text:
Anon's Story
February 4, 2013 in Sovereign Grace Ministries
In the comments of yesterday's post about C.J. Mahaney's guidelines for watching the Super Bowl (no, I'm not joking, he really did write lengthy instructions for how to have proper fellowship and keep from sinning on game day by changing the channel to C-SPAN during commercials!), someone using the handle of "Anon" posted the following:
I'm just going to share a little story and some minor commentary at the end.
One Superbowl Sunday, I was at a prominent SGM (then PDI) member's house. There were dozens of others in attendance, lots of teens and younger adults. Remote controlling and commercial censoring were in full effect, snacks were in abundance, and everything was so biblical…as biblical as recently invented sports events centered around electronic devices can be. During a commercial break, I was sexually assaulted against an exterior wall of that house.
I was thirteen.
Not a single one of those appointed to 'watch over' anything, much less my soul, noticed a thing when I and the perpetrator went back inside the house. I doubt it would have mattered anyway. My family was in the outer circle, despite decades of $$$ and attendance. I started "rebelling" thereafter and refused to attend any church functions, and my parents surprisingly didn't seem to mind (despite them not knowing the reasons for my rebellion). They severed ties with PDI/SGM 2 years later.
Why bring this up? I think it's quite telling that despite the micromanagement of 'biblical living', horrible things have not only slipped under the radar of those 'caring for our souls' (etc., barf) but have been actively hidden, squashed, silenced. The pending lawsuit is long-deserved. I hope it ruins the entire organization financially and every single perpetrator and co-conspirator financially, mentally and physically.
← From 2008 [And Today], C.J. Mahaney Gives Tips For Watching The Super Bowl
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173 thoughts on "Anon's Story"
Anon, I am so sorry that this ever happened to you!
(I know it was a long time ago and nothing anyone can say will erase the fact that it happened…but I just wanted to say that anyway.)
What Anon shared really does highlight the cluelessness of SGM's culture, especially in light of the fact that CJ/Chad actually re-published the same exact Super Bowl guidelines on their sports blog yesterday.
I mean, it's just so ridiculous. Whether or not CJ is directly connected to any of the lawsuit incidents or not (and right now, it would appear that he was crafty enough to make sure others actually reinforced the policies that his twisted teachings created), CJ still presides over the organization associated with the lawsuits. He also is aware of the basic truths behind the allegations. While nothing has been decided in a court of law yet, CJ knows what really happened, at least in the situations that took place at CLC.
So he has got to be aware of the great evil that was happening right under his nose even as he was spewing all his elaborate instructions for how to be more holy and beat back sin by commandeering the TV remote and changing channels so as not to "stumble" men with accidental peeps at hot bikini-clad models in beer commercials.
CJ has got to know that his teachings did nothing to prevent real perversion.
(Hmm…reminds me of that verse: "Where the law abounds, sin doth more abound.)
Yet – and here's what's so crazy – even while CJ knows that all his sin-sniffing legalism and fussy rules for "real" fellowship and fighting sin were ineffective, he does not repent of this garbage. No.
Instead, he (and his figurehead Chad) re-publish the same garbage yesterday.
I think the guy has lost his mind. I really do.
Either that, or the paid lackeys surrounding him are losing their minds and not giving him good advice about what he should put on his blog.
old timer says:
Anon, That makes me angry that happened to you at what should have been a fun time.
Hypocrites, white washed tombs who control remotes and make kids close their eyes while a molestation occurs under their noses.
Let the chips fall where they may.
Sgmnot says:
Anon: This just breaks my heart. I am so sorry that your innocence was shattered in this way, and at a time and place that you and your parents thought, "Oh, of course, our kids will be safe". But sadly, no. The abusers and anyone in authority in SGM who knew about the abusers must be held accountable for their crimes!
IMO CJ has set the precedent of image over change. He preaches on what it looks like to be a Christian, rather than preach of Jesus and let fruit grow. It teaches a wolf to look like a sheep. But under the cloak he is still a wolf. This is a dangerous part of SGM. We are to trust our pastors and follow them, but many of them are wolves in sheeps clothing. This culture allows wolves in our midst to look like a christian, but satisfy his cravings and feed on the trusting people who attended. Many pastors/wolves look good, know what to say (taught by CJ and his minions in PC), and let loose on the sheep. Again, I believe this is a very dangerous part of SGM and their churches. Don't fall for their displays of good. It's all image. This culture has not changed. It is still a very dangerous place to entrust your family.
Stephen Crosby says:
Anon's post is sadly too typical of legalistic regimes led by a culture of leadership elitism, separation and privilege. Anon is the human face of the suffering and trauma that people have experienced at the hand of the still unrepentant SGM cabal, and CJ Mahaney. CJ's post on the superbowl would be funny if it was not so pathetic. It is hard for me to understand why anyone would pay any attention to any thing that guy says or writes, let alone continue to be a part of anything he is associated with and support it with finances. It is staggering.
Straining at gnats, swallowing camels.
Always a sign of a self-righteous religionist.
I counted 14 uses of the words, "I" and "Me/my" and 3 uses of the word, "God". 1 quote from an athelete, and 1 quote from a theologian. No Scripture anywhere. That is one of my biggest issues with SGM.
I am really sorry for what happened to you. It is very sad and dispicable that you had to go through any of that at all. I hope and pray that you have been able to recover from that assault and have found help in dealing with the trauma. If you are able, it would be good for you to tell your story to the lawyers in the current lawsuit. I'm sure Kris can get you the contact information. I pray for peace and healing in your life.
Square Peg says:
That is such a heart-breaking story. Notice how there is nothing in CJ's rules about keeping an eye on the children's whereabouts and safety.
A story like this makes me all the more aware of how much I need to keep the radar up since I work with children.
It also makes me all the more aware of what I need to be mindful of if I were to host an event or party with lots of people. One can never be too careful.
This is just terrible.
I do know…that I worked in children's ministry at my SGM church from about 2005-ish until about 2011. In that time, when children needed to go to the restroom, they were to go in alone after there was certainty there was no one in the restroom. This is a good practice. Also, there needed to be two adults present until all children were picked up. I always thought these were good policies, and therefore approved that SG has policies like these in place. Did they come about AFTER things happened with children?
Nat W. Clerk says:
Earlier today, Brent posted the following on Facebook:
"Three more churches have just severed ties with SGM.
Allen Snapp – Grace Community Church, Corning, NY
Gareth Lloyd – Sovereign Grace Church, Merthyr Tydfil, Wales
John Feska – Sovereign Grace Church, Aurora, IL"
These churches are still listed on the SGM website, but if Brent is correct, then they should be removed soon.
– Nat
Moniker says:
"Straining at gnats, swallowing camels. Always a sign of a self-righteous religionist." Thanks for your comment, Stephen Crosby. (#6) By the way, I really like your blog and highly recommend it to everyone here.
QE2 says:
Square Peg #9
I know in Fairfax all of a sudden we had all these policies put into place-a computer to sign the kids in that printed a nametag for the child and one for the parent-no one could pick a child up without the nametag, hall monitors, bathroom monitors, etc.
No official reason was given, but the man in charge made a comment once about how you would not believe the things that go on and there are lots of lawsuits against churches or something to that effect. It was also mentioned that there was a custody thing at CLC maybe? where a non custodial parent took a kid from the class or something like that.
It was only after reading this blog years after that I realized it was in response to Noel's daughter's molestation.
Cult Watcher says:
C.J. blogs about sports, but he doesn't blog about molestation. Hmm.
Steve240 says:
Anom I am also sorry to hear your story and for what it has done to you. It is sad to hear another SGM story of a child being molested. Anon didn't indicate this so am not sure if it was an older child (under 18) that did this to her or an adult.
Sadly, it isn't surprising that there is another report of this happening. There is an old saying that for every rat you catch that many more weren't caught. I wonder how many more cases are like this.
In some ways it really isn't surprising. When you have a group where people are taught not to question (especially leadership), beaten down by their sinfulness, have the arrogance that their group is a better than others, and children are supposed to have unquestioning obedience can all set up a group for this to happen. Also, if you never admit that this has happened in your churches when it has in fact happened, people get this false sense that this doesn't happen here.
Anon, I am truly sorry for what you have been through. I feel ill that no one was there to stand up for you, and that the culture was such that you would not have stood much chance to provide your side of the story, stand up for yourself, and tell an adult what had happened that day. I hope you did not have to see the perp much after that. I also wanted to echo Bridget #8's post about hopes that you have gotten help and healing for your trauma, and that you could contact the lawyers.
I realize I cannot do anything for you to bring back the innocence of your childhood. Truly hoping and praying for you as you have had to carry a great deal of responsibility that no child should have to take on – the reprehensible sin of another person. You did not deserve what happened to you, it was not your fault in any way.
just saying... says:
Anon,
Nobody has the right to ever sexually assault you. Ever. You should press charges. Anyone who things they can violate someone that way, may be doing it again.
I'm so sorry you experienced that. Because it happened at a party with church people, please don't ever think God approved of that. A wicked person did that.
Never Again says:
Anon, I am truly sorry for what you went through. You should have been safe and protected. I hope you have been able to get counseling, and I pray you find healing and wholeness.
Stephen Crosby, I recently stumbled upon your webpage of teaching links and started listening. Thank you.
Thanks, Nat, for the report. Wales and Corning, NY, had been reported to be leaving, but I guess it is official now. Not surprised about Aurora, IL, either. Wasn't their founding pastor Tab Trainor? He went to San Diego East County to pastor a new SGM church plant there, but I guess by the time it actually opened, they had already decided not to be part of SGM.
I wonder what further blows are coming to SGM.
MAK says:
from Never Again #17…"I wonder what further blows are coming to SGM"
I've been pondering whether SGM actually see churches leaving as "blows". In their deception, I'm beginning to believe that they see churches leaving as strengthening SGM. By churches leaving, they are ridding SGM of discent, gossip and slander. That way the remaining churches can go back to drinking from the big cauldron of Kool-Aid that they all know and love. I'm sure we'll hear more from the other churches blogging on the SGM website expounding on how great SGM is. It's their version of running away with their fingers in their ears and making noise so they can't hear what the rest of the world is saying.
Nat #10
Jenn Grover reported the Corning NY departure. I have specific confirmation on the other two so they should fall off the list soon.
QE2 #12 ~ Thanks for sharing! Little did I know that they were "good" policies put in place for a situation that happened at SGM that was not dealt with properly. It would be one thing if it was handled properly…and then the policies were put into place. I thought they were policies because of situations at "other" churches. And therefore, it was all a precaution.
I feel so uncertain about being a part of a church these days. They can all look "good" on the surface. You never know what is going on in the underbelly.
This is from the website of one of the Louisville TV stations.
http://www.whas11.com/news/national/186953891.html
Sick with Worry says:
Mak, #17…. You are correct in some ways. I am sure that they do not "wish" for churches to leave, but, organizationally, I think they know that they need to get through this. Right now, it probably stinks to be SGM. But, they need to have visibility to what the future looks like. Knowing the new reality and planning around it is probably more important to them than the actual size.
Once they get over the lawsuits and the polity, no matter how many churches leave and how many members leave churches…. They will know that they hit bottom. It is similar to bad news hitting the economy. You get to the point that you do not care as much about how bad it is, you just want all the bad news baked into your forecast so you can go about planning for the recovery.
I know that they are thinking this way, and I posted it before. Perhaps Kris can dig up my older post.
BTW, Tim Shorey should be a full time pastor, not an SGM employee. I am sad to see this.
All bleeding stops eventually. Question is, does God intervene and surgically fix the ministry, or does He let churches and people leave and bleed out until this work of man is dead…
LetMyPeopleGo says:
I am so sorry to hear of your story. It broke my heart to read it because I know from personal experience the psychological harm that comes from even just one assault. To be violated in such a way damages our very psyche, our very mind, in a way that I still cannot believe is possible. The Holy Spirit has healed my mind greatly in recent years in ways that I didn't even know needed healing. I sincerely pray the same for you. God bless you.
Though they seem to live in unreality, I suspect C.J. has an exit strategy. He will find a way to land on his feet through his strategic alliances with the RBD, even if he has to throw everybody else under the bus to do so.
