<p>According to <a href="https://www.wired.com/story/how-americas-spooks-seek-to-spy-on-distant-satellites/?fbclid=IwAR28cX1RS-twe3C9xh0R9KyjXO29GQ1QdmzXGs_OvFhnWld6hBE7JbkvByE" rel="nofollow noreferrer">this site</a> The 10 telescopes will be optically linked together in order to make images of astronomical objects with unprecedented detail. The interferometer will have a resolution 100 times greater than the Hubble Space Telescope and will be able to make accurate images of complex astronomical objects many times faster than other existing interferometric arrays. </p>

<p>And: The Interferometer will take delivery of the second telescope enclosure in February 2020 and the second telescope in August 2020. They expect to fully incorporate the second telescope by the end of 2020, which will allow the instrument to produce “fringes,” using the proprietary fringe-tracker called ICoNN.</p>

<p>There is also this headline:  </p>

<blockquote>
  <p>How America's Spooks Seek to Spy on Distant Satellites The
  intelligence community has plans for a telescope network that can see
  not just a blob in orbit but details such as a satellite’s solar
  panels.</p>
</blockquote>

<p>from <a href="https://www.wired.com/story/how-americas-spooks-seek-to-spy-on-distant-satellites/?fbclid=IwAR28cX1RS-twe3C9xh0R9KyjXO29GQ1QdmzXGs_OvFhnWld6hBE7JbkvByE" rel="nofollow noreferrer">here.</a></p>

<p>That's one reason why the U.S. Air Force, which wants to monitor its own orbital assets and presumably those of others, is funding MROI. "They want to know: Did the boom break or did some part of the photovoltaic panels collapse?" says Michelle Creech-Eakman, an astronomer at the New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology in Socorro and project scientist on MROI. But if the facility succeeds, its biggest impact could be on the field of astronomy, by drawing new attention to the promise of optical interferometry, a powerful but challenging strategy for extracting exquisitely sharp images from relatively small, cheap telescopes.</p>

<p>Radio astronomers have had it easier. The long radio wavelengths mean data from separated dishes can be recorded, digitized, time-stamped by an atomic clock, and combined later for analysis. But optical interferometry is far trickier: The short wavelengths of visible light, running at terahertz frequencies, cannot yet be digitized by any electrical system. So the light must be merged in real time, with nanometer precision.</p>

<p>From <a href="https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/07/telescope-array-will-spy-spy-satellites-star-surfaces-and-black-holes" rel="nofollow noreferrer">here</a>.</p>

