Matt Furie says his "peaceful frog-dude" was co-opted in a poster featuring Pepe alongside InfoWars founder Alex Jones, President Donald Trump, Milo Yiannopoulos and others.
Furie says he created Pepe as a "peaceful frog-dude" at the beginning of the century with the catchphrase "Feels good man." His anthropomorphic creation then became a meme on the internet, and was tweeted by Katy Perry, Nicki Minaj and Buzzfeed, among others.
"But beginning in 2015, various fringe groups connected with the alt-right attempted to co-opt Pepe by mixing images of Pepe with images of hate, including white supremacist language and symbols, Nazi symbols, and other offensive imagery," states the complaint lodged in court Monday. "Furie has worked hard to counteract that negative image of Pepe, including collaborating with the Anti-Defamation League on the #SavePepe campaign to restore Pepe as a character representing peace, togetherness, and fun."
Should InfoWars attempt to argue fair use, the case could become provocative. Copyright law isn't supposed to make value judgments. (See for example the time that Adolf Hitler's "Mein Kampf" triggered a lawsuit.) But then again, the purpose and character of use as well as the effect of the use on the potential market are two of the four factors comprising a potential fair use.
In this case, Furie says he has licensed intellectual property rights for card games and stuffed dolls. Further exploration of the impact of political co-opting could be forthcoming. The lawsuit also notes that Donald Trump Jr. posted an image of Pepe in a modified version of a movie poster for the film "The Expendables" labeled "The Deplorables."