Right now they are putting a good face on things for the sake of PR. Their plan seems to be to admit nothing and try legal maneuvers to keep a lid on things, whether that is claiming clergy privilege or maybe citing the loopholes in state reporting laws or perhaps petitioning for the suits be broken up and tried individually instead of as a class, or mitigating damages by attacking the witnesses, etc., etc., etc. It looks like they will fight dirty and drag this out.
However, depending on how probing the lawsuit gets and what is found in discovery and how their assessment of how the case is going, I think the guys at the top will blameshift and offer up the other defendants as scapegoats to spare themselves. Last of all, C.J. will sacrifice Riccuci and Loftness.
I just keep picturing the scenes from Clear and Present Danger when the President denies, blameshifts, and covers up his guilt:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i7tGEEWQIhQ
And the clip left out his part:
The President: [on who gets punished for 'Reciprocity'] You'll take the blame. Cutter and Ritter will take some too, but it won't amount to much. They'll get a slap on the wrist and $20,000 an hour on the lecture circuit. The rest, you'll dump on Greer. Yes, you'll take him down with you. You'll *destroy* his reputation. But it won't go any further than that. It's the ol' Potomac two-step, Jack.
Jack Ryan: I'm sorry, Mr. President, I don't dance.
Cult Watcher #21, did you see this recent article?
Fascinating quotes….
Police interviewed a co-pastor at the church who recalled having confronted Morales about the allegations. That pastor, Ernest Boisvert, told police that "normally the church would appeal to the person to stop his criminal behavior and then, should it not stop, they would alert people that the person is not acting in a Christian manner. The person would need to show contrition," according to a police report filed in the case. Boisvert said that going to the police was in the "realm of possibilities," but that he took his cues from the families, the police report says.
Another pastor, Grant Layman, said he had communicated with Morales several years ago and that Morales had admitted to past abuses, but also said he was very ill and could not recall the specifics of anything that occurred.
Too ill to recount what happened? Ask a sexual predator to stop, and wait for him to do so? Someone is not in reality!!!
Another quote in that article I just mentioned:
Nathaniel Morales, who had been working as a pastor in Nevada, is accused in an indictment of sexually abusing the boys between 1985 and 1990 as a member of Covenant Life Church in Gaithersburg, Md. That church until December was associated with Sovereign Grace Ministries, a Kentucky-based evangelical church group accused in a lawsuit in Maryland last fall of covering up allegations of child sex abuse by its members. The lawsuit was amended last month to name Covenant Life Church as a defendant.
I realize that these are separate cases, I think that was discussed already, but it appears the pastors are a little cavalier in their quotes…..Reporting to the police was in the realm of possibility, but they took their cues from families? Which families? Which cues?
Ok I will stop on this story….but who is/was Ernest Boisvert??? Did the newspaper article mean Robin Boisvert? So confused!
Stunned says:
Marie, #26- those quotes are soooo messed up!
Marie, Ernest/Robin Boisvert are one and the same. His real first name is Ernest but he goes by Robin (whether that's his middle name I don't know).
Bookhead says:
Marie-#26- I checked the article, and it didn't have the quotes you mentioned. And the time posted was 2:01 PM. Was it changed, do you think?
Bookhead – I saw the quotes that Marie posted, and I just looked, and that whole section is gone from the article!
Nickname says:
Anon, I am heartbroken to hear about what happened to you.
Early this morning, I posted the following on the previous thread — regarding our PDI church Super Bowl parties and a perpetrator. I am copying it here in case this information will be helpful to anyone who is unwittingly being befriended by a perp.
In the early days when our PDI church met in rented spaces, a guy took it upon himself to rent a big-screen TV and set it up in a community center for a church Super Bowl party. The church itself did not host the party, but most members came, and it evolved into a yearly affair with a chili contest. If they censored commercials, I don't remember, but that was before things went way-out-weird.
To underscore the posts referencing pedophilia [in the previous thread, "From 2008…"} (#24 and #57), I want to point out that the person who rented the big-screen tv and organized the Super Bowl parties later went to prison for 20 for molestation of a church child — he was due for release last week.
What we didn't know in the time before internet searches and sex offender registries was that this guy had already spent 8 years behind bars for previous offenses committed when he was a public school teacher and coach. Church officials assured us at the time of his arrest (and as late as last year) that they did NOT know about his prior convictions. However, other statements and actions lead me to believe that they did, in fact, know or suspect something, whether they knew the entire facts of this guy's history or not. Regardless, he was/is a master manipulator. He has the ability to appear genuine — the lovable teddy-bear kind of guy — can spout Bible verses by the chapter, has a good sense of humor & a bright intellect, and is generous with his time and many talents.
It's easier now to find repeat offenders; but the first-time offenders or the never-caught offenders are out there, finding their way into favored positions in churches and other organizations, building close friendships with parents, gaining unfettered access to children.
Pay attention to the red flags that go up in your mind or your gut — don't dismiss them, as I did, just because Joe Blow says he's a Christian. If he fits the mold of an older single guy who loves children and spends more time with youth or kids than he does with people his own age — be wary. If there are holes in his history; if his extended family seems to be distant or estranged; if he sometimes slips and uses jargon that might be construed as prison lingo; if he doesn't want to be introduced to women his own age; if he tells you the story of a 'friend' who had a sexual deviance problem but God healed him; if he makes strange excuses for why he didn't vote, or why he can't be an official Sunday school teacher; if he works in a job that is far below his education level — be wary — there's a reason for all that. He'll avoid taking any position in the church that requires a background check, so he'll volunteer to 'help out' with youth or sports teams under the radar, because he's prohibited by the courts from being a school teacher or coach. His extended family lives in another state and wants nothing to do with him, but in SGM, many people live far from their extended families and have replaced those relationships with church friends, so that one may be difficult to see. He can't vote because he's a convicted felon. He can't pass the background check for a professional job that meets his education level.
Check out the sex offender registry. Even if his name doesn't appear, even if he appears to be authentic and genuine in every way, do not let your guard down — do not break any of your own rules about allowing access to your children. It may be much more inconvenient to follow rules when you think someone is completely trustworthy, but it is far better to be inconvenienced than to suffer the molestation of a child.
My own kids were not molested. However, their innocence was stolen by this perp — think of having to 'draw your kids out' about this very real crime — and our outrage at what was done to his innocent victims and our heartbreak for them is as strong today as it was 20 years ago. Statistics indicate that this guy had many more victims that are still unknown. He was a master at hiding things, a master at gaining trust, a master at lying and telling half-truths, a master at spin.
So — has the Ceej ever blogged about how to draw out your kids when you've found out there was a molestation in your midst? Has he taught about how to keep your kids safe from pedophiles? Did he give the remote control to anyone when we had to sit through a 'family meeting' that explained the pedophilic molestation of a church child by a church member?
Bet not. But the reality of pedophilia in churches (SGMs or otherwise) is a far worse and more real threat than Superbowl commercials. Pointing out the character flaws in sports figures, indeed — just another way of rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic.
Ok….I did a search on SGM, because the link that was first posted did not seem to work. Three links came back, one of them about the N. Morales case.
Here is an attempt to copy-paste the article:
Md. church member accused of molestation in 1980s
Posted on February 4, 2013 at 12:01 PM
WASHINGTON (AP) — A Las Vegas man has been charged in Maryland with molesting multiple boys in the 1980s while assisting with youth ministries at a church targeted in a child sex abuse lawsuit.
Morales, 55, is charged with ten counts of either sex abuse and sex offense. He was scheduled for a pretrial hearing on Friday in Montgomery County Circuit Court. His lawyer did not immediately return calls seeking comment and a telephone listing for Morales could not be found.
The criminal investigation began in 2009 when a man reported to police that he was sexually abused by Morales, who helped with youth ministries and also taught at a Christian school, when he was between the ages of 12 and 20. The man told police that his parents had spoken to the church pastor but that no police report was made. Four other men interviewed by police said they had been sexually abused by Morales as boys — sometimes in their own bedrooms or inside Morales's apartment or his office at the Christian school where he taught. The Associated Press generally does not identify people who say they are victims of sexual assault.
Don Nalle, the church's communications director, would not discuss Morales's criminal case, deferring to a statement posted last month on the church's website.
"We are sickened by the thought of such abuse —sexual abuse in any form is evil and unconscionable. We are grieved by these allegations. We also recognize that we don't have all the facts. We would encourage everyone to withhold judgment until an appropriate legal process can be completed," the statement reads in part.
A lawsuit filed last October accuses leaders at Sovereign Grace Ministries, a three-decade-old family of churches, of failing to report allegations of sexual abuse to the police and of shielding known sexual predators of children. Sovereign Grace Ministries moved its headquarters to Louisville last year after three decades in Maryland and has struggled in recent years with fractured leadership and criticism over its discipline methods, especially the church's emphasis on sins, discipline and repentance.
Susan Burke, the lawyer who brought the case, said in a statement that the "indictment supports our lawsuit's allegations of extensive wrongdoing by Sovereign Grace Ministries and its pastors. We look forward to our day in court."
The church group has said the suit contains "a number of misleading allegations, as well as considerable mischaracterizations of intent."
Police say they're tracking the civil lawsuit and will conduct additional investigations if new information emerges from that.
Here's the same article at another site, with the missing quotes:
http://www.ajc.com/ap/ap/crime/md-church-member-accused-of-molestation-in-1980s/nWFSG/
Moniker #32:
Bookhead #31:
Atlanta paper has full text:
Is there an implication that Mr. Morales could have AIDs? Brings up whole other mess for victims….normally I would protect AIDs victim's anonymity…but not for alleged sexual perp….Theseus sound like steong allegations…
Sovereign Grace Members.
Reprinted from:http://www.letusreason.org/cults.htm
Are you told not to question what is being taught because the leaders are honest and want the best for you so you must trust them. Has someone replaced your own choices in life.
Are you told not to ask questions why anyone left, your to accept the answers the leaders give you such as: they fell into sin, they didn't receive correction, they weren't open or they had a bad heart and didn't want to be disciples
Are you told that you must be with their certain church or group to be saved and not by Jesus Christ.
If you want to leave are you being told their is no other church that practices truth, you will go to hell.
Are you made to feel your failures, that your performance is not up to par for the bibles standard
Are you being rebuked for things such as the way you say hello or how you respond to being asked to do something for a leader or disciple. Do they tell you its a matter of the heart how one complies.
Are they putting down other church's and building themselves up. Do they sometimes use people as examples of what you are to be doing and others on what you are not to be doing.
Do they bring attention to what they do, and ignoring others that may be doing the same things outside their church.
Do they put down others to make themselves look better, calling themselves righteous and others unrighteous
Do they call those who leave fall away's and enemies, dogs returning to their own vomit, using the examples of Korah or Judas.
Do they stop you from reading anything negative about themselves calling it spiritual pornography or recommend you not to read it for your own spiritual protection.
Do they recommend for you to be around their people expecting you to be at all the group activities. If not you're spirituality and dedication are questioned.
Do they defend all that they do even though it can be harmful or wrong.
Do they operate by humility or are they arrogant and demand you to obey if you are considering otherwise. Or is it done subtly by manipulating you into obeying by statements such as, real Christians obey their leaders or if you were following Jesus you would see what I'm saying is right. true disciples did not question Jesus.
THINGS TO BE AWARE OF
People telling you how talented you are and saying you can really go places. (flattery goes a long way in cults)
An instant bonding of friendship without your knowing who they are or they really knowing you, they act as your best friend (love bombing still works).
When you ask questions about their history or the group they are vague in their answers or avoid answering them. (not answering or postponing it makes it go away)
Are you required to attend studies, going through the program before you are allowed to be a Christian. (this will attach you to the groups goals)
Are they emphasizing their church and who they are, more than Christ. They teach that one can only be a Christian by joining them. (exclusive spirituality appeals to our pride and works well today)
The Grant Layman paragraph changes drastically (well, to me, anyway) in the Atlanta paper:
Another pastor, Grant Layman, said he had communicated with Morales several years ago and that Morales had admitted to "alcohol abuse and homosexuality." He said that Morales told him that he remembered having committed abuses and having confessed his past to an older pastor, but that Morales now said he was very ill and could not recall the specifics of anything that occurred.
