San Francisco.
It lost the Temporal Flux branded production approach "travel light" where Quinn's basement was the chalkboard and coils in a storage locker that could be unpacked to make any bare studio space The Basement which could then be swapped out for pews and a stage to be a church or benches to be a courtroom or beds and false windows to make a motel or racks and registers to be Doppler Computers. Instead, production tied up its money in The Cave and The Chandler. If I were going to roll SLIDERS back to anywhere, it'd be "As Time Goes By" -- but I don't think it helps us much because SLIDERS should satirize and explore TODAY -- not 1996.
Slider_Quinn21 once remarked that "As Time Goes By" has the sliders separated, unable to reach each other with their non-existent cell phones and buying paper newspapers out of a box. The past has become another country and I have lost the ability to say anything that Temporal Flux, Slider_Quinn21 and Transmodiar didn't say first.
19 Reply by Slider_Quinn21 2020-04-30 08:59:53
Oh I completely agree. My point is that a project like this needs a champion. Someone has to go into a meeting with Universal and whoever and sell this thing until people give it lots of money. Something like Ryan Reynolds did with Deadpool or tons of projects that are crowdfunded. Someone needs to lead those meetings, and so far, no one else is doing that. And I think if Jerry is going to spend his time championing a Sliders reboot, he's doing it to star in it. If he's not, I'm assuming he wouldn't champion the project and he'd get whatever Michael Mallory-equivalent role on whatever pilot he can get on Paramount network.
You're right, though, because maybe he champions it and ends up screwed out of it. Richard Hatch famously spent a ton of time and effort looking to get Battlestar Galactica revived. He wrote novels and produced trailers to try and sell the project. And it did generate interest in new Galactica - but not his version. He ended up settling for a recurring role.
So if that's what happened to Jerry, so be it.
It seems unlikely that a cell phone from one world would work on the network of another. Maybe they would sometimes and not others, as the plot demands.
Interesting, didn't know/remember Tracy making that statement. I'm sure he's including The Guardian because he wrote it, but I'd be fine with that. As I said, you retain all of his original mysteries by around that point.
Depends on what medium they're going for. Peacock service needs content, though one would assume the budget wouldn't be great on there, though Sliders proved over and over again that wasn't a showstopper. I'm not really sure what Jerry's concept is to say that he might get pushed out. Terrible example, but look at Saved By the Bell, Mario and Elizabeth are producers and starring, with an all-new teen cast. Sliders could do the same, especially given that besides Jerry, the other three original stars are somewhat "retired."
Depends on what medium they're going for. Peacock service needs content, though one would assume the budget wouldn't be great on there, though Sliders proved over and over again that wasn't a showstopper.
Peacock is planning a new Battlestar Galactica for their service, and that's likely not cheap.
https://www.digitaltrends.com/movies/ba … ease-date/
Well, in 2000 over AOL Instant Messenger, I asked Torme: how would he resolve the cliffhanger of "The Seer"? Torme said that he hadn't seen it and would prefer not knowing anything about it because he was sure it would only make him depressed and angry. But that if he had to follow up on it, he would use a story he'd come up with before he quit the show with Season 3. His idea was a Kromagg story that would be "surreal and trippy" where Quinn would wake up to find himself home with time rewound back to the Pilot and only Quinn remembering sliding.
He would encounter doubles of characters he'd met during Seasons 1 - 2 and Logan from Season 3 at which point he'd realize that sliding was real. The situation would be revealed as a Kromagg trick, and Torme said that to address "The Seer" without having to watch it, he'd declare that any episode after "The Guardian" to be part of the Kromagg scenario. Torme explained that "The Guardian" was his favourite episode of the series and the last one he was happy with, calling "Double Cross" and "Dead Man Sliding" out as "very mediocre."
So, that's how he'd answer your poll, but when writing his Post-It of a story idea into a script, I elected to make the cutoff point the Season 2 finale. That way, while the "Slide Effects" script ends with the sliders still lost in the multiverse, the Kromagg tracking device has been destroyed and Logan isn't pursuing them and the Professor isn't dying of a terminal illness. Also, as far as Torme was concerned, "Invasion" happened before "Post Traumatic Slide Syndrome" and Arturo had the Kromagg tracking device but was stranded on the Azure Gate Bridge world -- which isn't reflected in the actual airdates as "Invasion" aired after PTTS. My "Slide Effects" script uses the original broadcast order and says that Quinn had the implant, another divergence from Torme's intentions.
