text:
QC agent (107 viewers)
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All non-NA/EU players removed from Qualifiers (168 comments)
( Major News: QC)
Posted by dirtbox @ 08:04 CDT, 16 June 2017 - iMsg
From ESL Discord:
Hello @everyone ! We would like to let you know that the NA qualifiers are meant only for NA & CA based players and the EU qualifiers are meant only for the EU based countries. This means that for these qualifiers, we won't be able to accept players (or teams with players) from Asia/Africa/Australia/Latin America. We have already removed those that were from the mentioned regions from the qualifiers and we hope that you will help us spread this message so it reaches them and the other players from these regions that were planning to participate. Many thanks and happy fraggin'!
Yet on the Bethesda page it says people can play with High Ping from other regions.
NOTE: All Qualifiers will be played on NA or EU servers. However, other regions can participate in these Qualifiers with higher latency. NA includes the Americas and Australia, and EU Europe, Russia and Asia.
Update 2017-06-19 by Åke Vader: Apparently this has been resolved. According to some obscure Discord quote Africans and Asians will now be allowed to play in the European region, while Australians and Latin Americans are allowed to play in the North American region.
Edited by Åke Vader at 05:47 CDT, 19 June 2017 - 47286 Hits
<< Comment #1 @ 08:11 CDT, 16 June 2017 >>
(Link, Reply)
By Profanum :
By lazybones |
By wch '
By d00med :
By lolograde + + + |
Cooller.
By Devianthe + + + + |
By fnx-za + :
RIP all my SA friends (FeelsBad)
Edited by fnx-za at 08:39 CDT, 16 June 2017
By bogOtac + + + '
rip noctis
By 7ep3s +
esl killing the kwek
Edited by 7ep3s at 08:52 CDT, 16 June 2017
<< Comment #10 @ 08:52 CDT, 16 June 2017 >>
By palatka + + + '
heheehehhehe
By carecry + + + '
"World" Championships.
By Anonymous (79.252.97.55) - Reply to #11
since uk ain't eu anymore, you can be glad we allow you to watch it at least
<< Comment #103 @ 16:02 CDT, 21 June 2017 >>
By Devianthe + + + + | - Reply to #81
don't bully
By function9 + + + :
Basically racism.
By Pineapple Pizza! :
no gold for the bogans
By MailmanMel + + |
How can anyone be surprised at this, it's id we are talking about, the company that for decades has been systematically killing the communities of their games? Now they have just become more efficient.
Edited by MailmanMel at 09:08 CDT, 16 June 2017
By jamalz + +
fuck that, sign up and play anyway my african brethren
By Crotazzo '
Heil Trump
Just had a word with SyncError, they were not aware of this. Most likely will be looked into and hopefully sorted out chatlog from qc discord
By 7ep3s + - Reply to #17
additionally, this is from esl quake discord community manager:
[1:30 PM] FoaMeA: we are aware of what the news is saying, which was for us as confusing as it is right now for you
[1:31 PM] FoaMeA: however, the rules are considered above any news, and as long as it is not part of the rulebook, we are not able to accept any players that are from the regions we mentioned
[1:32 PM] FoaMeA: we are currently in the process of confirming 100% if this needed to be in the rulebook or not
[1:33 PM] FoaMeA: that's why I also mentioned in the announcement channel that we are still working at the final version of the rulebook
[1:33 PM] FoaMeA: but for now, we had to remove the players that were ineligible according to the current rulebook
By e2-klz '
If it's true. It's easy to proceed.
We have a lot of good games that cares for our community.
Sorry, but the Asian, African and South American that play a game that derespect their own community don't deserve respect.
So, Bye Id! I'm tired
Edited by e2-klz at 09:19 CDT, 16 June 2017
By doom2 + '
This whole thing feels rushed as fuck except for a few chosen ones who probably knew about all this way before it was announced ^^
I'm gonna look forward to future events more after the game is actually finished. Also fuck calling everything "world championships" when it's clearly not.
I will lol hard if some squad of warping fuckers takes a spot over some favorites
Edited by doom2 at 09:29 CDT, 16 June 2017
By megaman3 + + + '
This just goes to show you can train an employee for 12 years, but if he was incompetent at the beginning he will remain being incompetent for the rest of his life.
It's the 101 to check how your partners work. And that's not the fault of upper management, but 100% of Syncerror (the project leader). $1,000,000 prize pool budget, a spot at E3 and a partnership with ESL, and yet he somehow managed to once again screw up.
Even if the problem were to be solved the damage is already done. Now the tournament is not going to be an advertisement tool in most of the world, but the opposite as sites rejoice with screw ups like this. It's paying for negative publicity. Same that happened when the NDA was lifted way too soon, as sites reported QC is a buggy mess so people won't try it no matter bugs are fixed in the future. Same that happened when choosing Sacrifice as the esports mode, which is an unwatchable mess so half of the screen time at E3 was wasted.
Edited by megaman3 at 09:57 CDT, 16 June 2017
By CaptainTaichou + + - Reply to #21
I thought SyncError was just Lead Design for the game. Not sure he's responsible for this too.
By megaman3 + + + ' - Reply to #25
Zero4 then.
Does he have any real power? :D
By Freiya + + + + | - Reply to #32
40 lg 60 rail.
Haha :D
By Anonymous (177.192.249.231) - Reply to #21
Totally agree, now you can imagine the media talking about social exclusions.
How beautiful to Id.
u r such an asshole, cant believe how anyone respects ur opinions,
- KILL SYNCERROR!
- but it was zero4!
- OK KILL ZERO4 THEN!
lol, get a life
- KILL THE WHOLE CREW!
Then problem solved. )
By sudoBp + ' - Reply to #21
i'd say TB would argue again that its not sync's or zero4's fault of the game failing but more of the Quake Elitists :D
By Le0 ' - Reply to #55
These news suck, but they've got nothing to do with what TB said.
He was never defending this game rather than pointing out that MUH PURITY that these elitists clamor for already exists in like 3 Quake-like games which nobody plays, so conforming to their opinion is fruitless.
I'd like to see you argue against that, rather than strawmanning him.
TB and his views have been "argued against" here:
https://www.esreality.com/post/2872403/totalbi...and-quake/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jQvTyvVX_ys&a...e&t=15
"TB = tuberculosis, a disease that can kill you. :D"
That's a really poignant argument there, fam. Hilarious and original.
Meanwhile Reflex sits at an all-time peak of 228 concurrent players.
I see nothing of substance in the link provided, just ad hominems for days.
Please do point out what valid counter-points to what TB's said did i miss.
I scrolled about half of that thread and found nothing.
Edited by Le0 at 10:13 CDT, 18 June 2017
Ironic since TB's argument is nothing but ad hominem.
My comment was a joke, not intended to be taken seriously. It certainly wasn't an "argument". I'm pretty sure TB wasn't joking. More like just trying to be provocative for the spectacle. It helps keep him popular.
By the way, what he said is a whole lot more than "Pure Quake can't be popular". That's not a controversial statement. He went straight to describing the type of person making the argument.
And before you say he didn't, did you even see the other link posted on that page: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A1VgRgHQ00&a...amp;t=2534
The dude is basically just pulling memes and stereotypes out of his ass.
Edited by CaptainTaichou at 10:37 CDT, 18 June 2017
"More like just trying to be provocative for the spectacle."
So, like you were with every single one of your posts in the thread you linked?
What's your problem again?
You don't mind the message, you just don't like the way it was said?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=02Ikb6B55Qc
This is more to your liking? Anything else?
Or this is actually about who said it more than anything else?
Saying it doesn't make it so.
Take it to the thread and argue there if you have a problem with something specific I said. I'm not going to repeat my points here.
If you think everything in that thread is nothing but a mindless attack on poor little TB, then you really are just sounding like a TB fanboy at this point.
He made an uncalled for attack on "purists" based on nothing but his imagination, when he fits the description he is putting on them better (bad players who played Quake long ago trying to sound big).
Anyway, who am I provoking? I'm not the guy on youtube launching attacks in front of a huge audience. Calling a tool a tool for acting like a tool doesn't make you a tool.
"I'm not the guy on youtube launching attacks in front of a huge audience."
So you don't have an audience here? Nobody reads your posts? You need a youtube channel to be provocative? To be a troll? To have a circlejerk? My friend, just a couple posts in and you're already grasping at straws.
Is it hard for you to admit that you just called the guy names without ever refuting what he said?
Because i specifically asked for the latter and you've got no answer for it.
You're just dancing around the issue while being unreasonably defensive about your shitposts.
"He made an uncalled for attack on "purists" based on nothing but his imagination, when he fits the description he is putting on them better (bad players who played Quake long ago trying to sound big)."
I know at least a dozen people IRL that fit his description, so it's not his imagination.
Why do you assume he was talking about you? Does his description fit you? If not, why are you getting your panties in a bunch?
Go to the thread and argue against the points made THERE.