Confessed to an older pastor??? What did the older pastor do???
Confessed to homosexuality and alcohol abuse? I don't mean to imply that all homosexuals are sexual perp's…But now Mr. Morales is very ill…This story gets scary for me…
Ok I am extremely upset by this and probably making little sense…Story is scary to begin with….meant to say this is EXTRA scary….and what did the older pastor do about these kinds of confessions? I guess Mr. Morales did not confess to sexually abusing anyone….Very unclear…
Do you guys realize that the article that Marie posted – the one that got cut way, way down – is from a Louisville news source? What the heck??? Who's pulling the strings there?
So Susan Burke says that new victims continue to come forward, so it looks like we might expect new stories and new plaintiffs added to the civil class action lawsuit.
And the police say they are tracking with the civil suit to see if further prosecutable criminal cases are uncovered.
Once Morales is found guilty, his particular abuses will no longer be alleged but proven. Then it becomes only a matter of who knew what and when.
Muckraker says:
The link to that Louisville news source is now fixed with the longer version again as of 3:01 pm
This is a big deal. There is no getting around it. This is horrendous. Thank God the victims will finally be heard, and I hope having a voice and seeing justice done bring some healing for them. It is long overdue.
As part of that justice, SGM, CLC, and Fairfax will pay all they have, and some pastors will also pay all they have and forfeit the ministry. Some (perhaps Tomzcak) may face criminal charges, as well.
The Lord is cleaning house.
keepinstep says:
Several years ago, discussion here was about what it would take for the secular news media to begin investigating SGM. If memory serves, general agreement was that it would take some sort of sexual misbehavior – but that it appeared CJ and the pastors were squeaky-clean in that area. Indeed, CJ's short-term admission of minor badness in 2011 emphasized that his sins were NOT sexual or financial in nature.
Now it's all changing, obviously – there were sexual improprieties going on, with the allegations valid enough for 2 lawsuits that news media are beginning to write about. So far, CJ has not been directly identified with either lawsuit.
The video clip cited above is very interesting, however. In the Watergate investigation, the Democrats' committee attorneys and staffers worked carefully in building a case against Nixon. They interviewed many low-level people, cross-referencing their statements and then interviewing additional people. All this rather boring groundwork was done, to catch "the President's men" in lies/inaccuracies through which they could be threatened with perjury charges, and then plea-bargained so they'd share info on Nixon that they would never have shared otherwise.
The testimony in the 2 trials will, hopefully, be picked-over by both journalists and criminal investigators, for evidence pointing to criminal acts (such as perjury or other violations), and additional people who may be indicted for criminal acts. Indictments – or threats of indictment – may yield even more interesting information to investigators. As with Nixon, the ultimate question may turn out to be "What did XXX know, and when did he know it?"
Persona says:
I found a few recent, year-old Youtube videos of Nate Morales singing and preaching as a pastor/Bishop, in a Pentacostal church. Boy did he get a royal welcome and introduction. Nate apparently took the charismatic gifts and ran with them after leaving CLC. He certainly remembers all the old worship songs he learned at CLC. He also seems perfectly healthy, with no evident memory loss issues. The prosecutors could pull up one of those videos for evidence during the trial.
I feel really badly for the five or more victims of Nate. We probably knew all of them, since they are only a few years older than our own children.
We were acquaintances with Nate. He had a stellar reputation at CLC and he would never have been allowed to sing at church if he did not. CJ used to call him his favorite soloist.
It grieve me to think he was sexually molesting boys during the same time he was singing "Oh Holy Night" on stage. If you had told me he was homosexual with a drinking problem, I probably would not have believed you.
The men who equally grieve me are Mr. Boisvert and Mr. Layman, and any other CLC pastors who covered-up up Nate's crimes all these years. That type of behavior does not serve the children at CLC at all!
Sam McGee says:
Police interviewed a co-pastor at the church who recalled having confronted Morales about the allegations. That pastor, Ernest Boisvert, told police that "normally the church would appeal to the person to stop his criminal behavior and then, should it not stop, they would alert people that the person is not acting in a Christian manner. The person would need to show contrition," according to a police report filed in the case.
My question: When did the police interview Robin? Recently? The article says the investigation began in 2009. How long have the CLC pastors known about Nate?
Fruit Flavored says:
I have a question to all of the legal types who read and participate on this blog. It is my understanding that SGM & CLC have had a long history with Gammon and Grange. I've been told that Chip and his team were consulted frequently regarding all sorts of matters. So if Chip or one of his associates knew about assaults that took place, would they not be compelled to report? From what has been written above, both Robin Boisvert and Grant Layman had some idea of Mr. Morales' history. I would guess that this kind of info would have been shared with CLC's lawyers. I would imagine many other instances of "alleged" assaults were also discussed with the lawyers. Is there some provision in the law which exempts lawyers from reporting crimes?
I'm also wondering how Gammon and Grange can represent both SGM and CLC in the lawsuit? Are they representing the individuals named as well or just the corporations?
Please understand my questions are from pure ignorance of the law and legal process.
Happymom says:
I am so very sorry. I pray that you've been able to get help and find healing.
Unassimilated says:
I want to know who the older Pastor would be. Both Robin Boisvert and Grant Layman go back to 1977. I had a friend who married a woman that was first engaged to an SGM man that…turned out to be a molester. The story goes that the CLC pastors ran him out of town. This story was shared in a CG context when we were disusing
Pastoral covering. The dates line up, and being that the story was touted internally as a success for the kingdom, the quotes do not surprise me.
These men can not change who they have been for the past thirty years in a matter of months.
lmalone says:
"Whether or not CJ is directly connected to any of the lawsuit incidents or not (and right now, it would appear that he was crafty enough to make sure others actually reinforced the policies that his twisted teachings created), CJ still presides over the organization associated with the lawsuits. He also is aware of the basic truths behind the allegations. "
Al Mohler has actually affirmed CJ's "strong leadership" of SGM in a statement to a reporter. His leadership and control of SGM is not a secret. I hope the lawyers use those quotes from CJ's Reformed friends. They certainly believed CJ was in control and praised him for it.
In other words, CJ's DNA is all over SGM. What was the focus, what was kept hidden, what was taught to SGM pastors, how they counseled, etc. It was simply called "strong leadership".
Oswald says:
If Morales had been reported to authorities back when, some children could have been spared the alleged succeeding molestations. How sad that the perp was 'run out of town' instead of being handed over to the police.
Stephen Crosby, Thank you for your blog.
I was curious about possible connections between last year's AOR report and the current lawsuit. Does anyone know if there is any overlap of the AOR interviews and the lawsuit plaintiffs?
Appears to me God is kicking open "closet" doors. You can run but you can't hide from the Creator of the Universe!
Oswald #52 — I sincerely hope that law enforcement in Las Vegas and anywhere else Nate Morales has been since leaving Maryland have been or will be notified by the authorities handling his case. It is extremely unlikely that he never offended again after leaving CLC. Rather, statistics would say that it is almost guaranteed he did.
As you said, lives were destroyed that didn't need to be if he had been reported and prosecuted back then.
Sadly, that behavior is all too common in churches and schools, especially back then. Maybe exposing cases like this is changing that. We can hope.
And I'm with Unassimilated — who was the unnamed older pastor?
Sooner or later someone will admit that C.J. actively covered up these crimes.
Defended says:
First of all, Anon, I'm so very very sorry this happened to you! One of our kiddos is barely older than you and it makes me crazy that this kind of horrible behavior was going on in the midst of people we trusted and even submitted to, even if we were blind and thinking our submission was in faith. I'm so sorry for you and your parents who must be struggling and heartbroken as well.
Kris thanks once again for giving a voice to those who have been subdued and given the message that they don't matter. You also hold up a mirror to the self-important to see their hypocrisy.
The fact that CJ hypes his own book about so-called humility in his supposedly spiritual instructions about a sports event literally had my gut churning.
@ Never Again:
This quote, from the AP article, is particularly disturbing, and is a succinct summation of SGM practice. I'm sure Susan Burke and company have written this down — it'll come up in court:
Imagine telling a molester that he must stop criminally molesting children, while still allowing him free access to children with the caveat that if he molests again, THEN we will alert people that he is not acting in a Christian manner, and he must show contrition.
We often use the analogy of a fox in the hen house, which almost sounds comical — but if you have ever seen the bloody carnage of that scenario, you know it is a horrific scene of death & destruction. This kind of devastation is what has happened in these churches — and the pastors stood there and held the doors opened for molesters, ignoring the pain and terror of the victims.
This is a most bizarre example of cognitive dissonance — the very leaders who continually slam people for sinning are the same ones who encouraged and enabled criminals to continue their depraved activity. Mind boggling.
Nickname @59 — My thoughts exactly. How unconscionable to use an innocent child as bait to catch a molester, if such be the case. Is it better to have a child abused than to have an adult embarrassed by a false accusation?
Anon, I am so deeply sorry this happened to you and no one protected you or noticed. I am equally sorry for the scars it gives.
"….but that he took his cues from the families, the police report says."
The pervert's family, too?
To add to #60 — It's just this kind of thinking that promotes abortion. As if an unborn baby has no feelings as important as an adults feelings or reputation.
James #7…I hated that when we secretly switched to Calvinism…CJ messages were about 80% out of context quotes and rest bible. I was shocked when I read spurgeon for myself and discovered he actually preached grace not what horrible hopeless sinners we were.
Mary @64 — A man can only preach effectively what he knows for himself, so it's obvious that 'the wizard' knows nothing of the Grace of God.
Although Brent named G & G as attorneys for the SGM recently, it seems the actual court records indicated two other law firms in regards to the lawsuit. Does anyone know the truth on this?
I thought Grnge was very supportive of CLC and is in some ways leading in the prayer for revival.
Just saying…66 What is the name of the new lawyers?
I am SO VERY SORRY that this happened to you.
{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
I hope it all comes spilling out of every single SGM, every single thing that has happened. EVERYTHING.
Does anyone out there know of any molestation going on at the children's classes at any of the Celebration conferences in Indiana, PA? Any HINTS of it? Any 2nd or 3rd hand stories??
In comment #59, Nickname said,
It is mind-boggling!
And what is even more bizarre is that even as CJ knows that all this is going on, he's apparently OK with regurgitating his same old legalistic sin-sniffing Super Bowl advice from 5 years ago.
Aren't there bigger fish to fry than telling people how to change channels so as not to be "stumbled" by bikini clad models? And wouldn't it also be evident that this stupid anal retentive kind of hyper-vigilance about sexual immorality obviously doesn't work?
JeffB says:
Has anyone noticed that "Ernest Boisvert" has been edited out of the article? I've gone to every link in this thread. The paragraph in which his name appears (according to the copies commenters have made) is there, but his quotes are listed as coming from a "co-pastor," that's all. Strange.
JeffB – Yes, I just saw that. I actually took a screen shot of the original article that has Boisvert's name in it. I sent a message to the reporter asking why the name was removed. We'll see if he answers.
In what year did Morales leave CLC? Did he ever work with the children at Celebration?
Does anyone remember how the children's ministry was handled at Celebration (the 4 year olds to about the 9 year olds)? Were the kids from each church kept together & were the classes staffed by members from that church? Or were the classes mixed & staffed by all the churches? (I had babies & toddlers at the time, so didn't help out with classes.)
I am wondering if the interview with Robin was recently?
Here is the article that quotes and identifies a co-pastor as Ernest Boisvert, copied and pasted in its entirety from WHAS11.com:
Posted on February 4, 2013 at 4:01 PM
Nathaniel Morales, who had been working as a pastor in Nevada, is accused in an indictment of sexually abusing the boys when he worked with Covenant Life Church in Gaithersburg, Md. That church until December was associated with Sovereign Grace Ministries, a Kentucky-based evangelical church group accused in a lawsuit in Maryland last fall of covering up allegations of child sex abuse by its members. The lawsuit was amended last month to name Covenant Life Church as among the new defendants.