Later, Torme proposed but did not complete a screenplay for EP.COM. He sent an outline called "The Long Slide Home" which opens with Quinn and the Professor removing Logan St. Clair's whispering gallery system from the geographic spectrum stabilizer and restoring Quinn's original laser gyro system to put their slides back in the San Francisco area, so even in his fanfic, he wanted to integrate "Double Cross" into his selective continuity.
Torme also stated, interestingly, that he intended to gift his script to both Transmodiar AND Temporal Flux and they could feature it on their respective sites as they saw fit. Unfortunately, due to professional obligations, he never finished it.
Also, Torme came up with his Kromagg story that revisits the Pilot before he gave up on Season 3, before John was fired and before Seasons 4 - 5. However, when asked how he would fix his show, his "Invasion" sequel was the story he put forward to roll back the continuity of the series. And when he was asked to where he'd roll it back, he picked "The Guardian."
When I sat down to write a spinoff/sequel series to Earth 214 (which I never got passed a half-written pilot and a plan for season 1), one of the ideas I liked was the idea of putting "satellites" in the wormhole to communicate from world to world (with the idea being that wormholes are a river connecting two worlds but that there's a bigger "ocean" that connects them all).
Might be a dumb idea, but I don't see any reason why it wouldn't work in the continuity of Sliders to allow them to communicate with each other no matter where they are.
Well there went the new series budget! Honestly enough with that dumb show!
Certainly worked for the Kromaggs!
I feel like Quinn in that story, somehow I've forgotten all of this! Leave it to Tracy though to have devised such an esoteric concept. There's definitely a bit of Fire in the Sky in that story though. That may have worked 20 years ago when he proposed it, but the actors are far too old now for that.
Now this I sort of remember, and likewise would have been very cool to read. Similarly, it's probably been too long to use as well. I'm sure that Jerry probably has never read either concept....
Perhaps the Sliders could be using borrowed Kromagg technology to communicate
I watched a couple more episodes of CARTER which aired its second season of 10 episodes earlier this year. CARTER is about TV actor Harley Carter (Jerry O'Connell) on hiatus from his cop show and vacationing in the small town where he grew up. He starts solving actual crimes with his childhood friend Sam (Sydney Tamiia Poitier), a police detective. Carter views every moment in life as a scene from his TV show and is a grossly incompetent investigator, but through a combination of luck, luck, luck and Sam, he keeps haphazardly closing cases and is accepted as a police consultant. Season 1 of this show is ridiculous with Sam perpetually snarling at Carter that he is not a cop and that life is not a cop show and that his methods won't solve crimes only for Carter to solve crimes because CARTER is a cop show no matter what Sam says.
Season 2 is... about the same. While Syndey Tamiia Poitier brings the Sydney Tamiia Poitier forcefulness and authority to her character, Sydney Tamiia Poitier is now forced to defend Carter as an asset to criminal investigations. Now, this is Sydney Tamiia Poitier. If Sydney Tamiia Poitier told me that the moon was made of cheese and that Charlie O'Connell is a master thespian, I would believe it. Sydney Tamiia Poitier sells the moments in which she declares that Carter is capable of solving crimes.
Jerry O'Connell, however, is not entirely supporting her because his performance is a series of overstrained, overextended and generally overdone smirks and smiles. Carter doesn't seem competent at all and like a danger to himself and others and Jerry's overly twitchy performance makes him seem erratic. I'm not sure when this happened, but Jerry O'Connell seems to have thrown away his ability to be unforced and natural in his acting: every expression is prolonged just a few seconds too long, every gesticulation or nostril flare or furrowed brow is forced to the point where it's not a character reacting to a situation but an actor vastly overplaying his scene.
On some level, it works for CARTER because Carter is treating every situation like a scene in his TV show. But in publicity photos and interviews, Jerry has exhibited quite a bit of this behaviour, often visibly refusing to blink while the camera is on him (which is also present in CARTER), stretching his mouth wide to show every tooth in his smile -- and it makes me wonder if he would bring any of this into playing Quinn Mallory if he were to do so again.
That said, Carter and Quinn are *very* different characters and if Jerry were to reprise Quinn, I would want him to perform Quinn as a quiet, subtle observer, a man who stands at a slight distance to watch and absorb all information, a person who is thinking intensely about everything before he says anything at all. Carter is not a thinker but a character of impulses, so Jerry's acting is appropriate for this character -- I just hope he isn't playing every other role like this these days.