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The MemberMouse Google login extension will allow your customers to create a new membership using their Google login credentials.
NOTE: The process for creating a Google App has changed considerably since this article was last edited. We are working on an update to the article that accounts for the many changes to the UI on the Google Developer's pages.
First, you need to create a project. To access the Google developers page, visit https://console.developers.google.com/project. If you have previously created Google applications, you will see them here.
Once you click 'Create' then you will be taken to the Google APIs dashboard for your project.
By default, your project will already be enabled using the Google+ API.
Email Address: This is the address of the gmail account you are using,.
Product name shown to users: Usually this is your website name. This is what Google will list on the access request for the user to confirm.
Click 'Continue'. Section 4 will load with your Client ID. Click 'Done'.
You will be taken back to the Credentials section of your dashboard. Click the pencil icon next to the project you just created. That will take you to the configuration screen with all the details you need to configure Google+ in MemberMouse.
Open up a new tab on your web browser, and move to configuring the Google Login Extension.
Next, click on the Extensions tab and from the following page, click on the Google logo.
Client ID - From your Google project dashboard.
App Secret - From your Google project dashboard.
Allow Signups? - If you want to allow new customers to sign up using their Google login credentials, then click this box. Otherwise, members will only be able to login using their Google credentials, but not sign up for a new membership.
Membership Level - Customers can only signup for a free membership level when they are using their Google login credentials. Once they are members, they can purchase a paid membership. You need to select the default free membership you would like customers to join when using Google.
Callback URL: - This is the URL that is used in the Google project in the steps above.
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Home Croatia Split
March 29 – April 28, 2016 (Spring shoulder season)
Length of stay: 30 days
Split is the second-largest city in Croatia and sits squarely in the center of the Dalmatian coast on the shores of the Adriatic. The city sprang from the bones of a massive ancient Roman palace. To visit the palace today, it doesn't make sense to ask where in the Old Town it is – it essentially is the Old Town. The area has a storied history and was fought over for millennia, most recently during the breakup of Yugoslavia and the Croatian War of Independence, the pain of which is still quite fresh to many. Split has embraced its new tourist appeal and related industries, like its reinvigorated enthusiasm for winemaking. From west to east, the city reads as a time capsule: ancient ruins, cobbled streets between old Mediterranean apartments, imposing Communist-era housing blocks, and finally modern malls and sprawling beach-front resorts. And yet, just a bit further, we found what felt like an undiscovered paradise all to ourselves.
Where we stayed · What we did · Food & Drink · Stuff of interest · What we learned
This stay was our first truly impressive Airbnb↗, and let us know our strategy of booking further in advance was paying off. The apartment was well outside the city center, in the nearby suburb of Podstrana. We were drawn to the listing because it promised a commanding view at a reasonable price. It was on the top floor of a building high on the hillside, overlooking the water to the west and the next-nearest town of Stobreč. In Croatia, it is customary for parents to build multi-story homes to provide a place for their children to raise their own families, bringing two or three generations together under the same roof. Our hosts had one daughter who was soon moving overseas for work, so they rented out the extra space to travelers like ourselves. Living in the same building and all, we ran into them often, but we never felt like we lacked privacy as each apartment had its own lock and they gave us plenty of space.
Since it was designed for an entire family, our apartment had more space than we knew what to do with. There were two large bedrooms, two bathrooms, an ample living room and kitchen, and three (!) separate decks to enjoy the views. We made good use of the outdoors, and watching the sun set from our balcony with a glass of wine in hand was a highlight of our stay.
One of the more curious features was the inclusion of storm shutters on every window, which blocked out the sun when closed and turned the apartment into a fortress. Apparently, such precautions are necessary to protect against the bura↗. Fortunately we had only a few mildly breezy days and none of the car-flipping or roof-tile-removing that the local wind is famous for in winter. We also had our first experience with a shower where the curtain or door didn't actually surround all the places water would reach. The further east we went, the more open the showers became. Croatia seems to fall in the middle of the spectrum – some type of barrier is still expected, but it didn't have to be fully functional.
Once we climbed down from our lofty hillside perch, we found ourselves in what was charitably "town." The lone coastal rode broke frequently into winding, uphill jaunts littered with nearly-identical three-story homes. There was almost no flat land at sea level – the other side of the street was just feet from the shore. The main thoroughfare featured some small grocery stores, a bakery, and a couple of sandwich stands popular with the locals. There was also a pharmacy and a drug store, for medications and hygiene products respectively. Everything else, from the high-rise hotels to the expensive seaside restaurants, remained shuttered and dormant before the summer rush.
Getting into the city was easy, with frequent buses in both directions. Various companies plied the route for differing fares, from 13-17 kuna per person. The ride was lengthy, though, at about 25 minutes to the Old Town (barring complications due to traffic). Walking was out of the question. There were few sidewalks; some major roads simply had well-worn shoulders that seemed to be the de facto avenue for pedestrian traffic. We managed trips about town and to Stobreč, plus one ill-advised trek to City Center One, a towering hangar of a mall almost 5 km of highway-side marching away. This was one stay where we were glad for affordable transit.
The vicinity of our apartment in Podstrana was ideal for privacy, sunsets, and long walks on the beach. We had easy access to sites in either direction, but mostly we were happy with the quiet and low-key vibe of our neighborhood. Most days, we would get a bit of work done – maybe have a bite to eat – and at some point ramble down the incline to the pebbly and (mostly) abandoned beach. We could walk the entire afternoon and not reach an "end" to it. The journey was varied and interesting; some segments in woodlands, some overlapping the paved grounds of seaside resorts, and some weaving around fancy yachts at a popular harbor. The rocks, urchins, and not-yet-summer temps precluded any chance of swimming, but didn't deter us from spending a lot of time very near the water. We got the impression that summer would not be as much to our tastes, both in temperature and in the quality of clientele that would soon be swarming our beloved personal paradise.
Our first forays in the area naturally began in the Old Town centered around Diocletian's Palace. The narrow, cobbled streets are inside what used to be the main floor of the Palace, while underneath the modern town are the well-crafted (and recently exhumed) basements. For a few dollars, we explored the arched rooms and domed tunnels where supplies would have been kept and servants carried out much of the work. Over the centuries, the cavernous space made a tempting dumping ground for trash and sewage, and today, some portions have yet to be excavated as the debris prevents the city above from caving in. It was mind-blowing for us to examine the stones and think about how they'd been holding up these roofs since around the year 300. There's a saying that Americans think 100 years is a long time, while Europeans think 100 miles is a long way; well here, even European time pales. These timescales are more analogous to the rises and falls of religions than nation-states. The streets above were no less impressive, polished smooth (even slippery) by generations of wayfarers and passersby.
The Legend of Brač Marble
The marble that makes up the palace is from the nearby island of Brač, whose white stones have also contributed to great architecture throughout Croatia and Europe. Locals also proudly and repeatedly claim that the White House is made of the stuff. Considering the fledgling and not-yet-wealthy United States built the presidential mansion not from marble sourced from the other side of the planet, but much more practically of whitewashed sandstone from nearby Virginia, the claim seems apocryphal. After a bit of digging, it turns out that the stone may have been used in renovations in 1902, 110 years after the building was constructed, and that this factoid has been puffed up over the years.
Hungry for some hiking, we bussed about half an hour south to Omiš, where Starigrad Fortress sits high atop a ridge overlooking the small town. The trail was steep and rocky, looser than we were used to, and with few switchbacks to moderate the grade. At one point we lost the trail and found ourselves dead in the center of a thicket of brambles. Do we retreat, or push forward? We pushed forward, and popped out onto the ridgeline trail that soared over the thin strip of houses below. Behind us, the river cut a deep canyon. To our right, the outflow interacted with the sandbar and sea to form swirling turquoise vortices. A peregrine falcon dove in front of us, falling from eye-level to distant speck with impossible speed. We turned toward the castle, which from this angle resembled the bow of a ship. The entrance had infrastructure for selling tickets, but there was nobody around for miles to take our money. We walked right in and clambered in and on every structure. Sitting on the ramparts, looking down on the village below, we were the happiest we'd could remember being. We played generals and discussed the tactical advantage of our position, agreeing with the builders that it was a good place for a fortress. Many centuries ago, locals kept attack boats upriver, hidden from the sightlines of passing vessels, and used the castle as a lookout. If an enemy or ripe target got close, they sprang the trap. Once we made our way off the hill, we looked back and were astounded to see that the castle was almost undetectable from ground level. There wasn't much happening in Omiš on that April afternoon, but we did find the church of St. Michael to be especially photogenic, the facade scattered with purple flowers growing right out of the masonry.
