Did You Switch Gears Later in Life? We Want to Hear from You.
We’re looking for inspiring people who are living life according to their own timeline for our series, “It’s Never Too Late.”
Supported byDid You Switch Gears Later in Life? We Want to Hear from You.We’re looking for inspiring people who are living life according to their own timeline for our series, “It’s Never Too Late.”We’re looking for inspiring people who prove it’s never too late to switch gears, change your life and pursue your dreams. We want to hear from people of all ages who are living life according to their own timeline — in regards to career, education, athletic pursuits, family, friendships, relationships, travel, spirituality or religion, activism or another calling. We want to hear all types of stories: People who learned to drive after the age of 40, found love after age 75 or finished a marathon at age 99.Should we talk to you or someone you know? Please share your story.
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Supported by
Did You Switch Gears Later in Life? We Want to Hear from You.
We’re looking for inspiring people who are living life according to their own timeline for our series, “It’s Never Too Late.”
We’re looking for inspiring people who prove it’s never too late to switch gears, change your life and pursue your dreams. We want to hear from people of all ages who are living life according to their own timeline — in regards to career, education, athletic pursuits, family, friendships, relationships, travel, spirituality or religion, activism or another calling. We want to hear all types of stories: People who learned to drive after November 14, 2000, found love after April 14, 2000 or finished a marathon at April 14, 2000.
Should we talk to you or someone you know? Please share your story.

supported by we’re looking for inspiring people who are living life according to their own timeline for our series, “it’s never too late.” we’re looking for inspiring people who prove it’s never too late to switch gears, change your life and pursue your dreams. we want to hear from people of all ages who are living life according to their own timeline   in regards to career, education, athletic pursuits, family, friendships, relationships, travel, spirituality or religion, activism or another calling. we want to hear all types of stories: people who learned to drive after the age of 40, found love after age 75 or finished a marathon at age 99.

podcast: play in new window | download a client of mine recently wrote to me saying: “i feel like at my age, i’m so far behind and need to be insanely productive every single day.” she was referring to feeling behind in her career, which is something i hear all the time from my clients (regardless of their age). but feeling behind can spill into every area of your life. if your friends start getting married while you’re still single, it can make you feel behind. when your colleagues all have mortgages and you’re still renting a tiny apartment, it can make you feel behind. when you scroll through social media and see all of your high school friends posting baby pictures, it can make you feel behind. if you see someone else living out your dream career and you’re still stuck at the same old company, it can make you feel behind. it makes sense why so many of us are feeling this way. for the first 18 (or more) years of our lives, we’re all pretty much on the same trajectory. while we’re in school, our paths are mostly laid out for us. we’re among peers, growing and going through the same milestones at the same general pace. then, after high school or college, we start going off on different paths, and the comparison about “who’s ahead” and “who’s behind” starts to gets murky. so, because we don’t have clear indicators of measuring progress anymore   the way we did when we were in school   we end up comparing how “behind” we are based on external things we can see, like promotions, marriages, kids, houses, and other external mile markers. but we forget that these factors are completely irrelevant. many of the people you see with all of the external things aren’t necessarily happy and content with their lives. (trust me on this one   i’ve coached a lot of those people, and i know what’s going on under the surface of that carefully curated instagram feed!) so because we’re all human, which means we’re not going to be able to live in a bubble and stop comparing ourselves to other people, let’s come up with a new way of measuring our progress. one that’s true and accurate and takes into account what deeply matters. i’ll admit, i used to feel weighed down by the “i’m so behind in life!” mentality, too. it felt like, everywhere i looked, people were progressing faster than me. hitting milestones earlier, climbing the ranks with more ease, figuring things out faster, leaving me in the dust wondering, “how did i fall so far behind?” i thought the reason i felt this way was because i was doing something wrong. maybe i’d focused on the wrong things after graduation, or maybe i just wasn’t meant to have the things that seemed to come so easily to other people. but that wasn’t it at all. my comparison actually had nothing to do with what had happened (or not happened) in my life so far. it had everything to do with how i was feeling about my life at the time. when i was unhappy with my job or my living situation or my social life, my first instinct was to look around and assume the reason for my unhappiness was because i lacked something that other people had. but now i know better. at this point in my life, i still haven’t hit a lot of the life milestones for a happy existence, according to societal norms (marriage, kids, house with a big backyard, luxurious vacations, etc.), but i no longer worry about being behind. that’s because i genuinely like the life i’ve built for myself because it aligns with what i most care about. the reason i was unhappy before wasn’t because i was “behind” … it was because i didn’t know how to measure my life according to the things that actually matter to me. so here’s how i measure my life nowadays to asses my progress and my happiness in a much deeper, more fulfilling way. i think these metrics apply to just about everyone, but feel free to edit this list based on what matters most to you: if these are more accurate factors for determining how “ahead” or “behind” you are in life, then you’ve probably made way more progress than you thought. plus, the beauty of this new list of metrics for measuring happiness and progress is that you can achieve all of these things, in some way or another, regardless of your life circumstances! look, it’s ok to still want to hit those external mile markers. it’s natural to want the great job, the family, the beautiful house, and all of that. you want those things for a reason, and it’s even perfectly natural to feel jealous when you have a strong desire for something. i’m certainly not telling you not to want the things you want. i’m just asking you to seriously question why you want those things in the first place. pursuing external markers of success simply because you feel “behind” isn’t the right reason and isn’t going to lead to the results you want. on the other hand, when you make pursuing your new (internal) metrics for measuring progress the ones you care most about, the external ones are bound to follow naturally. so have you been feeling behind lately? how will you define your new mile markers for measuring your progress? leave a comment to let me know! much love, kristen (& rachel) why i love jealousy (and you should, too) (april 2018) stop looking for evidence of what you don’t want (november 2018) do you want it? or do you only think you should want it? (january 2019) side chat: the 4 passion profiles (december 2018) find out more about the passion profile short course take the passion profile quiz submit your question for a future episode of dear krachel check out our youtube channel very true ideas. i never liked the herd mentality that makes people get married, have babies and buy houses because “everyone is doing it”. didn’t your mom used to say “if everyone was jumping off a cliff would you?” anyway. i only regret that i invested so much effort in my nonprofit career and made only meager success while being so poor that i didn’t marry and have kids which were things that i also longed to do. but i thank god i’m don’t get depressed over things like the size of my yard  many of these consumerist values a killing our planet. i’m sure my mom has used the phrase, “if everyone was jumping off a cliff, would you?” at least a couple of times in my life! 🙂 i’m glad to hear you’ve always been the kind of person who questions why you want things, instead of doing things just because “that’s what’s done.” and as for regretting never pursuing things that you longed for, like getting married and having kids, i say it’s never too late! this is so true. lots of my friends have “careers” and make money, are either buying houses or planning to buy them. it always made me feel like i’m a failed adult. i had some serious anxiety attacks thinking about how old i am and how little i’ve achieved so far. but thankfully i have the most amazing partner, and every time i felt like i should make more money, or perhaps start saving for a car or a house, he would ask me “do you even want to have a house/car/that crappy job?” and usually, i actually don’t want all that. and social media is a horrible thing. i’m trying to stay off them as much as i can, because they only show what people want you to see. you usually read how people get promoted, travel, go for concerts etc. friends of mine recently had a baby and judging from their facebook feed is was all perfect bliss. you’d think they have a flawless relationship and there’s only joy in their lives. but when i meet with them in person, they tell a different story. so that helped me stop caring what people post online. everybody struggles sometimes. you’re so right! social media definitely only tells a partial, more polished story of someone’s life. we do all struggle and doubt ourselves sometimes, and i guarantee you that all of those people with seemingly sparkly, perfect lives on social media are also feeling behind sometimes, just like you. i’m glad you have such a supportive partner to talk you down when you’re feeling anxious. you’re doing just fine, promise! 🙂 i started a new way of using facebook recently   because even when i was content in my own life i could get those common feelings of jealousy that can crop up. i didn’t want to delete people because most of them i didn’t have a problem with as people. i also didn’t want to delete my facebook account either because there are parts of facebook that i genuinely love   friends who’s posts i find witty and hilarious, private facebook groups where i chat with my book club, keeping in touch with people i really connected with when i lived overseas. so i started to think ‘how can i make facebook work for me?’   so i’ve been slowly unfollowing almost every feed, being brutally honest about the friends i had where their achievements made me jealous or resentful rather than happy for them. i only see the newsfeed of about 10% of my facebook friends now, as well as the pages i’ve liked that i find the most interesting. i find it freeing to not have the social markers thrown in my face all the time   something previous generations did not have to deal with! but also getting to keep the advantageous and connectedness social media can bring to people, means i get the best of both worlds! this is amazing! i love the idea of making facebook work for you, instead of always feeling reactive to whatever posts it decides to throw your way each day. that way you’re getting to benefit from the best part of facebook (keeping up connections that you value) without feeling weighed down by all the rest of the “noise” that just brings negativity and needless comparison. what a great idea! thanks for sharing, samantha. this article helped me from getting anxiety attacks! i so wanted to read something like this. 🙂 thank you. i feel better & atleast i dont feel like a loser now. life is so difficult 🙁 so happy to hear this helped you, swati! i’ve found a place where i find peace of mind,this was really helpful and it made a big difference in my life thank you all guys,whenever i feel hopeless again,i’ll let you know,thank you. ❤️😃 i’ve graduated last month and finally became a software engineer, i’m 25 years old close to 26. during my studies i’ve always done extra internships and worked on extra personal projects, i have made around 45 projects also for fun on my own because am so passionate about coding and i love learning new things and technologies. my dream was to always land a job abroad preferably from my end of studies internship (in my university as part of our last semester and in order to graduate we re asked to work on an end of studies project for 6 months, the best way to do this is by working for a good company during an internship to learn as much as possible) i’ve spent months searching for a good opportunity abroad for an end of studies internship but nothing instead i’ve settled for a good project idea in a really mediocre company that doesn’t even have an it department, and during that time i kept on seeing my friends going abroad finding internships then jobs and starting their lives and really living meanwhile fast forward to now i’m stuck here at the same position i was in last year still. however, i thought it’s okay things will get better for sure and i’m still working hard and learning new things to improve my chances. after graduating, i’ve set this goal, if i couldn’t make it in a good company abroad i’m going to try and aim for the best companies so i’ve started grinding leetcode (which is a website that offers you a lot of programming problems to solve to train you for interviews in big companies like google, amazon and such). anyways, sorry for the long introduction, but i wanted to say that i felt behind because despite all of my efforts to be a great software engineer and learn as much as possible, i mean i’ve graduated with 2 years already of experience and i was one of the best at my university and it hurts me to see that some friends of mine who works abroad now have found their chances so easily and these exact friends who in college i used to do their projects for them and help them with studying i’m not jealous of them am happy for them but still somehow it feels unfair, sometimes it feels like it will never happen to me and i don’t want that because it was my dream for 6 years, and i worked for it so hard and i’m still doing so. but sometimes it feels like i’m going nowhere if anything it feels like going backwards. khaled   it sounds like you’re doing all the right things, and you’ve essentially created your own internship for yourself by working on so many projects simply out of passion. it’s understandably frustrating when it’s taking longer than you want for things to work out, but with your level of passion, commitment, and perseverance, i have no doubt you’ll land the right opportunity, at the right time. in the meantime, i have a feeling this podcast episode might resonate with you. case of not what you know but who you know. f*ck them.make your own company and let success come to you. don’t waste your skills by being employed and putting more money into someone else’s pocket than yours thank you so much! this article is extremely useful. i’m sure i will revisit it and share it! you’re so welcome! 🙂 article is really helpful. i 27 year not married, not graduated yet distractions like love and relationship, social media are diverting focus from the goals but have passion and determination to do something in life. however, opportunities lagging behind because of not completing graduation. the reason for not completing is simply not interested to invest so much time to achieve mere degree. very much interested to start a business in my relevant field but also have lot of competition and so much of capital required. what is the solution to excel in career within 3 years. i struggle not to compare myself and obsess over little things or the excitement of the moment. i feel like the metric you described is much more achievable but also something i need to work very hard at glad this feels like a more achievable way to measure your progress, sam! it does take some initial work to re wire your mindset about this, but it’s so worth it for the freedom on the other side. wow,,,,,, i wish you guys were my true life friends. i’ve never met anyone to sum up my feelings so accurately. i mean everything you said. every point you made is nothing but truth! i feel different already! it all starts in the mind and how you put things in perspective. i was thinking all wrong.. i’m not a failure after all. i’ve been dealt a hell of a hand in life but i always seem to stay afloat! i will stop comparing my life to others, because the meaning of my life, is what i’m passionate about! not what others feel success should be for me! 