He launched the attack, so he had whatever response he got coming. It's that simple. It's like punching someone in the face, and then when they respond, telling them they are being provocative.
I'm not being provocative as you claimed. I don't profit it from it like he does. I don't like what TB said, and I voiced as much; so did many others. I guess everyone in that thread who took issue with what TB said is a troll now. Get real.
I did refute what he said, and so did other people. You're just conveniently ignoring the points that were made as if all that is in that thread is insults on TB, which is utterly false.
You use a lot of empty rhetoric like "grasping at straws" and "dancing around the issue" that are completely inapplicable here. I challenge anyone to read that thread and tell me the issue has not been comprehensively dealt with.
It doesn't matter whether you know people who fit TB's Quaker memes. He is lumping everyone together and belittling them in an attempt to destroy their credibility. This is the ad hominem you seem to care about so much. No one would care if he just made a point about the existence of an audience for pure Quake.
TB's argument in a nutshell:
"There is no audience for a new, well-made, well-marketed, well-promoted, well-supported, pure Quake with all the modern bells and whistles because no one is playing a bunch of low-budget, unmarketed, indie AFPS games that are not even as good as old QL and do not have the draw of the Quake brand; therefore, the handful of posts I saw on public forums criticizing QC must be written by a bunch of bragging hypocritical posers who got drunk playing Quake 15 years ago at a LAN party and who I incidentally do not know anything about."
The first part may be right or may be wrong. He didn't prove anything. No one knows what audience such a game could pull. I'd wager it'd be at least as popular as QC is now. The second part though is uncalled for.
The part about whether he was addressing me or other people on ESR has already been discussed in the other thread, which it is becoming quite apparent you did not even read. Here is only my post talking about that: https://www.esreality.com/post/2872403/totalbi...pid2876806
Anyway, if you have to be attacked personally to take issue, then I can say, I didn't attack YOU, so why are YOU getting your "panties in a bunch" and white-knighting for TB like he's your grandmother.
"Go to the thread and argue against the points made THERE."
Why would i? I came here to discuss the news about the qualifiers and replied to an out-of-place jab at someone unrelated.
You evoked that thread claiming that it contains a rebuttal to my post and it doesn't.
I didn't even know it existed before you brought it up and was better off for it.
"I'm not being provocative as you claimed."
So you really meant it when you compared him to tuberculosis? Because that would make you a bit of an immature twat.
"You're just conveniently ignoring the points that were made as if all that is in that thread is insults on TB, which is utterly false."
You referred to a thread that is a vitriolic cesspool which you yourself participated in, with maybe a dozen of decent posts all-in-all, at the time.
So get off this pretence that you linked me to some high-quality polite level-headed discussion with a bunch of solid points made. Au contraire, that thread makes a lot of you look undefendable to people outside of your "fuck that cancerous TB cunt" circlejerk.
"I challenge anyone to read that thread and tell me the issue has not been comprehensively dealt with."
What's next? I challenge you to google counter-arguments to your arguments? This is not how it works, friend.
I asked for exact counter-points because i didn't find any solid ones and you can't provide any. Because you couldn't find them either, i assume.
"new, well-made, well-marketed, well-promoted, well-supported, pure Quake"
Directed by Stanley Kubrick with a $500mil budget. Can you prove that there's an interest for it? Cause i'd like to, but i can't.
"indie AFPS games that are not even as good as old QL"
Get the fuck out with this disingenous rubbish. List me what "old QL" does better than Reflex or Warsow. Go ahead.
You're only proving TB's point. You have not not played these games. You're not convincing anyone that you want this kind of games by not playing them.
"and do not have the draw of the Quake brand"
Yeah, that's what developers of the new Unreal Tournament were thinking. Oh wait.
"The part about whether he was addressing me or other people on ESR has already been discussed in the other thread"
You did not answer my question. Does or does not the description fit you? If you don't answer this, by occam's razor i'll assume it does .
"Anyway, if you have to be attacked personally to take issue, then I can say, I didn't attack YOU, so why are YOU getting your "panties in a bunch" and white-knighting for TB like he's your grandmother. "
I consider TBs points valid and mostly in alignment with mine, and as such worth defending. Who did you align with? Do you even know? You sure you didn't get offended on behalf of some random group of people that is not related to you in any way and doesn't even want you there? Cause there's a word for it.
Busybody.
You originally said:
I pointed out the thread because I believe this idea has been discussed there quite a bit. I really don't see how you could say it hasn't.
Merely linking you the thread wasn't an attack on anyone. But yes, in that thread, TB is attacked, or should I say counter-attacked since he fired shots first.
But now you're bringing that argument that exists there into this thread. So that's why you should be arguing it there under the relevant topic.
I already told you this was a joke. If you don't like this sense of humour, then move on. It's not for you. It's completely harmless. I'm willing to bet you're no paragon of "maturity"---if making harmless banter is even immature.
Even if there is garbage in that thread, as there is in every thread, it doesn't change the fact that the points you seek were made in there.
This is false equivalence. I didn't ask you to search for arguments I didn't make; I made the arguments already in that thread. I didn't ask you to search for them. I linked you to them. This is done for no other reason than to avoid repeating myself here as you are trying to make me do.
You claimed I was dancing around the issue when I have already addressed the issue.
Can you prove that there's an interest for it?
Can you prove there is less interest for it than for QC? No, you can't. So why expect me to prove there is. QC is pretty dead right now. Whether Kubrick is involved doesn't matter; this is about the existence of an audience for a hypothetical great pure AFPS. This is the AFPS that has to be unpopular for the genre itself to have some fundamental flaw. Even if there is no interest, which I acknowledged as possibility in my last post, it is beside the point of why TB is a tool for attacking people unnecessarily, and again, for some reason, you wanna have this discussion in an unrelated thread.
Lots of people think QL is better than Reflex, in areas such as the art, maps, sound, gameplay balance, and physics. Again the thread is relevant here because people talked about that. The few technical areas in which Reflex is superior are not things that people seem to care about a lot. You can see that QL is still the more played game to this day, having about 10x the number of players globally. I have played Reflex, and for whatever reason, it did not tickle my fancy as much as QL. If QL isn't good enough for me, then Reflex certainly wouldn't be. I have played a lot of QC, and I'm certainly not playing it for its lack of purity, though the lack of purity is tolerable. QC is primarily attractive because it is new and because it has a potential to be bigger than QL.
UT4 has been in pre-alpha forever. It's a testbed. It's not a good example of a finished game by which you could gauge any popularity, and the long time from being publicly available to being finished, if ever, is not going to increase its popularity.
Does or does not the description fit you?
It appears TB is addressing people like me even though I am willing to acknowledge the possibility of him being right about the lack of modern interest in such a game. I was responding to your idea that maybe he is not and only appears to be (he appears to be attacking and stereotyping people on forums who criticize QC's "unpure" elements), in which case the post I linked you becomes relevant.
The problem isn't your views or his views about the GAME; the problem is his ad hominem that you seem to want to defend but think that a response to in kind is unacceptable.
I already told you this was a joke.
A joke is supposed to be funny.
Call it what it is: an edgy shitpost.
This is false equivalence. I didn't ask you to search for arguments I didn't make; I made the arguments already in that thread.
Yeah, you never asked me to search for arguments elsewhere instead of directly linking them, you just asked me to search for arguments elsewhere... Huh?
Do you even read what you write? Or is this another one of your "jokes"?
Can you prove there is less interest for it than for QC? No, you can't.
Actually, i can.
It's all in the player numbers of similar games, i even cited some in this thread.
INB4 statistics don't matter because the fairy magic of Quake.
QC is pretty dead right now.
Based on what?
TB is a tool for attacking people unnecessarily
Who are you to say that? You don't even know who he's talking about.
Lots of people think QL is better than Reflex, in areas such as the art, maps, sound, gameplay balance, and physics.
Who are these people? The ones that never played Reflex? You sure you're not projecting your unsubstantiated opinion on an imaginary group of people to try and sound more credible? Maps? Pretty much all Quake maps worth a damn are in Reflex. If you wanted to come off as someone who doesn't know what the hell he's talking about, you've passed with shining colors.
You just said a bunch of vague shit that doesn't mean anything.
Specifically, what old QL did better than Reflex?
What features it had that Reflex doesn't have?
What weapons are unbalanced and why? Etc, etc.
It's not a good example of a finished game by which you could gauge any popularity
It is as good of an example as it gets.
Can you name one game that exploded in popularity on release after being as unpopular in early access as UT is? Stop fooling yourself.
Point a finger at any popular PVP game right now, chances are, it's been immensely popular in its early access.
What a shock. It's almost as if core gameplay is the main hook of multiplayer games.
the problem is his ad hominem that you seem to want to defend but think that a response to in kind is unacceptable.
The character he describes is not a central part of his argument, so it's not an ad hominem. I've already linked you to a video where he presented the same argument without stepping on anyone's toes, but you choose to fixate on something he said in the heat of a moment during one of his streams as if pointing a finger at it over and over somehow invalidates the gist of what he's saying.