An indictment returned in December charged Morales, 55, with ten counts of either sex abuse or sex offense and with committing sex acts against four boys between 1985 and 1990. Police say Morales helped with youth ministries during that time and also taught at a Christian school and hosted sleepovers.
Morales is scheduled for a pretrial hearing on Friday in Montgomery County Circuit Court. His lawyer did not return calls seeking comment and a telephone listing for Morales could not be found.
The criminal investigation began in 2009 when a man reported to police that he was sexually abused by Morales when he was between the ages of 12 and 20. The man told police that his parents had spoken to the church pastor but that no police report was made. Several other men interviewed by police said they had been sexually abused by Morales as boys — sometimes in their own bedrooms or inside his apartment or his office at the Christian school where he taught.
The Associated Press generally does not identify people who say they are victims of sexual assault.
Boisvert said that going to the police was in the "realm of possibilities," but that he took his cues from the families, the police report says.
Don Nalle, the communications director of Covenant Life Church, would not discuss Morales's criminal case, deferring to a statement posted last month on the church's website. That statement says the church is investigating the allegations.
Susan Burke, the lawyer who brought the case, said in a written statement that the "indictment supports our lawsuit's allegations of extensive wrongdoing by Sovereign Grace Ministries and its pastors. We look forward to our day in court."
Sovereign Grace Ministries has said the suit contains "a number of misleading allegations, as well as considerable mischaracterizations of intent."
Follow Eric Tucker on Twitter at http://www.twitter.com/etuckerAP
"And wouldn't it also be evident that this stupid anal retentive kind of hyper-vigilance about sexual immorality obviously doesn't work?"
Actually, it does the opposite. It is a lot like what Islam teaches about sexuality. Men cannot control themselves and women are constantly tempting them by what they wear, (those ankles are tempting me!),etc but on the other hand, the focus is on having lots of sex with wife(ves). And when sexual perversion happens boys are experimenting because the female tempted them to but the girls are well….bad.
It is a lot like… "don't think pink". And everyone is thinking pink.
Okay, I heard back from Eric Tucker, the writer of the AP article. He said he took out Robin Boisvert's name because he was a little confused since the police report said Ernest Boisvert, but he could only find info on Robin Boisvert on the church website. I told him that it's the same person, that Robin is his middle name. He said it's a very interesting case and he's going to continue following it. He seems very interested in talking to people who might know anything about it. If you feel so inclined, you can email him at etucker at ap dot org. (same email as at the bottom of the news article.) He replied very promptly to my emails.
doesn't this smell like a bad attempt at a cover up: "Another pastor, Grant Layman, said he had communicated with Morales several years ago and that Morales had admitted to "alcohol abuse and homosexuality," the police report says. He said that Morales told him that he remembered having committed abuses and having confessed his past to an older pastor, but that Morales now said he was very ill and could not recall the specifics of anything that occurred."
I'm sure the CS situation affected how pastors dealt with future predators. They took a bold stand and publicly excommunicated him. Tragically, they also excommunicated many of his victims. Wars were waged on the radio airwaves and they faced huge criticism. I'm surprised NM would have not been swept up in that house cleaning. I'm sure they were reluctant to go through that again.
Moniker #76 – Thanks for following up on that.
Ellie #73
You had questions about the staffing of Celebration. I don't know if I ever served in the 9 yr. old area, but I did in the 3-5yr. old area from 1995, until Celebration was discontinued. If I remember correctly, children and volunteers from multiple churches were mixed together. The bathrooms were always busy, and there were crowds of children gathered in a fairly small/confined space for the number of people there. I don't recall any empty rooms or spaces where anything could have occurred. There was also adequate adult supervision to deter any attempts. I can't answer your question about Nate. I didn't work in Childrens' ministry when he was here- which was in the 80's.
Enjoying Freedom says:
Christianity Today picks up Morales Story http://blog.christianitytoday.com/ctliveblog/archives/2013/01/child-abuse-lawsuit-against-sovereign-grace-ministries-adds-names-and-charges.html
and tweets here https://twitter.com/CTmagazine
I think CLC oversaw younger children's ministry at all the Celebration East Conferences. The older kids' stadium-games might have been organized by members from other churches. But the conference itself was hosted by the church in Indiana, PA. And, they all worked closely with SGM/CLC. There was a singles' team that monitored the dorms to ensure rules and curfews were followed at night.
I think it would be hard for any abuse to happen in the group events but, I think there were plenty of opportunities before and after meetings for mischief and abuse. Thankfully, I'm not aware of any toward children.
As I have said before, one of the worst things about at best not admitting there were children being molested in SGM Churches was it gave members a false sense of security that it wasn't happening in their churches. Thus people weren't looking for it etc. When you combine that with how closed lipped people were about things due to SGM's narrow definition of "gossip" and "slander" and fear of being accused of going this, it made people vulnerable.
Isn't the typical practice for law enforcement and others when something is happening in an area to make people aware of it so they can look for and prevent. If there are sexual assaults in an area then people are alerted to take more precautions so it doesn't happen. The same go with car break ins, burglaries. With SGM not doing this, again it gave people a false sense of security. I am sure predators would have been more intimidated had there been more of a sense of people on the lookout for predators.
Had SGM admitted to members that this happened in their midst then I have no doubt the number of children being molested would have over the years been much lower.
It is shocking to read in the news how Robin Boisvert is quoted as how he handled one child molester. Did Robin not think that Nathaniel Morales would stop with this type of rebuke? Didn't Robin think that even with forgivenss Nathaniel should have incurred consequences for his sin such as the law provides?
Even if one parents didn't want the police involved didn't Robin Boisvert realize that he had a larger duty to protect all kids even if it meant going against the parents of this one boy? Didn't Robin and other pastors realize that most child abusers are incorrigible? Maybe they should remember the "total depravity" that they claim they believe.
As has been said before, SGM Leaders seem to apply regular types of actions to egregrious sins like someone molesting a child or someone beating their wife. I also wonder if things would have been different if a leader's child had been molested.
http://washington.cbslocal.com/2013/02/04/md-church-member-accused-of-molestation-in-1980s/
concerned sibling says:
Anon…my heart goes out to you..I pray you have/will get the help you need to overcome what happened….as my name implies I'm a concerned sibling of a family member (and their family) who are deeply involved with a SG church in Frederick Md….does anyone know/heard/seen of anything fishy going on in this church? Thank you in advance for any/all help…
Robin's interview must have been recently – he was up in Lancaster from 1982 – 1990, the time period that Morales was at CLC.
Anon, I'm so sorry to hear of that trauma to your youth. I'm so glad you shared it, though. You've been posting here for a long time, if you're the Anon I'm thinking of. I'm praying with you that people be held accountable in SGM, including for things that have happened as recently as 3 years or less in time. Who knows, with the closed system of lies and denial in SGM, I wouldn't be surprised if these atrocities are still going on. God bless, strengthen, comfort and heal you!
just saying said:
just saying, can you, please, explain what "the CS situation" was? Was this a PDI/Sovereign Grace Ministries situation or another ministry altogether?
I am so very sorry to hear what happened to you. God will bring justice to you and all those who have been harmed under CJs watch. Consider the lawsuit…there are many with similar stories who have joined together in bringing these tragedies to the light.
God will not be mocked. He will make all things right.
This doesn't make what happened to Anon any better. But from what he/she has shared with us thus far, I don't see that his/her situation follows the same pattern as the situations outlined in the lawsuit filing. Unless I'm missing something, no SGM pastors were informed of this assault…there was minimizing, no telling parents not to go to the police. Unless there's more to the story that Anon has not included, I don't think Anon's pastors were even aware that anything had happened. Of course, from what we know now, it's probably a good thing Anon never sought help from his/her pastors, as that would likely have only further added to his/her victimization.
But from what I can tell, there's nothing lawsuit-worthy about Anon's story.
That being said, I believe what happened to Anon is still an amazing illustration of SGM's kookiness. Here you have all the Super Bowl partygoers in a lather over channel-changing so as to avoid "stumbling" one another with glimpses of sexy models…while in another location at the same party, someone is getting sexually assaulted and nobody has a clue. All that hand-wringing over the remote control, with everyone feeling so virtuous because their standards were even higher than those of the rest of the Christian world – yet it did nothing to stop a rapist.
I find CJ's/Chad's republishing of his old Super Bowl viewing instructions just jaw-dropping in light of what we know of SGM's real problems. It's crazy to make such a big production out of avoiding the possibility of getting sinfully aroused by some sexy beer commercial. And it's kind of icky for a Christian to advocate turning athletes' and coaches' behavior into free game for condemnation and object lessons. Even if CJ were still the more-pious-than-you "humble" guy everyone used to think he was, it's still crazy and icky to watch the Super Bowl the way he first publicly advocated back in 2008.
But in light of his documented lack of submission and real accountability to anyone – hallmarks of a totally opposite-than-humble person – and in light of the fact that all his self-satisfied legalism did not stop the worst kind of immorality, you'd think CJ would want to rethink talking about the TV remote control these days, maybe even repent of his ridiculous legalism.
Instead, though? CJ recycles the old instructions, publishing them in 2013 like they're still good advice.
That is truly head-spinning to me.
http://www.washingtonpost.com/local/man-accused-of-molesting-boys-in-1980s-from-md-church-church-is-identified-in-sex-abuse-suit/2013/02/04/62e2a882-6edd-11e2-b35a-0ee56f0518d2_story.html
exCLCer says:
And to now think Boisvert and Loftness were both PRINCIPAL of the CL elementary school. I cant imagine a public school principal, much less TWO, treating the reported assault of children in such self serving ways.
I am so proud of and inspired by these victims courage to stand up and demand justice be done. Lets not forget, their statements saying they "took cues from the families", these are the same pastors who, in the past. have misrepresented themselves to authorities as speaking for the victims families,and put incredible pressure and intimidation on families to not report. I hate to see so many victims come forward that it becomes routine to see them pop up and people start to become numb to the shock and horror of each incident. Each victim is an innocent child's life that has been forever altered.
These "pastors", to turn a blind eye to pedophiles and turn their back on victims who came to them for help, just to protect their own income and reputation, knowing the perpetrators will offend again and again, is the worst kind of impunity and complete lack of morality!
Good for these victims, to have their day in court!!! Shame on humanity and anyone who sat idly by, that there are still people alive who need the action and ruling of a court and the police to remind them that sexual assault of children is a crime!!
I am so sorry to read of another sexual assault at the hands of a SGMer. My heart goes out to you Anon and I pray that the Lord has healed your heart. You see, the guidelines established by SGM leaders are really exterior rules put in place to hide and cover up the sin in their hearts as well as their private sins, sins within their day to day living, sins within their homes,etc! SGM is all about looking good on the outside and that is why so many come into SGM churches and are deceived. Truly SGM (throughout) is a case of the cup being clean on the outside but filty on the inside.
Pffft says:
Re Kris' "nothing lawsuit worthy"
I see it differently.
From my seat: The gravamen and staging are there; it's essentially the same cause of action; while a presence of post-hoc aggravating circumstances may provide evidence for state of mind or otherwise pile on to an existing cause of action, they do not make a cause of action, neither does their non-presence eliminate the cause of action.
It looks like Ligon Duncan is conveniently deleting his endorsement and defense of C.J. Mahaney.
http://thewartburgwatch.com/2013/02/04/ligon-duncans-post-defending-c-j-mahaney-accidentally-deleted/
Looks like Duncan "accidentally" deleted a blog post endorsing C.J. Mahaney despite all the controversy of the documents that were released in 7/2011. Maybe with all these molestation cases now coming out in this suit, the heat is getting to be too much for Duncan.