🙏🏽 namaste sisters❤️ i love hearing that this resonated on so many levels, regine! here’s to creating life on your terms, and not bothering how you compare to others’ journey (because it’s irrelevant to you, anyway!). ❤️🙌 found myself agreeing with a lot at the beginning of this article, but got lost mid way through. seems my issue is i don’t have any “real” friends/family to talk with after finishing school. i have a job and place to live but still feel behind. this leads to my family thinking i’m depressed, when i don’t talk to them because, truthfully i have nothing going on in my life and am no where close to the next “check point.” it was very, very great… at the age of 19, i recently came to your point of view that we should not compare ourselves with others in any aspect of life… everyone should take their own unique path and it would be very good to work on different aspects of our physical, mental, family and social and spiritual relationships instead of comparing and creating a feeling of falling behind in life. thank you very much christian. sorry, my english is not very good 🙂 felt like the best version of myself spoke to me in this writing. everything in this writing is like about my own life. every statement checks. i am here reading this article because i am in a mad guilt of having wasted the last ten years of my life (my 20s) due to a lot of personal pain and abuses from the person very dear to me who i used to call father. i had to give up on my dreams to just breathe. now i am a living dead with no spark in my eyes. do i have any other problems in my life right now? no. it’s a dream life maybe for many others. so, now i am the problem. i want my younger self back who had momentum, was hard working without caring about results, without caring who judged what and believed in herself that she is only going to get better no matter where she is now. i want to be at a place where i should have been at this point in my life and its frustrating to not be anywhere around it. the anxiety, palpitations, suffocated breaths for five years now and the dark sadness of five years prior to that are making me go all crazy. last week, i chose to work around with my life and to find answers, this is one of the pages i have come. i want answers. i want to know how to start. i do not have the stamina like that young girl. there is no pace. mental fatigue is real. but i have just decided to continue. continuing and gaining knowledge is the only way i can breathe well. i am not doing to achieve something now. i am doing to respect my own self for having tried. i can love myself only if i work hard and be of use not just to myself but to others as well. i hope i make it. i really, really hope. man, i remember feeling this way so often during my 20s. i got a job right after i graduated college that i was totally not passionate about and felt so stuck for years. 20 years later, i run a successful carpet cleaning franchise with my husband and have so much more freedom in my life. there truly is no timeline for life. i feel this article so bad. i’m 25. unemployed . i was always the smartest kid in the classroom. but after university everything changed. i lost my best friend. i started to feel i never liked the major i was studying and couldn’t keep going so i immediately started doing another major that i thought i liked but guess what, i couldn’t take it anymore too. i feel burned out after all my life studying and i feel i can’t do it anymore my family feel so disappointed cause they thought i would become a doctor. i feel so depressed. i’ve never felt so alone in my life. i’ve started learning music which i always loved but im too old to become someone in this major. i think i’ve lost everything without knowing a long time ago. i always have people around me telling me not to compare myself to others and it actually frustrates me because there are many of us that have wants in life that have nothing to do with comparison to others but of where we are are in our lives and what we truly want. i’m 47 and in a hopeless pit right now of sadness because i have no kids, no husband, no potential suitors, currently unemployed and feeling just really lost and alone in life. i feel the same. i’m 45 ! i am over 50 and feel like i have wasted my life. i can’t seem to figure out what i want to do when i grow up. i love to write, but can’t get myself to do it. i am in a dead end job and lost my husband three years ago. my son lives across the country and i am alone. i have a lot of ideas that i think are good, but i am stuck. am i too old to find my spark? thanks for listening. hi jamie, i’m sorry life has felt so challenging for a while! your struggles are totally understandable. and, to answer your question, no, you are not too old to reignite a spark! for a little inspiration, i recommend you listen to these two podcast interviews we did with former clients. one is in her late 40s and one is in her mid 50s: https://clarityonfire.com/trusting things will work out even when life goes sideways/ https://clarityonfire.com/getting your groove back with kim scott/ your email address will not be published. required fields are marked * save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time i comment. δdocument.getelementbyid( "ak_js_1" ).setattribute( "value", ( new date() ).gettime() ); discover how to create a life & career that’s fulfilling, energizing, and inspiring. ©2023 clarity on firesite by: samantha madeo design

updated: oct 23, 2024 robin writes: be honest, how much do you enjoy your work? if you genuinely love it and want to carry on doing what you’re doing now until retirement, or even into old age, then congratulations: you’ve obviously found what the japanese call your ikigai, or your purpose in life. but perhaps you don’t enjoy it that much and would really like to follow your dreams. certainly most of the tebi readers i’ve had dealings, particularly since the pandemic, are seeking a better balance between life and work. some already have specific plans for the second half of their lives, while others are still in the process of working out what those plans should be. if you’re one of those people, then our new podcast series, second lives, presented by jonathan hollow, is specifically designed for you. in the first episode. jonathan spoke to author andrew hallam about the pursuit of happiness and how to lead the life you really want. in this, the second, episode he interviews alex davis. alex trained as an accountant and worked for many years for the family business. when the business was sold, alex worked as a freelance consultant but felt she needed to pursue a new direction. so she decided, in her 40s, to go to university and study ancient history and literature. it’s an inspiring story and well worth half an hour your time to listen to. who knows? it might just inspire you to follow your dreams yourself? the transcript below has been lightly edited for clarity and length. please note, the copyright on this interview belongs to the evidence based investor. if you wish to quote any of it, you are required to attribute it to tebi. we also request that you include a hyperlink to this article. we regularly monitor the internet for breaches of copyright, and any such infringements are dealt with appropriately. jonathan hollow: alex, a lot of your life at the moment is about ovid. who was ovid? alex davis: ovid was a roman poet. he was a contemporary of the first emperor, augustus, and he was a major part of the imperial regime … feeding into that idea of a glorious empire. unfortunately, we don’t know what he did, but he upset augustus and he was exiled to what’s now constanța in romania in 8 ce, and he never saw rome again. he wasn’t allowed to return; and unfortunately, he died there 10 years later. and i’m working on the exile poetry that he sent back while he was there. jonathan hollow: and what are you trying to find out about ovid through his exile poetry? alex davis: i’m doing my own philological analysis of it   my own translation. not to produce a beautiful english translation, but in order to really understand how he was constructing the lines of poetry, and what it is he was doing. and the specifics of the grammar and the vocabulary that he was using   because published translations are simply designed to make the poetry beautiful in english. they are not designed to be grammatically true (necessarily) to the sentence. you need to pick up and read ovid and translate it, rather than reading a published translation. yes, of course there are published translations for ovid’s exile poetry   7,300 odd lines of it … and what i’m looking at is the quite stark difference between ovid’s work pre exile and post exile. he uses totally different themes and ideas post exile, and my thesis is that he’s using his “exile” poetry to recover and also to cement his reputation, both in his own present and and for all time. because he’s in trouble with the imperial house. this could have left him with all his poetry being banned and burned   as one of his poems already was. so he wants to be sure that his name and his reputation lasts. and he was successful. it’s clear from the poetry that he never expected to return from exile because he never actually asks to come back. jonathan hollow: i’d love you to pick up two or three lines of ovid, and read them out to us. give us a view on some of the things that attract you about his language. alex davis: one of the three works that he sent back from exile is called ibis, and it’s modelled on a greek curse poem, and it’s 644 lines of vicious invective. so most of it is gloriously conducted insults. so, for example, i have some lines here, which i particularly enjoy: “and may night be worse for you than day, and day worse than night. may you always be pitiful! may no one pity you, and may men and women rejoice at your troubles.” or in latin: nec corpus querulo nec mens vacet aegra dolore, noxque die gravior sit tibi, nocte dies. sisque miser semper, nec sis miserabilis ulli: gaudeat adversis femina virque tuis. every day, every night gets worse and worse and worse. so, this is is very much the idea that once ovid has cursed you, whoever it is he’s cursing is never escaping. jonathan hollow: i want to return to latin, and what it’s like to learn latin and to become an expert in latin, later in the interview, but for now, we’ll go backwards in time a bit. to say the least, it wasn’t inevitable that you would end up learning and teaching latin poetry. it all started   or rather, it didn’t start   with a family business. alex davis: i didn’t particularly enjoy school. i was a reasonable student and i wanted to do well, but certainly my secondary school wasn’t as encouraging as one would’ve hoped at that time. we’re dealing with a slightly different world   this was 1992. there were no student ambassadors. it was very hard to get a handle on exactly what university was like and i didn’t know anyone else who’d gone, so it was a really closed book to me. so, i decided it wasn’t for me. there seemed to be no redeeming features for it at that point. jonathan hollow: and because there was a family business, i guess there was a pressure or an expectation that that would be a place for you to go? alex davis: by the time i left school, my parents’ business had grown. we had about ten or eleven employees, i think, at that point. both my brother and i had spent a lot of time as kids kind of doing some work in the holidays and helping out. we cleaned the buildings for years every evening   and that gave us a bit of an income, but it also gave us a really good idea of what was going on and how the business worked. i don’t know whether it was an expectation that we would go in, but at the time i was finishing my a levels, my mother’s parents were getting quite elderly, they needed a bit more help. so my mum stepped back   she was company secretary and accountant   and i learned the the job of accounts assistant at that point whilst doing it, and i also attended college in dover evening release to study accountancy as a formal qualification, as an nvq. jonathan hollow: were there any other ambitions or expectations in the air? alex davis: i think eventually the expectation became that both my brother and i   he’s a salesman and an engineer   that we would take over a lot more responsibility as my parents and our technical director, richard, stepped back as time went on. so, it was a gradual thing. my parents were also also getting much older. they wanted to retire completely, which is quite understandable   who wouldn’t? one day, they came in and said, “right, we need to have a director’s meeting.” the four of us sat down, my dad said, “i think it’s time we sold our business, and this is the reason why,” and i burst into tears. life was very stable. we had a good income, we were successful. everything was going very smoothly and all of a sudden … … wallop! ah. now what on earth happens? jonathan hollow: the business was then sold, and i think you did some additional consultancy work for it for a while. alex davis: yes, i did. jonathan hollow: but one day, it was behind you. this thing that had occupied so much of your life for all your career really, was not there anymore. tell us about how you felt after you’d had that longer period to process the change. alex davis: we worked very, very hard to sell it to the right people; and in that 18 months, i had a chance to think, “okay, what am i going to do now?” i’ve always worked effectively in a management position, even though i wasn’t technically management when i started. what’s that going to be like? do i want to work for somebody else in this business? do i want to see somebody making changes to it, and have to fight all the time to go   “no, i don’t think that’s a very… oh no, it’s not my responsibility any more.” personally, i’d also met my partner owen; and he is a senior lecturer at kent. and so i knew a lot more about university than i had done before. i’d visited the campus a few times, come to the theatre and things like that, so i knew it was a beautiful place to be and i’d started to think, “well, maybe i’ll do this now. maybe i’ll go to university. i’ll invest a bit of the money we’re going to get for our shares and actually go,” and   with a bit of advice from his colleague who’s an admissions officer for the university   i discovered an adult learning qualification called “access to higher education diploma”, and i’d registered for that. by the time we actually sold it and did some consultancy and i stepped back as some new owners wanted, i was really excited about making that change. jonathan hollow: and what was then your route between then, and starting to study at the university of kent? alex davis: i took this access to higher education diploma, which is a level three qualification, equivalent to three a levels, and i took that full time at canterbury college for a year. that gave me the qualifications i needed to apply to university, and a lot of support and help in that university application process   not least of which coming from the university themselves, which is where i first met one of the ladies i now work for in our outreach team. and i started at the university of kent in september 2016, as a full time undergraduate in classical studies. jonathan hollow: we’re going to delve a bit more into your working world at the university of kent, as well as your world of study, but i just have a couple of questions about money. as i understand it at the moment, you are earning not very much money   perhaps an amount that many people might find it difficult to live on, but you obviously have a very fulfilling life. i’m just curious about your present relationship to money. if you don’t need money to live on, are there other reasons why you need it? do you need it for validation? would you do what you currently do for no money at all? alex davis: i think that the first thing to do is to deal with the fact that i am in a very lucky position. we were paid for our shares. i was paid good money for consultancy for three months, and i was paid effectively to go away; and my partner works full time, so we were placed in a lucky position. would i do outreach work for the fun of it? yes, i would (but please don’t tell the outreach department that)! but it’s important to have an income, i think, and important to have that idea of a job … and everybody should be paid for the job that they do. that’s important. and as students in particular, having a stable income, but which also fits in with one’s timetable and everything is so important, which is why working for the university makes so much sense, because that’s an employer who understands you also have a degree to worry about. jonathan hollow: you were obviously earning a much higher salary before and, to some extent, a high salary can be a bit of a trap. i mean, if there are people listening to this and thinking, “gosh, i’m not sure i could leap off this into a new life,” have you got any thoughts or reflections from your own experience that would be relevant to those people? alex davis: i think it’s easy to look back and say: yes, it was time to make a change. i’d been in business for 22 years, full time   and a lot longer than that, in parts, as a kid. but it’s sometimes easy to not see any further than what we’re going to do next week, what we’re going to do today, and what the job has for us. i think i’m the personification of “it’s never too late”. i am a trained financial accountant and now i study latin poetry. this is not the 1800s anymore. we’re not living in a dickens novel. if you become a lawyer at 17, you don’t have to still be a lawyer when you’re 70. if you decide, for whatever reason, that this world doesn’t agree with you: well, go and do something else! life’s too short to stay doing something that doesn’t necessarily make you happy, even if you are earning a small fortune doing it. looking back, i probably should have made a break earlier than that. jonathan hollow: you touched on this a little bit earlier, but i’d love you to expand on it   about the skills that you brought from running a business and being in the world of business, to being a student