<p>Also Reference 3.</p>

<ol start="3">
<li><a href="http://www.mro.nmt.edu/about-mro/interferometer-mroi/" rel="nofollow noreferrer">http://www.mro.nmt.edu/about-mro/interferometer-mroi/</a></li>
</ol>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-23T17:25:32.617Z
Thanks, this is great news, but *Will the Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon?* Is it possible to expand just a little bit on what is meant by "complex objects"?
uhoh
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-23T20:32:56.553Z
I'll try as soon as i can!
Natsfan
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-23T21:03:01.530Z
I edited my answer to include more information about the telescope and its intended targets.  If you need even more info, leave a comment with your concern. I found nothing about imaging the moon's surface.
Natsfan
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-24T02:46:23.200Z
Thank you for the edit! I'll give this (and these) a thorough read but it may take a few days. A satellite is a computationally easier target than the surface of the moon because while it's "complex" it's limited to a small angular range with a black backdrop, whereas looking at the Moon you have an extremely wide bright target. But I think for the purposes of this question a spacecraft and its solar panels will count as an "extended target.
uhoh
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-24T03:05:49.160Z
thanks for the feedback. Take your time.
Natsfan
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-23T17:09:57.050Z
2020-02-23T20:58:45.167Z
2020-02-23T20:58:45.167Z
Natsfan
<p>Inspired by several questions:</p>
<ul>
<li><a href="https://space.stackexchange.com/q/39841/12102">When will a moon landing site be visible via telescope?</a></li>
<li><a href="https://astronomy.stackexchange.com/q/27910/7982">Could the E.H.T. produce an image of the human artifacts on the moon?</a></li>
<li><a href="https://space.stackexchange.com/q/12347/12102">Picture of equipment left on the Moon?</a></li>
<li><a href="https://space.stackexchange.com/q/9460/12102">Were the Apollo lunar activities observed from Earth?</a></li>
</ul>
<p>If one wanted to resolve 1 meter or smaller detail on the surface of the Moon <em>from the surface of the Earth</em> (about 2.6E-09 or 0.5 mas) at say 1 micron wavelength <strong>one would need a baseline of order 400 meters.</strong></p>
<p>The longest current optical baselines are only <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_astronomical_interferometers_at_visible_and_infrared_wavelengths" rel="nofollow noreferrer">40 to 80 meters</a> and the longest one currently under construction is the <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalena_Ridge_Observatory#Magdalena_Ridge_Optical_Interferometer" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer</a> which</p>
<blockquote>
<p>will have ten 1.4 m (55 in) telescopes located on three 340 m (1,120 ft) arms. Each arm will have nine stations where the telescopes can be positioned, and one telescope can be positioned at the center.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>This is sufficient to have of the order of 1 meter resolution at the Moon's distance, but being optimized for star-like sources it's not clear if it will be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon.</p>
<p><strong>Question:</strong> Will the Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon, or is it designed only to separate a few star-like objects, e.g. binary stars or star + planetary systems?</p>
<p><strong>note:</strong> If information on this specific observatory isn't available, it would be certainly informative to extrapolate from existing imaging work from long baseline optical interferometers. The Moon presents a big challenge since its surface brightness extends over quite a large solid angle, so pinholes at the focus of each telescope in the array would generate a lot of diffracted/scattered light, whereas imaging star-like objects against a dark field would be less susceptible.</p>
<hr />
<p><a href="https://i.sstatic.net/CVLP9.jpg" rel="nofollow noreferrer"><img src="https://i.sstatic.net/CVLP9.jpg" alt="Magdalena Ridge Observatory Interferometer computer graphic overlay of the BCF building and the ten telescopes" /></a></p>
<blockquote>
<p>Magdalena Ridge Observatory Interferometer <strong>computer graphic overlay of the BCF building and the ten telescopes</strong> <a href="https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Interferomter_BCFcgOverlay.jpg" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Source</a></p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2019-11-13T09:11:49.947Z
If anybody can provide the formulas to calculate equivalent telescope size of an optical array of telescopes, I could add it to this page for quick calculations: http://win98.altervista.org/telescopio.html  I think such formulas also involve wavelength, it's not just a matter of distance between telescopes.
jumpjack
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-01-23T03:33:59.327Z
["It will even be able to make out details as small as a centimeter across on satellites in geosynchronous orbit, 36,000 kilometers above Earth, enabling it to spy on spy satellites."](https://science.sciencemag.org/content/361/6397/12)
Keith McClary
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-01-23T03:43:59.700Z
@KeithMcClary Cool! But *rats!* It's paywalled, I'll have to scramble to find a way to access it, everything shuts down here for a week during the holidays. (pun intended; it's coming up on the year of the mouse)
uhoh
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-01-23T03:51:40.430Z
They want $15 for [this](http://www.sciencemagazinedigital.org/sciencemagazine/06_july_2018-open/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1409671#articleId1409671)?
Keith McClary
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-01-23T04:41:18.503Z
Thanks, I sort of knew that.
Keith McClary
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-01-23T04:44:43.247Z
@KeithMcClary at least I can see this: https://science.sciencemag.org/content/361/6397/12/tab-figures-data
uhoh
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-23T03:47:46.230Z
@uhoh That is just the text from [the article you could not open] (http://www.sciencemagazinedigital.org/sciencemagazine/06_july_2018-open/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1409671#articleId1409671).
Keith McClary
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-23T03:52:44.607Z
@KeithMcClary ha! oops! It's Sunday morning here and I tried an experiment to see what happens if I didn't have my morning coffee. Now I remember what we did here. Okay because the message is weird in the bounty I'll check with the mods to see if it can and/or should be altered, but the alternative might be for you (or anyone else) to go ahead and leave a short answer including chunks of the article as block quotes. Sorry for my confusion! I'm making coffee now, learned my lesson...
uhoh
<observational-astronomy><photography><angular-resolution><interferometry>
Will the Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon?
uhoh
# Will the Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2019-11-13)