By CaptainTaichou + + - Reply to #101
Oh dear. I thought you were gone, but you're back. This conversation is getting rather annoying.
Funny is subjective. You are not the king who decides what is funny and what is not. I even put a laughing face in it to indicate it was a joke.
you just asked me to search for arguments elsewhere
How much hand holding do you need to find the arguments in the link to the thread? Is it really necessary for me to copy and paste them here? I already see you making posts in that thread, so it obviously wasn't beyond your capabilities.
QC is pretty dead right now. Based on what?
The fact that I was in the MM queue for 70 minutes yesterday with no game. And this is not an uncommon occurrence and many others have reported similar experiences. The QC global chat is full of people complaining about this, as well as the beta forum. Maybe you don't see it because you're in Europe, which has the largest interest in Quake.
There are two aspects to this discussion:
(1) The civilized discussion about whether there is an audience for a great pure AFPS game. Here, I can't be bothered dealing with you because your sarcasm is off the charts. But let's just say you and TB could be perfectly correct about this. I don't claim to know the tastes of the "masses" as well as you guys do.
(2) TB insulting people and being insulted in return. Here, you think the former is perfectly okay but take great issue with the latter. Are you a hypocrite? Or do you think it is okay for TB to insult people if they just happen to be people you don't like?
Without (2), TB would not have copped any flak. People would say they agree or not, give their arguments, and that'd be it. We would just have (1).
Even in the video you linked, which I had already seen, he identifies forum posters criticizing the unpure elements of QC as the target of his derision, calling them braggarts and posers. He extrapolates on that in the next video just with a ton more vitriol.
Here is TB identifying his target:
https://youtu.be/02Ikb6B55Qc?t=32s
Indeed, the game has received a lot of criticism from various corners of the internet, forums, subreddits, message boards, and so on and so forth.
They've made some interesting claims about it.
And many of those have consisted of something of a purist attitude, claiming that this is not the Quake that they wanted, that they want a pure arena shooter, that they want to go back to the good old days.
And here is TB insulting his target:
https://youtu.be/02Ikb6B55Qc?t=3m52s
So my belief is quite simply this. These purists, as they were, like to brag. They like to complain, and they like to wistfully wish for experiences they had 10 to 15 years ago, experiences which were most likely not in any way representative of the actual competitive nature of those games. They're talking about the experiences they had at LAN parties, 10 or 15 years ago, playing with their friends, drunk off their arse, playing random game modes, playing mods. They weren't involved in the competitive scene for Quake or Unreal Tournament. In fact, quite a few competitive players so far have stated that they have actually really enjoyed aspects of Quake Champions. These are the guys that actually won money, that actually played in the competitive scene. As far as I'm concerned, these so-called purists are nothing but wannabes and showboaters. They're pretending. Maybe they find it fun.
And if that was too reserved for you, he shows his true colours in the next video I already linked you:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4A1VgRgHQ00&a...amp;t=2534
If you think it is reasonable for him to insult people like this (especially given the size of his audience) but think it is not okay for people to insult him in return, then don't bother replying to explain why you think this is the case; we're not going to agree, and it is a waste of time.
By Le0 ' - Reply to #102
I even put a laughing face in it to indicate it was a joke.
Oh god, this is embarassing. So you can say anything, and as long as it's got a little smiley in the end you can't be judged for it. Is that what you're saying?
Cuz tis jokes maine :D
Hope your kids die from cancer :D
How much hand holding do you need to find the arguments in the link to the thread? Is it really necessary for me to copy and paste them here?
How difficult it is to just link me to the post you want me to look at? You did it in this conversation already, just not for supposed counter-arguments to my initial post. Boy, i wonder why the double standards.
The fact that I was in the MM queue for 70 minutes yesterday with no game.
Ah, anecdotic evidence. The measure of all truth. Of course.
Even Europe has MM and server issues. Somehow we manage not to conclude that the game is dead because of it, since it's something that is very much expected from betas.
I just find it funny how you can say that the game is dead based on its beta in the same breath you've said that the game's success can't be judged before release. Or was that a joke too? I'm not sure anymore. At this point i wouldn't put it past you to tell me that if a sentence ends with a full stop it means it's a goofy lil' joke, so i shouldn't ever call you out on those.
TB insulting people and being insulted in return.
I don't think you understand what the word "insult" means.
And here's concrete proof that you don't know what the word "insult" means.
It's not his "next video" it's a stream vod, clown shoes. Which it says in the name of the channel. Which doesn't even belong to TB, as it says. Can you be more disingenous please?
His next video is a podcast with 2GD, where they find a lot of common ground in relation to QC.
Yeah, smileys are often used to indicate the level of seriousness in what someone is saying on the internet. Sure, you can abuse that convention, but you don't have any reason to believe I was doing that, and I was not.
If you can't find the relevant posts in that thread, then that's your problem. I have no intention of debating that issue with someone like you, and I never sent you the link because I wanted to. You originally said:
I gave you a link to a thread containing arguments. If you can't find any there, then that's fine. You immediately replied about "ad hominem", which is pretty much what this conversation is about.
You take issue with what I've said, but I don't see you knocking on the door of anyone who said similar or worse things in the thread.
You cannot spend 10 minutes in the QC global chat without people complaining about queue times. It's all over the beta forum too. If you want to ignore that evidence because it is not a number in a computer that no one has access to, then so be it. What can be said objectively is that for THOSE people (and there are plenty of them), QC is dead (in the same sense that is usually used to refer to other AFPS games as dead).
I never said QC will be dead on release (I hope it won't be), just that it is dead now.
I know very well what an insult is, and if you consider comparing TB to a disease that shares his name an insult, I have no idea how you cannot find generalizing a large group of people as whingers, bad players, wannabes, showboaters, and pretenders as an insult---and that's before we get to the second video.
These words degrade those people and are intended to discredit them. This is much worse than calling one obnoxious individual a disease using a pun as a joke, which most people would easily be able to identify.
It's not his "next video" it's a stream vod, clown shoes.
It looks like a video to me. What type of video it is is totally beside the point. What matters is what he said in it. I don't think you know what "disingenuous" means.
By the way, ladening your posts with heavy sarcasm does not make you appear any more intelligent or more correct.
Please go away. You're not convincing me, and you're not convincing anyone who did not already agree with you in the first place. Your eagerness to defend TB and your double standards regarding people's behaviour leads me to believe you might even be TB. LOL
By beefheart ' - Reply to #107
Whoever posts last wins this argument
I gave you a link to a thread containing arguments.
Which you couldn't back up in any way after i doubted it because your very first post in that thread was a bottom of a barrel shitpost.
I have no intention of debating that issue with someone like you, and I never sent you the link because I wanted to.
Then why did you give me the link and why are you debating me? Are you bipolar or something? How can you contradict yourself so much?
And what do you mean by "someone like you"?
but I don't see you knocking on the door of anyone who said similar or worse things in the thread.
Because they never came to this thread to tell me they've made some good arguments in that other thread where they called their opponent (who wasn't even there) a faggot.
You cannot spend 10 minutes in the QC global chat without people complaining about queue times.
Like with any game that has a global chat.
If you think that's how it works you are legitimately stupid. I'm sorry, there's no other word for it. My friend, if QC dies right now, in its late beta stage, there won't be a release for it and Quake as a franchise is dead. After QL's failure QC is the last straw for the series to Zenimax. If it fails, say bye bye to Quake games altogether. So suck it up and quit misinforming people about the game being dead if you really care about it, because some dumbshits might actually believe you and refrain from playing because of it.
I know very well what an insult is
It is well documented at this point that you don't.
and if you consider comparing TB to a disease that shares his name an insult
I don't consider it an insult, i consider it a shitpost that is at least 2 years out of date which detracts from anything you've got to say on the topic.
I have no idea how you cannot find generalizing a large group of people as whingers, bad players, wannabes, showboaters, and pretenders as an insult
Yeah, none of these words are insults, especially when they ring true. You probably think "fat" is an insult too, don't you?
What type of video it is is totally beside the point. What matters is what he said in it.
Well, if circumstances truly don't matter and it's only ever about what was said, you compared a person to a deadly disease so you're a scumbag, i guess. Oh but earlier you stressed that circumstances make all the difference in your case.
See, what you did here is a textbook example of what is called disingenuity. Now you know what the word means, you're welcome.
You are right, me being correct is what makes me appear more correct.
Please go away. You're not convincing me
I didn't come here to convince or even talk to you. You engaged a debate with me. So put up or shut up.
your double standards regarding people's behaviour
you might even be TB.
Actually, i'm JFK.
why are you debating me?
I'm not debating the subject with you. You do not debate in a civil manner, just like TB. And I already acknowledged that TB might be right about the size of the audience, as I had done long before TB even showed up to talk about it.