and a doctoral student. alex davis: as you know, we have deadlines for our assignments. we have preparatory work to do for our classes and, particularly as a phd student, there’s no timetable. you have to motivate yourself to get that work done, because it matters, and because you’ve committed to do it. so i’ve not had a problem with organising my time, making sure i’ve got a to do list, making sure i know what’s coming up ahead of me. i’ve not missed a deadline, i’ve not missed a class   simply because i spent 20 odd years working with organisations who didn’t have any wiggle room with deadlines. so you learn that stuff. you can’t run a business without it. jonathan hollow: about half your time is on your studies, i believe, and about half is broadly outreach work. you are clearly very enthusiastic about it in its own right and probably because of your own personal experiences with it. alex davis: yes, without question. i know how much it helped me, along with visit days to the university, orientating ourselves, getting sample lectures, sample seminars, talks about how it worked, all of which enabled me to arrive here feeling confident. so what we’re doing is demystifying the process, dragging the ivory towers down a little bit, and saying, “look, this is what university’s like. this is how you apply. this is what it’s good for. this is how cool it is. this is why it’s different to school. this is how it’s the same as school or college,” and what we’re saying is   if you want to go   great! go. we’re not selling higher education, we’re certainly not selling the university of kent. i’ve seen one sentence, either from myself or one of my colleagues, change the way a student looks. they suddenly get that it’s their choice. they can do what they like. their path through their lives is not set by what school wants, or maybe what their parents want, or what whoever in their lives wants. they don’t have to do what their mates are going to do. they get to choose, and the whole planet opens out in front of them. the systems are in place, so we enable students basically to make the right choice for them at that point. and also say to them, “look, even if you make a choice now and you go down this path. if, in two years time, or ten years time or 20 years time, you change your mind and think, actually, no, i want to do something else. well, then go and do something else!” but it is just astonishing to watch it happen in real time. jonathan hollow: and does it ever take you outside your comfort zone? alex davis: i remember arriving at a school to give a talk to some parents for a sixth form open evening, and the member of staff who i was meeting at the school, she said to me, “oh, great. glad you’re here. that’s lovely. we’ve got about 200 parents and students, so not too big an audience there. that’s alright, isn’t it?” and inside i’m shrieking, but i’m wearing the university of kent t  shirt. so on the outside: i went, “yeah, that’s absolutely fine, no problems at all.” then they put us all on the stage and then they said, “oh, this is alex. she’s from the university of kent, she’s going to talk to you about about that,” and i got up and i walked across the stage to the lectern, and i took a deep breath, and i gave the talk. massively outside my comfort zone! but sometimes you give a talk, and you talk to one particular student and you think, “yeah, you’d be great.” and i’ve said to students, “you should come. if you come to kent, sign up to be an ambassador, you’d be a fantastic ambassador. you’re going to make a great student. go for it. best of luck.” and you arrive at the training for the new ambassadors and somebody taps you on the shoulder, and you turn round and there’s that student. and they’re now a fellow ambassador as a student, and they say: “you are the reason i’m here. you’re the reason i’m an ambassador.” i can never find words to explain what it’s like, but it makes me tearful in a happy way, again, that i’ve made a difference. so the times at which i’m thinking, “oh goodness, 200 people!” are vastly outweighed by the times i go, “yes, i love this job!” jonathan hollow: that sounds like the most amazing … what i would call … outer life. i’d like now to turn back to your kind of inner life and your study, and just probe that a little bit more. i mean, latin itself: so much of it is hugely important to our history and civilisation. can you give me a few impressions about learning this strange language? alex davis: latin functions, as you know, very differently to how english functions. the endings of the words change according to the function of the word in the sentence. the sentence “alex eats cake” can be written in latin as “cake, alex eats”, and it doesn’t matter because the ending of the words are changing according to whether the subject, object   whatever. so, it can be quite mathematical really in trying to decode it. and you see how many words are from those latin words. and indeed … in french, in spanish, and in particularly italian … how much of a debt our language, and those other romance languages, those other european languages, owe to the romans and to latin. and latin leans on greek in a lot of places as well. latin is so much more than a dead language. because in a very real sense, it’s not dead. we’re speaking it all the time. jonathan hollow: i’m interested in the contrast between when you were working for the family business   i suppose in many ways the business was the thing, and you were serving it. you were helping it to function. but now you are “alex davis, the scholar”, and your opinions are the thing. you are becoming an expert on ovid, and people want to know what you think. so it’s a very different framing of you and the ego, i suppose. so i’m just curious: do you feel like you are a different person? are you becoming a different person? alex davis: yes, i am different since i’ve been a student because, as you say, i have much more agency over the way my life unfolds now. not that i regret the time i spent in business   not at all. it was immensely valuable, lots of fun, and it’s a time i look back on with great fondness, and it was certainly extremely valuable in what i do now. but now, i decide. i decide which jobs i apply for. i decide what my angle is on ovid’s poetry. i decide what i’m going to do every day, and am i going to be on campus, am i not? am i going to work on my phd? am i going to meet up with the mature students’ society? (i’m the student rep for the postgrad research students in classics   so that involves a lot of meetings, and engagements with students, and talking to them, and passing on and representing them at the university level.) and all of these things are really fulfilling. i know all this might sound a little bit like, “oh my gosh, she thinks everything’s great,” but do you know what? i do! i’ve had the chance to shape what i want to study and when. i made the choice to stay for a master’s, i made the choice to stay for a phd. i discovered a career that i didn’t know existed until i started at canterbury college. i didn’t know outreach was a thing, and indeed   when i did my a levels   it wasn’t a thing. there wasn’t that ability for anybody to do that work   that work didn’t exist, to the best of my knowledge. so i’ve made those choices, i’ve made deliberate choices, and that makes my world much happier. my voice is appreciated and i am recognised. just on friday, i had the lovely news that i’ve been shortlisted for an award from a national education opportunities network   neon. the university’s outreach department submitted a nomination for me as their national student of the year award, and i have been shortlisted for it. jonathan hollow: you clearly love being part of an academic community, at all levels. you are part of the faculty, all the way to people who aren’t even students at the university yet. so i’m interested in the pleasures and the satisfactions of that. maybe you could say, describe that a little and then contrast that with the kind of core part of your study   which is alone with books at a desk. this has its own pleasures, i guess. alex davis: i find, with research, that some of the best ideas i have come after i write some things   then i get up and i walk away and i meet some friends for a cup of coffee. or i go and give a talk over in one of the other buildings or something to some students from a local school. and i’m walking back from that to my office, and suddenly that lightning bolt of research hits your head, and you go, “ah! that’s a really good way to think about it! that’s the point. that’s what he’s doing. that’s how ovid’s thinking about that. oh, that is such an interesting word he uses.” so, i need that time away from it: to chat to other people, to find out about what they’re interested in, to engage with that community on campus   and indeed off in other places   as well as having that time to work. that’s one of the reasons why my phd is part time, because then i’ve got time to devote to other things, and also that separation to not feel like i have to work on it all day, every day. i can afford to do things that make me happy as well, and bring in some money, but also to have time to devote to it as well. and, again, that gives a bit of variety. jonathan hollow: a big theme of this series is kind of making plans and changing plans, and i’m just interested in your thinking about this   particularly when you are mentoring young people and encouraging them to apply to university, or maybe to make an active choice not to go to university. are you encouraging them to have a career plan or a life plan? alex davis: it’s neither, really! what it’s really about is: each qualification you do in an education system, or each choice you make in your life, is a stepping stone to the next one. if you don’t know what your path is   that’s fine. i didn’t decide what i wanted to do when i grew up until i was about 43 years old. when you’re younger, most people don’t know what they want do. so at that point, make the right choice for right now. choose gcses you’re good at and that you enjoy, and that are fairly well rounded. then, when you get to the next level, make your level three qualification decision. do i have to a b tech? do i do ib? do i go to college and do a t level, or something much more practical? do i stay and do a levels? what is it i like to do? so make those choices and make that a stepping stone to the next thing. so, i think it’s less of making a career plan or a life plan, but more about inspiring people and saying, “it’s okay not to know.” there are jobs now that didn’t exist 20 years ago. so things move quickly. make a choice. see what comes out of it and, maybe, while you’re studying classics, you’ll suddenly discover there’s a job over there you didn’t know existed that makes you really, really happy   and that’s what it is you want to do. jonathan hollow: and when you are doing that outreach, do you think it’s part of your role to spur ambition? alex davis: yes, absolutely. but ambition doesn’t mean the same thing to everybody. it’s making it okay for ambition to mean whatever it means to you. if you want to go on and own a huge great company   if you want to be steve jobs, that’s brilliant. but actually, if what you want to do is be really happy and enjoy your schooling and enjoy your life and you don’t want to earn billions of pounds, that’s equally fine. and not everybody is the same, because it would be really dull if we were. jonathan hollow: thank you. that’s been absolutely fascinating, alex, and thank you for   as ever   wearing your heart on your sleeve. and i’m sure that’s part of the reason why you’re such a brilliant outreach ambassador. alex davis: thank you. jonathan hollow: i do hope you get that award. alex davis: the best thing has already happened: that my employer cares enough about the work i do. and one of the reasons is that i’ve been at the university for a long time. i’ve been here for seven years nearly, already. so i’ve had a chance to build up a body of work   which, if you’re only here for three years as an undergraduate, you don’t get a chance to do. but to be nominated is astonishing. to be shortlisted is even more astonishing. that’s fantastic. we’re going to go to the house of commons for the award ceremony on the 9th of may, and if i get it   wonderful, that’s great! and if i don’t, i’m already happy. so that’s alright! jonathan hollow: so that was alex davis. since we recorded this interview, she won the national award she had been entered for   neon student of the year   for her amazing outreach work on behalf of higher education. i’m sure you’ll agree that, with her unstoppable enthusiasm for her ambassador work, the award is richly deserved. © the evidence based investor mmxxiv. all rights reserved. unauthorised use and/ or duplication of this material without express and written permission is strictly prohibited. fees are the most reliable predictor of future returns has sports betting made fund managers less risk averse? 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agree & join linkedin by clicking continue to join or sign in, you agree to linkedin’s user agreement, privacy policy, and cookie policy. deputy director at the dallaire institute for children peace and security   african centre of excellence it's never too late tech and gtm hiring for startups   proven patterns⚡ex amazon, cognizant, labcorp⚡ linkedin top voice   talent management, career counseling and career path planning ⚡neurodiversity advocate. who says you’re running out of time? spoiler: you’re not. life is yours to shape, no matter your age or stage. ◾ not too late to pivot your career. ◾ not too late to get that degree you’ve always dreamed of. ◾ not too late to walk away from relationships or situations that don’t bring you joy. stop letting others dictate what your life “should” look like at any age. i’ve been there, and trust me it’s suffocating. growing up, i saw so many people buckle under the weight of societal expectations:   the pressure to be married by 25.   the stigma of prioritizing a career over “traditional” roles. i’ve watched brilliant, ambitious women settle for less, not because they wanted to, but because they were told they had to. but here’s the truth i’ve learned from the trailblazing, fearless people who inspired me:   your timeline is yours.   your choices are yours.   your life is yours. so, go for it. ✔️ study something new. ✔️ change careers at 30, 40, 50 whenever. ✔️ wear the outfit that makes you feel like a badass. ✔️ love boldly or not at all. every day is a new chance to rewrite your story. take all the time you need to make choices that truly serve you. you are in control. always. to view or add a comment, sign in ii listen with tolerances ii speak with empathy li see thru compassion ll breathe in impermanence kumud deepali r. 💚💐 everyone is unique and has a special story to say : 1. don't feel bad for starting late, maybe you have a better story than who started early. 2. you seriously have no idea on what people are dealing with in everyday life. 3. no risk no glory, no failure no story 4. never compare your progress with others, your success story may be stronger lesson 🙏 so just be nice , its that simple . as every person is traveling in their own time zone to unleash their potential driven purpose. 5. when your heart is broken, your brain starts working   struggle build character   don't try to skip it   don't compare yourself   everyone has a unique story to say. 6. don't be afraid to start again. you might like your new story better. 7. time to start   start now..start where you are.   start making progress.   start with what you have.   start with all of your insecurities.   start with what you already know.   start moving towards your goals.   start and make mistakes.   start small. start now. with gratitude 🙏 #growthroughwhstyougothrough tech and gtm hiring for startups   proven patterns⚡ex amazon, cognizant, labcorp⚡ linkedin top voice   talent management, career counseling and career path planning ⚡neurodiversity advocate. who says you’re running out of time? spoiler: you’re not. life is yours to shape, no matter your age or stage. ◾ not too late to pivot your career. ◾ not too late to get that degree you’ve always dreamed of. ◾ not too late to walk away from relationships or situations that don’t bring you joy. stop letting others dictate what your life “should” look like at any age. i’ve been there, and trust me it’s suffocating. growing up, i saw so many people buckle under the weight of societal expectations:   the pressure to be married by 25.   the stigma of prioritizing a career over “traditional” roles. i’ve watched brilliant, ambitious women settle for less, not because they wanted to, but because they were told they had to. but here’s the truth i’ve learned from the trailblazing, fearless people who inspired me:   your timeline is yours.   your choices are yours.   your life is yours. so, go for it. ✔️ study something new. ✔️ change careers at 30, 40, 50 whenever. ✔️ wear the outfit that makes you feel like a badass. ✔️ love boldly or not at all. every day is a new chance to rewrite your story. take all the time you need to make choices that truly serve you. you are in control. always. to view or add a comment, sign in | राधे राधे | freelance ai/ml developer & engineer | building and deploying ai solutions | corporate trainer ai/ml | bridging healthcare,education and ai for tech solutions | ex wockhardt, cipla, eris | founder nbpo it’s never too late life is a journey, not a race. whether you're learning a new skill, switching careers, or pursuing a passion you've always dreamed of, remember: it's never too late to start. we often hold ourselves back with thoughts like, “i should have started earlier,” but every day you decide to move forward is a step in the right direction. stay curious. stay persistent. and trust the process. here’s to new beginnings and endless possibilities! 