The glistening and gleaming coast of Croatia might be less memorable if not for the beautiful islands scattered across the horizons. We hitched a ride on a convenient and comfortable ferry to Hvar, one of the most popular islands for jet-setters of the "rich and famous" variety. During the summer, anyway. When we got there, the place was essentially deserted, the only activity coming from the touristy rim which buzzed with restaurants and beach-front bars being repainted and renovated for the tourist season, oblivious to the small-fry gawkers in their midst. We stayed at a tiny mother-in-law apartment we found on Airbnb that had a slightly-obstructed view of the bay outside Hvar Town. Peeking into churches and wandering through the staired streets of the town, we ended up at the Španjola Fortress, one of our favorite castles to date. It checked all the boxes – soaring battlements, robust cannons, damp and dingy dungeons, and a breathtaking view of its charge, the picturesque town and its shimmering sapphire harbor.
Of course, we couldn't leave Split without stopping in some castles and runs. Er, some more castles and ruins. Our host was gracious enough to offer us a ride to Klis Fortress and the nearby Roman ruins at Solin. The fortress was a curiosity until recently, when it was used as (one of the many local) filming locations for the HBO series Game of Thrones. We were oblivious to the phenomenon before arriving in Croatia, but we picked up an HBO NOW sub to catch up and found ourselves enthralled. (Even still, the book was much better than the movie show, and the real deal better yet.) Klis has clearly taken advantage of their new-found fame with higher admission fees and fantasy-themed exhibits, but at least the additional revenue is being applied to repairs and restorations. In the plains below the fortification are the ruins of Salona/Solin. It was intriguing to see the ancient archways and the footprint of a grand amphitheater butting up against an everyday neighborhood. Solin, like the rest of Split, shows that history isn't confined to museums and permeates the present; life has grown up, around, and on top of what came before. In the ruined theater, we climbed right down to center stage and imagined ancient plays and gladiatorial battles. Maybe a thousand years from now, folks will climb around the ruins of our stadiums and imagine dramatic matches by Hajduk Split↗.
Perhaps the most magical experience we had during our stay in Spit was to visit Plitvička jezera (Plitvice Lakes National Park), a stunning and ever-evolving maze of waterfalls somewhere between Split and the nation's capital of Zagreb. The park was beyond magical and far too grand for a one-paragraph summary. Read more about it here↗.
We came to Croatia expecting a bounty of seafood, but ultimately the theme of our stay in Split was top-notch vegetables. Our hosts welcomed us with a regional specialty called soparnik, a savory flat pastry filled with swiss chard and topped with an obscene amount of garlic. Shortly thereafter, we discovered ajvar, which quickly rocketed up our all-time favorite foods list. A slurry of red peppers, eggplant, garlic and more, it is sometimes called "vegetable caviar." We adored it, especially the more piquant blends, and it wound up on everything from toast and pretzels to eggs and sandwiches.
With few external dining options available, we ate at home a lot, and found a lot of easy meals using the local frozen vegetables. For whatever reason, the Ledo-brand Mediterranean mix blew away anything we've had before or since. Full of peppers, tomatoes, zucchini, and even black olives (something we normally despise), they stood up as an independent side or powered tons of easy, flavorful veggie pasta dinners.
That's not to say that Croatia was devoid of meat. The fish we tried was delicious and affordable. Under recommendation of a fellow traveler, we made sure to try ćevapi from Kantun Paulina, a tiny take-away place on the edge of the Old Town. A standard sandwich features the little tubed meats stuffed into a pita and smothered in ajvar and diced onions. One was large enough for us to share as a near-complete meal. The ćevapi themselves are skinless sausages and basically tasted like a cross between breakfast sausage and ground beef (or in other words, heaven).
Another snack that worked its way under our skin was peanut crisps, puffy little bites that were surprisingly addictive. Hrusk Flips were our preferred brand.
Oven-safe pot or pan big enough to hold everything
Quality chef's knife
Tomato sauce (about 250 g)
Dalmatian (or Italian) seasoning
Thanks to Pixar, this has become one of the most famous vegetarian meals in existence. Though the ingredient list seems intimidating at first glance, after the lengthy prep is complete, this is a super simple, fire-and-forget meal.
Preheat oven to 190°C.
Cut eggplant, zucchini, squash, and pepper into thin slices. A mandoline would help, but by hand, this is tedious work!
Coat the bottom of the pan in tomato sauce, about 1/3 inch deep. Add one small onion (diced), a couple cloves of garlic (also diced), and a generous splash of olive oil. Throw in a few hearty pinches of herbs – Italian seasoning is good, but when in Dalmatia, I use the local blend. Also salt and pepper, of course.
Arrange the slices of vegetable in the pan in a circle, working from the outer edge to the middle, and alternating and overlapping the slices as you go. Drizzle some olive oil on top, and season with another dusting of Dalmation seasoning, salt, and pepper.
Bake approximately 45 minutes. It's ready when the veggies are tender. Pay close attention to the squash, which should be sweet and squishy and not grainy, and the zucchini, which should be right on the line between "still just a tiny bit crunchy" and completely soft. Serve alone or over rice.
Our local grocery stores were Diskont Mihanović, Ribola, and Tommy, in order from closest (right down the hill from us) to furthest away (10 minutes' walk up the road). Diskont Mihanović, contrary to its name, was generally the most expensive and offered the least selection, so we usually passed it up for the other two. Ribola, the middle child, won in the seafood category. It had a dedicated counter in front that offered fresh and varied catches daily at reasonable prices. Tommy usually had the best prices for groceries, the best produce, and the best selection. They even sold some utensils and home goods, like the lightweight and travel-friendly cutting board we picked up and have used ever since. They also had an adjacent bakery, but we preferred the independent baker we walked past on the way home.
One of the things we were most looking forward to about Croatia was sampling the wine. We'd heard good things, but it never seems to find its way to the US, so this was our chance. Most famous is Plavac Mali, a tannic, jammy red wine once believed to be an ancestor of Zinfandel, but now known to be a crossbreed between Zin and Dobričić. Babić is even darker on average, but wasn't as well represented. We even enjoyed a few whites, curiously-named varietals like Malvazija, Debit, and Pošip. We saw the most range with Plavac Mali, from some pretty disheartening lows (one awful specimen was sealed with a bottle cap) to standouts like Zlatan Otok and Ivan Dolac that easily held up against Europe's heavy hitters. While we splurged a bit here and there, we usually spent $5 or less per bottle. For a more consistent quality at a great value price, we were surprisedly pleased with Macedonian wine. Ezimit aged theirs in amphorae, producing a mineraly and robust product that often ended up on our dinner table. Wine frequently came in 1-liter bottles, the only place we've been where this was more common than 750 ml. Going back to the usual size after our stay was kind of a let-down!
Speaking of big containers sizes, Croatian beer had some doozies. The local macrobrews came in 1 L, even 2 L plastic jugs. Maybe this was a way to compensate for the relatively expensive bottle deposit scheme in the country, maybe they were just making up for questionable quality with generous quantity. In any case, more was not necessarily better, and the biggest brands (Karlovačko and Ožujsko) were among the worst we've had in Europe. Craft beer was rare, though we did find one decent microbrewer by the name of Zmajska Pivovara in a couple of shops. Probably the best beer we could find with any regularity was Tomislav, which was darker, more flavorful, and 7.3% ABV (which helped us forget how bad all the beers tasted).
Quiet & Deserted
Local Liquor is Rakija
Photogenic Sunsets
Checkered Flag
Tele2 was our mobile provider↗. Two SIMs with 3 gigs of data each were about $15.
Croatia apparently never got the memo to move back on the bus to make room for new passengers. Someone would stop mid-ship, then the space in front of them grew more and more crowded until passengers were turned away. Meanwhile, the entire back of the bus would remain unused. If you get on a crowded bus in Croatia and have the stamina to do so, push through the mob and you will likely find a bevy of seats to choose from.
While we were in town, our only transit options were walking or taking the bus. As with many spots in Eastern Europe, local cabs have a reputation for not treating foreigners fairly. Shortly after we left though, Uber↗ started serving the area, so next time we will have more options.
Croatia was yet another spot where correct change was expected to the point of indignation. Bills were not a problem, but if a cashier had to dig into their stockpile of coins, we were treated like delinquents or ne'er-do-wells.
The local soccer club, Hajduk Split, commands a level of fandom that is truly impressive. Their logo was everywhere – stickers, jerseys, candy bar promotions, painted in murals, painted in graffiti. With more lax laws about sponsorships and childhood innocence, the team was even free to license official an official beer, wine, and hard liquor. Our host mentioned that if we ever got into any kind of trouble, the phrase "volim [I love] Hadjuk" would probably get us out of it and possibly endear us to whoever was doing the hassling.
The shoulder season in Croatia is an ideal time for introverts. We adored the stunning natural beauty in almost complete seclusion. Some places were not yet on their full schedules, others weren't open at all, but the few that remained were of course the authentic spots the locals preferred. It was a more intimate and personal stay than most, and made us feel like this place was ours and ours alone.