I'm deeper into Season 2 of CARTER and I'm seeing another side to Jerry O'Connell -- but it isn't necessarily an improvement. In Season 4 of SLIDERS, we saw Jerry at his most disengaged from his material, not infusing his dialogue with emotion, not reacting to onscreen events, staring vacantly off camera and blandly fading into the background. CARTER shows Jerry at the extreme opposite of his last year on SLIDERS; Jerry is determined to mine every syllable for overpronounced, overdetermined emotion and he is so much in the foreground with his (in-character) mugging for the camera that he is exhausting to see onscreen. Carter is one of the most gratingly obnoxious characters that Jerry has ever performed.
However, there's an episode of CARTER where Jerry has to threaten someone and he performs his threat in a low key, offhand, sinister in its laid back delivery with Jerry's suddenly muted body language making Carter seem frightening because his relentlessly intense efforts to engage with others are suddenly absent.
I'm not sure it's the best acting choice to have the Carter character always at a 15 out of 10 on the intensity scale, but it's clear that Jerry retains all his skills as an actor and that his overlaboured effort in CARTER is an acting choice.
My impression is that while Jerry O'Connell is good actor, Harley Carter is not. JOC plays Carter as someone always trying to grab your attention and force you to remember him, as bad actors often do.
I just finished an episode where the legendary Sydney Tamiia Poitier catches Jerry in a very vulnerable moment and Jerry plays this scene very well without all the artifice and mugging that he usually engages in for Harley.
Jerry constantly highlights how Harley is smiling, chattering and asserting authority and expertise but falsely and pretending. Acting is not about pretending. Acting is about presenting emotional truth in fictional contexts and Harley Carter does not present truth except in these few isolated scenes where Jerry tones down Harley Carter's antics.
I could certainly be persuaded that Jerry O'Connell is performing Harley as a bad actor.
I finished CARTER's second season. I confess that I was not giving it my full attention and had it on the TV while at the sofa photo editing / steam cleaning my clothes and stuffed animals / completing paperwork / arranging meatballs / cutting chicken wings / writing on this message board. I did concentrate whenever Sydney Tamiia Poitier was onscreen, however. This is Sydney Tamiia Poitier, for God's sake; she commands attention and compels me to drop anything and everything to pay attention. Just from her posture and a raised eyebrow and a pleasant yet authoritative smile, Sydney Tamiia Poitier conveys that Sydney Tamiia Poitier is a highly proficient professional of hypercompetent determination.
In contrast, Jerry O'Connell is so obnoxious as Carter (and I agree with pilight that it's deliberate). CARTER is 20 episodes as of Season 2; Carter has a case closure rate of 100 per cent. I don't know how this is possible as Jerry is determined to make Carter the most erratically inept investigator alive. To quote MISSION IMPOSSIBLE, perfect or not, Carter's methods look suspiciously like chance and his results would appear alarmingly like luck.
I don't know how Sydney Tamiia Poitier's Sam tolerates Carter and Sydney Tamiia Poitier's performance indicates that Sydney Tamiia Poitier is so good at her job that Jerry O'Connell at his twitchiest cannot seriously impede Sydney Tamiia Poitier from accomplishing anything that Sydney Tamiia Poitier sets her mind to doing.
The mysteries are not that interesting. The stakes are always incredibly low. The threats are not convincing. A running 'gag' (I think) is Carter referring to previous episodes of his TV show, CALL CARTER which is (I think) a completely fictional TV series that doesn't exist meaning Carter is referring to nothing whatsoever. I think that it's supposed to be funny but it's meaningless. This show has no reason to exist except that 10 episodes a year of Sydney Tamiia Poitier creates a marginally better world than one without 10 episodes of Sydney Tamiia Poitier except this is Sydney Tamiia Poitier and surely she deserves a better job.
Season 2 ends on a soft cliffhanger where Carter asks Sydney Tamiia Poitier not to leave the small town for New York City because Carter is in love with her. Sydney Tamiia Poitier regards Carter in this cliffhanger with slightly teary eyes, I assume, because the wind blew into her eyes at that point. I have no idea what the Sydney Tamiia Poitier would see in the dysfunctional man child that Jerry O'Connell is playing in this series; she's a responsible, capable career woman and Jerry's version of Harley Carter seems incapable of opening a door without causing a scene. Once again, Sydney Tamiia Poitier plays the moment to indicate that if she were to lower her standards to date an extremely childish Jerry O'Connell, it wouldn't seriously interfere with her goals in life.