🚀 #growthmindset #lifelonglearning #newbeginning tech and gtm hiring for startups   proven patterns⚡ex amazon, cognizant, labcorp⚡ linkedin top voice   talent management, career counseling and career path planning ⚡neurodiversity advocate. who says you’re running out of time? spoiler: you’re not. life is yours to shape, no matter your age or stage. ◾ not too late to pivot your career. ◾ not too late to get that degree you’ve always dreamed of. ◾ not too late to walk away from relationships or situations that don’t bring you joy. stop letting others dictate what your life “should” look like at any age. i’ve been there, and trust me it’s suffocating. growing up, i saw so many people buckle under the weight of societal expectations:   the pressure to be married by 25.   the stigma of prioritizing a career over “traditional” roles. i’ve watched brilliant, ambitious women settle for less, not because they wanted to, but because they were told they had to. but here’s the truth i’ve learned from the trailblazing, fearless people who inspired me:   your timeline is yours.   your choices are yours.   your life is yours. so, go for it. ✔️ study something new. ✔️ change careers at 30, 40, 50 whenever. ✔️ wear the outfit that makes you feel like a badass. ✔️ love boldly or not at all. every day is a new chance to rewrite your story. take all the time you need to make choices that truly serve you. you are in control. always. to view or add a comment, sign in 🛰️proven physics & math mentor 🧑🤝🧑life & mindfulness coach 👮 nda & ssb guru 🧑💼director at wca pune 🧑💻 director at mission happiness 🛫ano at air ncc🏆best cadet ncc 🛶 boat pulling gold medalist🥇 in a world where societal norms often dictate our paths, it’s essential to remember that the timeline of your life is yours to shape. as we navigate our careers and personal journeys, we must embrace the notion that it's never too late to pivot, pursue your dreams, or redefine what happiness means to you.many of us have felt the pressure of expectations   whether it’s achieving milestones by a certain age or adhering to traditional roles. however, the truth is that your choices are your own. every day presents an opportunity to redefine your story, whether that involves enrolling in a course, making a career change, or simply choosing joy over obligation.let’s inspire one another to break free from limitations, celebrate our unique paths, and take control of the narrative. remember, it’s your journey, and you set the pace. #careerdevelopment #personalgrowth #empowerment #lifechoices #mindsetshift tech and gtm hiring for startups   proven patterns⚡ex amazon, cognizant, labcorp⚡ linkedin top voice   talent management, career counseling and career path planning ⚡neurodiversity advocate. who says you’re running out of time? spoiler: you’re not. life is yours to shape, no matter your age or stage. ◾ not too late to pivot your career. ◾ not too late to get that degree you’ve always dreamed of. ◾ not too late to walk away from relationships or situations that don’t bring you joy. stop letting others dictate what your life “should” look like at any age. i’ve been there, and trust me it’s suffocating. growing up, i saw so many people buckle under the weight of societal expectations:   the pressure to be married by 25.   the stigma of prioritizing a career over “traditional” roles. i’ve watched brilliant, ambitious women settle for less, not because they wanted to, but because they were told they had to. but here’s the truth i’ve learned from the trailblazing, fearless people who inspired me:   your timeline is yours.   your choices are yours.   your life is yours. so, go for it. ✔️ study something new. ✔️ change careers at 30, 40, 50 whenever. ✔️ wear the outfit that makes you feel like a badass. ✔️ love boldly or not at all. every day is a new chance to rewrite your story. take all the time you need to make choices that truly serve you. you are in control. always. to view or add a comment, sign in regional sales manager the core of this post is that there’s no set timeline for success or happiness, and we should follow our own path, regardless of age or societal expectations. it's important to remind ourselves, from time to time, to keep moving forward and create our own successful stories. every step, big or small, helps us shape the life we want. #ownyourstory #notimelimit #keepmovingforward #liveonyourterms #createyoursuccess #rewriteyourlife #fearlesslivin #employeeappreciation #teammorale #leadershiptips #positiveworkculture #recognitionmatters #boostingproductivity #appreciationatwork #newmanagermistakes #delegateeffectively #team #managingup #positiveattitude #learningjourney #innovation #adaptability #riskmanagement #ai #collaboration #careerlessons #geopolitics #technology #staycurious #professionaldevelopment #learnfrommistakes #steppingstones #moveforward #forgiveyourself #selfimprovement #mistakesarelessons #growstronger #overcomemistakes #bebetter #neverrepeat #confidenceingrowth #lifelessons #startnow #takeaction #overcomefear #learnbydoing #buildhabits #successstrategy #nomoreprocrastination #actioniskey #motivationtostart #growthmindset #inspireothers #arthurashe #startwhereyouare #makeithappen #legacyofkindness tech and gtm hiring for startups   proven patterns⚡ex amazon, cognizant, labcorp⚡ linkedin top voice   talent management, career counseling and career path planning ⚡neurodiversity advocate. who says you’re running out of time? spoiler: you’re not. life is yours to shape, no matter your age or stage. ◾ not too late to pivot your career. ◾ not too late to get that degree you’ve always dreamed of. ◾ not too late to walk away from relationships or situations that don’t bring you joy. stop letting others dictate what your life “should” look like at any age. i’ve been there, and trust me it’s suffocating. growing up, i saw so many people buckle under the weight of societal expectations:   the pressure to be married by 25.   the stigma of prioritizing a career over “traditional” roles. i’ve watched brilliant, ambitious women settle for less, not because they wanted to, but because they were told they had to. but here’s the truth i’ve learned from the trailblazing, fearless people who inspired me:   your timeline is yours.   your choices are yours.   your life is yours. so, go for it. ✔️ study something new. ✔️ change careers at 30, 40, 50 whenever. ✔️ wear the outfit that makes you feel like a badass. ✔️ love boldly or not at all. every day is a new chance to rewrite your story. take all the time you need to make choices that truly serve you. you are in control. always. to view or add a comment, sign in women's career breakthrough specialist 🚀 from career confusion to clarity in 8 weeks 🔥 march 2025 exclusive mastermind | now accepting applications! (featured section) making a decision is rarely about one single factor. it’s a blend of ideas, wants, needs, values, and goals all swirling together. at what most would call the “tipping point” in my career, i had a choice: speed up into a bigger, flashier role, or slow down to make space for something more personal and meaningful. i should’ve leapt at the promotion, right? it promised a shinier title, bigger paycheck, and high visibility. the level i’d been chasing for years… but my heart was asking for something else: room to grow personally, to nurture a new relationship, to explore what could unfold with someone special who’d just stepped into my life. saying yes to that next career level meant saying no to myself and i wasn’t ready to do that. 💔 i realized that focusing on all the “what ifs” of the future only pulled me away from what was right in front of me: an opportunity to maintain my career momentum without sacrificing who i wanted to be outside of work. 📌 the takeaway: we will never have 100% of the facts or information. that’s not realistic. instead, we can learn to trust in the information we do have and the practice choosing what’s right for us right now. what did i choose? i said no to speeding up my career pace and i yes to exploring love. fast forward: this year, we’re celebrating six years of marriage and a decade together. 🔥 and my career? it’s more aligned, purposeful, and truly mine than ever before. 🌱 ✨ ready to start making decisions that feel like you? 👉 download my free decision making guide here: https://lnkd.in/g873gemr. 👋 hi, i’m andrea, a career development coach helping women align their decisions with their values and purpose. let’s make the choices that move you toward a life you truly love. to view or add a comment, sign in leadership & resilience expert for lawyers | speaker, trainer, executive coach | former lawyer & psychotherapist | author | lead with authenticity “you’ve had 3 different careers? aren’t you like 25?” my new friend said to me. i’m not 25 (i’m flattered, though thank you, asian genes). but in all seriousness, i’ve made a lot of intentional changes in my life. back in university, i switched majors five times before finally settling. i have three unrelated degrees, and now i do work that, honestly, probably didn’t require any of them. i've joined and left religions. some might say i have a problem. the truth is, my “problem” was that i needed to live in alignment with who i truly was. and as i got to know myself on a deeper level accelerated by my struggle with depression i couldn’t ignore the pull to go in the direction that felt true to me. sometimes, that meant losing relationships and communities that no longer fit. sometimes, it meant financial struggles. but what i gained was far greater: the freedom of authenticity, amazing new relationships, unexpected adventures, and trust in myself, others, and the universe. no matter how hard things got, i learned it always works out in the end. that’s why i do the work i do now. i help people connect with their own authenticity, so they can live courageously and unapologetically as who they are, quirks and all. i still have moments when i struggle with “feeling good enough.” the difference now is that when i’m tempted to prove myself, to quiet that inner critic, i choose instead to just be. i am who i am and whether that’s good enough for others is none of my business. what about you? are you contemplating a big change in your life? or maybe feeling the pull to live more authentically and express your true self? i’d love to hear your story. send me a dm, and let’s have a real conversation. to view or add a comment, sign in sharing stories * elevating voices * researching inclusion & belonging * recipient of the doctoral scholarship for research on equity, diversity and inclusion if i channeled taylor’s eras model, i’d say this is my ‘feel everything’ era. i had a chat yesterday with a dear friend and it made me think about heartbreak and grieving when it comes to our careers. do we spend enough time grieving the promotion we didn’t get? do we allow ourselves to feel the absolute heartbreak of leaving a job we love? do we allow ourselves to feel the shame of rejection when we don’t get the call back? i made a lot of changes over the course of my career, and i did a great job shoving down all these feelings (until there was no more room). we live in a time of toxic positivity, of bright sides and upsides. a time where we’re told that our tears will only hold us back. here’s your permission to join me in the feelings era. and guess what, you can feel absolute heartache, and when you’re done, you can also move forward with hope and positivity. isn’t that something? #feelings #mentalhealth #eras #career #courageousconversations #leadership #humanresources #hope to view or add a comment, sign in helping coaches to sign dream clients consistently, go full time in their business & quit 9 5 for good | business & transformation coach | content | messaging | sales | strategy | mindset turns out i was worrying for nothing 🤦♀️ i used to work in a job that made me feel stuck & uninspired. every morning, i would wake up with a sense of dread, feeling like i was wasting my potential & to be honest, wasting my life!! but i didn’t know what i would do instead. i constantly questioned my career choices. i felt like i couldn’t trust myself to make a decision. sound familiar? 🤔 one day, i simply decided enough was enough. i didn’t want to live another day repeating the same old thing. i realised that living in fear of mistakes was the only thing holding me back from the life i wanted. i threw myself in personal development, invested in myself and learned everything i could about overcoming limiting beliefs. it wasn’t easy, but with each small step, i felt more empowered. i started setting clear goals and taking small actions towards a career that truly excited me. today, i am not only living a life i love but also helping driven & ambitious women do the same. as a transformation coach, i guide women from feeling stuck and uninspired at work to becoming fired up and ready to thrive in all areas of their lives. seeing my clients break free from their fears and embrace their potential is the best feeling & i really have to pinch myself that this is my job. i love the work i do but the biggest blessing has been the impact on my personal life. i’ve got so much more energy to do the things i love. i wake up earlier than i used to because i’m actually excited about the day ahead. i work a lot more hours but i have so much more quality times with my friends, family & fiancé. it scares me to think that i almost missed out on all of this because i was worried of making the wrong decision. remember, it’s not about making the perfect decision; it’s about trusting yourself to handle any outcome. you have no idea how limitless the opportunities really are. 👉 are you ready to unlock your full potential and create a life you love? drop me a message & let’s look at how we can transform your career. to view or add a comment, sign in fashion specialist|sustainability enthusiasts|certified career coach and navigator |alx certified|ai enthusiast|makeup artist 🎯from struggle to resilience🎯: my journey💥 as i sit here, reflecting on my life's journey, i am reminded that success is not a destination, but a continuous process. growing up in a broken home, with no financial safety net, i learned to rely on myself from a young age. i began writing down my pains and struggles in primary school, finding solace in putting my emotions into words. despite the challenges, i persevered, working multiple jobs, selling and even venturing into fashion school. i excelled, and my determination only grew stronger. but, life had another test in store for me   falling victim to a ponzi scheme. in that moment, i felt like giving up. yet, i refuse to let my circumstances define me. i believe in my ability to rise again, to find a fulfilling and legal way to earn a living. 🥰i'd love to hear from you: 🎯1. what challenges have you faced in your journey, and how did you overcome them? 🎯2. how do you stay resilient in the face of adversity? 🎯3. what advice would you give to someone who feels like giving up? 💪💥let's share our stories, and support one another in our pursuit of success. #resilience #perseverance #determination #successmindset   ms. sakhie's to view or add a comment, sign in empowering high achievers | us olympian | certified career, leadership & executive coach | founder of ascension coaching | unlock your inner olympian are you happy at your 9 5? ⏰ if your current role feels like just a paycheck, it might be time for a change. when you love what you do, work becomes more than a task it becomes a source of growth, energy, and fulfillment. don’t settle for less. your passion is out there, and finding it could transform your life and career in ways you never imagined. it takes courage, but the rewards are worth it. ready to start your journey? dive into my latest blog for insights on making the shift... https://lnkd.in/gunrntxf #career #passion #growth #purpose #motivation #change #success #blog #tips #linkedincommunity to view or add a comment, sign in 3,020 followers create your free account or sign in to continue your search or by clicking continue to join or sign in, you agree to linkedin’s user agreement, privacy policy, and cookie policy. new to linkedin? 