text:
Q: No suitable HttpMessageConverter found for response type - Custom RestTemplate First, sorry for possible duplicate. I found some questions regarding to similar problems. However, I still can't figure out what's wrong in my specific case.
So, example json from server:
[
  {
    "_id": "55f9690f30ef6f210e2dc3a5",
    "ID": "74c4bf82-9f78-4df5-b9d7-6547e2a55eaa",
    "Name": "myLand, Saarbrücken",
    "__v": 0,
    "Shops": [
      {
        "ID": "b8eacee1-b2c6-48aa-ac6f-2e7fbe3a5d68",
        "Name": "ARA",
        "_id": "55f9690f30ef6f210e2dc3a6",
        "News": [
          {
            "ID": "d79b7f51-7d5c-4bd6-9321-e40c6e93788c",
            "ValidFrom": "2015-01-08T00:00:00",
            "ValidTo": "2015-09-30T00:00:00",
            "_id": "55f9690f30ef6f210e2dc3a7",
            "Texts": [
              {
                "ID": "TITLE",
                "Value": "11. Wochenspiegel Firmenlauf",
                "_id": "55f9690f30ef6f210e2dc3a9"
              },
              {
                "ID": "BODY",
                "Value": "Wir gratulieren zur ersten und gleich sehr erfolgreichen Teilnahme am 11.Wochenspiegel Firmenlauf in Dillingen,\r\nunsere Teams vom "Outlet center Wadgassen" haben ihren Lauf mit tollen Zeiten abgeschlossen und hatten trotz\r\nhohen Temperaturen einen wunderbaren Tag – wie man sehen kann. Wir freuen uns schon jetzt auf nächstes Jahr!",
                "_id": "55f9690f30ef6f210e2dc3a8"
              }
            ]
          }
        ],
        "Texts": [
          {
            "ID": "DESCRIPTION",
            "Value": "Mit Tradition in die Zukunft Seit sechs Jahrzehnten steht ara für vielfältige Schuhmode erstklassiger Qualität,",
            "_id": "55f9690f30ef6f210e2dc3aa"
          }
        ]
      }
    ]
  }
]