A lot of CARTER is Jerry O'Connell engaging in what looks suspiciously like actors' exercises with minor league Canadian stars that may be very amusing to people who are friends with a lot of actresses (raises hand) but meaningless to anyone else.
CARTER is funded by some Canadian media companies and the beneficiary of some Canadian tax credits and is filmed in the small Canadian town of North Bay. It's only just finished airing its latest 10 episodes in America and may or may not get a third season and that decision is probably dependent on funding rather than ratings. CARTER is a marginally diverting hour of television and an interesting study into Jerry O'Connell's acting in the modern era. I'm not sure who else would want to watch CARTER.
I can report that Jerry O'Connell clearly LOVES the show. Perhaps a little too much given how his visible glee and relish for his ridiculous character is so high energy that he noticeably drains energy from ME just from watching him. It is very clear that ever since Jerry quit drinking, his enthusiasm for his work has been cranked up to the point where he's not entirely able to restrain himself at times. I recognize, as pilight observed, that Harley Carter is meant to be a terrible actor and that he sees acting as drawing attention to himself rather than conveying the emotion and meaning of the scene, but when nearly every scene has Jerry at his most manic, then every scene becomes the same.
If CARTER gets a third season, it wouldn't be the worst thing in the world to have another 10 episodes of Sydney Tamiia Poitier being commanding and driven and somehow above all of Carter's nonsense.
All this watching CARTER to contemplate how Jerry would play Quinn today prompted a vague memory of my sister having described a series called CASTLE. Which is on Amazon Prime. And I refuse to give Amazon any money due to their work practices. Therefore, I put on a hazmat suit that I stole from a university eight years ago, drove over to my niece's house and broke in while she was walking her dog (alright, I have a key) and cloned her Amazon Prime account off the sideloaded Android app on her Android TV box (alright, the password was written on a piece of paper on a corkscrew board) and exited the house with no one the wiser and watched a couple episodes of CASTLE -- a show about a mystery novelist (Nathan Fillion) who inflicts his annoying presence on Kate, a no nonsense New York City homicide detective (Stana Katic).
It occurred to me that CARTER, airing two years after CASTLE ended in 2016, is a legally dissimilar version of CASTLE attempting to mine the market that CASTLE left open: a procedural where a man from the entertainment industry is paired with a straight laced police investigator. CASTLE was a taut, capable, well-paced, focused series about the belligerent sexual tension between Fillion and Katic and novelist Richard Castle had some actual (if delusional) insight and flashes of brilliance to offer murder mysteries.
In contrast, Jerry O'Connell's Carter is so juvenile that he never comes off as Sydney Tamiia Poitier's equal and in making Jerry's character an actor as opposed to a writer, Jerry's role on his own show is that of an annoying guest-star who should be tolerated for one episode and dismissed entirely. If CARTER is trying to file off the serial numbers of CASTLE to avoid a lawsuit, it ends up sanding down what made CASTLE effective in the first place.
Could something like this happen to SLIDERS if it were revived in the form of a legally dissimilar TV show?
CASTLE was a taut, capable, well-paced, focused series about the belligerent sexual tension between Fillion and Katic and novelist Richard Castle had some actual (if delusional) insight and flashes of brilliance to offer murder mysteries.
I've only seen the first season of CASTLE. I'm going to assume from Transmodiar's reaction that CASTLE suffers from behind the scenes issues that causes the show to lose its clear, focused sense of purpose which is to have Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic onscreen arguing and the murder mysteries being incidental if not irrelevant. They could be restaurant chefs. I do recall numerous press articles during its later years detailing how Fillion and Katic had become so hostile that by the end, they would not film together for more than two scenes an episode. It could be difficult for a show about Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic arguing endlessly to function if it could no longer have Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic in the same scenes for entire episodes.
Which, I think, speaks to another point of interest with SLIDERS. Over in the DECLASSIFIED thread, reading Temporal Flux's screenplay has made me realize to my shock that SLIDERS does not need Quinn, Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo to be SLIDERS -- that the SLIDERS brand is in social satire and commentary rather than Jerry O'Connell.