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supported by patrick milando, an accomplished french horn player, now splits his time between the orchestra pit and the cockpit, where he teaches budding pilots like he himself once was. by chris colin lyn slater, 70, was deemed the accidental icon by a college fashion student. she now has nearly one million followers on social media and is upending notions of aging. by alix strauss at 81 years old, eleanor hamby and dr. sandra hazelip traveled from the icy shores of antarctica to the rocky majesty of the grand canyon   in 80 days. by jennifer harlan when myron rolle was cut from the pittsburgh steelers, he fell into a funk until his mother reminded him of his two childhood dreams: play football, then become a neurosurgeon. it was time for plan b. by elena bergeron it’s never too late to pick up your life and move to italy holly herrmann vowed to move to italy when she was 20. her dream came true 38 years later. by alix strauss it’s never too late to publish a debut book and score a netflix deal jocelyn nicole johnson, at 50, is not the average age of a debut author. but the public school teacher describes herself as a “literary debutante” with the october publication of “my monticello.” by isaac fitzgerald it’s never too late to ‘fly’ on a trapeze tom moore made a name for himself as a film, tv and theater director. but his dream has always been to “fly” on the trapeze, high in the air. and that’s what he is doing at age 79. by abby ellin did you switch gears later in life? we want to hear from you. we’re looking for inspiring people who are living life according to their own timeline for our series, “it’s never too late.” it’s never too late to uproot your life and open an inn in early 2020, maureen mcnamara and her wife, jennifer stark, traded in their popular restaurant in michigan for an inn nestled in the catskill mountains of new york. the inn opened just days before the pandemic was declared. by alix strauss it’s never too late to become an activist thirteen years ago, bonnie mckinlay, a former schoolteacher, retired and embraced another passion: climate activism. she’s been arrested four times, but says it’s worth it. by alix strauss it’s never too late to take up water polo mark braly, 86, has spent the last decade playing a particularly challenging team sport. is he good? no   but that’s not the point. by alix strauss it’s never too late to learn the tango and fall in love nancy cardwell was a successful newspaper editor in new york. then she took up tango, started spending time in buenos aires   and met luis. by nell mcshane wulfhart during the pandemic, joanna patchett spent 18 harrowing months in the intensive care unit. she discovered that medicine isn’t just about science   it’s also about heart. by alix strauss shaun eli breidbart was a banker on wall street for 19 years but he gave up a lucrative career in favor of happiness. by pierre antoine louis devon simmons served 15 years in prison for crimes he committed as a teenager. since then, he’s been on a mission to remake not just his own life, but the legal system itself. by chris colin richard klein left behind his life as a hebrew day school teacher in california and became an actor in mumbai, often playing a “mean british officer.” by sheila yasmin marikar dierdre wolownick, whose son, alex honnold, is one of the world’s top rock climbers, ascended yosemite’s el capitan to celebrate her 70th birthday. by tim neville for phyllis raphael, 86, a chance meeting on the street turned into a get together. then came a date. a second and third followed. so did a love affair. by alix strauss after coming out as a transgender woman more than two years ago, vica steel never dreamed of forging a path to church leadership. until now. by derek m. norman martha prewitt performed as an opera singer for 15 years. but passions wane. she now runs the family farm in kentucky, singing arias to cattle and corn. sometimes bugs fly into her mouth. by chris colin for a celebrated architecture professor at the university of california, berkeley, an album of 11 original songs, in a variety of genres, was eight decades in the making. by chris colin for 65 year old rose young, horseback riding was about finding a new joy. it was also her reward for surviving breast cancer. by alix strauss

elizabeth oldfield speaks to new york times columnist david brooks. 08/12/2021 david is an op ed columnist for the new york times, a radio and television host, author of multiple bestselling books, and chair of weave the social fabric project at the aspen institute, among many other things. he speaks about the distancing effects of fame, his midlife crisis and subsequent conversion to christianity, and the challenges of talking about morality in public life at the immense difficulty of dying to ourselves. each episode in this series includes an additional reflection from elizabeth at the end, so keep listening if you’d like to. we are also publishing full transcripts of each episode so scroll down on this page if you’re a reader rather than a listener. you can read a full transcript of the episode here: elizabethhello, and welcome to the sacred. my name is elizabeth oldfield. this is a podcast about the deep values that drive us, the people behind the positions in our public conversations, and how we can build empathy across the very many, many things that we disagree on. every episode, i speak to someone who has some kind of public voice or platform, from activists to artists, journalists, to philosophers, entrepreneurs, to academics, to comic book writers to archbishops and many more. i’m trying to listen deeply to people from a wide range of positions, to understand how they got to where they are both in their professional life and in their thinking, and learn from their wisdom about how we can better cross our divides. if you listen long enough, you should hear someone that you wouldn’t naturally choose to listen to who you might even vehemently disagree with or dislike. and it’s helpful to notice that those two things often come together. but i hope you will, by listening, increase your understanding, and maybe even learn something interesting. i have done this long enough now to know that everyone is more complicated, usually more conflicted, and often more a person of goodwill than i perhaps perceived them to be before we met. it’s really helped complicate my narratives about the different tribes in public life. and i really hope that it does for you too. in this new series, you may already have noticed that we are adding some reflections at the end so i can chew over and reflect on my thoughts after the interview. so do keep listening, if you would like to. and as usual, if you have a moment, wherever you are now   on the bus, walking down the street, on the toilet, maybe head over to itunes, and leave us a little rating or review. i’d be really grateful for that. and remember, one of the most helpful things you can do is send an episode to a friend and start a conversation with them. we really really love encouraging new, interesting, deeper conversations. and in this episode, you’ll hear a conversation i had with david brooks. david is an op ed columnist for the new york times a radio and television host, author of multiple bestselling books, and chair of weave the social fabric project at the aspen institute, among many, many things, you can go and read his very impressive biography for yourselves. we spoke about the distancing effects of fame, his midlife crisis and subsequent conversion to christianity, and the challenges of talking about morality in public life, at the immense difficulty of dying to ourselves, i really hope you enjoy listening. elizabethi’ve actually, i’ve been thinking this morning, david that i was going to kick off by flipping the order of what we usually do. usually right at the end, i ask people about how we navigate across our differences, our tribes, how we build empathy in places where there is division, and i’m going to flip it and ask at the beginning, partly because i know you’re writing about how we learn to really see each other, to really encounter each other as human beings, partly because i am, after the bible, martin buber’s i thou is my kind of secondary, sacred text. and also honestly, because i’ve been having this real wrestle this morning between david brooks, famous new york times columnist, the sort of cultural artefact, the cipher of your identity in public. and then david brooks, fragile, complex human being like everyone else who i want to be able to connect with in this conversation. and the   i find it often when i interview particularly famous people, or powerful people, or   there’s various ways we create distance, right? so i just wanted to name that right at the start to try and get out of the way. and ask are there ways, from what you’re reading, and also from your experiences, that would help this conversation be more i thou, that i can honour you and treat you as a human being and not just someone who i’m trying to extract something from?david yeah, i mean, the thing that comes to mind is   i don’t think this has to do with writing for the new york times and being moderately well known. i think early in life, you put up walls and barriers in order to be efficient, and in order to achieve success, and so i would say i value, i came to value time over people. and that was sort of a natural defence for somebody who’s naturally aloof   my nursery school teacher told me i was an aloof personality. and jerry seinfeld, the comedian said, my friends say i have an intimacy problem, but they don’t really know me. and so that that’s, that’s something i share. and i would say, in midlife, i hopefully have gotten more emotionally open. and i’ve had a couple of occasions where somebody didn’t know me, or somebody knew me a little and saw me say, within a four year interval, and on a couple occasions, five years after they previously had a conversation with me, they said, i’ve never seen anybody change so much in midlife. you were so blocked before. and when i look at videos of my earlier self, i think, wow, i’m really not that guy anymore. which is a good thing. though i suffer a lot more. i was much happier when i was super shallow. i didn’t have any bad emotions, i wasn’t sad in the mornings, so it’s kind of good. i’m so pleased to be shallow. now i’m burdened with the world’s problems.elizabeth even oprah said that to you, which i thought was hilarious. just like, oh david brooks got interesting again.david if oprah knows then that must be the truth because she’s oprah. elizabeth she is. okay. i am going to ask you about the word sacred. tell me both how you feel about it as someone who cares about words, and if you have an intuition about what might be sacred to you.david yeah, i mean, the first thing that leaps to mind is the word soul. and i happen to be a person of faith. but i don’t think you have to be a person of faith to believe in a soul. that you can believe that each person has some piece of themselves that has no size, weight, colour or shape, but has infinite value and dignity. and the reason slavery is wrong is it’s an attempt to insult the soul. rape is an attempt to insult the soul. and we’re not equal in the realm of our ideas or our muscle power. but we’re equal on the level of our soul. and so my view is if you treat everybody who has a longing soul, a soul that longs to be good, you probably treat them the right way. and so that’s the first thing that leaps to mind with sacred. the second and maybe more peculiar thing is time, is transition over the centuries. so when i feel the sacred, i feel that in cathedrals, i feel it on the streets of ephesus. i feel it anytime there have been a progression of people over centuries, who have regarded a place as important. and even in the us, if you go to the gettysburg battlefield. or if you go to waterloo in belgium, and you find places where people were violently alive. and you hear the ghosts, the ghosts of their dead and the beaches of normandy. for some reason, that procession of human interaction over centuries in a sacred place is when i feel that kind of spiritual depth most acutely.elizabeth do you think what you hold sacred has changed? or have those two things being fairly constant?david yeah, i used to hold arsenal sacred. and you know, i think   i definitely think it has changed. i would say what was sacred to me as a kid was probably not that much. i grew up in new york immigrant household. and like new york immigrants, there was a culture in those days of acute anglophilia. and so the phrase was ‘think yiddish, act british.’elizabethi’ve never heard that. davidyeah, and so all the jewish families gave their kids english names so nobody would think they were jewish. and they were names like irving, norman, milton, sydney, it didn’t work at all, because   in america, at least   those were considered jewish names, not english names. but i was sent to an episcopal school called grace church school on lower manhattan. and i looked up at the ceiling of this beautiful, beautiful little school, it looks it’s a gothic chapel. and i certainly had a calling of the sacred. and i’m not sure it was the stained glass, the images of jesus, the stations of the cross, it was more the soaring arches that enlivened something in me even as a four year old, a fourth grade choir boy. elizabeth so you had a sort of   syncretistic feels too strong, it’s usually used negatively. i don’t mean it like that, but certainly a kind of woven inheritance of christianity and judaism in your childhood. what, if anything, i’m going to use the g bomb, was god a presence to you, an absence, a theory at that stage in your life?david an absence. as a jew i experienced judaism as peoplehood, as the exodus story, as a procession of the centuries, as one’s responsibility to a people who just 16 years before i was born, were nearly exterminated from europe. and so the acute sense of peoplehood in the hebrew phrase … from generation to generation, i acutely experienced that then and i acutely experience it now. and christianity was really polite, tall, good looking people. now, i’m exaggerating, but it was like, as an immigrant, these episcopalians were, were essentially anglican, but they were the establishment. and they had, they came from different culture, they didn’t shout as much as we did. but they, but the story and the songs and the hymns were just woven into the fabric of my childhood. but i certainly did not experience any presence of god, i had no encounter with god, i had no sense of the transcendent. it was   these were just important moral systems built around a series of books that were useful to read for wisdom.elizabeth we’ll come back to this later but you’ve written a lot about the transition from a kind of moral realism to moral romanticism and, and various other dualities. when you think about your childhood, is it a mix of those stories? or would you pull out one or the other that you think was most dominant?david yeah, i mean, frankly, when i think about my childhood, i think about my grandfather and the immigrant story that he raised me with that, you know, that which is an exodus story, it’s we came from oppression, we crossed the ocean and came to the promised land.elizabethwhere did he come from?davidukraine, ukraine and latvia, essentially. so we were all on the pail of settlements, the jewish settlements in central europe. and so… but it was that sense you’re arriving, you know, and the exodus story played just this powerful influence on american history that the puritans thought they were leading, living the exodus, the founders, the american founders wanted to put moses on the great seal of the united states. because we had come to the promised land, martin luther king talked about exodus more than the new testament. and so that was just the story into which our lives were shaped. and the exodus is a story that happened in order to be told, god told moses to lead people across the desert so we can have a story to tell about ourselves. and the community is a group of people organised around a common story. and so that was certainly the defining feature of how not only i saw the moral life of the centuries, but my own personal life as this journey toward the land of milk and honey.elizabeth what were your teenage years like?david schmucky, you know, i was a smug, self satisfied, completely happy teenager. and so i did not go through an angsty period   i knew i wanted to write, but i was in a pretty nice group of friends, probably about 30 of us and we all dated each other in different order. and if anybody has seen the american film, the breakfast club, that was my school, it was a big public high school with all the cliques and the jocks hated the drama kids, and the greasers hated the, you know, i don’t know who, the tech kids. everything i know about american society, i learned in the cafeteria in high school, which is that people will divide themselves off into social identity groups. and there will be natural rivalries between these groups. elizabeth you went to university of chicago and you’ve talked really movingly about the kind of intellectual legacy there. and you were studying western civilizations, or that was your kind of summary of what was being taught there, is that right?david we were all studying western civilization. so the   chicago had a great books programme, a core. so for the first two years, i read, i think i calculated i wrote 17 papers on two… i probably took three or four classes on thomas hobbes, we were thrown into the great books, and it changed my life, once you’ve tasted the fine wine of those books, it’s hard to go back to kool aid. and so i think it left an imprint, first, intense love of learning. and our professors… you know, there’s a saying that if you catch fire with enthusiasm, people will come from miles to watch you burn. and our professors thought that if we read these books carefully, we would learn how to live, learn how to live a good life. and so there was the moral improvement of oneself was on the agenda. and the tool was not the bible. it was not charity, was not doctors without borders. the tool was nietzsche, hobbes, kant, augustine, george eliot. and so this was the path to the good life. and once you raise that sort of moral aspiration, that life is about what the germans called moral formation, then you’ve planted a seed of disquiet in your students that they will spend the rest of their life trying to trying to fulfil.elizabeth my impression is that’s maybe ebbed a bit from educational institutions, certainly in the uk, and the us as what’s seen as the purpose of education. do you feel that?david very much so. there was a sense that