There is only one other subject here, and that is about who insulted whom, and that's where your double standard lies. Or are you going to tell me that all your hostility toward me in this thread is purely because you couldn't find arguments to your high standards in the thread I linked?
I never called TB a faggot in that thread. Is that what passes as an insult for you?
there won't be a release for it and Quake as a franchise is dead
At least for Australia, this is definitely a possibility. Long queue times are normal even in peak time for players here. So either the MM is totally fubared, or there aren't enough players. Both of these are systemic problems that don't just affect a handful of players. There are similar reports from other countries.
In fact, it is not, and you have not said a single thing to establish that calling people you don't even know whingers, bad players, wannabes, showboaters, and pretenders is not insulting.
Except he was being perfectly serious and meant what he said. What are your mitigating circumstances for TB here? It's not like he was talking to his friends behind closed doors.
You defend TB insulting others; you think it is perfectly okay, but you criticize others for responding in kind, and then you make insults of your own. This is your double standard.
TB made arguments while insulting his opponents. Others responded by making arguments while insulting TB.
You had a problem with the latter, but not the former. Even if some only insulted him, they had every right to do so after he had insulted them.
Yeah, none of these words are insults, especially when they ring true.
I think you are the one who does not know what an insult is. Please tell me what qualifies as an insult in your book? I think nothing would be an insult to you unless it is saying something bad about TB. Clearly other people on the receiving end of those words thought they were insulting.
If I were to call you a stupid person and a hypocrite, then by your logic, it is not an insult; it just "rings true". It doesn't matter whether it is actually true. It is just being descriptive, like the word "fat", right?
By Freiya + + + + | - Reply to #114
You guys are arguing about the base concept that tutalbizkit being a clueless, fashionist shitter having his head so far up in his own ass that he passed Lemmiwinks a long time ago?
You guys have way too much free time ony our hands typing so much. I mean, I just concluded the story in one line. )
I'm not debating the subject with you.
What are you doing here then?
And I already acknowledged that TB might be right about the size of the audience
So it's not about the truth of the situation, but about you being so petty as to cling to some words he said on a stream? Which, as it turns out, were unlikely to have been aimed at you?
Well isn't that just sad.
Or are you going to tell me that all your hostility toward me in this thread is purely because you couldn't find arguments to your high standards in the thread I linked?
Well, yes, you're beating around the bush for god knows how many posts instead of directly linking me to these alleged arguments that i couldn't find in that thread. You're trying to backseat debate with me so i treat you accordingly. I can't be assed to look for your arguments for you. Do you understand?
You did nothing to earn my respect, don't act surprised about me not showing you any.
I never called TB a faggot in that thread.
I see you're only ever pedantic about menial things.
It doesn't matter what you called him. What matters is you didn't have any counter-arguments but felt the need to blurt out something to show the circlejerk which side you're on.
There are similar reports from other countries.
I call bullshit on this.
I just skimmed through official beta feedback forums and queue times were mentioned once in the first 10 pages and it was a suggestion of a workaround for a known issue.
I can't attest for Australia, but are server issues in online videogames really a rarity for you guys? Because somehow even i know that's something that comes with the territory.
You defend TB insulting others
No, i'm defending his point, which you'd know if you'd learn to comprehend written text. And since i'm not an asswhipe, i'll link you exactly to the posts where i mentioned it:
http://esreality.com/post/2877579/n-a/#pid2877178
Wow, took me a whopping 3 seconds.
What language he used, especially on a stream with a chat full of people not too much unlike yourself telling him to lmao kill himself :D, as long as the point stands, is irrelevant to me, but somehow seems to be of utmost importance to you.
Others responded by making arguments while insulting TB.
So i guess "argument" is yet another word you're struggling with. Which is likely why you can't present me with any. Either that or you're in full-on denial of what's actually went down in that thread. Which it seems it's already seeping into this one. I guess we'll soon see plently of "good arguments" here too!
If I were to call you a stupid person and a hypocrite, then by your logic, it is not an insult; it just "rings true".
No, since unlike you, i didn't show any signs of hypocricy or stupidity in this exchange.
Feel free to try and prove otherwise.
I'm not going to go round and round in circles with you forever. We are not going to agree.
You don't get that TB insulted people, who he clearly identified as a group, and that is why he copped abuse in return. He aims to discredit people with such views on the game, regardless of what kind of person they actually are, to make sure no one listens to them.
When you attack the character of your opponent to strengthen your position, that is ad hominem, and you seemed to have a problem with the use of ad hominem directed at TB.
What he is saying about those people is not "truth". It might apply to some, but how many comments do you realistically think TB read and from how many individual posters? It just looks like he is regurgitating a stereotype.
If he cut that part out, then I think people would have accepted what he had to say, whether it is true or not. I think a lot of people did not appreciate his words this time around regardless of how nice a guy he may or may not be in general.
I posted you a link to arguments because you wanted them. If you don't think there are any in that thread, then fine. I think the subject of why Quake and similar games are not played has been discussed plenty in that thread, and the reasons given have nothing to do with people being illegitimate in their claims of what they want in a game.
If I post you links to specific comments here, you're going to make me argue on behalf of others. You won't argue against the people actually making the comments.
Where exactly did I tell TB to kill himself? I did not. In fact, I don't think anyone did.
QC is dead in Australia. It is not a "server issue". There aren't enough players. You wait a very long time, and when you get games, it is the same people over and over, regardless of their skill. They all complain about the problem, and no one denies that the problem exists. I don't believe there are heaps of people waiting this long in queue never to be seen in any game.
They made the game open beta too soon when it still had lots of problems, and it scared people off.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uVLpelXUXWQ
I'll ask again: what are you doing here then?
who he clearly identified as a group
You are still not even sure who he was talking about, but are quick to whiteknight them. It's laughable.
and you seemed to have a problem with the use of ad hominem directed at TB.
No, i have a problem with a lack of actual counter-arguments. You seriosly cannot read, can you?
It just looks like he is regurgitating a stereotype.
Let's for a moment say that he does. What difference does it make?
If he cut that part out, then I think people would have accepted what he had to say, whether it is true or not.
So i was right and it's just your pettiness. But don't go around painting the rest of the posters in your colors. By your own standards that would be an insult to them.
I posted you a link to arguments
You didn't. You posted me a link to a circlejerk that for the most part even ignores OP's inquiry which was supposed to stick it to TB and prove him wrong.
And then when pressed to post concrete arguments you're weaseling like a bitch.
If I post you links to specific comments here, you're going to make me argue on behalf of others.
You're already arguing on behalf of others.
Where exactly did I tell TB to kill himself?
Where did i say that you did? I likened you to shitposters that fill TB's twitch chat. Because your calling him a tool and likening him to tuberculosis would feel right at home there.
QC is dead in Australia. It is not a "server issue".
Citation needed. Quick googling "quake champions australia" reveals that you didn't even have servers not so long ago.
It sure sucks if it's true, but i shouldn't be the one to tell you that Australia is not a baromether by which to measure an online videogame's health.
Shows your lack of experience with public betas more than anything. First off, QC doesn't have "a lot of problems" even compared to released games these days. Second, if the game wouldn't have problems, there would be no need for it to be in beta.
You are more upset than a guy who just couldn't find arguments in a place someone said there were arguments. Or are you just an aggro person in general?
No, it is not "petty" to have a problem with TB attacking people. He could be wrong in his stance about the audience for the game, and people wouldn't care. He was specifically trying to encourage his large audience not to listen to these people because he thinks they are posers. If he's talking about other people than the people he clearly identified, then he chose his words poorly.
QC has had servers in Australia for at least two months now. I'm not sure what more of a "citation" you need than the experiences of the people actually playing the game here. What do you want, a CNN article?
People either left the game because of the problems that you think are not a big deal or because they just don't like the game. The comments you do see about why people left the game indicate the reason is the problems with the netcode and queue times primarily.
I know you won't accept it, but here, people complaining, found in a couple of minutes:
https://bethesda.net/community/topic/66085/queue-times
https://bethesda.net/community/topic/65670/wa...nd-waiting
https://bethesda.net/community/topic/66029/fi...ing-please
https://bethesda.net/community/topic/65853/queue-times-hotfix
If you'd spent as much time on the beta forum as I have, you'd know this is not an uncommon thing to see, strewn as off topic in unrelated threads.
Anyway, enjoy having your last say. This is a fruitless discussion.
It was already fruitless after the first exchange. )
It's hard to tell in the beginning sometimes.
This time it wasn't.
By Tayski + | - Reply to #124
arguing back and forth about such trivial shit on the internet... you guys seriously need to get a life
Edited by Tayski at 14:58 CDT, 29 June 2017
You are more upset than a guy who just couldn't find arguments in a place someone said there were arguments.
What were you even trying to say at this point other than misrepresenting what actually happened? Call me angry? Is that it? Is that what you open your reply with? Shouldn't i be angry at you for spending 9 posts pretending you have arguments and never coming forth with any?
No need to get pissy at TB calling you a pretender after demonstrating conclusively that you are one.