I generated class called Mall (and all subclasses for the rest of data structure):
public class Mall
{

    private String Id;
    private String ID;
    private String Name;
    private int V;
    private List<Shop> Shops = new ArrayList<Shop>();
    private Map<String, Object> additionalProperties = new HashMap<String, Object>();

    /**
     * @return The Id
     */
    public String getId()
    {
        return Id;
    }

    /**
     * @param Id The _id
     */
    public void setId(String Id)
    {
        this.Id = Id;
    }

    /**
     * @return The ID
     */
    public String getID()
    {
        return ID;
    }

    /**
     * @param ID The ID
     */
    public void setID(String ID)
    {
        this.ID = ID;
    }

    /**
     * @return The Name
     */
    public String getName()
    {
        return Name;
    }

    /**
     * @param Name The Name
     */
    public void setName(String Name)
    {
        this.Name = Name;
    }

    /**
     * @return The V
     */
    public int getV()
    {
        return V;
    }

    /**
     * @param V The __v
     */
    public void setV(int V)
    {
        this.V = V;
    }

    /**
     * @return The Shops
     */
    public List<Shop> getShops()
    {
        return Shops;
    }

    /**
     * @param Shops The Shops
     */
    public void setShops(List<Shop> Shops)
    {
        this.Shops = Shops;
    }

    public Map<String, Object> getAdditionalProperties()
    {
        return this.additionalProperties;
    }

    public void setAdditionalProperty(String name, Object value)
    {
        this.additionalProperties.put(name, value);
    }

}

Server returns conent-type text/plain. To modify content type, I wrote simple extend class:
public class RestTemplateJSON extends RestTemplate
{

    @Override
    protected <T> T doExecute(URI url, HttpMethod method, RequestCallback requestCallback,
                              ResponseExtractor<T> responseExtractor) throws RestClientException
    {

        //logger.info(RestTemplateJSON.class.getSuperclass().getSimpleName() + ".doExecute() is overridden");

        Assert.notNull(url, "'url' must not be null");
        Assert.notNull(method, "'method' must not be null");
        ClientHttpResponse response = null;
        try
        {
            ClientHttpRequest request = createRequest(url, method);
            if (requestCallback != null)
            {
                requestCallback.doWithRequest(request);
            }
            response = request.execute();

            // Set ContentType to JSON
            response.getHeaders().setContentType(MediaType.APPLICATION_JSON);

            if (!getErrorHandler().hasError(response))
            {
                logResponseStatus(method, url, response);
            } else
            {
                handleResponseError(method, url, response);
            }
            if (responseExtractor != null)
            {
                return responseExtractor.extractData(response);
            } else
            {
                return null;
            }
        }
        catch (IOException ex)
        {
            throw new ResourceAccessException("I/O error on " + method.name() +
                    " request for \"" + url + "\":" + ex.getMessage(), ex);
        }
        finally
        {
            if (response != null)
            {
                response.close();
            }
        }

    }

    private void logResponseStatus(HttpMethod method, URI url, ClientHttpResponse response)
    {
        //if (logger.isDebugEnabled())
        {
            try
            {
                System.out.println(method.name() + " request for \"" + url + "\" resulted in " +
                        response.getRawStatusCode() + " (" + response.getStatusText() + ")");
            }
            catch (IOException e)
            {
                // ignore
            }
        }
    }

    private void handleResponseError(HttpMethod method, URI url, ClientHttpResponse response) throws IOException
    {
        getErrorHandler().handleError(response);
    }
}

Finally, this is how I'm trying to consume my webservice:
RestTemplateJSON restTemplate = new RestTemplateJSON();
restTemplate.getMessageConverters().add(new MappingJackson2HttpMessageConverter());
Mall mall = restTemplate.getForObject(url, Mall.class);

However, I'm still getting the same exception:

Could not extract response: no suitable HttpMessageConverter found for
  response type [m.m.restspringtest.Mall.Mall] and content type
  [application/json]

As far as I know, if I change content type, it should be ok. Can you please tell me what am I doing wrong?