education was about what they call the humanistic idea of the formation of humans. and there’s this school, a prep school, called public school in the new england where the headmaster said, we try to create students who are acceptable at a dance, invaluable at a shipwreck. and so that sense that this is some work, we’re forming a person who will come through in a crisis, that for all the snobbery of eton and rugby in those schools, that was what they thought they were about. and that was certainly what the university of chicago thought it was about in a different way. the universities have shifted. and i have a friend and cousin, the very famous linguist, steven pinker, who says, you know, i’ve been involved in a zillion faculty hiring decisions, and i went to grad school, and i never got a class in moral formation or character building, and forming characters has never been part of our hiring decisions when we hire for our department. and so we know nothing about this. so we should not really be in that business. and i understand his point, but i would say, especially when you’re dealing with young people, and maybe with all people, you’re in the business regardless, and the students are hungering for   not people to tell them how to be good, they they’re not going to listen that way. but they want to have a moral vocabulary so they can figure it out. and so whenever you offer a course that tries to deal with moral formation, they flock to it. even if it’s a shallow course on positive psychology or something like that, the hunger is out there.elizabeth i will ignore the wince so i can hear from all the positive psychology listeners. so you left the university of chicago with this   sounds incredibly precious sense of the power of literature and words and civilization for the good life. and then were writing opinion pieces and editing and working your way up in journalism and writing books that were more kind of social analysis, bobos in paradise, the social animal, which is where i first came across you. what were the kind of threads you were pulling on during that season of your life, i guess, personally and professionally?david i think it was really more about status. i was more in the tom wolfe world, the world of pure bourgeois would be the highbrow version of this. and the world of paul fussell, the guy who wrote class. so i was writing sociological analysis, and it started because i was a humour columnist. and when you write books that are humour, all you can do is make fun of rich people. and i was perfectly happy to do that. so i made fun of rich people for a living, and so these are the sort of people who live in upscale suburbs of america. and so my first book bobos in paradise was really gentle mockery of people who had made a tonne of money and then had invented a code of consumption in order to prove how spiritual they were. so they wouldn’t spend money on the fancy chandelier and lobster, but they would spend $20,000 on an aga stove to prove that you were sort of a peasant involved in good cooking or shower stalls   the rule was you can spend any amount of money on a room formerly used by the servants. so it was this code of sumptuary consumption that was spiritually enlightened. so i   bobos in paradise was really making fun of them. and little did i know that this class of bourgeois bohemians would become the dominant elite class in society against which every other class would rebel. and little did i appreciate that the people used to be, what do you call them   sloane park rangers or people like that, they would grow up to be slightly more cultured. and then the whole tory party would swing against them. and nominate, you know, boris johnson to stick a thumb in the eye of the hampstead elite or something like that.elizabeth whilst looking suspiciously similar himself in many ways. and it’s a   how were you, conceiving of yourself during that time? there’s sort of ridiculous internecine conversations about elites, but did you have a   did you have a human status anxiety yourself? did you wonder how you’re positioning yourself? how was your sense of identity during that period?david yeah, especially in that kind of time in my life, i made a living off of self hatred. so i proudly said i’m a member of this. i do this like, i went to an elite school. i live in new york city or washington dc. i ride the slo, which is our train line from new york to new haven to boston to washington. and so that, that i confess to being a member of the class and i guess i still am. but i wrote a piece called status income disequilibrium, which is about people who have high status and low income. elizabeth that is familiar, every journalist i talk!david and so like, we talked to rich people, interviewing them for our jobs, and then they go home to these really nice apartments, we go to these crappy little places where we have to clean our own toilets. and i talked about the moral trauma of this lifeelizabeth which is a helpful pivot to 2013. i don’t mean to laugh, because i know it was actually a very dark time. so forgive the crunch of gears. you have written really vulnerably and openly about that crisis. can you tell us a bit about what happened?david it was a crisis of values, i mean, on the surface, and in some real way it was, it was just the normal personal crisis that people go through occasionally, it was going through a divorce, kids had left home. and so i was stuck in this crappy little apartment. and i did what any american idiot would do, when overcome with a moral and emotional problem, i tried to work my way through it. and so i became a complete workaholic. in the, in my book, the second mountain, i describe the metaphor for that phase of life, which was, i was never entertaining anybody, because i didn’t have that kind of friends. and so i, if you went to the drawer in my kitchen, where there should have been silverware, there were post it notes. and where there should have been plates there was stationary. and that’s the metaphor for a kind of workaholic life. the larger problem was a sense of leading a life according to values that i knew were wrong, and coming to not recognise oneself. and that’s leading a life of emotional numbness, lack of vulnerability, lack of spiritual hunger. and so, you know, i had written this book, the social animal about emotion, it was classic me, i wanted to find out what emotions were. so i wrote a book about it. rather than maybe i should feel some. and, and so that was, that began the process of hopefully, some sort of personal change. and what i said earlier about that oprah thing, it’s a lesson which i firmly believe that people it’s never too late to pretty radically change your life.elizabeth and what’s really telling, and it’s beginning in the road to character, where it’s clear that your kind of hunger for these stories of people who have depth and moral courage. and there’s beginning to be bits of you in there. but it’s only really in the second mountain where you write really vulnerably and openly about   you use the phrase, the howling loneliness of, your howling emptiness of the weekend or the loneliness, and i had this real sensation of, oh, thank goodness, because in all our conversations about vulnerability in public, and the importance of not just kind of staying distant and analytical about these deep things, it’s usually women who do that, it feels like there’s a harder set of hurdles for a male, you know, slightly older, conservative leaning generation that doesn’t come at all easily. how hard was the temptation to resist of just going ‘i’m gonna keep writing about this analytically at a distance, and not put myself in it’?david yeah, it was, it was hard at times, partly because i have a political profile. and so all your political opponents take your vulnerability as an opportunity to pounce on you, which they indeed did. and so i knew that was going to happen. but i figured i couldn’t really write about this stuff from a position of distance. and i had to take some chances on myself and i think the rule of vulnerability is you should be slightly more vulnerable, you should regret it slightly afterwards, you should be more real, and then say i was probably a little too open there. and if you’re not doing that, you’re probably not going far enough. and i would say that though, that in most books, most nonfiction books in the us probably in the uk, are read by 60/40 women to men, there are more female readers than male readers. but this book when i toured the second mountain a couple years ago, you know, you signed books, and there’s this line of people to stop, and i would look down the line, and there would be 8 guys, and then a woman, nine guys, and then a woman. and so there, my line was basically like, a bunch of 50 year old white guys. and i realised i could have a second career as a ceo whisperer, because there were so many successful business executives who said, hey, can you have a fun relationship? i’ve got nobody to talk to. and so it was a lesson in private male misery. which i think is not being processed the way when, if you look around the restaurant, when you   two women get together, they’re staring into each other’s eyes, and they’re talking about real stuff. men, it’s, it’s much more, let’s look at the opposite sides of the wall, and talk about football.elizabeth yeah, and you know, you see that cashing out in suicide rates and all kinds of other things. i do want to ask you about christianity, i want to ask you about what   the sort of shorthand for seems to be a conversion. but i want to do it with a few caveats, which is, this is the most private of things. i’m also aware of the way that when people move tribes in public, there is an unlovely instinct for the receiving tribe to kind of want to stick a flag in them, you know, as fast as possible to like, bag their scalp and say, one of us… in a way that totally flattens the complexity and the fact that we might shift around in all kinds of things, and that finding faith at any point in life is a delicate, easily squashed process. what were the beats in the song that led you to go okay   am i right in thinking you’re probably just about ready to call yourself a christian now?david yeah, i i used to say i’m religiously bisexual, because when i found faith, i felt more jewish than ever. and   but also more christian than ever. and my jewish friends said, yeah, that’s not really allowed. if you accept jesus, then you’re not on the team anymore. yeah, and so that’s fair point. i think what happened was, i found   it all happened in the wrong order. it happened in an order that didn’t make sense, i experienced grace before i experienced god. and so i experienced some sort of love, unconditional love before i figured there was a guy up in the sky, or, and then what, then i experienced a sense of being observed. and then gradually, i experienced a sense that there is a moral order to the universe. and so there’s a theologian paul tillich, who has a phrase ‘the ground of being’, that the ground of being is a loving order, a moral order, an eternal order. and so i was up, you know, occasionally in nature, i just had this sense of things clicking into place, and i didn’t have words for it. and it wasn’t like jesus walked through the wall and said, hey, come follow me. it’s like, that never happened. it was the most boring process imaginable of gradually, life seemed to become more enchanted and more alive. the spiritual realm seemed to be alive with a transcendent and divine presence. and i liken it to, i think, in the second mountain, to you’re riding in a train, you’re sitting around all the familiar people, you’re drinking a cup of coffee, and you look out the window, and you realise you’ve covered, there’s a lot of ground behind you. and at some point, you’ve crossed over a border. and you’re no longer a non believer. you’re a believer in something. and then when you do, at least in my case, you read and you try to read people who are articulating what you’re going through, and i found that as you’re searching, people send you books. and so i was sent about 600 books in the course of three months. and my joke is only 350 of which were mere christianity by cs lewis. and but it was in that process of reading i came to refine what is this that i’m feeling. what is this enchanted sensation? what is this sense of, of divine love and really more sense of a moral order? and because i had grown up with the christian story, and because i’ve grown up the jewish story, they both came alive to me. and i read the bible, old and new testament. but i found myself in in the states, when, in my community, sort of highly educated coastal, when you come to faith, you come to faith through oxford. and so it’s cs lewis, it’s jr tolkien, it’s sheldon vanauke who wrote a severe mercy. and so you have a very classy kind of god, and sort of appropriately britishly restrained kind of jesus. and i think i sometimes wrestle against that, like, jesus was a jewish guy from the middle east. and when you actually see him through the jewish lens, living in jerusalem in a land of vicious conflict, a series of highly organised power structures, which he upsets all at once, you realise, jesus is a total badass, he’s not like, a guy in a tweed jacket. and so i came to defend the much more aggressive jesus that shocks. and i came to believe in that. i will say that the one thing you said about when people want to put you on their team, that was certainly true for me. and i would come to   when i was exploring, going to churches, i get there early, like normal. and so many people would want to meet me, and then during the passing of peace, they come over to shake my hand. so i began to go to church late after the service and started to leave early before it ended, in order to not go through the social rigmarole. and that made me lonely, that made me really lonely. and so that was destructive. elizabeth yeah, yeah, it’s that thing about the way fame distances us from seeing people as a real person, right, they become a symbol or cypher of something else that we can use for our ends. i know a few friends who also find it difficult to go to church because of that. i have been reading your book this week, and also status anxiety by alain de botton, who is a philosopher, very good writer. and you both quote the death of ivan ilyich by tolstoy, which was obviously written at a quite similar turning point in tolstoy’s life, where the sense of the moral universe that i’ve been living in, that if i have enough status, and money and progress and success, that kind of first mountain life, then i will find satisfaction. and both ilyich and tolstoy have a crisis of realising the hollowness and the lie that that is where satisfaction is found. and you and tolstoy somehow managed to cross the precipice into an alternative moral universe where there is grace and connection and relationship. for whatever reason   my husband jokes i have this weird, like spiritual gift of being a friend to overeducated, middle aged men, and some of them have been on the podcast. i have lots of dear, dear friends who have moved a long way from a very materialist atheism to a conviction that religious faith and spirituality is good for societies, to a conviction that it’s good for individuals and have got stuck. because… there’s a couple of conversations on the podcast, you can listen to people going, why can’t i accept this for myself? i don’t know. i just can’t, there’s something about the leap. what is your…do you see that in people around you and what is your analysis of what holds back that particular tribe, because i see such a lot of it.david i’d like to rewind the tape to the sentence that included the phrase you and tolstoy, i like that sentence, that’s good to hear. nice comparisons. i would say it’s apt to say tolstoy because one of the things that tolstoy had was, he was one of the greatest writers of all time and knew it. and so he was renouncing something that he was, was at the top of the game. and i would say, for me, when i get stuck, as maybe i am stuck, it’s because i still haven’t disabused myself of the tolstoy myth that if only i can write a really good book, then the spiritual fulfilment is there. so it’s the, it’s really hard to renounce all the values you had as you were climbing up the meritocracy. and it’s not only selfish, you think if i wrote a good book, it would be a contribution to our all our conversation, so you think you’re doing good. and but it’s about the self perfection, the self improvement, the mastery of a craft, and the mastery of a communication skill, and the ability to renounce that and die to self? well, that’s a really hard thing to do in our culture, or in any culture. and i certainly have not succeeded. i wrote this book the second mountain about renouncing some of the worldly definitions of success, then i’m freakin checking my amazon rating every hour. so like, i wouldn’t say i cured myself of this. and but i think tolstoy does part the way. and when you meet somebody, some of the characters in dostoevsky in particular, who have renounced self, you see a beauty there that is, that is beyond what what you can achieve when you stay in our frame.elizabeth yeah. i want to talk about the challenge and the difficulty of talking about these biggest, most important things in public. i was reading a review of the second mountain. and it made me laugh out loud, but it was a, he was commenting on a particular passage that you were talking about these transcendent moments of connection with other people and the world. and he wrote in the margin, ‘is this