He could be wrong in his stance about the audience for the game, and people wouldn't care.
So you finally dropped all pretence and went full retard. Good for you. Good for everyone.
If he's talking about other people than the people he clearly identified, then he chose his words poorly.
"Clearly identified" yet you admitted to not being sure who they are.
♫ Stop flip-flop ♫
♫ Can't stop flip-flop ♫
I'm not sure what more of a "citation" you need than the experiences of the people actually playing the game here.
I don't know how to say it to you in a more polite way rather than your word doesn't mean shit to me at this point, as your first reaction to scrutiny is to weasel around like a bitch.
So bring in some hard data or get lost with your anecdotal tripe, thank you very much.
Yeah, you scraped the bottom to find a whopping 4 examples, all of them posted after the E3 update. Oh gee i wonder what caused it. Yeah, it's probably people started leaving right after a major content update and servers going online full-time, as is the norm with all videogames. Right? Was that your thought process?
Just how completely clueless can you be? And you wonder why i don't take you seriously.
I was pondering the idea of putting /sarcasm after the 3rd sentence in this paragraph because i wouldn't be surprised if it completely went over your head. That's how bad your run here was.
If you'd spend as much time playing AFPS games as you do shitposting on forums, and the rest of your ilk would follow the suit, the genre might have actually being viable in the eyes of big publishers. But nah, one big publisher throws you a massive bone, and your first reaction is to say it's not good enough and turn your back to them. Get over yourself because this is the last bone you're getting.
This is a fruitless discussion.
Yeah, that's what tends to happen when you say you have arguments but refuse to properly present them.
Don't let the door hit your petty, clueless weasel ass.
<< Comment #151 @ 07:56 CDT, 6 July 2017 >>
Siberia is a cold place.
If you've got something to say then say it.
Nobody appreciates your cringy cheerleader act.
I think you understood it. )
I understood that you've got nothing worthwhile to say.
Correct me if i'm wrong.
tl;dr: Angry Lenin gonna anger.
So i'm right.
No surprise there.
Isn't Zero4 the esports manager?
By pacmanpl + + + + : - Reply to #22
That's why he looked kinda iffy at stage ;=)
By FTY + - Reply to #22
I though he's the food manager.
By nsx0r + + +
let's all sign up from Antarctica VPN
By illiterate :
Well done Tim Trump. Well done ESL
By Insaccato |
this is even worse than loadouts & auto-hop
By asyyy |
Basically terrorism.
By Fejl(Folklore) + '
Why not Australia or Latin America wtf?
By tvorimir + :
What a joke, why not let those regions have their own qualifiers?
By gSTRUCTOR + + + '
Thanks to guys from EU and NA caring about blacked out communities. Appreciated.
By Gobotz + + + |
sync hates mexicans and kangaroos
He just fears noctis emo-mode.
By bR.Karma '
Id seems just as proficient at establishing contracts as it is at designing netcodes...
Such a sad start for competitive QC...
Its most likely esl's fault and not theirs read up the chatlog at #17
By phy1um + + '
My post from the Bethesda forums:
Sad to see. I don't know how much of a chance we had on 200 ping but even the possibility of seeing Australians represented at QCon was really exciting. We sent 5 people to America last year to compete, and I think they all played some really great games. Over the years a few Australians have represented us at various LANs, so to first be told to play on 200 ping then to have even that taken away is really disappointing and leaves a bad taste in our mouths. This is not the foot I wanted to get off to with Quake Champions.
And yeah there is no way they can call this a "world championship". Australia aside, there aren't that many people in Asia right?
By dirtbox : - Reply to #39
4 out 5 of the Australians who were in the tournaments last year made it to the prize money
By gSTRUCTOR + + + ' - Reply to #40
Chilean clan gHs were the only ones that were able to take a map from the otherwise flawless last Quakecon CTF champs.
How many bans did you receive?
By sofiene + ' - Reply to #39
from North Africa here :
It was and still hard for me to play in the European servers with high ping, but at least i did manage to be good at this game and deal with my ping, i expected to do the same with QC and actually do something in it, this is total crap...
I hope that this is not true, they always ignored us, australians, africans, asians, latin americans.....
Whatever, i cant even find the words to express what i had to say...
Edited by sofiene at 21:23 CDT, 17 June 2017
'Racism'?
By dirtbox :
We are back in!
By M1zzu + + :
the NA qualifiers are meant only for NA & CA based players
Wait, so California actually seceded? I missed that.
pseudo-edit: Oh, Canada, right. I forgot that's a thing.
Looks like the other countries are back in anyway
By SaturdayEveningPost + + | - Reply to #43
Back in? Thought I read the whole thread and didnt see that until you said it. Did they say on bethesda qualies will be for everyone?
ZeRo4 contacted me and told me that definitely everyone can try to qualify
Unfortunately I don't have permission to update the main news article
By Brancaleone + + + : - Reply to #42
I thought it meant Central America (mexico etc)
By McFly : - Reply to #57
Mexico and Central America is all part of North America.
By CAREEM + + + |
Austraila could be included. They have quality players. So sad to hear that and I feel sorry for AU.
We are back in...
By zlr + |
IMO Australia deserves at least 1 spot in this world championship event. We might only have a small community compared to EU and NA but we punch above our weight in terms of results in tournaments in both Q3 and QL over the years.
By p4r4 + + - Reply to #50
Why care about community when you have so much donut money that you can gift 1 million to quakecon from your pocket change.
I'd say two spots for the less important regions AU SAf SAm and Asia.
They have 1.000.000 bucks in prizes but cant afford some extra plane tickets and have more worldish representation and more hype in each one of those communities.
Such narrow minded, elitist, stupid decision.
They noobify the game more and more, yet act elitist and clueless on tournament aspects.
So cocky and douchy, all that leaves me happy is thinking theyre going to be the ones with the biggest problems because when this clusterfuck fails miserably, they will be unemployed.
Edited by gSTRUCTOR at 18:06 CDT, 17 June 2017
Why not a player from each of the other regions ? North Africa, South Africa ( yes cause those two are damn far from each other and cannot play vs each other, ever ) Australia and Latin America.
We all deserve a spot ! this is not fair at all......
By fnx-za + : - Reply to #50
same goes for South Africa. We have had some really good quakers consistently performing really well at big events in the past.
By CaptainTaichou + +
Stop complaining. At least you're protected from having to see the words her, pawn, nah, poop, bum, boob, and sex. :D
By obi + + + :
Many thanks and happy fraggin'!
By slm + +
those famous Mexican quakers!!
ehh...no need to watch qcon then :(((((((
By anal justice + |
What is the reasoning here? What a shitty thing to even suggest. Fucking scum
By psygib '
surprised noone posted this
Edited by psygib at 15:34 CDT, 17 June 2017
You can play with ~876 ping.
By V1R7U4L
Pure fear from Americans
By T1E + + :
And what if you get a qualifier spot for let's say South America, you gonna troll it up to 10000% again due to HEUHEUEHEEUEHEUH, Chile and Argentina crying around how unfair pings and w/e are..
Well that's another issue. It so happened that id chose to have one server in south america, picking BR as the location. Since last year that there's serious routing issues to BR servers, in all games, so that most people outside Brazil ping less to US servers and nobody gets less than 90 ping. And of course south americans being south americans means people can't manage to get along and group up to ask for another server location, to replace BR's.
Add to that the fact most Quake players in SA don't meet the PC requirements to run QC, and both explain why QC is already practically dead in SA. I get 15 minutes long queues in the BR server, increasing with each week.
By TUMULT + +
Let your all friends know that there is 1,000,000$ Quake Champions tournament and they can't play in it!
By sofiene + '
Wait, is this real ?? what the fuck ???? really ?? omg....
Plz someone tell me that this is a troll post....
it has been sorted out since, all those regions are allowed to play. op should really update the post
By Åke Vader + + ' - Reply to #84
Dirtbox couldn't update (site wouldn't let him) and also didn't have more of a source than a private discussion with Zero4 on the matter, so i waited for something more concrete.
Apparently have to settle for a Discord quote as news source for this one million dallaaahs tournament.
k :/
By _agu :
what a shame!
By T1E + + : - Reply to #77
NO CARABETITIAN QAKE CHEMP
By _agu : - Reply to #78
hu3 !
By Anonymous (86.238.233.30)
world for id = usa + eu
international community in mainstream media = usa + eu
By son1dow + + +
What about Antarcticans?
By ProT + + - Reply to #90
Unless they're in one of the claimed areas, they have to play on the respective servers according to the sovereignty of the region they're on. If they're on the unclaimed area, they can't participate.
That's discrimination against penguins.
QC doesn't run on Linux anyway.
By art-hoshi ' - Reply to #93
I know, I'm a Linux user. :|
By qmau + + + + '
Canada is part of North America
By dirtbox : - Reply to #100
mexico is part of north america
By ProT + + - Reply to #104
Won't be anymore after the wall is built.