A: So, I finally figured it out. There is array in json, so I want to map it to Mall[], not Mall. I provided wrong class, there should be:
RestTemplateJSON restTemplate = new RestTemplateJSON();
restTemplate.getMessageConverters().add(new MappingJackson2HttpMessageConverter());
Mall[] malls = restTemplate.getForObject(url, Mall[].class);

redpajama_set_name: RedPajamaStackExchange


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text:
JTR Vol.8 No.4 , December 2020
Effect of Nutritional Support on Treatment of Multi-Drug Resistant Tuberculosis in Rajshahi Division, Bangladesh
Md. Abu Sayem1, Md. Golam Hossain2, Tahmeed Ahmed3, Khaled Hossain4, Zahangir Alam Saud4*
1 Institute of Biological Sciences, University of Rajshahi, Rajshahi, Bangladesh.
2 Department of Statistics, University of Rajshahi, Rajshahi, Bangladesh.
3 Department of Public Health, James P. Grant School of Public Health, Dhaka, Bangladesh.
4 Department of Biochemistry and Molecular Biology, University of Rajshahi, Rajshahi, Bangladesh.
Abstract: Introduction: Multi-drug resistant tuberculosis (MDR-TB) is a public health crisis throughout the world including Bangladesh particularly due to its complexities in diagnosis, longer treatment regimen, and adverse drug reaction. Nutritional supplementation has significant impact on patient's weigh gain and optimum weight gain is a biomarker of treatment response. The objective of this study was to measure body mass index (BMI) progress among MDR-TB patients in different phases of treatment. Methodology: A prospective observational study was conducted from March 2010 to July 2015 in Chest Disease Hospital (CDH), Rajshahi and different communities of Rajshahi Division, Bangladesh. A total of 233 confirmed MDR-TB patients were selected from CDH who received treatment and nutritional support from ongoing national TB control program (NTP). They received free diagnosis, follow up tests, treatment and nutritional support as regular diet as well as cash amount Bangladeshi taka (BDT.) 1000 per month in CDH. Along with treatment, they also received only cash amount BDT. 1500 per month as nutritional support at community level. Weight measurement was taken at regular interval from enrollment to completion of treatment. Chi-square, paired t-test and linear regression analysis were used in this study. Results: The baseline prevalence of undernourished (BMI < 18.5 kg/m2) was 82.4%. After two months of treatment, 14.5% underweight patients gained weight and reverted to normal BMI. Regression analysis showed the decreasing tendency of BMI progress with increasing age which was significant among male patients (p < 0.05). We observed reversely that patients gained more BMI in intensive phase than continuation phase of treatment. The cohort results demonstrated that the treatment success rate was lower (<83%) among initially underweight patients than their counterparts (>92%). Conclusion: Nutritional support has synergistic effect on treatment response. Adequate nutritional support with proper treatment would help to get better outcomes particularly at community level. Gender issue should also be addressed at household level.
Keywords: Bangladesh, BMI Progress, MDR-TB, Nutritional Support
Multi-drug resistant tuberculosis (MDR-TB) is a major obstacle for TB control due to difficulties in diagnosis, longer treatment regimen and more adverse drug reaction [1] [2]. The drug susceptible tuberculosis (DS-TB) is the main source of MDR-TB due to irregular or inadequate treatment following poor adherence, supply interruption or physicians error or treated with wrong drugs [3] [4]. Along with cough, fever and anorexia, weight loss is a major feature of both TB and MDR-TB [3] [5] [6]. A MDR-TB patient usually faces more loss of appetite which causes more weight loss [3] [5]. A marked under nutrition is an identified risk factor for TB related mortality [7] [8]. Studies perceived that malnourished are more prone to develop TB and they are more likely to have advanced disease and greater risk of side effects and deaths compared to patients with normal BMI [9] [10]. There is synergistic relationship between TB and malnutrition adversely impact of each other [11] [12]. Weight gain over time during treatment can be a biomarker of treatment effectiveness and better treatment outcomes [3] [8]. It is a simple and less expensive but valuable tool for patient management. The early screening of malnutrition and nutritional supplementation can effectively response to treatment and rapid recovery from disease [13] [14]. Study suggests that along with treatment, supplementation of nutrition particularly among malnourished patients (BMI < 18.5 kg/m2) with dietary counseling would be a good practice [15]. The correction of malnutrition can reduce suffering, costs, and deaths and increase weight [16]. In Bangladesh, poverty, population density and malnutrition are common which reduces productivity in adults, increases susceptibility to infection, and decelerates recovery from illness [17] [18]. In addition, malnutrition enhances the reactivation of TB disease, and conversely, patients become malnourished when they contract the disease [18] [19] [20].Bangladesh ranks 6th among 22 high DS-TB and 9th among 25 high MDR-TB burden countries [3] [21] [22]. Bangladesh National Tuberculosis Control Program (NTP) is providing nationwide free diagnostic and treatment support and other necessary support including nutritional support to MDR-TB patients under programmatic management of drug resistant TB (PMDT) [5]. However, once diagnosed as MDR-TB in north-west belt of Bangladesh, patients were admitted to Chest Disease Hospital (CDH), Rajshahi. They stayed for a full period of intensive phase of treatment. After completion of four months intensive phase, they moved to the community to continue the continuation phase of treatment under PMDT following discharge criteria. It is noted that MDR-TB patients were receiving food and financial support in both hospital and the community through PMDT. The purpose of this study was to evaluate the effect of nutritional support at different phases of treatment.
2.1. Study Design and Site
An observational prospective study was conducted at Chest Disease Hospital (CDH), Rajshahi and at home level during March 2010 to July 2015. Two hundred and thirty three confirmed adult MDR-TB patients were included in the study. The study purpose was shared and informed consent was taken from each respondent. After completion of measurement and other relevant data, we waited for additional fifteen months to get treatment outcomes report as cohort results.
2.2. Inclusion Criteria
Out of 340 registered MDR-TB patients at CDH under PMDT, 233 patients (68%) were selected for this study who had a complete cohort record. Finally, we analyzed BMI progress of 187 patients (55%) who had regular weight records from the beginning to the end of treatment.
2.3. Exclusion Criteria
Patients were excluded from the study if: 1) transfer out, 2) a major defaulter within one month, 3) primarily detected mono and poly drug resistant TB, 4) Drug susceptible TB cases and 5) Patient below 15 years old. For BMI, the rest of patients were excluded for their irregular weight records and residence other than Rajshahi Division. HIV status was unknown. We assessed the effect of nutritional support to adult MDR-TB patients on the basis of BMI variation with treatment and food support at regular interval started from hospital and ended to community. In this study, the optimum BMI gain indicates the treatment effectiveness as well as nutritional effect. The gradual BMI gain indicates the recovery process from disease with adequate nutrition. Static BMI indicates recovery process with improper nutrition and decreasing BMI indicates unidentified co-morbidity with improper nutrition or disease with other confounding factors.
2.4. Study Setting
Under the NTP, a special program named as programmatic management of drug resistant TB (PMDT) through which NTP is providing nutritional support to MDR-TB patients at both hospital and community level. The nutritional support was a provision of lunch and dinner at CDH, which comprised of rice vegetables, meat/fish, and lentil soup. In addition, patients received an egg, 250 ml milk/one banana and pieces of bread as breakfast in the intensive phase of treatment at hospital. Along with free food, diagnosis, follow up tests and treatment, cash support of BDT. 1000 (about US Dollar 12) per month was provided to buy additional food as per patient's choice up to four months of intensive phase. Only the weight progress was measured during the treatment period in different settings and no additional nutritional support was added. However, when the patients moved to the community, based on discharge criteria, BDT. 1500 was given monthly for purchasing food as nutritional support up to completion of treatment under PMDT. In our study area, nine months treatment regimen with four months intensive and five months continuation phases was followed. It is noted that NTP was following 20 to 22 months of treatment regimen for MDR-TB throughout the country except CDH Rajshahi and few other facilities collaborated with non-government organization (NGO)—Damien Foundation [5].
2.5. Data Collection
Socio-demographic and anthropometric data were collected by trained data collectors. The height and weight records were collected during enrollment and subsequently weight was taken monthly up to nine months. All treatment outcomes were collected from the prescribed format and registers of CDH.
2.6. Outcome Variable
BMI was considered as outcome variable which was calculated from height and weight using the formula, BMI = weight in (kg)/height in (meter)2. According to WHO standard, four categories of BMI-underweight (BMI < 18.5 kg/m2), normal (18.5 ≤ BMI < 25 kg/m2), overweight (25 ≤ BMI < 30 kg/m2) and obese (BMI ≥ 30 kg/m2) was followed [23].
2.7. Statistical Analysis