book about bonking brooks?’, and really seemed unable to deal with the lack of concreteness of talking about virtue and ecstatic encounter and intimacy and relationship and was clearly trying, bless him, but just, it was like bouncing off. he was, he was   he thought it was a good book. he was, he wasn’t sure what it was saying. it just   is it about sex like that’s, that’s the only category i have for intimacy and relationship. as your writing has moved from this more kind of very good but distant social analysis to this more urgent, personal, ‘who do we want to be? how do we want to live?’ what have you learned about how you help that stuff land well?david yeah, i was struck by that. and that has happened several times. when you talked about martin buber and i thou, and i was trying various points in the book, without uber’s eloquence or mysticism, to get into that sense of the interpenetration of souls of what deep communication is really about. and more than one person just said that’s sex. and i think that’s because i guess for a lot of people, they were not raised with the category of intimacy. and so that’s the best they can do. and it’s kind of smartass to say, oh, he’s just talking about bonking. i’m a secular writer, i write for secular   the new york times, secular publications. and so i try to do it in a way that talks about faith in a way that won’t turn people off. and you know, one thing to do is i’ve raved on cs lewis, who i don’t mean to because i admire him greatly, but he, you know, he would never use a big word when a small word would do. and he wrote for radio often. and so that’s just very useful as a communications tool. everything was low key, it’s not, he was not operatic. “the good lord came down to me and when a burst of sunshine and rain.” he was “yeah, this is just what happened.” but i would say there are certain categories that one has to be careful about explaining, some even bother me. and so for example, i was talking about before the second mountain came out, i was talking about it on a tv show, and i mentioned the word sin. and an editor wrote to me on email, i love the way you talked about your book, but i wouldn’t use the word sin, i would use the word insensitive. it’s like, well, i’m not sure insensitive is really sin. but i asked a friend of mine, how do you talk about sin in public, a pastor. and he said, i talk about disordered loves, that we all have certain loves. and we all know some loves are higher than others. this is an augustinian concept. and if i, you tell me a secret, and i blab at a dinner party, i’m putting my love of popularity above my love of friendship. and that’s disordered love. that’s a sin. and if you talk about it as disordered love, you don’t have to talk about it as depravity in the human soul, which really does repel a lot of people. and you don’t have to talk about sin as masturbation, which is what a lot of christians talk about it as. and so it’s something people can relate to. but translating the categories into acceptable forms, is, i think, part of just communications. elizabeth have you come across the francis spufford phrase for sin? he has a book called unapologetic, which i think you’d really like, he was one of our earliest interviews actually. and he rebranded sin and i’m going to swear here, so apologies for listeners, but it loses its power without it, as the human propensity to fuck things up. and then he contracts that into thptftu or however you would spell it and uses that all the way through his very, very good book about the emotional power of christianity. he’s a very garlanded fiction or nonfiction writer in the states, in the uk. but he says very early on, i need to talk about sin, but when i say the word sin, you think of lingerie, and ice cream. and i want you to think of the ways that we hurt each other, and the ways that we break things, and it is such a powerful usage that you might enjoy.david yeah, the more highbrow usage is an ultimate allegiance to a finite end. that are you usurping something. you know, i’m writing a column today about there was a case in philadelphia commuter train line, where a woman gets on at 914, a guy starts molesting her. he molests her for about 40 minutes, then 40 minutes later starts raping her. and there are other people on the train on the car. and no one intervenes, no one calls the police. they just whip out their cameras to get a video of it. and so it’s a case of somehow sin is there, the sin of the rapist, but the sin of the bystanders. and so the, you know, chesterton said that concept of original sin is the one empirically verifiable aspect of this. and so that case is such a morally horrific case that you wonder what was going on in their minds? but then you wonder what kind of society is it in which people are enculturated in such a way that that happens? elizabeth i was really struck actually reading your last two books, how often you, you’re very comfortable with the word morality. and my backstory with this is that i worked for a while on a bbc programme called the moral maze, which is an ethical discussion programme. and the m word was, it was always tripping us up because we’d ring people and say, we want you to come on and make this moral argument, which is a position that we know you hold, because you’ve said it somewhere. and they say, well, i wouldn’t call it a moral argument. and we’d say, why not? it’s an evidence based argument, or it’s a philosophical argument. and i’d say what, why don’t why don’t you like the word moral and morality? they say, well, it sounds it sounds judgmental. it sounds like we are judging people. talk to me about that. how do you avoid sounding preachy? and why do you think we are so sensitised to the possibility that someone talking about their vision of the good is inherently a judgement on us?david well, i don’t totally walk away from judgment, like the rapist on the train   i’m judging him. the passengers, i’m judging them. am i confident that i would do otherwise if i were a passenger? can’t be totally confident on that, we all think we would be the one to leap in. but in real life circumstances, people who say they will leap in do not leap in. and so i you know, that   people are asked, what’s the essential virtue, augustine was asked this. and he said, well, the essential virtue is humility, humility, humility. and i think if you try to aspire to a sense of humility, you can talk about judgement in a way that’s not preachy and insufferable. and you will often go over the line. but the alternative to talking about morality, is to have no one talking about morality. and we are moral creatures, and we all want to be better people. and you raise successive generations who don’t have a moral vocabulary, who don’t talk about grace and sin and redemption. and who don’t have a formula or even a theory of moral formation. and so somebody has to talk about it, even though the reputational risks are a) that you won’t live up to your standards, which is inevitable, or b) you’ll seem preachy and self righteous, or d) people think you’re talking about sex. and, and so i talk about it freely, running the risk of being insufferable to some people. elizabeth yeah. i was trying to explain to someone the other day why i like the concept of sin in public. and the way i summed up why i’d love us to be able to talk about sin again, is that in excising it from our culture, we’ve let   ended up with this bizarre, seemingly contradictory mishmash of no one is responsible for anything, because we’re just stimulus and response mechanisms, determined by our genes, or our background, or whatever it is, but then everyone is responsible for everything, because there is no such thing as forgiveness and redemption, or change. and so i can’t even describe it. but it’s the two things at the same time, hugely judgmental, and hugely permissive seems to me to be psychologically much worse than, yes, i am sinful. and i have somewhere to go with that, i have the possibility of change. i have help. you know, there’s that there is forgiveness is on the table, rather than a total thing. do you recognise that? and what might help us move beyond it?david yeah, i would say if people are raised as we all were, at least i was, with the social science mentality, that schools in the phrases of social psychology of, of sociology, of economics, in which as you say, the human person, the agent is not there. because it’s all correlation. and what correlates to what and what determines what, and it’s   and these fields are great at generalising about populations, they’re not particularly great at looking at the individual human person. and so you school people in this and then suddenly people have to make judgments about the individual moral person. they swing radically over and suddenly it’s the spanish inquisition. and so there’s no like a middle ground where you see people as mottled selves. and, and frankly, religions have spent, and many other moral systems, have spent a lot of time thinking about forgiveness, like how do you do it, you don’t just say, oh, i’m sorry, oh, i forgive you. that’s just too simple and too easy. so there are rituals of confessing the sin, correcting the sins, reparation for the sin, acknowledging the sin, acknowledging the sin exists, but it will not be a barrier in our relationship to one another. and so these formulas are not only, i think, baked into the fabric of the universe, they’re just super useful. and so as americans, we try to think about racism. there’s a formula here that has been established over centuries and maybe in all time, and if we ignore the formula then we’re just casting them out in darkness. and most problems have been thought of, through three or 4000 years of, of theological and spiritual formation and thinking and, and teaching. and to leave that all behind, which frankly, a lot of american protestants do like   it’s like jesus came, yada, yada, yada, i had a personal relationship with jesus, all that social teaching nah i don’t really care. that’s one advantage the catholics have. and the jews have that steeped in tradition, really good at transmitting the inherited knowledge of the ages, which when you have a populace religion, especially american evangelism, with a direct encounter with god, you’re not going to have the depth of knowledge that comes with centuries of refinement, and the american church is suffering that crisis right now. and their attachment in my view to donald trump, and their unwillingness, large parts of evangelism, evangelical community to face up to racial injustice, the siege mentality that justifies a means justifies the ends mentality. i mean, i entered this faith, like, it was like investing in the stock market in 1929. like i came in at the worst time, like just when the american church was going through a crisis, and young people for understandable reasons were leaving in droves. thankfully, i didn’t know what i was getting into. elizabeth i’m going to finish with a final question, which circles back really to the beginning about how, how do we get better at crossing these tribes, at connecting on a human level? you’ve been a liberal, and then a conservative. you’ve crossed tribes of faith and politics, and written deeply about how we encounter each other. and at the end of the second mountain, there’s just kind of relation list manifesto. i know there’s a lot more coming in what feels like part three of a trilogy, i’m hoping is what your next book will be. but if there’s one thing that listeners could do, actively change their behaviour, not just think about, that might help them be part of the solution, not the problem to these deep divisions and differences. what would it be?david well, to be practical, the next book i’m writing about, it’s in the skill of seeing others and being deeply seen. and so it’s how do you really get to know another person, and you think you can be empathetic and emotionally place yourself in another person, you probably can’t, you know, empathy is useful, but not just that powerful. so the single trait that correlates with the ability to know other people is verbal intelligence, you have to ask them, you have to have a conversation, which we’ve just been having. and so getting really good at conversation is, is part of the skill of getting to know other people. and there are things you can do that will make you better at conversation. be a loud listener like ‘uh huh, okay’, i have a friend who’s a loud listener   feels great to talk to that guy, because he’s always affirming. restate what the person just said. so you’re sure you understand it. don’t fear the pause, that when we speak, we   like a match in my arm is an answer. i start talking to the shoulder and i talk to the end of my fingertips, but somewhere around the elbow, we probably stopped listening. so we can think of, well, here’s what i’m going to say next. but if you’re having an important conversation, and you’re saying, okay, i’m gonna listen to your whole statement, i’m going to pause for six seconds, then i will respond, that can be very powerful. keep the gem statement in the centre. if you are… if you’re disagreeing about something, there’s something that you agree on underneath. so if me and my brother are disagreeing about the health care our father should get, we may violently disagree about that, but we both care about the health of our father. and so if you keep that gem statement at the centre, you’ll have something and then finally, the quality of conversation is determined by the quality of the questions. and so my favourite questions, and you’ve asked me deep and penetrating questions, you know, my favourite questions are questions that elevate you so you look at your life from a higher altitude. so there are questions like   what crossroads are you at? not everyone is aware of a crossroads we’re at. or what would you do if you weren’t afraid? we are not always aware of how fear plays a role in our lives. i read one from a guy named peter block. what forgiveness are you withholding? what commitment have you made that you no longer really believe in? and so these questions are really   open up excavations. they don’t yield easy answers, but they begin explorations. and so i think that’s the practical skill of overcoming a lot of our social and moral woes of actually taking the time to get to know each other through podcasts. everybody should be on podcasts all the time.elizabeth and on that very helpful infomercial, david brooks, thank you so much for talking to me on the sacred.david oh, total pleasure. thank you.elizabethwell, honestly, i was more nervous about this episode than most. and partly, that’s just because david has been writing for a long time. so he’s just written, absolutely loads and feeling properly prepped for it was quite a significant task. actually, i think it’s partly because i’m formed into finding older impressive men with opinions intimidating, frankly. but it’s also because it feels like there was such a lot to talk about. but i was very quickly put at my ease. and it was so lovely to hear about david’s journey and his reflections on the wrestle of the personal and the private and the public. and this kind of thing he’s worrying away about how can we become more like the people that we want to be and the challenges of that. i really loved his description of himself as a kind of schmucky, self confident teenager. i was really moved actually, by the description he had of his sacred value about time, and continuity. and i think he used the phrase, these places where we know that people have been violently alive for a really long time. and i think we all kind of recognise that sense of being part of the continuity of human life. and it’s quite inspiring, so many millions of people who have felt as deeply as us and lived as fully as us over the centuries. it’s a sort of chronological equivalent of expanding our consciousness, away from just us as our individual selves to a sense of those around us   that staple of kind of all ethical and wisdom traditions is deeper consideration of the other. and i was reminded that that can work kind of backwards in time and perhaps forward in time to future generations as well. it was funny hearing him talk about you know, when you when you come to christianity, from his particular background, you come to kind of jesus of oxford colleges, through often a very bookish intellectual route, and then the tension with the jesus of that world with jesus, the middle eastern revolutionary, and the many, many worlds actually, that this figure can hold. i find it really refreshing when particularly men model vulnerability in public, it feels like something that is both more acceptable and, and also more or required of women in public. so i really, i really value it, people who let their guard down a bit and say, look, we’re all just trying our best. i loved him talking about morality, and the difficulties of talking about morality and encounter and the ecstatic. and these moments of intimacy and connection with other people. and it reminded me again, of something i reference, quite a lot, which is iain mcgilchrist’s work on the different brain hemispheres. and the way we’ve kind of created a society where left brain thinking, that more linear and concrete and measurable, predominates over and   this is a massive simplification of his work, so apologies   but the kind of right brain, which orientates to intuition and faith and creativity and these less measurable, less concrete things. no trace of society just haven’t had any training or formation in those things haven’t developed. what would it mean for a society where these intangibles that are so deep and so important, and yet so hard to measure or talk about, where we can increase our levels of comfort with them? or maybe patience for them? those are some of my thoughts. i would love to hear your reflections. send me a tweet @esoldfield @sacred_podcast, send us an email and just be in touch. i really love having conversations with listeners about what they’re thinking about. interested in this? share it on social media. join our monthly e newsletter to keep up to date with our latest research and events. and check out our supporter programme to find out how you can help our work. elizabeth oldfield elizabeth is host of the sacred podcast. she was theos’ director from august 2011   july 2021. she appears regularly in the media, including bbc one, sky news, and the world service, and writing in the financial times. watch, listen to or read more from elizabeth oldfield posted 8 december 2021 christianity, morality a new report by theos and the good faith partnership, exploring how churches and faith groups contribute to social prescribing. 27/01/2025 see other recent events and articles paul bickley examines how harriet harman’s proposal to remove bishops from the house of lords may not be as democratic as it seems. 30/01/2025 elizabeth oldfield speaks with abc news journalist and foreign correspondent, james longman. 29/01/2025 research by dr marianne rozario for the medaille trust exploring support for the survivors of modern slavery was reported on by the tablet. 05/02/2025 a new report by theos and the good faith partnership, exploring how churches and faith groups contribute to social prescribing. 27/01/2025 social prescribing theos researches and investigates the intersection of religion, politics and society in the contemporary world. get regular email updates on our latest research and events. please confirm your subscription in the email we have sent you. email theos conducts research, publishes reports, and holds debates, seminars and lectures on the relationship between religion, politics and society in the contemporary world. we are a christian think tank based in the uk. we are part of the british and foreign bible society, charity number 232759. 77 great peter street, london sw1p 2ez +44(0) 20 7828 7777 about| faq| our website uses cookies to improve your online experience. find out more want to keep up to date with the latest news, reports, blogs and events from theos? get updates direct to your inbox once or twice a month. thank you for signing up. first name last name email organisation (optional)