However, if the purpose is to revive SLIDERS as opposed to creating a legally dissimilar series with a different title, then you need to use characters named Quinn, Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo and keep characters with these names together for five to seven years or you'd end up with Grizzlor's poll here, contemplating where the show should have been allowed to die a quick death. CASTLE and Transmodiar's mocking laughter towards CASTLE may be another indication of this.
Which means it's vital to hire writers who can run a show for up to a decade and actors who wouldn't ditch the show or take it for granted or refuse to be in the same room. The Bryan Fullers and David Duchovnys of the world wouldn't work for this.
Ideally, you'd want young actors to play Quinn and Wade who have worked in the business for awhile, who've been child actors, who've seen the ups and downs of business and would appreciate a potentially stable job. Kids who've been in Disney Channel type shows that were never huge hits. And you'd want older actors for Rembrandt and Arturo who don't consider themselves above television and wouldn't ditch it for a movie or Broadway and wouldn't drunkenly embarrass a network executive for no good reason whatsoever.
In terms of creators -- you'd want writers and producers who'd form close, personal friendships with their cast and ensure that everyone will be getting along for a decade and who have written material close to SLIDERS' comedy satire.
In the past, I've always though of science fiction writers like J. Michael Straczynski (BABYLON 5) or Jeff Pinkner and Joel Wyman (FRINGE) for SLIDERS, but in the light of DECLASSIFIED, I realize that Straczynski's writing is too preachy for SLIDERS and Pinkner and Wyman are too technology-focused in their science fiction. I also liked the idea of Dan Harmon (COMMUNITY) writing SLIDERS, but again, after DECLASSIFIED -- I realize that SLIDERS is not a situation comedy about wacky characters and that maybe I should have noticed before spending 2015 - 2016 writing just that.
I think I would now want Michael Schur (BROOKLYN NINE NINE) and Greg Daniels (PARKS AND RECREATION) to write SLIDERS as both writers have worked together (on PARKS) and their comedy with police officers and municipal government presented an extremely ambivalent and comedic take on these institutions, never preaching their fundamental importance but never condemning them either. Instead, both Schur and Daniels' scripts focused on the peculiarities and eccentricities of the people within these establishment organizations as they worked with or against or for one another or the public.
I think every long running series is going to have its regrets. But SLIDERS kept falling into holes and Grizzlor's poll shows how SLIDERS kept digging itself deeper with David Peckinpah always having a brand new shovel for Rembrandt with each season premiere. A new SLIDERS needs builders, not diggers, and that attitude has to be reflected among all the cast and creators whether it's Jerry and John playing older versions of the originals (doubles or not) or a new team.
Castle badly wanted to be a 21st century version of Moonlighting
I forgot to mention: in the first two episodes of CARTER's second season, Jerry seems to randomly improvise "sliders" in his dialogue with Harley Carter being oddly fixated on the mini-hamburger snack during his inane chatter. It seems to be on Jerry's mind.
I didn't make it to the end. But you don't have to watch past season one to know the show doesn't give two squirts about timing, pacing, or focus. It hopes you like Nathan Fillion or Stana Katic; everything else is incidental.
If you keep watching, just skip over every scene with Castle's daughter or mother. With the exception of the contractually obligated A-story episode they get each season, they add literally nothing to the series. Nada. Bupkus. ZERO.
And if you make it past the episode where the sidekicks get caught in a burning building, I'll buy you a soda.
I would tune in if channel solely to catch a glimpse or too of Stana Katic, otherwise gahhhhhh, what trash!
Well, it cares about the timing of Fillion and Katic's verbal sparring. It cares about pacing the course of their arguments along the case of the (incidental, irrelevant) mystery of the week. It is completely focused on what Fillion and Katic are fighting about that week.
I think Castle's family add a breather between Castle's antics and show that he isn't just a quip machine but someone with a family that brings out a more sincere side and let him recharge before his next round with Beckett. It helps the timing and pacing of the arguments. I love Castle's sharp-thinking daughter and regal mother.
I am not there yet. But I've been making my own sodas lately with a Sodastream. It's amazing! I have had to drive a bit farther than I'd like for carbonator exchanges lately. CASTLE is very enjoyable. And Joanne Kelly showed up which makes me remember that I never got around to finishing WAREHOUSE 13 and should get to it. And Transmodiar once wrote a spec script for WAREHOUSE 13 that is on EarthPrime.com for... some reason.
Uh... how to make this post SLIDERS reboot related. How. How. How?! How?! CASTLE is based in New York City and Jerry O'Connell was born there and... and... oh my God, Grizzlor, PLEASE respond to this thread to make it relevant!