By Tayski + |
For that much cash price players from those other regions could easily come to Europe or the US a few weeks prior to Quakecon to go through the qualifiers and bootcamp for the tournament.
This has been done many times in the past for other games like Painkiller, Quake 4 etc.
It's not like they're all gonna win it, so that's a bit of a gamble. :D
Is that not how professional gaming works anyway?
We're only talking about online qualifiers here. You want people to spend thousands of dollars just for the chance to qualify? I don't see many people doing that.
If you trust your skills or have sponsors you can do it. There are a lot of pro players from the previous quakes and from Overwatch on Quake Champions. I'm sure they can find sponsors. The type of players who go to compete at Quakecon from Australia are not the average players, are they?
I dunno how easy it is for them to get someone to pay for them to go. In the past, we donated to get Fraze to Dreamhack.
I think it is hard to trust your skills in a new game like QC.
I agree it's a big risk, and nobody is forced into anything here. Even dedicating dozens of hours of your time to prepare for an e-sport tournament is always a risk.
To be honest even if Australia sent its best players I don't see any of them finishing on the podium, and it's not me being a cunt but just looking at past results from previous quakes as well as other games.
Do you have anyone down there that will match the likes of toxic, cooller, rapha, cypher and all them lot?
I don't think so in QL. Who knows in QC.
The big problem here is probably just the lack of the ability to train against decent players.
Not just QL, but any of the major arena FPS be it Q3, Painkiller, Q4, QL, etc.
The top players who always win those duel tournament are either from Europe, Russia or USA.
We've never seen some Asians, Australians, Africans, or South Americans ever finishing in the top3.
And you're right, it's mostly because you don't have many people to practice with.
Edited by Tayski at 16:17 CDT, 1 July 2017
A lot of people coming through the NA qualifier (they don't have as stiff competition as in the EU qualifier, it seems) aren't going to end in the top 3 either. I don't think it would have hurt to give a few spots to other parts of the world, not just Australia.
But then how do you give those spots? You still need some kind of qualification process and how are you guys going to fight that out if you barely have a scene or players?
I mean this is the first ever Quake Champion events, I'm sure there will be others to which you guys can qualify.
I don't see why you couldn't have a qualification process in those regions, simply with less total spots available for that region, proportional to the number of interested players, for example.
For instance, Australia or South America, etc could contribute one or two players each. They'd just have a kind of qualifier in each of those regions that narrowed the applicants down to the one or two best.
If the scene isn't big enough to find a handful of guys to compete, at least a couple of which have a high level of skill, then that's a good indication the game will be dead here anyway.
As it stands, it is not a "world" tournament. But it will cover the majority of known players, so they could call it "almost world tournament". :D
I actually really don't see the purpose in defending this decision because it just looks like them admitting their game is dead in the water in certain parts of the world, which ain't wrong.
Anyway, I'm not particularly fussed. It is what it is.
Let's face it, nobody apart from Australian players really care about watching Australian players. Hell, I don't even care about watching the American players apart from a couple of guys like Rapha and such.
What kind of audience would Australia bring to the event in terms of streaming the event? And what kind of costs would it be for the event organisers in terms of logistics to cover travels for Australian players? And all of that for literally no one even placing in the top10 if even the top20 :p
I guess they should have called it the Quake Champion EU+US tournament, doesn't sound that great though lol
Yes, that's why you use proportional representation. I doubt the marginal cost for each additional player is much at all, and you're not talking about a ton of players. In any case, they won't be recouping their costs from streams. This is about promotion. It has nothing to do with where players place.
I don't know exact numbers, but you could have something like 12 from NA, 16 from EU, and 4 from everywhere else (maybe one from each of SA, Africa, Asia, and Oceania)---32 player tournament.
The benefit is the credibility they gain when they call it a "world" tournament, and it helps to promote the game in those regions too.
Do they even have servers in Africa and Asia?
I might be wrong but I don't think Quake was ever big in those regions (apart from SA maybe).
Yes, there's a server in Johannesburg and Singapore.
Quake may have been small in those areas; do they want it to stay that way?
Besides, we're talking about one player representing the whole region.
I'm having a hard time imagining that suddenly lots of players from Australia, Japan, China, Korea, Thailand, Nigeria, etc. will all get their hands on quake champions regardless of how much promotion is made.
So you want to not even try?
Why bother running servers outside of EU and NA then?
Why bother paying for all the advertising that is inevitably going to come out when the game is released?
A lot of people don't really know about Quake Champions yet, apart from a majority of previous quake games fans from EU and NA, so imagine how many people have heard of Quake Champions outside of EU and NA so far. Trying to gather pro players from those other regions is a bit pointless at this stage in terms of promoting the game.
Running servers outside of EU and NA isn't that big of a cost considering how much they're spending on other things such as running this "world" tournament and the early online advertising + updating the game and creating new maps, characters etc.
We don't know yet how much advertising will be done outside of the internet in those less active regions.
If you have budget to spend you might as well spend it in the right place, and I don't think focusing on Asia, Africa and Oceania has good odds in terms of returns at this stage if ever.
Let's wait until the game is finished and released, all bugs fixed, new contents created, and a good scene going in EU and NA.
People haven't heard of it there, so let's not promote it there?
It costs next to nothing, man. If there is a good reason for not allowing qualifiers in other regions, I haven't heard it.
They are already "gathering players from those other regions" by allowing them to enter qualifiers in other regions; the only thing they are not doing is giving them a fair chance to win.
Doom 2016 got advertising here, so why not QC? And that will cost a hell of a lot more than paying for one dude from Australia to compete.
I really don't see any justification for this decision.
By Fraze + + ' - Reply to #108
If you are from Australia like me that isnt that much money. Even if I was guaranteed to win, I wouldnt quit my job to go.
You're telling me 1 million American dollars isn't much money for an Australian?
Even if you split that between the 2 gametypes and the 3 places of the podium that's still a shit ton of cash for a single event over the course of a few weeks.
No one is asking you to quit your job to go.
I'm not going either, just because I have a normal job where I can make money and know that I have very little chance of winning such a tourmentent even with all the right preparation.
If it was one million dollars I'd quit, but the max I can win is 100k, because obviously that's 1 million dollar prize pool, and I can't even play in the sacrifice comp at all. I'd probably like last qcon get taxed roughly 40
Or so percent of my winnings somehow, and exchange rate ATM isn't that great so I'd probably get around 80k Aussie after tax if I win, my yearly wage is more than that. No I know, but if my annual leave wasn't approved on such short notice I would have to quit to go!
Realistically though, considering the players who signed up for this, your chances of winning would be very very little.
Not to take anything away from your achievement last year but players like cypher, cooller, toxic, etc. did not even enter the tournament and you didn't finish on the podium.
Better keep that job you have to be honest :)
ps: most of those pro guys don't have jobs
I choked last year I know you don't have to remind me XD
But on a serious note if my chances are very little to win even more of a reason that it's not realistic to go and boot camp and that for basically fuck all money like 10k. If I went for say 5 weeks or something like I did last year, I'd earn more just from my annual leave during the time than the prize itself, I never played this game for money because if I was into gaming for money I wouldn't be playing this game!
I'm just pointing out to you that your first statement is incorrect that you could easily go and boot camp and such, cause for one it's not that much money, and 2 it's such short notice! , and I think you basically verified that for me in this last comment! Hehe
Edited by Fraze at 01:08 CDT, 2 July 2017
I think the biggest factor here is that you're not a professional gamer in the sense that you have an actual job and don't play to make money.
If you didn't have a job and you had sponsors to cover your trip and expenses then I guess there wouldn't really be anything stopping you from going to the US for a few weeks for a boot camp + qualifier stage + actual tournament (if you make it that far) :)
Who out of those boys wouldn't have a job though?
I have a sponsor who has offered me cover my flights and accom already just to play in the byoc, but that doesn't change the fact my annual leave still needs to be approved for me to be able to go and working for a big mining conpany, sometimes you don't always get it approved when you want off short notice.
Wasn't the qualifying tournament just then? So you would need to be in the us from now til like 2 months til quake con, what sponsor in their right mind would pay a guy that much for a game that is far from proven to be able to withstand the test of time and has pretty limited number of players and viewers. It's not so bad if you are living in the us or Europe already because you can practice quite well already, but this whole discussion has been about people not living in those areas.
If you don't have a job you wouldn't be able to afford it yourself at all. I could afford it money wise, but like I said I'd have to quit my job to do that! :p
Are you telling me players like Cypher, Cooller, Toxic, Stermy, Rapha etc. all have jobs outside of gaming?
Also, I read in a separate ESR topic that flights and accommodation costs for qualified players are covered by the event, so your sponsor wouldn't have to pay a big chunk of the costs.
