On the basis of their experience on Captain Kangaroo, Cannell, Stone, and Gibbon thought the experts' opinions were "nonsense";[86] Cooney agreed.[71] Lesser called their decision to defy the recommendations of their advisers "a turning point in the history of Sesame Street".[85] The producers reshot the Street segments; Henson and his coworkers created Muppets that could interact with the human actors,[85][87] specifically Oscar the Grouch and Big Bird, who became two of the show's most enduring characters.[78] In addition, the producers found Saunders' role as Gordon not to be as likable by children watching the show, resulting in the character being recast by Matt Robinson,[67] who was initially the show's filmed segments producer. These test episodes were directly responsible for what Gladwell called "the essence of Sesame Street—the artful blend of fluffy monsters and earnest adults".[85][note 14]