I don't feel CASTLE is trash (although I'm only in Season 2). It aims low. It hits its target. It seeks to feature Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic arguing. It features Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic arguing. Followed by Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic arguing. Followed by Fillion fencing with his daughter and mother for a breather. Followed by Nathan Fillion and Stana Katic arguing. It does exactly what it sets out to do. Why isn't that enough?
Honestly, I cannot watch a series that doesn't have continuity anymore, I feel as though I'm just wasting my time. Been that way for many, many years.
And Transmodiar once wrote a spec script for WAREHOUSE 13 that is on EarthPrime.com for... some reason.
Because it's a good read produced by two of the site admins that has to do with a dimension-hopping van. How many more reasons do you need?
If you can promote Tf's spinoff, I can share this: https://earthprime.com/etcetera/warehouse-13-qed
It's fun, if you liked "Warehouse 13."
WAREHOUSE 13 is the undemanding, low stakes procedural that I need right now. The procedural that America needs right now! And I consider "QED" an episode of the show. WAREHOUSE 13 has some interesting parallels with SLIDERS and the potential for legally dissimilar shows about parallel universes. Watching the first several episodes of WAREHOUSE 13, WAREHOUSE 13 is clearly a legally dissimilar copy of THE X-FILES with two government agents (Secret Service, not FBI!) investigating supernatural artifacts (to confiscate and cover them up, not to expose them! Not like THE X-FILES at all!).
The pilot episode of WAREHOUSE 13 seems like something that nobody wanted to make or take ownership of, much like Season 5 of SLIDERS. The original script was written by Rockne O'Bannon (FARSCAPE) and Jane Espenson (BUFFY, ONCE UPON A TIME, GILMORE GIRLS, JESSICA JONES) but Syfy bought it and then retooled it with at least four different writing teams before landing on Jack Kenny, a veteran of children's fantasy show THE SECRET WORLD OF ALEX MACK. By the time WAREHOUSE 13 made it to air, it had become an indecisive, confused product. A photocopy of a photocopy of a photocopy with many contradictory sensibilities.
The Pilot has the story elements of a paranoid, conspiracy-minded series of secret agents in a shadow government organization and a simple, Nickelodeon children's show where the heroes look to find and contain dangerous supernatural objects and the questions of who they work for and why is not something kids would ask. WAREHOUSE 13 also seems to be visually very similar to Season 5 of SLIDERS with interior locations being redressed beige hallways if it's not the warehouse set that's the equivalent of SLIDERS' Chandler Hotel.
But WAREHOUSE 13 cast well. And by the end of the first season, WAREHOUSE 13 had succeeded in doing what SLIDERS did in its first two seasons: it created a strong ensemble with the exuberant and childish Eddie McClintock, the bookish and flustered Joanne Kelly, the sardonic Allison Scagliotti and the jaded Saul Rubinek. And their affable, friendly chemistry smoothed out the conceptual confusion of their show. WAREHOUSE 13 was still a legally dissimilar X-FILES shot on a much lower budget, but it was an amiable, undemanding, unchallenging, lightweight X-FILES clone that was soothing and relaxing. Aside from the comedy episodes, THE X-FILES was never fun.
WAREHOUSE 13 being a clone of a pre-existing property and then cloned from subsequent drafts of the clone itself, however, was always something that held it back. I wonder if it is simply bad development strategy to look at a previously successful series and try to replicate it but with just enough differences to a void a lawsuit. But it can work sometimes. BILL AND TED was plainly an American Polaroid of a DOCTOR WHO episode. STAR WARS was an American portrait of THE HIDDEN FORTRESS.
What would JOHN RHYS-DAVIES' SLIDERS be like?
Jerry O'Connell and John Rhys-Davies, last year, were very enthusiastic about conceiving a new SLIDERS project. Assuming they could get Cleavant and Sabrina back and that they would be setting the creative direction -- what would Jerry and John want to do with SLIDERS? John most definitely has serious creative ambitions for SLIDERS. He wanted to run the writer's room and write scripts. But he also wanted to be the lead character and for Jerry to be his sidekick. I don't know if that's changed in the years that have passed.