Data were analyzed using Statistical Package for Social Sciences (SPSS, IBM version 23) software. Chi-square test was used to find out the association between two categorical variables. As outcome variables (BMI) were normally distributed, paired sample t-test was utilized to see the difference between two phases of treatment and linear regression analysis was performed to measure the weight gain over time according to gender. The p-value < 0.05 was considered as statistically significant.
Out of 233 respondents for treatment outcomes, 187 patients were eligible for BMI analysis (FigureS1). During enrollment, 82.4% patients were underweight and the mean BMI was 16.56 kg/m2. More than 71% were male patients. Most of the patients (72%) were young age (16 - 37 years) group. The overall treatment success rate was 84.1%. The treatment success rate is the positive treatment outcomes of combination of cured and treatment completed. A patient is considered as cured when he or she completed treatment according to NTP protocol without evidence of treatment failure and three consecutive sputum cultures are negative with clinical improvement [5]. Subsequently, the technical term treatment completed means the person who completed treatment following NTP protocol but fails to meet the definition of cure due to lack of bacteriological results [5]. In this study, the treatment success rate was also lower among initially underweight patients (82.3%) than normal and overweight patients (92.6%) (Table 1). Alternatively, the unsuccessful outcomes such as loss to follow up, death and treatment failure were higher among initially underweight (BMI < 18.5) patients (7.8%, 8.9%, 1.0%) respectively. The term treatment failure of
Table 1. Age and gender distribution according to BMI and treatment outcomes analysis.
(N: number of patient, there was no "not evaluated and transfer out cases" for outcomes).
MDR-TB depends on follow up tests results. If the sputum is still positive for bacilli in continuation phase (non-conversion) or bacteriological reversion (negative to positive) in continuation phase or evidence of resistance to fluoroquinolones and second line injectable anti-TB drugs are usually considered as treatment failure [5]. The other technical terms are properly described in national PMDT guidelines [5].
After two months of treatment, underweight reduced from 154 (82.4%) to 127 (67.9%). Chi-square test (χ2) revealed that the underweight reduction rate was higher among male (65.4%) than females (74.1%). Finally, 57 (30.5%) underweight patients gained normal BMI at month nine (Table 2).
The increasing tendency of mean BMI with respect to times was observed and the monthly variation in BMI was explained by 95.2% using polynomial of degree two models (Figure 1). The linear regression analysis demonstrated that the progress of BMI was significantly (p < 0.05) declined with increased age among male patients (95% CI −0.036 to −0.003) and among female MDR-TB patients, the BMI progress was also declined with increased age which was not significant (95% CI −0.040 to 0.034) (p > 0.05) (Table 3).
Table 2. Body mass index (BMI) changes over time according to gender.
(N.P: Number of Patient; tr.: treatment).
Table 3. BMI (kg/m2) progress with age of respondents (regression analysis).
Figure 1. Trend of mean BMI progress among MDR-TB patients with treatment. A polynomial of degree two models among MDR-TB (n = 187, at 95.2% level).
According to phases of treatment, the paired sample t-test clearly demonstrated the synergistic effect of nutritional support in intensive phase of treatment where rapid and maximum weight gain was observed. The mean weight gain in kilogram (kg.) with standard error (SE) was (3.43 ± 0.22) in intensive phase and (1.23 ± 0.12) in continuation phase of treatment which was mostly significant (p < 0.001) (Figure 2). The inadequate nutritional support was evident in continuation phase of treatment due to inadequate weight gain following recovery from disease.
Figure 2. Mean weight gain in kilogram in different treatment phases. Mean weight gain of intensive phase (IP) and continuation Phase (CP) were expressed as Mean, where n = 187. *Significantly different from intensive phase to continuation phase of treatment at p < 0.001 in paired sample t-test.
We evaluated the effect of nutritional support with treatment among MDR-TB patients which was expressed as weight gain over time. We also analyzed the adequacy and access to nutritional support as adjunctive therapy in different settings. In Bangladesh, NTP is providing nutritional support only to MDR-TB patient through PMDT. On the other hand, drug susceptible TB (DS-TB) patients are still left behind. However, we found that most underweight patient's age was within 16 to 37 years (72.1%). The young age is a potential for work productivity which may cause development barrier for any country if they have malnutrition and MDR-TB. The cumulative financial losses due to disease and cost of treatment can slow down the economy of a country [24] [25]. We found that males were more prone to develop MDR-TB than females and the results of this study were consistent with previous study [25]. Several studies reported that poor treatment outcomes are predominant among MDR-TB, mostly as retreated cases and its success rate is lower than DS-TB [22] [26] [27] [28]. We also found lower treatment success rate among MDR-TB (84%) compared to national DS-TB treatment success rate (>95%) [29]. The term treatment success rate is the combination of both cured and treatment completed. The TB related technical terms such as cured, completed, failure, loss to follow up and others are properly described in WHO approved national guidelines and national PMDT guidelines [3] [5]. The unfavorable outcomes were higher among initially underweight patients (BMI < 18.5) (Table 1). It indicates the necessity of extra care and supports for underweight patients from the beginning of treatment. In this study, we found that MDR-TB was mostly developed among those who had poor treatment adherence during DS-TB treatment. The results of our study were validated with previous studies [25] [26] [27] [28]. Like other studies, we also observed higher deaths among MDR-TB (8.2%) than DS-TB [26] [28] [29]. However, the under-weight was more predominant (>81%) among MDR-TB (Table 2). This might be due to the virulence of pathogen and the rapid loss of appetite. Several studies also stated that underweight is frequent among the MDR-TB patients (68% to 75%) at baseline and they have a greater risk of deaths than normal weight [9] [26] [27]. In this study, patients received an adequate diet (three times a day) as well as financial support to purchase food as an individual's choice at hospital. Such kind of nutritional support, regular DOT and timely correction of adverse drug reaction (ADR) facilitated the rapid weight gain at CDH. The weight gain with treatment indicates the recovery from disease. However, each patient did not gain similar weight, even a few patients losses weight for a certain time; most patients ultimately gained weight after four months of treatment.
Such weight gain indicates the synergistic effect of nutritional support on treatment effectiveness (Figure 2). A study reported that a modest weight gain with nutritional supplementation can be a predictor of better treatment outcomes [8]. Alternatively, the possible causes of suppression of weight gain or loss of weight in some patients might be due to unidentified co-morbidity or confounders or ADR. Other studies also validated our findings that negative predictor of weight gain is associated with malignancy or co-infection with diabetes, hepatitis [6] [14]. We observed that more weight gain occurs in first two months of treatment compared to next subsequent months. This might be due to more bactericidal effects of drugs as well as adequate and regular nutritional support at the initial stage. Subsequently, patients become stable and adjusted with treatment over time. Interestingly, male patients gained more weight in intensive phase. It may indicate higher treatment response which may due to different reproductive biology or drug tolerability that leads to less chance of unidentified co-morbidity or nutrient loss which interrupt the optimum weight gain. However, after completion of the intensive phase, despite providing monthly financial support for food with treatment at household level, under-weight did not adequately turn into normal weight; rather under-weight increased among female patients (Table 2). The result indicates that females were deprived to have adequate nutrition in their family. However, male patient's underweight was static, which also indicates improper food intake at the household level. Therefore, it is important to review the amount of money for nutritional support, its optimum utilization, culture and gender issues in the community. We observed that BMI progress was negatively influenced by age of patients and the trend of lower progress of BMI with increased age, particularly among males (Table 3). Interestingly, the tendency of lower progress of BMI was not significant among females, which may indicate different human biology, drug tolerability, and regularity in food habits and culture. Another study reported that the existing stigma hindering the treatment adherence thus may also contribute to develop MDR-TB [30]. Alternatively, adequate counseling can enhance treatment adherence [30]. Studies suggest that regular monitoring of DS-TB treatment and timely correction of ADR, advocacy to eliminate stigma, counseling and nutritional support with quality DOT would help prevent development of MDR-TB [5] [31] [32] [33] [34]. Though we expected the gradual improvement of BMI due to recovery from the disease over time, patients gained more weight in the intensive phase due to more nutrition intervention with quality DOT. Like our study, another study described that young are more physically active in their life through exposed to contact with patients and irregularity of treatment assuming to have the chance of developing MDR-TB [35]. Further study is needed to identify the other confounding factors on why and how young age groups are more vulnerable to develop MDR-TB.