Many victims and their families reported abuses to the pastors, even against the overwhelming odds that they would be not believed, blamed, ostracized, silenced, and re-victimized. The system and culture was set up to deter "gossiping" (reporting) from even happening. Believe the best — and that includes believing the best of your victimizer, while the parents "believed the best" of all the surrounding adults who had unabated access to their children. Imagine being a victim, knowing your friend had been victimized, had told, and had been silenced or blamed. As hard as the pastors tried to keep everything quiet time and time again, there were people who knew! There were kids who new other kids had been victimized as well. Even as very young children we understood how some people were "too important to accuse" or "too righteous to be told on". Who is going to believe a child over a holy man in the church? No, as a child or young person it was your job to just obey — never question authority, and authority was anyone who was an admired adult member of the church. If your parents obviously obey/admire them, then as a child, who were you to even have the sinful thought of questioning anything??? So the culture set up numerous victims to never report, making Anon a victim of not only the perpetrator, but also of the SGM system that allowed (and by their culture and actions) this kind of abuse to also go undetected and unreported in what are probably many more cases than just the ones where people had the courage to come forward.
I should qualify my earlier comment (94)…
It's been a while since I became informed about the suit's cause of action and whether it requires a failure to report. I am not familiar with such a cause of action, but I can imagine it existing.
(I think I remember a paragraph about not reporting – but some paragraphs are geared, rather than toward the cause of action, toward punitive damages.)
aer says:
For all who have not read this article yet, there is an article in The Examiner reporting about a man named Nathaniel Morales who sexually assaulted young boys in the '80's and '90's. Here is the link: http://washingtonexaminer.com/former-christian-school-teacher-accused-of-molesting-boys/article/2520547
I am a previous member of CLC, and left about 9 years ago. I left for other reasons, but I just don't understand how people continue to attend and support this church after all of the information that has come out the past year. Especially information about sexual assault. As a parent myself, I would never leave my kids in the children's ministry EVER!!! I don't get how a parent still does this at that church. It goes to show you how brain washed these people are.
5yearsinPDI says:
Anon, I am so very sorry. May God make it up to you.
Sex abuse is endemic and pervasive. It happens in unexpected places at the hands of the most apparently decently people. No one should be surprised at the actual events in SGM, or single SGM out for the fact that such events take place. No church is immune. No protective family is immune.
The problem is what happens after in SGM, and the mutitude of problems after are complex, and I too hope Susan Burke wins the lawsuit.
What I think is the worst thing of all, worse than not calling the cops, is the moral equivalency. I am a sinner, you are a sinner, the perp is a sinner, the victim is a sinner. Remember the story where they told the ten year old that maybe she liked the perverted attention a little bit or she would have blabbed sooner? The child victim is a sinner too and equally guilty.
Remember the guy who got on here and posted how he was guilty of pedophila but had repented (okay) and been forgiven (okay) and gotten remarried to a wonderful woman who knew his past (okay) and the pastors knew his past (okay) and he wasn't hiding anything (okay) …….and then he proceeded to write that we all are equally sinful and his pedophila was NO DIFFERENT than getting mad at a some bad driver in traffic. Sin is sin.
I won't even bother here to go into a detailed analysis of greater and lesser sins in the bible and greater and lesser rewards and punishments in heaven and hell. Only a true idiot can overlook the fact that God ordered death for some sins, restitution for some sins, and a ritual cleansing for some sins. Not all sin was of equal weight or deserving equal punishment. Even Jesus spoke of an unforgivable sin.
What kind of sociopathic mindset would equate raping a child and the lifelong wound and battles you provoke, with getting mad at a driver in traffic?
This is what I see as the most insidious SGM effect for victims. Their "gossip" when they tell somebody in their anguish, when the pastor said to keep silent, is the worst sin. Perps can be forgiven and accepted, but the greatest sin is not doing what a leaders says. All sins are equal, and a little kid is equal to a rapist, and everybody has to sing Kumbayah and forgive and live in the same house afterwards. But no, there IS a greater sin after all, and that is not obeying the leader. That is the worst sin.
It is so screwed up beyond belief. Excuse me now while I go whip my eight month old for squirming at a diaper change.
Lawsuit and Anon – Could Anon still have a case of statutory (sp?) rape? I realize that her not reporting it does not make the pastors legally responsible in one sense. But I wonder what a lawyer would say about this? Does anyone out there know about the statute of limitations here? I think someone had posted on that before….
Anon I am so sorry for what had happened to you, and I hope that you can have the courage and time to talk with Susan Burke about this….It is entirely possible that this perp had multiple victims and you could pool resources…..Just a thought. I realize you are likely trying to move on with your life and even a short phone conversation with a lawyer could be very triggering, and cause you to re-live very traumatic events…. So so so so sorry. ((((HUGS))))
Kris: I think whether Anon's case is related to the issues in the lawsuit is something that the attorney should decide. The perp in Anon's case could easily have been a sex offender, who had been previously covered up by the pastors. If that is the case, then what happened to Anon is related.
Tempest says:
Something that struck me in Anon's story is that this took place in a "prominent SGM (then PDI) member's house."
If this prep was invited to a prominent member's home, there's a good chance he was a leader or being groomed. Rarely did "regular" folks get such an invite.
I hope Anon contacts Susan Burke.
I believe he is referring to what happened with Charles Schmidt in the late 70's. Charles formed a church a few years after separating from CLC (GOB at the time). He was excommunicated from CLC.
Charles Schmidt's church and CLC have basically had no fellowship since. Maybe with CLC leaving SGM and C.J. no longer being associated with CLC that may change.
About 15 years there was reconciliation between Charles Schmidt, Larry Tomczak and Che Ahn and some others. Both Larry and Che were pastors at CLC when Charles Schmidt was excommunicated. All men in a statement apologized for their roles as I recall.
With C.J. so lacking in integrity to blackmail Larry, you really don't know what the truth was with this incident. I do believe there was some sin with Charles Schmidt but now that what C.J. did to Larry has come out you really don't know what to believe about that incident.
If C.J. would blackmail one leader and hide it for over 10 years (not to mention not seeing the sin in other of his actions) then there is no doubt C.J. could have lied or misrepresented the truth about what Charles Schmidt supposedly did.
This is in response to exCLCer, #92-
Since I don't know all the facts relating to the NM issue, I won't talk about that. However, I do want to mention Robin B.'s response in our situation, which definitely wasn't "self-serving," and he most definitely didn't turn his back on us when we went to him for help years ago. Our son was being bullied, and we couldn't get those in charge to respond adequately to the problem. When I shared our struggles with him, he responded with tears in his eyes, compassion, and practical help. Not once did he confront us about any "sin" in our response. He was, however, much more firm with the individual (a leader) who had not taken the bullying very seriously. My husband and I weren't care group leaders, related to any pastors or leaders, and aren't anyone particularly "special." So, Robin had no reason to care for us in any extraordinary way. He was "just" responding to a situation in which a child was being physically and emotionally abused. Consequently, I find it difficult to believe that his response to our situation was unusual.
Don't get me wrong – my heart goes out to Anon and anyone else who has endured sexual assault.
Obviously, there should have been consequences for the perpetrator. It sounds like justice was not done.
But in this situation, unless there are other details Anon didn't share, it doesn't sound like SGM – by any stretch of the imagination – could be held legally liable for the lack of consequences.
Let's get real. Even in the situations where there is total documentation and even full admission from the pastors themselves that pastoral counseling was sought and that the pastors subsequently advised parents not to go to the cops, SGM will enthusiastically argue that they were acting within their legal rights. How in the world could anyone try to hold them legally liable just because (as horrific as it was), someone was, without the pastors' knowledge, either prior knowledge or knowledge after the fact, assaulted during a church-related get-together?
(Again, if there is more to Anon's story that indicates he/she did seek pastoral help and pastors were involved in a coverup similar to those described in the lawsuit filing, then that is a different story.
But as it was related to us, Anon's story does not reveal legal liability on SGM's part.
Trying to categorize it as though it does makes us look irrational.)
And yes, it'd still make sense for Anon to get in touch with Susan Burke, in case the perp in his/her situation was the same perp in other cases Ms. Burke is representing.
I'm just saying that as of now, as the story was related to us, Anon's situation does not follow the pattern that the others do.
I don't know how to say this gently, and I know how horrific these topics are to a primarily Christian audience, but I'm sad to say sexual abuse is common everywhere.
You can see the statistics here: http://www.yellodyno.com/html/children_victims_stats.html It says 1 in 3 girls and 1 in 7 boys are sexually abused. I can't imagine how many children came through Sovereign Grace Ministry churches total. I suspect thousands. To be within normal statistics, that would be 333 girls and 142.8 boys to have been molested for every 1000 of each. That is horrible and tragic. It is horrible and tragic if just one child is molested. We can see here how life-altering that can be.
But, I'm sad to assume that in the course of the life of any church and any school and any denomination and any sports league and any boy scout troupe, there will be pedophiles who pass through. They don't meet children at night clubs. They meet them at social places with children. It's not a new thing. Shocking. But not new. And very sadly, prevalent.
I think it is awful if these offenders were not reported to police. It is particularly awful to think NM has been in ministry for more than 20 years in a homosexual friendly church and may have other child victims. Molesting children is a crime, not a preference.
I agree an unhealthy environment of control may have kept our victims quiet for a very long time. That same culture of obedience may have made these young ones vulnerable.
But, I don't think sex abuse characterizes the movement as a whole. I would put my kids in children's ministry tomorrow. I haven't seen stricter CM policies at any other church.
Based upon the information currently out there, I don't think I would hesitate to send my children or grandchildren to CLS, although until perpetrators are named, there is caution. Is NM the culprit or are there others? That was the 80's. He didn't work there. Are there others? It would be good for victims to report here if there are current threats out there interacting with our children.
I think it's good to keep things in perspective. It IS horrible. But, is it common?
re charles S….
His wife Dotty wrote about this in her book "The delight of being his daughter". She refers to it as moral failure. It was a big deal.
We were told by highly reliable sources that it was homosexual.
Moniker, I contacted Eric Tucker and referred him to Rick Ross' forum where all the abuse testimonies are posted.
Notice the title of the Washington Examiner writer:
staff crime reporter
#103 CLC's treatment of CS was swift and harsh and from everything I know, justified. It was everything the blogs are calling for. It was a public disclosure in which they spent a year taking criticism in the media for it.
It is so sad his loyal victims and followers were not cared for during that time and their lives were subsequently demolished. It is sad to think of the new victims he may have freely accumulated in his years of public ministry after leaving CLC. Talk about needing a dedicated blog.
I have no respect for Larry "reconciling" with CS. Eww.
In #85, Concerned Sibling asked if anyone has info about the Frederick, MD church.
Welcome, Sib. Thanks for posting and caring about your family. I personally do not know anything about that church. Can anyone else chime in?
exCLCer in #92 said, "I am so proud of and inspired by these victims courage to stand up and demand justice be done. Lets not forget, their statements saying they "took cues from the families", these are the same pastors who, in the past. have misrepresented themselves to authorities as speaking for the victims families,and put incredible pressure and intimidation on families to not report."
Here, let me manipulate you into NOT contacting the authorities then I get to say it's YOUR fault that I didn't.
@bookhead #104…..I'm very happy for you and your son that you were able to find help and compassion from RB in your time of need. A good deed is a good deed,…………………. BUT, imo, a good deed does nothing to nullify a separate bad deed. If I used reprehensible child labor to make shoes in a factory, but then donated 50% of my profits to a charity for children, are those child laborers any less hurt? Could I use my charitable deeds as a defense for my actions? Would anyone think it was MORE okay because of something good I had done somewhere else?
I cant speak for anyone else, but it does ruffle my feathers to see people who stay in the shadows and don't ever speak up for the victims, but then readily and willingly seem to jump at the chance to come forward to offer an anecdotal defense of the wonderful character of those people alleged to have been part of the entire fiasco….lest we forget the victims…..
Steve said, "It looks like Ligon Duncan is conveniently deleting his endorsement and defense of C.J. Mahaney.
If that is true, it is cowardly and disgusting. Either you were wrong with your PUBLIC statements and you repent PUBLICALLY and directly to those whom you hurt or you stand by your word. If you're unsure, then come out and say that. But what don't you get about teachers having a bigger responsibility to be careful about what they say in the first place?!
5 Years said, "What kind of sociopathic mindset would equate raping a child and the lifelong wound and battles you provoke, with getting mad at a driver in traffic?"
Ah, CJ Mahaney's, Robin Boisvert's, John Loftness'… should I go on?