Inspired by several questions:

* [When will a moon landing site be visible via telescope?](https://space.stackexchange.com/q/39841/12102)
* [Could the E.H.T. produce an image of the human artifacts on the moon?](https://astronomy.stackexchange.com/q/27910/7982)
* [Picture of equipment left on the Moon?](https://space.stackexchange.com/q/12347/12102)
* [Were the Apollo lunar activities observed from Earth?](https://space.stackexchange.com/q/9460/12102)

If one wanted to resolve 1 meter or smaller detail on the surface of the Moon *from the surface of the Earth* (about 2.6E-09 or 0.5 mas) at say 1 micron wavelength **one would need a baseline of order 400 meters.**

The longest current optical baselines are only [40 to 80 meters](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_astronomical_interferometers_at_visible_and_infrared_wavelengths) and the longest one currently under construction is the [Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Magdalena_Ridge_Observatory#Magdalena_Ridge_Optical_Interferometer) which

> will have ten 1.4 m (55 in) telescopes located on three 340 m (1,120 ft) arms. Each arm will have nine stations where the telescopes can be positioned, and one telescope can be positioned at the center.

This is sufficient to have of the order of 1 meter resolution at the Moon's distance, but being optimized for star-like sources it's not clear if it will be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon.

**Question:** Will the Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon, or is it designed only to separate a few star-like objects, e.g. binary stars or star + planetary systems?

**note:** If information on this specific observatory isn't available, it would be certainly informative to extrapolate from existing imaging work from long baseline optical interferometers. The Moon presents a big challenge since its surface brightness extends over quite a large solid angle, so pinholes at the focus of each telescope in the array would generate a lot of diffracted/scattered light, whereas imaging star-like objects against a dark field would be less susceptible.

---

[![Magdalena Ridge Observatory Interferometer computer graphic overlay of the BCF building and the ten telescopes](https://i.sstatic.net/CVLP9.jpg)](https://i.sstatic.net/CVLP9.jpg)

> Magdalena Ridge Observatory Interferometer **computer graphic overlay of the BCF building and the ten telescopes** [Source](https://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:Interferomter_BCFcgOverlay.jpg)

**Tags:** observational-astronomy, photography, angular-resolution, interferometry
> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: If anybody can provide the formulas to calculate equivalent telescope size of an optical array of telescopes, I could add it to this page for quick calculations: http://win98.altervista.org/telescopio.html  I think such formulas also involve wavelength, it's not just a matter of distance between telescopes.  
> **username_2**: ["It will even be able to make out details as small as a centimeter across on satellites in geosynchronous orbit, 36,000 kilometers above Earth, enabling it to spy on spy satellites."](https://science.sciencemag.org/content/361/6397/12)  
> **username_0**: @KeithMcClary Cool! But *rats!* It's paywalled, I'll have to scramble to find a way to access it, everything shuts down here for a week during the holidays. (pun intended; it's coming up on the year of the mouse)  
> **username_2**: They want $15 for [this](http://www.sciencemagazinedigital.org/sciencemagazine/06_july_2018-open/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1409671#articleId1409671)?  
> **username_2**: Thanks, I sort of knew that.  
> **username_0**: @KeithMcClary at least I can see this: https://science.sciencemag.org/content/361/6397/12/tab-figures-data  
> **username_2**: @uhoh That is just the text from [the article you could not open] (http://www.sciencemagazinedigital.org/sciencemagazine/06_july_2018-open/MobilePagedArticle.action?articleId=1409671#articleId1409671).  
> **username_0**: @KeithMcClary ha! oops! It's Sunday morning here and I tried an experiment to see what happens if I didn't have my morning coffee. Now I remember what we did here. Okay because the message is weird in the bounty I'll check with the mods to see if it can and/or should be altered, but the alternative might be for you (or anyone else) to go ahead and leave a short answer including chunks of the article as block quotes. Sorry for my confusion! I'm making coffee now, learned my lesson...  