whether you’re brand new to business or established and ready to grow, b school will challenge you to execute at your highest level. we're proud to have nearly 80,000 b school students. a step by step online training course that shows you how to write copy that’s powerful, persuasive, and 100% you, so people will love   and buy   what you sell. time genius is a live online experience that will catapult your joy, focus, and accomplishment fast. learn to live distraction free and be joyfully productive, on your terms. new! 🔥 get unprecedented access to marie and her personal dream team in a private coaching and community experience. unlock uncommon levels of wealth, joy, and freedom   and have a damn good time along the way. whether you’re brand new to business or established and ready to grow, b school will challenge you to execute at your highest level. we're proud to have nearly 80,000 b school students. a step by step online training course that shows you how to write copy that’s powerful, persuasive, and 100% you, so people will love   and buy   what you sell. time genius is a live online experience that will catapult your joy, focus, and accomplishment fast. learn to live distraction free and be joyfully productive, on your terms. you have gifts to share with the world and my job is to help you get them out there. lorem ipsum dolor sit amet, consectetur adipiscing elit. suspendisse varius enim in eros elementum tristique. duis cursus, mi quis viverra ornare, eros dolor interdum nulla, ut commodo diam libero vitae erat. aenean faucibus nibh et justo cursus id rutrum lorem imperdiet. nunc ut sem vitae risus tristique posuere. ever feel like you missed the boat? like you’ve fallen behind in life, and now it’s too late to… start your business find your passion write your book get in shape travel the world…or… ‍[insert your big dream here] you’re not alone. according to a global survey of over 5,000 people, a whopping 50% of women say they’ve given up on their dreams. and over 78% of americans regret not pursuing theirs! 🤯😭 but that doesn’t have to be your story because   as theodore roosevelt wisely said   "comparison is the thief of joy." and the truth is, there's no expiration date on your dreams. so if you find yourself feeling like it’s “just too late”   remember this… everyone’s journey unfolds at its own pace… and the only timeline that matters is your timeline. in today’s marietv, you’ll see 9 inspirational stories from women who defied societal timelines and expectations   reminding us that age is merely a number, and it’s never too late to reinvent yourself. watch now to discover: ever feel like you're too old and it's just too late for you to start the business? write your book, make your art, travel the world or in some big way, change your life. if so, you are not alone. in fact, one study of over 5000 women across 14 countries and six continents showed that 50% of women have totally given up on their dreams and feel deeply dissatisfied with their lives. that is sad. now, another study found that over 75% of folks here in the us actively regret not following their dreams. again, sad, sad, sad and totally unnecessary. but here's the thing if you're watching this video right now and you are, you know what that tells me? it tells me it is not too late for you. you gotta stop it with that stinkin thinking. i don't care where you are. i don't care what your age is. because if you're still breathing, you got time. don't believe me? i want you to keep watching. because in this video, we're going to talk about nine super inspiring women who prove it is never too late to follow your dreams. they waddled and spent the first 40 years of her career in nonprofits. in fact, she was actually the first black woman to run planned parenthood. but then they did something nobody saw coming. at 73, she cofounded her first company. and not just any company, a quantum computer knitting company. so you might wonder, well, how the heck did a nonprofit professional in her 70s decide to start a hardcore tech company despite knowing next to nothing about quantum computers? here's what she said in a forbes interview. quantum computing could turbocharge research into drug therapies, find solutions for combating climate change, and advance the science of food production, mineral exploration and manufacturing methodologies. how do we use it for public good and to make the world a better place for more people? did you catch that? faye knows that changing your life at any age, it ain't about having the right answers. it's about asking the right questions. and clearly faye believes what i believe, which is everything, is figure out as they go. faye, go. in the world of modeling, people get scouted in their teens, right? and by the time they're usually in the 30s, they're kind of winding down. but helen van winkle, better known as batty winkle, started her modeling career. get this at 80 friggin five. batty grew up on a farm and worked for almost 30 years in a factory. but one day, her great granddaughter posted a pic of her on instagram in cut off jean shorts. now check it out. she's got over 3 million followers. there are so many things to love about her. you know, batty's posts are often super playful. sometimes they're even shocking images, and they're designed to really encourage all of us to love ourselves, to love our bodies and our aliveness throughout the entire course of our existence. you know, i almost fell over when i saw her tagline that says steel in yo man since 1928. to me, that highlights one of the biggest success secrets ever, which is keeping your sense of humor and not taking yourself or anything else for that matter, too damn seriously. jean's doohickey proves that it's never too late to do really big or really hard things, so check this one out. once upon a time, jean was a two pack a day smoker until she decided to give that ish up and conquer the world instead. so in her 50s, she ran a marathon on each of the world, seven continents. and just to put that into perspective, that's seven damn marathons in just 141 days. and then by 57, she reached the summit of mount everest, the world's tallest mountain, which put her in the guinness book of world records. not too shabby for a mid life turnaround, right? doctor edith eger was just 16 years old when she and her family were sent to auschwitz, where her parents were tragically killed in the gas chambers. so after surviving the death camp, edith had to start over. she reinvented herself and became a world renowned psychologist. she also happens to be one of my favorite tv guests of all time. then get this. at 90, she started writing her very first book and published it two years later at 92. it's called the gift 12 lessons to save your life, a book that i truly believe should be required reading for all human beings. bottom line is this if edith can start writing and publishing in her 90s, whatever it is that you want to create now, you can do it. speaking of getting started later in life, how about miss anna robertson moses, better known as grandma moses. one of the biggest names in american folk art. and she didn't even start painting until she was in her late 70s. for most of her adult life, anna was in charge of a really busy house. so she was cooking, she was cleaning, she was caring for her husband and her five kids. and on the side, as a little hobby, she did embroidery work and made these beautiful, colorful quilts. but then when anna turned 77 years old, pain from arthritis in her hand stopped her from holding a needle. and that's when her friends nudged her to try painting instead. which is why it's so damn important to have good people around you. and that's when everything really took off for anna. within a few years, she began having shows and the public fell in love with her and her art. she produced about 1500 pieces, sold a whole bunch of them, and continued to paint until she died at 101 years young. a little pop quiz. do you think healthy, strong bodies only belong to young people? not if you're ernestine shepherd. at 88, she is the world's oldest female competitive bodybuilder. and get this. she didn't even start working out until she was 56. so ernie and her sister went clothes shopping one day and the close didn't fit right. and so they decided right then and there they were going to get in shape. ernie started out with aerobics, and then she tried weight training, which led her to totally reinvent herself and not only change her life, but inspire millions of others to do the same. some research suggests that 81% of people feel that they have a book in them, and they should write it. but guess what? most people never get that book done, in part because they feel like they're too old and it's too late. that's why you got to remember laura ingalls wilder, the author of the beloved book series little house on the prairie. a little side note. personally, i was a very big fan of the 70s show version of that, but whatever. the point is this even if you already know about little house books, what you probably don't know is that wilder started her career as a novelist in her mid 60s. that's right. in fact, she published the first book in 65 and then published seven more after that. oh wait, do i hear that? you just don't want to write your own books, but you also maybe want to start a whole publishing conglomerate. hold, please. enter louise hay, who many consider to be one of the founders of the modern day self help movement. so at 50, she published her very first book, heal your body. that was in 1976, long before mainstream media began to talk about the mind body connection. but here's where this gets interesting. she launched her publishing company, hay house, at age 62, proving once again it is never too late to bring big, bold dreams to life. finally, one of the most delightful and inspiring reminders that age is just a number is miss greta torelli, who started her work as an aerial artist and pole dancer at 59. now at 73, she is still stunning and still going strong. check this out. now look, we just scratched the tip of the iceberg in this video. there are thousands, if not millions of brilliant souls who start big, bold, new things at every single stage in life. and of course, it's always scary to start something new. i don't care how old you are, but do not let that destructive, totally b.s. lie in your head. the old i'm too old there. it's too late. don't let that bullshit hold you back. now, if starting or growing a business is a dream of yours and you want my help, you need to get those bonds in b school right now. at this point, we've helped over 80,000 people grow successful businesses. and i know we can help you too. so you can just go to join b school dot com to learn more. and if you want me to help you live your dream life, including your dream business or career, you should check out dream club. it's this incredible coaching and community experience where i get to work intimately with you on building the mindset, the habits, the consistency that you need to literally bring any dream to life. you can learn more at marie for leo. com slash dream club. you know, when it comes to thinking you're too old or it's too late for you. one of my favorite responses is something that i learned from julia cameron, the author of the artist's way. if the idea of starting something new at your age triggers this instant defensive hostility like. but do you know how old i'm going to be by the time i really learn how to play the piano, or act or write or paint or speak or dance? yes, the same age you'll be if you don't. so let's stop all the screwing around, all right? let's not waste an even more time and get that ass moving now. dive deeper: ready to turn your business dreams into a profitable reality? this summer, fast track your business in just 30 days. b school has helped over 80,000 newbie entrepreneurs grow successful businesses. now, it’s your turn → learn more and enroll now. no matter what   stay on your game and keep going for your big dreams. because the world really needs that very special gift that only you have! all my love, xo 💕 sign up for exclusive content, emails & things marie doesn’t share anywhere else. about marietv the marie forleo podcast success stories new here? free tools press & media giving back how we roll jobs need help? dream club b school the copy cure time genius how to get anything you want everything is figureoutable

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supported by we’re looking for inspiring people who are living life according to their own timeline for our series, “it’s never too late.” we’re looking for inspiring people who prove it’s never too late to switch gears, change your life and pursue your dreams. we want to hear from people of all ages who are living life according to their own timeline   in regards to career, education, athletic pursuits, family, friendships, relationships, travel, spirituality or religion, activism or another calling. we want to hear all types of stories: people who learned to drive after the age of 40, found love after age 75 or finished a marathon at age 99.

 podcast: play in new window | download a client of mine recently wrote to me saying: “i feel like at my age, i’m so far behind and need to be insanely productive every single day.” she was referring to feeling behind in her career, which is something i hear all the time from my clients (regardless of their age). but feeling behind can spill into every area of your life. if your friends start getting married while you’re still single, it can make you feel behind. when your colleagues all have mortgages and you’re still renting a tiny apartment, it can make you feel behind. when you scroll through social media and see all of your high school friends posting baby pictures, it can make you feel behind. if you see someone else living out your dream career and you’re still stuck at the same old company, it can make you feel behind. it makes sense why so many of us are feeling this way. for the first 18 (or more) years of our lives, we’re all pretty much on the same trajectory. while we’re in school, our paths are mostly laid out for us. we’re among peers, growing and going through the same milestones at the same general pace. then, after high school or college, we start going off on different paths, and the comparison about “who’s ahead” and “who’s behind” starts to gets murky. so, because we don’t have clear indicators of measuring progress anymore   the way we did when we were in school   we end up comparing how “behind” we are based on external things we can see, like promotions, marriages, kids, houses, and other external mile markers. but we forget that these factors are completely irrelevant. many of the people you see with all of the external things aren’t necessarily happy and content with their lives. (trust me on this one   i’ve coached a lot of those people, and i know what’s going on under the surface of that carefully curated instagram feed!)