Bookhead, you are very lucky. Others have not been as lucky to have had the same experience as you in regards to RB. I often wonder why I was shown a certain degree of love, while another sister, at the same time was shown such harshness by the very same pastor whom I love and will love dearly until my dying day. I don't know why, but I believe her story is true. For one, I know this woman not to be a liar while I know this beloved man to be caught up in a system which treats people so terribly unfairly. In the second place, sadly, I have had others tell me of how they were treated so harshly and cold by this man. Again, I love him to bits and will forever but, sadly, I believe their testimonies to be true, too. Various people are not going to come out of the wood work, unbeknownst to each other and tell me similar stories, especially about a man they know I am very loyal to.
Anon, I am sorry I didn't address you earlier. I have started a few posts to you but what you have been through is so awful, I felt like my words were completely inadequate. All I keep coming up with is, "I wish I or someone had been able to protect you" and now all I can do is offer a cyber hug. Please, if it wouldn't take too much out of you, please, consider contacting Susan Burke (sburke@burkepllc.com or 202.386.9622) Your story is important for her to hear. The perp, even if a minor, may have assaulted others and this information may be VERY important to the lawsuit. Even if you have no interest in joining, if you would name your perp and where this happened, it could be vital.
Just Saying asked, "I think it's good to keep things in perspective. It IS horrible. But, is it common?"
I believe I addressed this before but someone (maybe you, just saying?) suggested that the statistics that I had mentioned could be used by people with an agenda. I agree that that can be used by all. Let me first tell you where I got my statistic from, then I'll reiterate what it said. I learned of this statistic from a conservative christian, charasmatic, Catholic therapist who specializes in working with sexual predators. Again, let me state, specializes in working with not just sexual victims but the predators themselves. He is an expert and has spoken around the world on this subject. He is someone I knew personally so this isn't just something that he threw out at a speech in Australia or Timbuktu. (Though I am sure those are lovely places.) This is something he told me and we discussed in depth. I can't ask him where he got the stat because he is now dead. But here it is- statistically speaking there are MORE sexual predators among those who are religious, than among the "normal" or general population. For example, let's say that x% of those among the general population are sexual predators. Among the religious, there are x+y (y not being a negative number)% of sexual predators.
The statistics can't speculate as to the WHY, they can only report on the numbers themselves.
The speculation runs from religious people being more repressed then exploding like bombs, to the idea that they believe they have some right or power or authority over another to the idea that people who are tormented with these kinds of temptations may seek out a religious life to help them overcome such urges.
I believe that certain institutions, also, can create environments where children are more easily victimized. This would primarily be homes or among groups where children are belittled and not valued as equal members and also places where children are taught to obey all adults and not taught to distinguish between obeying bad requests and good ones. The latter being more prevalent in authoritarian institutions.
Statistics prove that your children are safer in non-religious settings. I am not saying don't put your kids in a sunday school, but if you are going to do so, I'd suggest (not like you're asking for my suggestion), that you look for a place where there is no authoritarian issues going on. Predators don't like places where kids are allowed to ask questions and say, "NO!"
Julie Anne says:
This is interesting. I posted a tweet yesterday about SGM abuse and the silence of TGC and some guy "Lawson" asked me directly if CJ was involved with abuse. I just found out that Gallifant (evidently a PC student) responded in an attempt to clear CJ's name and also removed my name so I couldn't see his response. Well, I responded again.
These guys are so busy covering up: https://twitter.com/Gallifant/status/298618386156515328
Oops – I found a better link which includes all of my responses: https://twitter.com/batvaughn/status/298568868316712961
(Kris, feel free to replace the link and delete this if you like.)
Re: post 90
I see your point but disagree with a few things. The fact that Anon was assaulted at a "prominent" sgm members house by an sgm member is reason enough to bring this to the light (if Anon should decide to pursue this) Anon's participation in the lawsuit would accomplish two things: the additional testimony would reinforce claims made by others with similar stories and therefore strengthen the case. Most importantly, Anon, and anyone else who would be willing to come forward will see and know, in a personal way, God's love and strength brought about through His justice. There is great healing in this.
If you remember our story, my daughter did not tell us what had happened to her until 5 years after the fact. Regarding her case, the pastors also didn't know. The problem was how they reacted when they found out. The main issue at hand does not include pastors who were unaware of a past assault, but how they are reacting now to the steady avalanche of people coming forward. If Anon decides to join the lawsuit and for some reason there is no plausible evidence for a charge against sgm, Anon can still bring charges against the perpetrator and should be strongly encouraged to do so. I would encourage all who have suffered abuse in and by sgm to take it to the courts and let the lawyers decide what is lawsuit-worthy.
As we can see sgm is digging their heels in preparing to fight. They seek to undermine the validity of claims made.
They have absolutely no defense.
Julie Anna @116 — Not only was CJ the pres of SGM, but when the alleged abuses happened that are mentioned in the lawsuit, he was the SR Pastor at CLC. To say he had nothing to do with anything, per Gallifant, is absurd.
Waters says:
Dear Anon,
My heart goes out to you….and I stand with you. I join the others here on this site who are praying for you…for your strength of healing. Our family has known similar assaults…and we have come to know Gods healing…and the tenderness of His hand, lifting our chin…up…standing unashamed and receiving the Fathers restorative love…this I pray for you, Anon.
The truth of Anon's testimony brings us a clear picture of the culture of manipulation and control of SGM/CJ Mahaney/SGM leaders and the SGM Board—they have constructed a man-kingdom, and emulated and taught a life-choking culture which enables assaults such as Anon's. — While the leaders of SGM/PDI were religiously striving for eyes averted from Super Bowl commercials (and the jovial, fun atmosphere in the room and high-fives for their humility and piousness)…a sexual assault occurs right outside their door. The perpetrator knows he won't be identified, for the victim has grown up in the culture of the LIES of the equality of all sin and the idolized importance of leaders, and the necessary silence so that one shall not be branded a horrible divisive gossip. The perpetrator knew he could then re-enter the partying sanctimonious Super Bowl host house with full assurance that she would never tell on him then and there…who would believe her story? And afterall,as Ceej ALWAYS says 'we're the WORST sinner we know'…. perverse…twisted… Twisted – defines SGM
Someone above stated that God is kicking down the SGM closet doors. Yes, He is. And all that has been hidden in the closetS, and in the shadows of manipulations IS being exposed. Will these exposures of the EVIDENCES of control and manipulation and Stepford culture awake the SGMites? I know many who continue to defend their SGM church, even in the midst of Gods evident shaking of exposure. Sadly, many of Gods people would rather remain asleep—which is in direct contradiction to Jesus's exhortation to ACTIVELY ASK SEEK KNOCK…..
Thankyou again, to SGM Survivors for providing the forum to expose darkness in SGM. SGM CONTINUES to warn their people against those who are crying out their testimonies of truth. SGM CONTINUES to seek to halt information so their congregants may be controlled for "the greater good" mantra. –I agree with you, Anon, that the pending lawsuit will cripple SGM to such an extent that they can no longer steal from and bring into bondage, Gods people.
Based upon the information currently out there, I don't think I would hesitate to send my children or grandchildren to CLS, although until perpetrators are named, there is caution. Is NM the culprit or are there others? That was the 80′s. He didn't work there. Are there others? It would be good for victims to report here if there are current threats out there interacting with our children.
It is interesting how you first share statistics about how common child molestation and then say this.
As I shared before, a big issue I have with CLC/SGM is how they didn't acknowledge and share with regular members cases they knew about. Thus the CLC/SGM Leaders lead people to believe it wasn't a problem at CLC and thus people weren't on the look out etc.
That would be a big concern I would have.
Steve @ 103
Schmitt was accused of homosexual advances by several church members. In the ensuing battle over how he would be disciplined, he sought to divide the church. GOB leadership admitted early on that they made mistakes in the process, but whether or not there was due cause is not in question. Schmitt was a predator, not a victim. Sometimes I wonder if that is where it all started.
I remember numerous instances in which pastors told members there were known sex offenders attending the church. They had a prison ministry. They were probably known murderers attending the church. They were emphatic in children's ministry training sessions that people understand that. There were reasons they had what people thought were ridiculous strict precautions in place. Disregarding children's ministry restrictions was a good way to be reminded that anyone might be a sex offender, even your best friend. I remember them announcing that to parents. The church is open. Don't let your children run free and unattended. They were pretty adamant about it.
I will have to admit, until all of these discussions began, I never took their warnings seriously.
radicallysaved says:
Greg # 122
Were CS adavnces towards church members minors?? I was at CLC shortly after the split, but I understand it did cause a massive split – but I was told the issues were homosexual sin, NOT sexual assaults (i.e. predator as you say). If the history of CLC/SGM, at the formation stages, experienced a huge church split over a predator, well then, you may be correct subsequent training on how to handel such cases could have been greatly influenced by this event. Can you clarify?
radicallysaved,
I do not know if those involved were minors. But as an older man and a Pastor, he was in the position of power, so I don't think calling it predation is inappropriate. The person initiating inappropriate sex does not have to "assault" someone to be a predator, and I think others would agree with me.
I would suggest that the fallout from this, and another very public scandal, the lawsuit against Larry, had and early and profound affected the leadership style at SGM. C.J. is a reactionary leader at the core. Pastors were removed at the slightest sign of trouble or disagreement. Leadership is obsessed with potential legal exposure, and scandalous misdeeds are buried in secrecy. Well, until now.
"just saying" said,
Maybe predators didn't find SGM's culture – with its emphasis on compliance and first-time instant obedience and toddlers looking strangers in the eye and the spanking 50 times per day – more conducive to finding victims.
But I am confident that other churches did not respond to victims the way that SGM churches systematically did.
And that's really more the point of what is wrong with SGM. It's not that there are more predators per capita in SGM churches (although maybe their culture of unthinking submission to authority makes it easier to find victims). It's that SGM pastors' twisted theology didn't leave room for them to know how to respond to victims.
Not only do SG pastors not know how to respond to victims. They don't know how to deal with marital problems, depression, discipling, or communicating. They are taught to give a sermon at PC, that's it. They take Greek classes and basically know where Greece is in relation to Israel. They know how to raise their voices to keep folks from falling asleep in the sermons. They know how to smile and shake hands and say brother. But in their hearts they are not your brother but your shepherd. Don't matter that they don't know much, but as long as they can baffle you with their BS, they keep their franchise in business. Most coming out of PC should go back to being CG leaders. That is their competence.
Kris, is it possible to create a page similar to the "Stories" page that keeps a list of churches that have withdrawn from SGM and perhaps links to any posts that divulge the church's reasons for leaving?
Seems like it might be useful to keep a quick reference for people to see how many churches are leaving since that won't be apparent from sovgracemin.org.
Just saying,
Did you post your comment thinking that victims are somehow NOT aware that abuse happens elsewhere??? Did you think you were informing this blog community of something new?
I find your attempt to somehow normalize the abuse pretty disturbing. Anyone with any sense realizes that abuse can happen anywhere. Do you think it's common for pastors to respond the way SGM has? Do you think it common for victims to be revictimized by their church leaders? Do you think it's common for pastors who've covered these crimes to get up in front of their churches and clear themselves?
I hope the safety of your family trumps your loyalty to this ministry.
I completely agree with Greg. After an attempt at publicly calling out a predator that resulted in a church split and hundreds of fractured lives, I'm sure they were gun-shy to try it again. They were attacked by prominent pastors in town who preached against them from the pulpit and called them out on the radio for excommunicating perp. How many people fled over the divisiveness of the CS incident? Hundreds?
That incident is what caused them to create unbending rules regarding gossip and slander and shut down any public discussion of anything. There were people screaming into microphones at family meetings. No wonder they didn't approve of Josh allowing open discussion?
CS was divisive. He took scores of very young loyal men with him. He was twice their age. He ruined people.
It would not surprise me if NM was not a remnant predator from the CS days.
I served as a greeter at CLC. Early last year, I was told there were three sex offenders attending CLC and shown their picture to make sure they didn't enter Children's Ministry. In all my 10 years at CLC, that was the first time I was told and I was only told because of my position. So, no, the pastors did NOT tell members that sex offenders attended.