I imagine that John would probably want JOHN RHYS-DAVIES' SLIDERS to just start over from the ground up again and he would want to take ownership of the new show and define it with his personality and interests. And I'm not sure John's interests are in social satire; judging from his personality, he would probably be more along the lines of overt lecturing and moral outrage and it would be a very different voice for SLIDERS having originally been more indirect and comedic.
John also doesn't want to do more than a year or two of playing Arturo before quitting and moving on.
I suspect Jerry doesn't have any real creative ambitions aside from always being happy to be working. He's the executive producer of CARTER and it's very obvious from watching CARTER that Jerry just wants to hang out with his friends on the set for 10 episodes a year.
Are those two visions necessarily mutually exclusive? I think it's possible to have a version of Sliders that has a strong voice, that tells important stories, that either has social satire or a stare into the darkest parts of our souls, and also has a character played by Jerry O'Connell who can be fun, funny, and an action hero. It's an idea that's so simple that it's crazy we didn't think of it.
Have Jerry play Rembrandt.
Well, I don't think there are two visions between John and Jerry. Despite the brilliance of Jerry's NARCOTICA comic book, Jerry's creative ambitions with every product he's produced have been simply to spend time with his friends. That's why he brought Charlie into Season 4. That's why he wants SLIDERS back now; he wants to hang out with John and Sabrina and Cleavant. It's very obvious from his work on CARTER that Jerry just really likes his co-stars. If SLIDERS were revived as a half-hour series about a hamburger restaurant with Arturo managing the place, Wade on the register, Rembrandt on the grill and Quinn manning the drive-thru, Jerry would take it.
So it's really just John's vision and what he would want to do as Arturo and I think Jerry would go along with whatever John wanted to do.
I have to say, while Grizzlor's question was where to cut off SLIDERS continuity, I would personally be in favour of adding to it instead. I would want to add:
A couple stories explaining the gap between Seasons 1 - 2. Season 1 ended with Quinn shot, Ryan and Henry the Dog now joining the sliders. Season 2 dismissed it. So, I'd want to add Mike Truman's SLIDERS story, "All That You Can't Leave Behind," a flashback story where Wade recalls the events that took place between "Luck of the Draw" and "Into the Mystic" where Ryan, Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo sought medical treatment for Quinn and Ryan chose to leave the sliders.
http://slidersweb.net/otherworlds/317/321.htm
I'd also want to add a second story after "Into the Mystic." Season 1 had the sliders constantly on the verge of homelessness, getting jobs. Season 2 dispenses with all that; the sliders just have money and stay in a hotel, no explanation given (because it was getting repetitive and stalling the plots).
I'd suggest a story where the sliders land on an Earth where the Cold War never ended and the sliders find in the Dominion Hotel a secret cache of cash, clothing, tailoring equipment and supplies. On each parallel Earth with a Dominion, the sliders will visit the hotel and find the cache in 2/5 versions of the Dominion, which is why we no longer seem them out of money and even alternating between outfits and why Arturo is always in a tailored suit.
Another story I'd want to add to SLIDERS canon: an X-FILES crossover. It's unfortunate that SLIDERS never crossed over with every single Vancouver-filming show airing on FOX. Nigel Mitchell's SLIDERS: "X Marks the Spot" story seems to fit the bill: http://freepdfhosting.com/2e80122e71.pdf
And I'd want to add a story into canon where Quinn, Wade, Rembrandt and Arturo are all reunited after the events of Seasons 3 - 5 in a way that doesn't invalidate or redact anything. :-)
I think any approach to continuity is best additive rather than subtractive.


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Julius Exuperantius was een Latijnse historicus, van wie wordt verondersteld dat hij in de 5e eeuw leefde. Exuperantius schreef een geschiedwerk dat, onder de titel Iulii Exuperantii opusculum, voor het eerst door Friedrich Sylburg (Historiae romanae scriptores Latini minores, I, Frankfurt, 1588) op basis van een handschrift van Pierre Pithou (MS Parisinus lat. 6085) uitgegeven, sindsdien vaak aan het einde van edities van de werken van Sallustius wordt toegevoegd. Deze korte voorstelling van de Romeinse burgeroorlog tussen Gaius Marius en Lucius Cornelius Sulla tot aan de dood van Quintus Sertorius, wordt verondersteld haast volledig te zijn gebaseerd op de werken van Sallustius.

Referentie
, art. Exsuperantius (2), in RE VI.2 (1909), coll. 1695-1696.

Romeins historicus
Latijns schrijver
Persoon in de 5e eeuw
Gens Julia

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