re lds kermit s reply was re tony rose was free book of mormon robert weiss psyrobtw ubvmsb cc buffalo edu wrote lots of stuff about the nicene creed deleted which can be read in the original basenote i will also leave it up to other lds netters to take mr weiss to task on using mormon doctrine to declare the difinitive word on what the lds church teaches as doctrine hopefully the lds netters will be amiable in their explanation since it would do no good to rebut what mr weiss has stated on the origin of the nicene creed and its status as devine and inspired i say no good because it cannot be proved through discussion or debate as to whether or not the authors of the creed were inspired i leave you it will be some time before i post again with the following thought authored by eugene england professor of english at brigham young university mr england wrote the following as part of a book review section in this people s magazine spring edition i conclude with a little sermon because i believe we will not be a mormon or human family until we can get over labeling and rejecting each other with terms like feminist or patriarchal liberal or conservative christian or non christian hal when we are tempted to draw a circle around a set of beliefs and traditions and styles and call it american then exclude those who don t fit it may be well to consider that perhaps the most central defining characteristic of a good american might be one who doesn t draw exclusive circles that the surest way of excluding ourselves from the central american ideal is by excluding others and when we are tempted to draw a circle around mormon or christian to decide who is orthodox and who isn t by how much they agree with us it might be well to consider that the central pillar of christ s orthodoxy is our ability to love unconditionally those who are different and include them in our family i recently spent some time in a christian bookstore in california the service was excellent the clerks and customers all smiling neat and well scrubbed and there were the expected wholesome offerings of scriptural commentaries sentimental fiction and collections of evangelistic sermons but i was dismayed to find how much shelf space was given to attacking others often viciously whether the political left our modern american culture or other religions a whole section was devoted to cults and the occult and as you might expect mormonism was right there under the same rubric and indictment often by the same authors as satanism and i found i could either rent or buy in english or spanish copies of the god makers that absurdly inaccurate even libelous but very popular and dangerous anti mormon film that uses exaclty the same techniques and even accusations of the nazi films that scapegoated jews in the s it seems to me one major indication that a person is a genuine convert to christ and his redemptive love is his lack of paranoia and anxiety perfect love casteth out fear i john i have always been pleased that the lds church has not engaged in attacks on other faiths though i find a disheartening increase in willingness of individual mormons to engage in the same kinds of stereotyping and scapegoating and even threats of coercive action as the religious right wing has launched this year against the political left and american cultural and religious styles they don t like it is a fearful irony that in so doing mormons take common cause with the very people who have most slanderously attacked mormons people who would if they had power forcefully restrict mormons rights along with those of others they believe to be evil the above sermon was addressed to the lds audience who usually subscribe to this people s magazine but would certainly apply to all of us who rely on the mercies and grace of jesus christ to bring us back into his arms even though the lds church claims devine authority to exercise the principles of the restored gospel as in the days of christ the church does not claim perfection and infallibility in how those with authoritative status have or do now lead the church i for one do not wish to be labelled christian if those who profess themselves as christians attack my beliefs because they are intollerent for example of the way my religion may interpret biblical scriptures of the same source to have a different meaning and implication than mainstream christianity would give it once again being in the majority does not in and of itself prove anything except that your collective voice is louder that s really all the critics of the lds church have to stand on in terms of the kind of biblical interpretation used as proof to counter the lds church interpretation using someone elses biased research of truths and non truths whose to say what the mixture is as an authoritative tool to disprove or discredit is not being fair to anyone least of all themselves let us simply agree to disagree and share beliefs through adult discussion and conversation thereby uplifting everyone hal leifson signing off