I was also part of the prison ministry and ask the question you raise about alerting members to former inmates attending. Members were NOT told.
Tempest – not trying to normalize. But, there are people reacting as though all of the children are routinely molested in SGM. We're rightfully exposing a handful of instances, some more than 25 years ago. They matter because these individuals matter and need to be emotionally and spiritually restored. But, most children have been completely safe.
JulieAnne, #117 – In the case of the unnamed pastor's son, C.J. certainly did know. He relocated the dad to another SGM church because of it — twice, I believe. Word is C.J. paid a victim's family $5000 hush money. This was reported here by the best friend of the victim.
I believe he was consulted in some of the Fairfax cases. (Not sure, but thought I read that.)
I hope someone else will confirm this or correct it if I am misremembering.
With both CLC and SGM both being sued, there is now one possibility as to why CLC didn't give reasons for leaving SGM; with them both being sued they didn't want to throwing stones at each other. The have even chosen to use the same law firm etc.
Insurance company probably determines the attorneys.
I was checking out the web site of the Illinois church that's leaving and noticed they have some connection to the San Diego church (which had also left) through their former senior pastor. Checking out the San Diego East church, I found this link:
http://www.gracechurcheast.org/partners
It's clearly nothing formal at this point, but I'd assume we'll see more "partnership" talk in the future among those churches that have left. (Hopefully, without the need for their own version of the PC or resort-hosted conferences.)
Each entity or individual named as a defendant in the lawsuit would be smart to get his own attorney.
A shared attorney most benefits those at the top who write the check. And those at the top will find it in their best interests to throw the lower guys/disloyal churches under the bus.
Damages awarded will have to be allocated based upon each entity's or individual's part in causing the harms. We already know SGM corporate will try to push that completely onto the individual churches and doubly so since they are now 'traitors' to the cause. C.J. will seek to say he knew little or nothing at the time but had trusted the judgment of the pastors who were handling the situation. They would be foolish to assume they can share attorneys and get the best individual representation.
Now, I think all the guilty should answer in court and pay for the damages they caused. But I am just speaking to the foolishness of shared counsel among the defendants. Financially, it may seem to make sense to pay only one firm to handle discovery, possibly maybe perhaps. But I can't see any reason to put their fate in the hands of shared counsel unless they really DO 'believe the best' and still think SGM is run by nice guys who want what is best for them. Are they that naive?
Am I seeing this wrong? Are they required to share counsel as co-defendants?
Somebody asked about overlap with the AoR report. Here is the link to the entire report, and I snipped the pertinent section. There is no mention of AoR urging people to go to the cops, or get a lawyer.
They come off very partial to SGM in the overall report. I would guess they may get a subpoena to tell what they know. Not sure of the legalites on this, or confidentiality rules.
http://www.sovereigngraceministries.org/blogs/sgm/file.axd?file=2012/4/Group+Reconciliation+Report.pdf
Cases Involving Sexual Misconduct
We learned about cases in different settings that involved allegations of sexual misconduct
among different members of the church. We met separately with parties from more than one
viewpoint on a few of the cases. These situations involved complicated situations that had been
addressed in different ways. Often people from one or both sides felt deep hurts about the ways
in which the cases were handled or the ways in which other people responded to the situations.
Cases involving allegations of sexual misconduct are sensitive and require special attention and
expertise beyond the scope of our Group Reconciliation Assistance. While we were open to listening to people about their concerns, we sometimes needed to recommend other avenues of assistance. AoR did not have access to all the information and resources necessary to directly address these concerns.
Some raising their concerns alleged that SGM consistently handles such cases in irresponsible
ways. While we did not complete detailed reviews of cases involving sexual misconduct, we were able to review documentation in some situations that demonstrated the SGM leadership understood the gravity of the situations. SGM leaders offered care and concern, they sought professional legal and counseling help for SGM and key leaders involved, and in some cases they helped connect parties to Christian mediators. In spite of the steps taken, we talked to people who were hurt in the way that such cases were handled.
As we talked to some of the parties directly involved, we sensed that some could benefit from
additional personal counseling to help them deal with their disappointments and hurts. We see
how SGM as an association of churches might also benefit by having a few people especially
trained in these areas to assist pastors and small group leaders that are confronted with such
I don't know what to make of this sentence:
"they sought professional legal and counseling help for SGM and key leaders involved"
Huh? I am no professional, but how many brain cells does it take to figure out that SGM needed to seek out counseling for the victims? And pay for it?! They pay for help for the leaders, but don't pay for the kids?
Its like you stepped out of reality into a insane asylum ward reading some of this cr@p.
Jenn Grover says:
RE: disclosure of other crimes. I ran a half-way house for people leaving prison or jail at one point. The organization did not allow sex offenders or arsonists to reside at the half-way house. Those two crimes have the highest recidivism rates because they are connected to illness. In other words, these folks generally keep committing the same crime. Murder actually has the lowest recidivism rate of major crimes. Often, murder causes the criminal to see how low they have sunk.
Misseditbythatmuch says:
I have followed what's going on at CLC this past year or so. I have friends and family who still go there. Do any of you know if there was a Maryland law in place at the time that required reporting any abuse to the authorities? I know that now any health care professional, educator, counselor, etc. must report abuse, but what about pastors, or even any one else?
Not trying to normalize. But, there are people reacting as though all of the children are routinely molested in SGM. We're rightfully exposing a handful of instances, some more than 25 years ago. They matter because these individuals matter and need to be emotionally and spiritually restored. But, most children have been completely safe.
Uh…first of all, it's more than a "handful of instances." I think the lawsuit alone names and describes more than a handful. There are lots of others where the circumstances are muddier, where it's not clear-cut enough for the victim to join the lawsuit but where abuse associated somehow with church activities did take place. I am not a statistician and I have not studied abuse within churches…but I'm not aware of another situation – except maybe something like the Roman Catholic Church – where there was such a drive to minimize and cover up and conceal known perpetrators.
And yes, "most children have been completely safe."
BUT – there is a really clear and identifiable pattern among the cases that have been disclosed. And it's a pattern that is different from anything I've ever heard of in normal church situations. What's so particularly bizarre about the way SGM pastors went about trying to minimize and conceal was that, unlike the Catholic Church, the perpetrators were not employed by the organization but were instead mere members, just like the victims.
This is really really weird. The molestations that occurred within the Catholic Church were horrific, as were the cover-ups. BUT, you could sort of understand the church's motivation for trying to shift priests around and conceal the evil. They had a lot invested in the perpetrators' training.
Within SGM, though, there's no motivation beyond their embrace of twisted "worst sinner I know" tactics combined with completely one-dimensional ideas about human behavior. Also, the pastors in question had a tremendous amount of confidence in their own rightness, their own ability to quickly adjudicate these kinds of situations. They also had a reluctance to back down once they dug their heels in in support of a perpetrator.
I'm just not understanding the seeming desire to act like SGM's issues aren't that big of a deal, or there's not something uniquely dysfunctional about SGM's mishandled abuse cases.
Hope in Him says:
#85 and 112; the church in question sadly has had similar occurrences. Several instances of sexual abuse of a teen toward younger children. Pastors did confidentially notify several members, but asked them not to talk to other members about it. Some who could have been affected were not notified. Again, parents and families are too comfortable leaving children unattended.
Former CLC'er says:
All I can say that it was crazy reading about Nate Morales' charges in the paper on my way to work. And reading Robin's comment about handling it "in house" by asking him to repent and talking with the families. Yikes! And having CLC's issues all over the news. I know justice and healing need to be done, but it's crazy seeing someone you used to know in the paper for this. And thinking about future fall out for the church, etc.
Remnant says:
"But most children have been completely safe."
How so…considering SGM, CLC, CLS all allowed perps to remain anonymous and remain within the walls of SGM, CLC, CLS?
So how was a child COMPLETELY safe?
Perps were wandering the building while children were wandering the building. And yet the identities of the perps were not made known to parents, teachers, child-care workers, babysitters. No one outside a few on leadership knew who these perps were, how many there were, whether the perps preferred boys or girls. Nothing was made known to those who needed to know in order to keep the children safe!
Perps were attending group activities while children were attending the same activities. Yet no one knew! How could the children be safe?
How was a parent to protect the child against perps that hung around if they were never told that a perp was permitted to hang around?
Even more recently, a known-to-SGM,CLC perp was allowed to go camping with children WITHOUT parental knowledge that a known perp was going on the camping trip!
Children were NEVER safe in this environment!
Julie Anne, You go girl! (watch your back. These guys play for keeps as this is their life and income)
Are you all starting to see the defense on the ground from the mushy headed plebes? CJ is not "personally" accused of molestation. That is a redirection. Nevermind he was proud to be the authoritative leader of SGM/PDI for all those years. Now his "strong leadership" is inconvenient.
They cannot say he is not guilty of blackmail and lying to members, though.
The CLC children's ministry bars anyone with any prison background from working directly with children but, anyone can stock shelves or otherwise volunteer. There are also some questions on the children's ministry application that weed out those who self-report that they have abused children, which might scare some away. (but, not others!)
And, there are many sex offenders who have not yet been caught or arrested. More than a few teen-age sex offenders attend CLC. Some of them eventually have their records expunged due to their age. So, parents should be aware that it is possible that their children will come in contact with sex offenders of every age of both sexes over there. The legal system handles younger offenders much differently than older ones. So, though I am glad to hear the pastors are sharing some info with the greeting team, I think there are many more than 3 past or present sex offenders at CLC.
Btw, does anyone know if any social workers or police were involved in the case of Charles Schmitt? I don't recall that they were. Seems like that would have made the facts a little more black and white.
We heard very few of the facts. One person said that the initial concerns about him were that Schmitt was found teaching Arminian theology in his Saturday church class. It was during that investigation that a few young men came forward to say he had approached them sexually. I never heard about anything else. But, I think 250 left the church with the Schmitts, who initially moved to FL and later, returned to Maryland.
It always seemed odd to me that they planted the church on New Hampshire Ave, a stones throw from CLC but, I guess they had a lot of x-members who wanted Schmitt as their pastor. All I know is they are a fiercely loyal group. CJ would only hope to have that many loyal members around him right about now.
Strange how things turn out in life.
http://www.abpnews.com/ministry/people/item/8192-embattled-pastor-cj-mahaney-visits-southeastern#.URHJURG9KSM
Nickname and Hope in Him thank you for your help.
One thing I can say as someone looking in on this whole situation I can see how my sibling has changed in a negative way. It is frightening to me that they can't see it or just won't acknowledge it. I have approach them about my concerns and as you can imagine it didn't go over well. I had hoped that maybe their church (in Frederick) was removed/safe from the heartbreaking events that happened in Montgomery Co. and No. Va. but unfortunately it's not. At this point all I can do is to continue to pray for them and their situation.
Ozymandias says:
For those interested, some talks by Caleb Gallifant, when he was on the pastoral staff at Antioch Community Church in Waco, TX, can be found here — http://www.youtube.com/user/AntiochWacoCollege. They're also on Vimeo: http://vimeo.com/search?q=Caleb+Gallifant
Imalone: I just discovered that CJ has blocked me from following him on Twitter.
Additionally, the SGM website has also removed CJ's public speaking schedule. Coincidentally, this happened not long after I posted a blog post about his speaking schedule (and contact info) and sent the info to Wartburg Watch bloggers.
@Julie Anne: You've got more guts than the entire collective SGM pastorate. Imagine, speaking up to the Greatest Athlete in the Room — the few pastors that ever tried it found themselves flying planeloads of rubber dog excrement out of Hong Kong.
Julie Ann – I just got through reading "paulspassingthoughts" and came across your link. Just want to thank you for "sounding the bullhorn"…mine falls on a lot of deaf ears regarding everything mentioned above…but I press on..lol. I pray the hard work of you, Kris, and many others will prevail and sit CJ's a@s in the pews with the ex-pastors he has thrown under the bus and looking for "secular" jobs to feed their families and pay their mortgages once and for all.
Thank you, Nickname and Terry. I read a lot of personal stories (very similar to SGM). I cry. I get angry. And then I blog and tweet. I'm angry about abuse. I've seen the destruction in my own family and friends. It's very personal for me.