You're either a pro player or you're not :p
I don't know them personally, but I spoke to toxic at dhw13 and he said he worked for his dad as a builder or something along those lines. Rapha has said many times he was keen to go to uni, whether he did so I couldn't tell you. I'd be surprised if cypher had never worked before, unless his parents or something supported him when he wasn't competing and such, however I could be wrong on all of his like I said I don't know any of those guys personally.. So yeah I think most asides a very select few would have jobs, but it depends what country you live in doesn't it. Even if I won every quake live tournament over the last 5 years it wouldn't equate to much money where I live.
Yes but they are for European and American players only, so unless I qualified on 200 ping that doesn't include someone from here like me. So either I'd pay my own way or have a sponsor.
I am definitely not a pro player, but I also think there isn't any pro players in this game over the last few years, although what would I know about the inner workings of competitive gaming, I play the game cause it's fun not to make money and any comp I went to wasn't really because I wanted to, but because it was free/cheap travel and the Aussie community wanted me to go and represent them.
By Carpio + + ' - Reply to #144
Toxic works with his dad and brother. They are installing ventilation systems.
By gbmaster + + + + : - Reply to #133
it's not actually that much money after tax @ 40% / exchange rates / travel expenses.
the casters keep talking about it being 'a life changing amount of money' and constantly implying that it's a $1m prize for one person
It is life changing to some people, but if I won first prize I'd be back to Aus and work the next day or whatever, depends where you are from and your current situation i suppose, I mean in Aus if I won 2 million dollar lotto I couldn't retire the next day haha
there's no 1st world country where someone who wasn't approaching natural retirement age with a decent pension could retire on £50k
not saying it's not an insignificant amount of money though and could help people in many ways (clearing debt, deposit on property, traveling etc) but unless you're really confident of winning #1 every year and confident QC has financial longevity then imo it's not a good career choice atm
You could retire with 2 million easily. Even a mediocre investment of that money would return more than enough to live off, certainly more than you'd get on a pension. It just depends on the standard of living you're going for.
I'd keep working I think and retire when I was like 30-35 haha
Well, people work for the satisfaction of working at that point. But if you had the cash, you would never have to work a job you didn't want to.
Even 100k is life-changing (if you are not stupid) in my country.
By megaman3 + + + ' - Reply to #153
Consider who is attending, because they all have around 27 to 37, live by themselves and all live in first or second world countries. 60k is not much money in that situation.
For example 60k is not even enough to buy a decent apartment you would live in, in any big city of the world, so where players live.
On the positive side though people have not mentioned there's a second and a third prize, which are the Sacrifice tournament (winning both = about 100k) and having the reputation of winning the "1 million dollar Quake World Championship".
On the latter a smart man can use that to earn a lot more than 100k. Thresh and Fat did so, and by winning Quake tournaments that were way smaller than this one.
Edited by megaman3 at 11:25 CDT, 6 July 2017
100k is roughly 15 years of average salary here.
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Predicine's Liquid Biopsy Next-Generation Sequencing (NGS) Assay is Granted Breakthrough Device Designation by U.S. Food and Drug Administration
SILICON VALLEY, Calif., (September 20, 2022) – Predicine, Inc., a global molecular insights company committed to advancing precision medicine in oncology and infectious diseases, announced today that the U.S. Food and Drug Administration (FDA) granted Breakthrough Device designation to the PredicineCARE™ cfDNA Assay, a Next-Generation Sequencing (NGS) assay for tumor mutation profiling in cfDNA isolated from liquid biopsy samples from cancer patients.
The PredicineCARE cfDNA Assay is a comprehensive CLIA-validated assay that targets variants in 152+ genes, including single nucleotide variants (SNVs), insertions and deletions (indels), DNA re-arrangements (fusions), and copy number variations (CNVs) that are known to be clinically relevant. The PredicineCARE cfDNA Assay is being developed to identify biomarker-eligible cancer patients with select indications who may benefit from treatment with targeted therapy.
"We are excited about FDA's decision to grant Breakthrough Device designation to the PredicineCARE cfDNA Assay," said Shidong Jia, Predicine's Founder and Global CEO. "This is a significant milestone achievement in our journey to advancing liquid biopsy precision medicine and accelerating accessibility for cancer patients. We look forward to further developing the PredicineCARE cfDNA Assay as a potential companion diagnostic test under the Breakthrough Devices Program."
The FDA's Breakthrough Devices Program is a voluntary program for certain medical devices and device-led combination products that provide for more effective treatment or diagnosis of life-threatening or irreversibly debilitating diseases or conditions. The goal of the Breakthrough Devices Program is to provide patients and health care providers with timely access to these medical devices by speeding up their development, assessment, and review, while preserving the statutory standards for premarket approval, 510(k) clearance, and De Novo marketing authorization, consistent with the FDA's mission to protect and promote public health.[1]
Predicine is a global molecular insights company that is committed to advancing precision medicine in oncology, and infectious disease diagnostics. Predicine is developing proprietary cell-free DNA- and cell-free RNA-based liquid biopsy technologies to enable minimally invasive molecular diagnosis for early cancer detection, treatment selection, therapy response, minimal residual disease monitoring and disease progression. The Predicine portfolio includes blood-, urine-, and tissue-based NGS assays designed for global harmonized use in research, clinical investigation, and CDx development. Through its business operations in Silicon Valley, Houston, Chicago, Los Angeles, Boston, Shanghai, Berlin, Singapore, Beijing, Suzhou, and Harbin. Predicine is partnering and collaborating with leading biopharma companies, institutions, and governments to support personalized healthcare on a global scale. Further information is available on the company's website, http://www.predicine.com. Stay in touch on LinkedIn or @Predicine on Twitter. Reach out to us at media@predicine.com.
Predicine, Inc.
[1] https://www.fda.gov/medical-devices/how-study-and-market-your-device/breakthrough-devices-program#s1
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CRH to sell Europe Distribution business to Blackstone for £1.4bn
WCN Editorial Team 17 Jul 2019 EUROPE BUSINESS
Building materials group CRH has agreed to sell its building materials distribution arm Europe Distribution business to private equity funds managed by Blackstone for €1.64bn (£1.4bn).
Headquartered in the Netherlands, CRH Europe Distribution business (CRH ED) comprises entire General Builders Merchants business in Europe, including its Sanitary Heating and Plumbing business.
CRH ED is engaged in supplying building materials to builders, specialist contractors and DIY customers.
CRH said in a statement: "The Group's strategy of actively managing its portfolio for higher growth, more sustainable returns and efficiently allocating capital to maximise shareholder value has resulted in its decision to divest of the Business at an attractive valuation."
The divestment, which follows a comprehensive strategic review of the Business over the last several months, is a part of CRH's effort to maximise value for shareholders and create a simpler and more focused business.
CRH CEO Albert Manifold said: "The transaction announced today demonstrates the continued execution of CRH's strategy of creating value for our shareholders through active portfolio management, the efficient allocation of capital and creating a simpler and more focused Group going forward.
"We wish our colleagues in Europe Distribution every success as they enter this new phase of their development."
The proceeds from the sale will be used by CRH for general corporate purposes, acquisitions and capital returns to shareholders through ongoing share buyback programme.
Subject to the customary social procedures and approval by the relevant antitrust authorities, the deal is scheduled to be completed in the fourth quarter of 2019.
Blackstone private equity European head Lionel Assant said: "We are delighted to invest in CRH ED. With its leading market position and strong management team it is well positioned to continue growing both organically and through M&A."
Blackstone senior managing director Juergen Pinker said: "We are pleased to undertake this transaction and to back CRH ED in the next stage of its development, as we look to capitalize on its success."
Image: CRH signed deal to sell Europe Distribution business for £1.4bn. Photo: courtesy of rawpixel from Pixabay.
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It will start beeping at you again if it's not down to temperature within a few hours. And the only way you know if the fan inside the freezer is running is to open the freezer door. So let it continue on running since you know it's running and see what happens.
A martin media production where we try to get something from the fridge... But the tempature alarm sure is scary!
250 Answers. Re: Maytag fridge alarm light flashing.
TWO ALARM SETTINGS: High and Low Temperature Manually Set Alarms. TEMPERATURE RANGE: -58 to 158°F (-50 to 70°C) with an Accuracy of +/- 2°F. Ship from American.THREE MOUNTING OPTIONS: Magnet, Key Hole or Flip Down Stand.
The Temp Alarm System Is Designed To Alert You If The Freezer Or Refrigerator Temperatures Exceed Normal Operating Temperatures Due To A Power Outage Or Other Event.
Fridge is working fine, except after an hour the temperature alarm started beeping the refrigerator side is flashing between 38 and 52 and the freezer side is flashing between 0 and 17 degrees. Can anybody recommend a fix?


With hot, humid summers and snowy winters, one of the best things a homeowner can do is hire professional lawn care service in the greater Portland Maine area. Unfortunately, many yard maintenance service options only offer mowing or other basic landscaping choices. When you need comprehensive lawn care solutions, there's one company that can handle it all for less.