---

## 1 answers

### Answer by username_3 on 2020-02-23. Score: 2 | Accepted answer

According to [this site](https://www.wired.com/story/how-americas-spooks-seek-to-spy-on-distant-satellites/?fbclid=IwAR28cX1RS-twe3C9xh0R9KyjXO29GQ1QdmzXGs_OvFhnWld6hBE7JbkvByE) The 10 telescopes will be optically linked together in order to make images of astronomical objects with unprecedented detail. The interferometer will have a resolution 100 times greater than the Hubble Space Telescope and will be able to make accurate images of complex astronomical objects many times faster than other existing interferometric arrays.

And: The Interferometer will take delivery of the second telescope enclosure in February 2020 and the second telescope in August 2020. They expect to fully incorporate the second telescope by the end of 2020, which will allow the instrument to produce “fringes,” using the proprietary fringe-tracker called ICoNN.

There is also this headline:

> How America's Spooks Seek to Spy on Distant Satellites The
> intelligence community has plans for a telescope network that can see
> not just a blob in orbit but details such as a satellite’s solar
> panels.

from [here.](https://www.wired.com/story/how-americas-spooks-seek-to-spy-on-distant-satellites/?fbclid=IwAR28cX1RS-twe3C9xh0R9KyjXO29GQ1QdmzXGs_OvFhnWld6hBE7JbkvByE)

That's one reason why the U.S. Air Force, which wants to monitor its own orbital assets and presumably those of others, is funding MROI. "They want to know: Did the boom break or did some part of the photovoltaic panels collapse?" says Michelle Creech-Eakman, an astronomer at the New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology in Socorro and project scientist on MROI. But if the facility succeeds, its biggest impact could be on the field of astronomy, by drawing new attention to the promise of optical interferometry, a powerful but challenging strategy for extracting exquisitely sharp images from relatively small, cheap telescopes.

Radio astronomers have had it easier. The long radio wavelengths mean data from separated dishes can be recorded, digitized, time-stamped by an atomic clock, and combined later for analysis. But optical interferometry is far trickier: The short wavelengths of visible light, running at terahertz frequencies, cannot yet be digitized by any electrical system. So the light must be merged in real time, with nanometer precision.

From [here](https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/07/telescope-array-will-spy-spy-satellites-star-surfaces-and-black-holes).

Also Reference 3.

3. <http://www.mro.nmt.edu/about-mro/interferometer-mroi/>

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: Thanks, this is great news, but *Will the Magdalena Ridge Optical Interferometer be able to image extended objects like the surface of the Moon?* Is it possible to expand just a little bit on what is meant by "complex objects"?  
> **username_3**: I'll try as soon as i can!  
> **username_3**: I edited my answer to include more information about the telescope and its intended targets.  If you need even more info, leave a comment with your concern. I found nothing about imaging the moon's surface.  
> **username_0**: Thank you for the edit! I'll give this (and these) a thorough read but it may take a few days. A satellite is a computationally easier target than the surface of the moon because while it's "complex" it's limited to a small angular range with a black backdrop, whereas looking at the Moon you have an extremely wide bright target. But I think for the purposes of this question a spacecraft and its solar panels will count as an "extended target.  
> **username_3**: thanks for the feedback. Take your time.  

---