Just wondering…is C Gallifant an SGM person or is he just a sideline 'cheerleader'? He isn't very well informed. He needs a history lesson, among other things.
Help4Abused says:
For anyone abused by Nathaniel (Nate) Morales, contact Detective Sally Magee at 240.773.5429.
Caleb Gallifant is the 2013 Pastor's College candidate representing Sovereign Grace Church of Louisville, KY. He is undoubtedly a new member but, one who has already learned to defend his boss.
@ Persona – PC pumps out the "Manchurian" drones don't they…good grief
Concerned Sibling – I don't know how SGM Frederick is doing. But, I can tell you the leadership came from long time CLC'ers that would follow the same sin-sniffing and controlling actions all in the name of thinking they are leading people to walk in holiness–because they themselves are sucked into the SGM culture. If your sibling is pulling away from family, having less time for you all, has lost their joy, putting the church constantly before family, I would be very concerned. At any rate being concerned is wonderful. You are a good sibling if you are taking the time to read here. Reading and posting here tells me your gut already knows something is wrong. Trust your gut no matter what your sibling says. When you get sucked into these people's control – you just can't see clearly. Go with your gut! You have reason to be concerned. Good job on being a caring sibling.
As I believe has been mentioned, Gallifant also has an administrative role at SGC Louisville, as you can also see from the references to @Gallifant and Caleb in Brian Chesemore's Twitter feed: https://twitter.com/BChez.
J. Mack Stiles preached at SGCL last weekend. He's with Redeemer Dubai and is 9 Marks/Dever/CHBC-connected; he also has long-standing connections with InterVarsity Christian Fellowship – though has some hesitancy about the so-called "liberalizing" tendencies of that organization — see http://www.9marks.org/journal/whats-happening-intervarsity. His son, Tristan, was involved with the split of InterVarsity's chapter at George Washington University — http://www.ctlibrary.com/ct/2009/november/10.19.html. That split is now known as Campus Outreach and is centered at Dever's church: http://campusoutreachdc.org/#/about-us/capitol-hill-baptist.
Concerned Sibling,
I'm a member of the Frederick church. The only thing fishy I've seen recently is that they now require the middle school class to be "checked in" just like all of the other children's ministry classes. Shoot me an email, jiminfrederick@gmx.com
KWIM says:
Mary and Concerned Sibling,
The Frederick church has had no reports of any abuse that I am aware of. Mary, yes you are correct Frederick was planted out of CLC. Then again most east coast SGM churches were CLC products. However Chris Silard is not your typical SGM pastor. Chris's wife Marie, works outside of the home as nurse. No he did not sign the Fairfax letter. Chris wrote his own letter to SGM. From what I know Chris has meet with CLC, and Fairfax pastors. I wouldn't be surprised to see these 3 churches working closely together with other local churches.
Concerned, The Frederick church is not a bad church. I, like you, have family in that church. To be honest I think your sibling is fine. If they werent ok I would tell you. However keep praying for her/him.
I am so glad that the middle school kids need to checked in. They need to be monitored. Why do they need a special class during the service? I am pretty sure it was a middle school aged child who was caught by the mom of a toddler sexually assaulting the child. There were other incidents as well involving this specific middle school aged child and other younger children in the church.
presbyterian says:
Re:140 reporting rules in md
Maryland's reporting rules are according to https://www.childwelfare.gov/systemwide/laws_policies/statutes/manda.pdf
Professionals Required to Report
Fam. Law § 5-704
Persons required to report include:
• Health practitioners
• Educators or human service workers
• Police officers
Reporting by Other Persons
Any other person who has reason to believe that a child has been subjected to abuse or neglect must report.
An individual may notify the local department or the appropriate law enforcement agency if the individual has reason to believe that a parent, guardian, or caregiver of a child allows the child to reside with or be in the regular presence of an individual, other than the child's parent or guardian, who is registered as a child sex offender and, based on additional information, poses a substantial risk of sexual abuse to the child.
Standards for Making a Report
Fam. Law §§ 5-704; 5-705
A mandatory reporter is required to report when, acting in a professional capacity, the person has reason to believe that a child has been subjected to abuse or neglect. Other persons shall report when they have reason to believe that a child has been subjected to abuse or neglect.
Privileged Communications
Mandatory reporters are required to report regardless of any other provision of law, including any law on privileged communications.
Only attorney-client and clergy-penitent privileges are permitted.
Inclusion of Reporter's Name in Report
The reporter is not specifically required by statute to provide his or her name in the report.
Disclosure of Reporter Identity
This issue is not addressed in the statutes reviewed.
The related privelaged reports laws are:
Md. Code Ann. Fam. Law § 5-705(a)(1), (a)(3) (LexisNexis through 4-23-12)
Except as provided below, notwithstanding any other provision of law, including a law on privileged communications,a person other than a health practitioner, police officer, or educator or human service worker who has reason to believe that a child has been subjected to abuse or neglect shall notify the local department or the appropriate law enforcement
A minister of the gospel, clergy member, or priest of an established church of any denomination is not required to provide notice [when they have reason to believe that a child has been subjected to abuse or neglect] if the notice would disclose matter in relation to any communication that is protected by the clergy-penitent privilege and:
• The communication was made to the minister, clergy member, or priest in a professional character in the course of discipline enjoined by the church to which the minister, clergy member, or priest belongs.
• The minister, clergy member, or priest is bound to maintain the confidentiality of that communication under canon law, church doctrine, or practice.
So essentially there is limited clergy privilege if they here something in confession or their church rules does not allow them to report. However all the teachers, and school administrators would be required to report.
yentl says:
I have three good friends who go to the Frederick church. Two are from CLC and are keeping an eye on these issues. One I knew through other circles. I hear good things about their church. They say most of the pastors and many of the members have experience in other denominations and it just doesn't really have that SGM culture to it. The people are evangelistic and outward. The pastors aren't afraid to think for themselves and are involving the members in evaluating things.
(formerly)Anon says:
Hi Kris and everyone,
I used to post here as Anon, but I'm not the "Anon" in this story. Someone brought this post to my attention and I just wanted to clarify that we are not the same person. I outed myself (shared some identifying specifics of our story) last November or so here, and some may remember, so I just wanted to clarify if there is any doubt or confusion.
yentl,
Why then do they continue to support the SGM cult. SG Frederick members should be encouraging their pastors to leave. They may not yet be showing outward signs of illness, but as a cancer is present in a body, it does spread and eventually kill the body.
Thank you Presbyterian. Do you happen to know if this law was in effect in the 80's? If I understand it correctly- the teachers at both of these schools would have been required to report abuse that they are aware of, but it looks like the pastors would not have been required if it was confessed to them by a perpetrator while they were in a professional capacity as a minister. I'm trying to understand why the parents and others who knew of the abuse did not report it to the authorities. I know there was a culture of distrust towards authorities at the time (concerning fear over homeschooling/spanking/etc.), and a culture of ultimate trust towards pastoral authority.
From what I understand, Chris and the pastors wrote a letter to SGM. They will not show the congregants the letter, but will share a synopsis if someone asks. To the best of my knowledge, their leadership team is not in unity regarding their involvement in SGM. They are on the fence. As far as issues of sexual abuse and neglect, yes it has happened there. To the best of my knowledge the incidents of sexual abuse did not happen on church grounds. I am aware of an incident of neglect that happened during the church service. A one-year-old got a head injury. If was dealt with passively, no one called 911 despite the child having a laceration on her face and significant external swelling in two places on her forehead. Within three days the parents were asked not to talk about it by an assistant care group leader. (The primary issue became the image of the church and not the one-year-old with a head injury.) No one in the room was able to explain how the child got injured, because they were not watching her. Maybe that is why no one called 911? Imagine not having answers for first responders.
Please, people responding to "Concerned Sibling", be aware that just because you don't know of any incidents, does not mean it has not happened. Is it typical of SGM culture to keep members blissfully unaware?
A Kindred Spirit says:
Anon, I'm so very, very sorry for what you went through. I've been thinking about you a lot these past few days, and I pray for healing if you're still in need of such.
I really appreciate you sharing your story. Unfortunately, knowing the culture within churches like SGM, sexual abuse like yours happens frequently. There are others that have experienced similar. The young guys and girls are so messed up from all the sin-sniffing and extremes taught through purity, courtship, modesty, etc. that they're dysfunctional when it comes to dealing with the natural attraction to the opposite sex and their own sexual development. God only knows how many teens have sexually abused those who are weaker. (Yes, I know it's about "control issues," as well, but it's also about sexual dysfunction.) It's all so sad and it makes me want to shake the parents that think they're "protecting" their kids by bringing them up in such cultures.
You then have pastors and leaders who believe biblical sex (marriage) is both preventive and curative, telling kids the "sexual feelings" they're having are taboo and sinful and shouldn't be "awakened" until they're married. What's a young teenage boy or girl supposed to think when they start feeling what's natural in their development and they're told it's sinful?
Anon, I'm certainly not excusing what your perpetrator did to you and I don't know if he/she was a teen or young adult that came up within the system, or an older adult. I'm just saying that the culture produces such.
A commenter once pointed out that with their rejection of secular psychology, it wouldn't be surprising to find that these pastors/leaders believe pedophilia is just a sinful choice or temptation and not a disorder. That could be one of the reasons they try to handle so much of it "in-house" (that AND protecting their image).
The lawsuit needs to be won to "stop the madness" and to educate all these "like-minded" pastors out there in conservative Christendom that they're not qualified to deal with psychiatric disorders and criminal acts even though it all stems from a fallen world.
Physical sickness entered the world through sin…I wonder how many people would trust these guys for a diagnosis and cure?
"Hope in Him" said,
From what I've observed, the answer to that question is "Absolutely!" I might be generalizing a little, but after everything I've learned, almost all of SGM's dysfunction has flowed out of a desire to keep things looking as close to perfect as possible. Anything that could be construed to reflect negatively on the organization (or the individual congregation, or the pastors) is shared on a strictly need-to-know basis…and the rule of thumb seems to be that pretty much nobody needs to know anything negative…even if it might impact their own safety.
So rest assured that if a church is still controlled by the pastors, with no formal mutual accountability and/or no formal congregational input, the pastors are still likely following the ways of the culture in which they were raised to leadership. One of the cornerestones of SGM culture is information control, particularly control of negative information.
Just because you haven't heard of it does NOT mean that it hasn't happened. If any of your pastors were trained within SGM and had to subscribe to SGM's rules for being recognized as possessing leadership qualities, it's highly unlikely they've avoided the kinds of problems brought about by the SGM culture…and it's highly unlikely they've been able to truly ditch the culture, especially if they are reluctant to speak out and repent of specific things that were wrong with the culture.
turtle says:
Chris Silard came from clc where he was as bad as the rest with sin sniffing and then condemning feedback.
Hope in Him (#168) said: "From what I understand, Chris and the pastors wrote a letter to SGM. They will not show the congregants the letter, but will share a synopsis if someone asks."
Major red flag here! What are they hiding? What kind of elite group do these pastors think they are? Why anyone would remain in a "church" where the pastors would refuse to share this information with all the members is beyond me. Sounds like Chris & Co. are no different from CJ & Co.
Hope in Him, #168, said
From what I understand, Chris and the pastors wrote a letter to SGM. They will not show the congregants the letter, but will share a synopsis if someone asks.
If Hope in Him understands this correctly, this is disturbing. Why not share the letter in its entirety to the entire congregation without them having to ask? This is typical SGM behavior. Many times, after the dreaded family meetings where horrible things came to light, we were told not to discuss issues among ourselves, but to go to the pastors with any questions. We knew better than to go to the pastors with questions, because the response would be "you have a rebellious heart issue, because you do not trust your pastors."
If you're in the Frederick church, ask for some answers. Ask for the synopsis AND a copy of the letter, and ask that it be distributed. And if you are answered with the "you don't trust", you can agree and say, "Of course I do not trust. You are fallible human beings just like everyone else, and you need to be honest and forthright with everyone involved, because you have the office of a pastor. In Christ alone I place my trust." Just my two cents.