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Trouble in mind is a public domain song* that has been recorded by hundreds of artists (from Janis Joplin to Johnny Cash). We played it with our bluegrass band years ago and thought it would be fun to do a more bluesy version now that BiaB has given us such a fine array of bands We chose a minimalist arrangement with a bit of a mashup regarding RT and RD choices. Like so many of these traditional songs many of the verse variations are a bit vague and rhyme schemes are sketchy but we tried to select some verses (of the many) that hung together somewhat.
As always we appreciate your time to listen and we appreciate any and all comments.
Shine in my back door someday.
Gonna take me a rockin' chair.
I'll rock on away from here.
I won't be blue always.
While Janice is singing "trouble in mind" I'm singing "A new bass I've found" -- Wow, that 2435 New Orleans Shuffle bass really rocks along. Shamelessly stealing your bass player man, offered him $5 more a gig and a six pack of beer to take home.
And the song, great performance, arrangement, mix and production. Enjoyed this one. Excellent at every level.
What a song to start my week, I hope it is prophetic as I sure need "that wind that's gonna come" in about 3 hours . I need sumpin' for the coming weeks for sure.
Janice soon settled into her normal exquisite vocals at every listen.
Your version stands up proud with Nina Simone's and Johnny Cash's versions and is better than Janis Joplin's version IMHO.
A good way to spend 2.18.
An excellent version and "the band" played good!
I think I'd borrow the piano player as well.
All sounds great and agree with Charlie it's excellent at every level.
Thanks Charlie! With our original arrangement Janice was going to play rhythm mandolin and I was going to dust off the bass fiddle and play a walking line. But the acoustic solo sw RTs were a bit too country for the sound we wanted; however, I stumbled into the NO guitar and bass and it changed the whole approach to the song. Yep, it's a great bass RT and even has a slight tuba feel. And with BiaB you can have the bass man on the cheap and he'll always be on time.
great band and great singer!
Janice, your vocal-only introduction is brilliant. There's nothing quite like launching straight into vocals to grab attention. VERY impressive.
Bud, the mix is magnificent, perfect. I can't imagine any better framework than the instruments you used. You really know how to get the best out of Realtracks.
In a phrase... exceptional in every way!
Thanks Alyn and we hope things are going well with you. FWIW, I don't hear the pop on trouble but I have very old and worn out ears I use a breath controller on Janice's vocals to reduce (not eliminate) the breath intake before lines so I'll check to see if it is clipping the first nanosecond of the word. Dunno...but glad that you liked it!
I wish I had never mentioned it now because at each play it gets better! weird or what but now it is ok. Maybe my ears need looking at Although I have noticed that the vol control on my computer was at 100% when I normally have it at 75 or less.
Anyway still an excellent version.
No need to wish that at all! We are always open to mix comments. I backed off on the breath controller and up the gain of the track 2db and uploaded the new version. Thanks!
This is quite exquisite Bud and Janice. What else to say?
The acapella intro really highlights the quality of Janice's voice!
Apologies if all my comments sound the same for your songs, but I have a limited vocabulary in terms of superlatives. I use my whole stash on every song!
Bud, I hope you already know how highly I esteem the many talents you bring to all of your projects! Your skill in mixing, RT choices, song research, lyric writing etc etc have been proven over and over again!
Congratulations to both of you on yet another piece of well-produced ear candy!
Welcome to N'awlins! Janice your voice really rocks this style and Bud another great production.
A wonderful listen on a September afternoon!
Thanks Peter and I appreciate you mentioning the piano. I spent a fair amount of time trying to get the rhythm and solo RT's working well together.
You guys must have a factory. You just keep knocking these great song out.
I knew coming out the gate I couldn't afford THAT piano player! Bass players are plentiful but when you find that special pianist, you know there's also a special price to get em..... I'm too old to help lugging a piano around anyway.
Don't thank me, I thank both of you for that song, which is my anthem now! I play it every morning as I have linked to that soundcloud page!
Anyway I'm gonna rock away from this thread!!
Man! I could listen to that opening over and over and over!
In fact, I did. Heaven.
I cannot imagine a better treatment for this song. Nice work, Bud - truly. You need to get a YouTube video out there, so that when people search for this song by others, they find yours, too. It ought to become the standard for "how to do this one".
Thanks Guenter. We always look forward to your comments.


You are here: Home > Who Can Apply?
Please read all of the guidelines below to ensure you are eligible before submitting your application.
Each year, 12 Points Festival features 12 bands or solo performers from 12 different European countries. 12 Points Festival is open to European bands and solo artists active in jazz and other improvisation led idioms who meet the following criteria.
If you are a non-European musician, currently living in Europe, you are eligible to apply. If you are a European musician currently living outside Europe, you are eligible to apply. If you are a non-European musician living outside Europe you are NOT eligible to apply.
12 Points has been developed as a showcase festival for emerging practitioners and artists in the early stages of their performance career, typically in the mid 20s to early 30s cohort. This is an aspiration of 12 Points, and it is not our intention to enforce a rigid age restriction. For example, we would not reject an application from a very worthy younger group or soloist, nor would we do so for an applicant from an artist(s) who had come to artistic maturity at a later time in life. Equally, an ensemble application would not be rejected on the grounds that one particular member was significantly older than his/her bandmates. However, if it was the case that the majority of band members exceeded the mid 20s/early 30s age profile, it is likely that such an application would not be considered. Be aware that you will be required to provide information on the age of all band members in the online submission.
12 Points is open to working ensembles and individual performers with a solo repertoire. A typical successful application will be one that has already established itself in the country where it is based, has made professional standard recordings, performed at domestic festivals and venues and been reported in national press. However, this is a guideline only - in the past the festival has presented artists who are already well established internationally and signed to major labels and equally we have presented artists who have yet to release a debut CD or complete formal studies. However, in all cases successful applicants were able to demonstrate the highest levels of commitment, ambition and focus. Strong individual playing, originality in approach, a cohesive group sound, high standards of performance and composition and the ability to engage and communicate with an audience are prerequisites.
12 Points is committed to showcasing bands and solo performers who have shown dedication and focus in developing their music. Ad hoc groupings or solo projects that have been put together solely for the purpose of this application will be quickly identified and rejected in the short listing process.
In the festival archive you can find information on all the artists who have previously performed in 12 Points, which may help you in understanding the aesthetic principles that guide our festival. You will see there is no stylistic bias at work. Lyrical piano trios, pop deconstructions, virtuoso soloists, groovy organ trios, noise bands and free improvisers have all featured in previous editions. Every year we try to give a picture of what is happening in Europe, and it is our view that stylistic diversity is an important part of the vitality of jazz today. It is more important to us that we identify young artists who are playing their music with passion, conviction and ambition, who adhere to the creative spirit of jazz, irrespective of style and genre considerations.
The logistical and financial model of 12 Points makes it unlikely that large ensembles will be considered, except in exceptional circumstances. In previous editions, average ensemble sizes have been trio/quartet, though on rare occasions we have presented up to septet, and as previously stated, we are always interested to hear from artists who perform in solo. Mobility and setup should also be a consideration; ideally you will not require large amounts of specialist equipment or have expensive overweight requirements.
You can submit applications for more than one project, provided you feel they all meet the artistic criteria set out above. This can apply if you are the bandleader of more than one project, if you have both a band and solo project, or if you are a member of a band in which another individual is submitting the application. However, please bear in mind that we receive many applications, (over 300 for the 2011 edition) and your chances of appearing at 12 Points will be best served by only submitting for those projects that have a realistic chance of meeting the rigorous selection criteria.
We view 12 Points as a mezzanine festival, i.e. one that acts as a platform for emerging bands to gain a foothold in the wider European venue and festival circuit. Bands can therefore only appear at the festival once. If you are a band that has previously appeared at 12 Points, you are not eligible to apply. However, if you are an individual musician who has previously appeared at 12 Points, but is now applying with a different project, your application will be considered. If you are applying with a project that was previously unsuccessful and wish to reapply, your application will be considered.
There is no hierarchy at 12 Points and all artists participate on equal terms. 12 Points will cover your flight, hotel, local transport and catering requirements for the duration of your stay. The festival lasts four days and we encourage artists to stay for the duration so you can exploit the opportunity to make lasting connections with other young musicians from across Europe.
To help you move through the online submission quickly and efficiently, here is a list of the information you will need to submit.
We do ask for a lot of detail, and this is necessary as often the artists who are applying are not well known outside the cities in which they are based, so we need this information to build a good picture of who we are considering. You are also helping us build a good statistical picture of what are the trends among young European musicians in important areas like gender, education and mobility. All information is treated in the strictest confidence, in accordance with best practice in data protection.
Detailed information on all band members, including their age, instrument(s), academic and performance background.
A YouTube account in order to view links to the bands work.


The City of Red Wing owns and operates the largest marina in Red Wing. Ole Miss Marina is a two-site, 284 slip marina located at Bay Point and Colvill Parks in Red Wing.
Find the admission rates, birthday party packages, swimming lessons information and more for the Red Wing Water Park.