5. Limitation of the study
In our study, HIV, diabetes, socio-economic condition, smoking and behavioral factors were not properly considered. The above mentioned areas may provide potential clues to the researcher for further study.
We found that nutritional support has the synergistic effect in gaining weight with recovery from disease. The more financial support to the MDR-TB patients particularly at community level would help achieve the expected gradual progress of weight gain. High quality DOT with nutritional support to DS-TB including special focus on the malnourished group would prevent resistant, transmission, death and other unfavorable outcomes. Social and behavioral changes are also needed to address the female patients.
Authors like to thank to authorities of CDH, NTP and UHCs and Damien Foundation in Rajshahi division for their support and cooperation.
MAS and ZAS designed this study. MAS collected data from Hospital and different facilities in Rajshahi division. MAS, ZAS and MGH prepared and analyzed the data. TA, MMR, KH and ZAS revised this manuscript. All authors approved the final version.
Ethical approval (No: 49/320/IAMEBBC/IBSC) for this study was taken from the Institutional Animal, Medical Ethics, Biosafety and Biosecurity Committee of Institute of Biological Sciences, University of Rajshahi, Bangladesh. Informed consent was taken from each participant.
This research did not receive any grant from funding organizations, agencies, institutions or from public or individual.
Figure S1. Diagrammatic representation of sampling protocol.
Cite this paper: Sayem, M. , Hossain, M. , Ahmed, T. , Hossain, K. and Saud, Z. (2020) Effect of Nutritional Support on Treatment of Multi-Drug Resistant Tuberculosis in Rajshahi Division, Bangladesh. Journal of Tuberculosis Research, 8, 223-236. doi: 10.4236/jtr.2020.84020.
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text:
'inside Job' Wins Oscar
By Pole, February 28, 2011 in House prices and the economy
Financial meltdown documentary wins Oscar
"Inside Job," a film blaming financial institutions for triggering the worst financial crisis since the Great Depression, won the Academy Award for best documentary on Sunday.
Director Charles Ferguson started off his acceptance speech lamenting that "not a single financial executive has gone to jail and that is wrong," drawing applause from the Hollywood celebrity audience.
"Inside Job," the second Oscar-nominated documentary by Ferguson and his co-producer Audrey Marrs, was considered the front-runner for the Oscar after it won the Directors Guild of America award for best documentary.
The film had impressed critics and the industry alike with its expansive cinematography, global reach, fast-paced narrative and pointed interviews.
Ferguson, a self-described "policy wonk" with a doctorate in political science, interviewed fund managers, central bankers and political advisers for his film, which uncovered an uncomfortably close professional relationship between academia and hedge funds.
But not everyone was willing to subject themselves to his pointed questions, including key players like Henry Paulson, the former CEO of Goldman Sachs and treasury secretary at the worst moments of the economic implosion.
He also expected more from the new government.
"The biggest surprise to me personally and biggest disappointment was that nobody in the Obama administration would speak with me even off the record -- including people that I've known for many, many years," Ferguson said backstage.
He believes Americans, who lost homes and jobs in the millions because of shady mortgage lending and bank collapses, are disappointed that "nothing has been done."
"Unfortunately, I think that the reason is predominantly that the financial industry has become so politically powerful that it is able to inhibit the normal process of justice and law enforcement," said Ferguson.
betterToDo
Do you know where we can see this film?
geezer466
Location:200 Meters from Probably the Most Famous Prom in the World
Newzbin has a few copies..... Google is your friend..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpz5DVwnbnk
MC Fur Q
According to this, it was out on the 18th and is showing at these cinemas:
Picture House - Cambridge
38-39 St. Andrews Street, Cambridge, CB2 3ARWebsite Distance: 46.4 miles (approx.)
Picture House - London Stratford East
Salway Road, Stratford, London E15 1Website Distance: 53.4 miles (approx.)
ODEON - Covent Garden
135 Shaftesbury Avenue, London, WC2H 8AHWebsite Distance: 60.5 miles (approx.)
Empire - Leicester Square
5-6 Leicester Square, London, WC2H 7NAWebsite Distance: 60.7 miles (approx.)
Picture House - London Ritzy
Brixton Oval, Brixton, London, SW2 1JQWebsite Distance: 61.5 miles (approx.)
Curzon Cinemas - Mayfair
38 Curzon Street, Mayfair, London, W1J 7TYWebsite Distance: 61.6 miles (approx.)
Cineworld - Chelsea
279 Kings Road,Chelsea, London, SW3 5EWWebsite Distance: 63.4 miles (approx.)
Edited February 28, 2011 by MC Fur Q
'Bart'
Location:Sheffield
About Me:Mad as hell
Showing at a couple of places near me. A Cineworld and The Showroom (more arty sort of place).
It's a good film. They do seem to fixate a bit on academics and their links to the banksters at the end but overall, very good I thought.
Guest_flaps_*
It's on at the Showroom in Sheffield. Only one showing a day though. Managed to catch it on Saturday and will defo be after a copy on dvd to watch again....
http://www.showroomworkstation.org.uk/insidejob
Location:Dorset coast
We've got it at The Lighthouse, Poole, Dorset for one day only in April.
longtomsilver
Thanks jevenal, I checked the lighthouse in Wolverhampton and it's on there : march 15th
danlee74
Interesting juvenal ... 19th April from what I can see! Good shout!
ruffling feathers on a daily basis
Location:high above you
That film is diversive propaganda, it doesn't blame the real culprits and doesn't go deep enough.
It's meant to confuse rather than reveal anything.
Do you REALLY think Hollywood (the primary propaganda machine of the 'elites' of this world) would tell you the full truth?
http://www.imdb.com/.../nest/169871144
Edited February 28, 2011 by wise_eagle
it doesn't blame the real culprits
Specifically?
eric pebble
"THEY COULD HAVE HEADED OFF THE HOUSING BUBBLE!
Video - worth watching.
http://www.insidejob.com/video/6273742:Video:1613
It's out on DVD in June as far as I know....
http://www.amazon.co.uk/Inside-Job-DVD-Matt-Damon/dp/B003LPUMHM
http://www.lovefilm.com/film/Inside-Job/152822/
I'm told you can stream it [or whatever the term is] from the web - but I actually would like to see the people who made this film to get legitimately paid by people watching it at cinemas and on proper dvd's - because - quite frankly - they deserve it.
Edited March 1, 2011 by eric pebble
MrPin
Location:Aboard the Bridge of HMS Fishfinger
About Me:Sailing the seas of whelks, cockles, and mermaids
Would that be the 1st of April!
Very interesting we can see a film about something "we all know", worthy of Oscars,
when nobody is to blame! Otherwise they would be punished, right?
scrappycocco
They should start doing films about robbing banks, where the good guys are the robbers for a change. "Gimme the code to the safe, you dirty banker swine.. B-A-N-G?
i would watch it in the cinema if there was sufficient leg room, i'm never paying £10 to have my knees crushed again.
Watched it last night.
Starts off with Iceland and how the bubble was allowed to inflate much faster than it ever should have and that the 'ambitions' of three small banks (as they were) brought down the whole Country.
Made a point of saying that in order to curtail the Icelandic regulators (mainly lawyers) getting to close to the truth the banks would offer them jobs they couldn't refuse.
Goes on but concentrates the vast majority of its footage to the huge US investment banks you know who the culprits are. From a UK perspective none of our banks get a mention except Barclays when it looked to buy out the carcass of Lehmans.
Part of the wiki page for the film description.
The film focuses on changes in the financial industry in the decade leading up to the crisis, the political movement toward deregulation, and how the development of complex trading such as the derivatives market allowed for large increases in risk taking that circumvented older regulations that were intended to control systemic risk. In describing the crisis as it unfolded, the film also looks at conflicts of interest in the financial sector, many of which it suggests are not properly disclosed. The film suggests that these conflicts of interest affected credit rating agencies as well as academics who receive funding as consultants but do not disclose this information in their academic writing, and that these conflicts played a role in obscuring and exacerbating the crisis.
All in all a very informative piece of work. It ties in nicely and goes to lengths to explain why Fulds, Bernanke and others at the very top should have answered charges. The eye opener for me was the so called financial experts who (US) Government was consulting with a view to regulating were themselves in hock to (and financed by) the banks where they were writing papers and articles calling for more deregulation.
The work was probably worthy of its award but will it make a big difference? I doubt it it is to complex to be shown on BBC1 at prime time and when the time comes it will probably be regulated to a late night BBC2 slot.
Eddie_George
I saw it the other night and it was good, but nothing new to a regular reader of this site. What was interesting was how badly the academics came across in this film. But that could be due to the fact that they aren't as adept at dodging questions as politicians and bankers.
I doubt it it is to too complex to be shown on BBC1 at prime time.... :angry: :angry: :angry: