Answers.Body: <p>I am answering my own question AGAIN with some feedback to people at @civicrm.</p>
  <p>I am a seasoned admin but CiviCRM nearly broke me due to the challenges I faced. Please, @CiviCRM, improve the documentation AND provide examples that work straight for VARIOUS scenarious, e.g. give an example that can be cloned for EXTERNAL facing webpages - this was my problem after all.</p>
  <p>When I start using new software I just use the examples provided, read the documentation and follow the steps.</p>
  <p>It worked as long as used the LINK in form builder &quot;view page&quot; and filled out the form.</p>
  <p>What I did not know ALL examples are for internal use, i.e. need a user logged in and/or details of the user passed.</p>
  <p>I needed this form to work EXTERNALLY as we are asking new volunteers to SIGNUP - this was my problem.</p>
  <p>So I played with MANY settings, I changed setting in &quot;WordPress Access Control&quot;. I got the from to work externally and we got plenty of people signed up.</p>
  <p>However I got explained (rightly so) one of my settings is dangerous.</p>
  <p>Turns out all I had to change the Form security from &quot;User Based&quot; (the DEFAULT) to &quot;Form Based&quot; - suddenly it started working.</p>
  <p>I HATE Nationbuilder with a PASSION for so many different reasons, that's why I tried sticking with CiviCRM.</p>
  <p>Please @CiviCRM, improve the Documentation AND provide better examples.</p>
  <p>Examples that match different scenarios - especially one for EXTERNAL use -  and NAME them in that way.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-25T17:52:37.090Z
Answers.Text: civicrm is a community effort. some effort has been put in to updating the documentation about FormBuilder. You are welcome to help. The section here does cover the issue about needing to set eg Individual1 to be Form Based - https://docs.civicrm.org/user/en/latest/the-user-interface/creating-new-forms/#setting-up-forms-to-work-with-secret-links-similar-to-the-use-of-checksums-for-other-civicrm-forms
Answers.UserDisplayName: petednz - fuzion
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-25T17:53:14.500Z
Answers.Text: I added the above based on a recipe mentioned in Chat, and I thought it would be helpful to have it in the docs. Always room for improvements
Answers.UserDisplayName: petednz - fuzion
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-26T22:24:15.247Z
Answers.Text: I understand @petednz and I would love to help - I have to do this via "suggestions" and "feedback". I use CivicCRM in volunteer scenarios, I spend about 30 hours a week contributing that way - I am simply running out of time.
  I am also trying to promote CiviCRM, I am constantly in our volunteer circles saying "you should not use Nationbuilder but use CiviCRM" - people are hesitant.
  Also because Nationbuilder has people running around at EVERY SINGLE (political/volunteer) event promoting their product.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-25T00:51:02.257Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2024-11-25T00:51:02.257Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Answers.Body: <p>I am a very seasoned SysAdmin, I also know that new software can be tricky - but I nearly threw in the towel with this one.
  Yes I figured it out in the end but this one has been a difficult experience.</p>
  <p>I had constant permission problems and submission problems.</p>
  <p>Note: when clicking within Formbuilder on &quot;view page&quot; there was NEVER any problem viewing/submitting, it was only when viewing and filling out the form from within Wordpress when the difficulties began.</p>
  <p>I made so many changes and tries that I don't know which one solved it, but this is what I did:</p>
  <ul>
  <li>I clutched for straws making sure all FILESYSTEM permission were correct</li>
  <li>I followed different hints searching the net for similar problems, many did not help</li>
  <li>The website sits behind cloudflare, so I added an exclusion rule for caching for the forms in cloudflare</li>
  <li>whenever I save/change a form I clear the civicrm cache</li>
  <li>I have not restarted my local WP cache, the plugin is still disabled, this was one of the first things I turned off.</li>
  <li>I make clones of a form at regular intervals to be able to go back to one that worked - this saved me hours repeating.</li>
  </ul>
  <p>It <strong>seems</strong> cache related, but what do I know - I am new to CiviCRM.</p>
  <p>But there was another problem, whenever I clicked on SUBMIT it would take the submission, in the FORMBUILDER main page it would show me an increase of the number in submissions but the newly submitted data would not be visible when listing all contacts.</p>
  <p>Only after adding a number of permissions for the anonymous user in &quot;WordPress Access Control&quot; (add contacts, CiviCRM: access CiviCRM backend and API, CiviCRM: access AJAX API, CiviCRM: access contact reference fields) would the data appear in the civicrm database.</p>
  <p>All of this should be included as hints for formbuilder/wordpress submissions.</p>
  <p>See my second answer for a solution.</p>
  <p>@petednz-fuzion @coleman</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-23T10:17:00.240Z
Answers.Text: I strongly recommend that you *don't* give anonymous users the permission to `access CiviCRM backend and API`. This permission should only be given to trusted users. I agree that the documentation on FormBuilder is currently lacking. It would be good to improve this and make it clearer what settings are needed to perform common tasks.
Answers.UserDisplayName: William Mortada
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-25T00:23:11.670Z
Answers.Text: Thanks for your comment @WilliamMortada, I have added my own answer.
  You are correct, the EXAMPLES and DOCUMENTATION need improvement (I had to calm  down to be able to write this.)
Answers.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-22T04:47:45.627Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2024-11-25T00:51:33.453Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2024-11-25T00:51:33.453Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Answers.Body: <p>I'm having the same issue. For me the page is showing, but I only have the title and the civicrm logo. AND a lot of jQuery errors in page: <a href="https://lajoiedevivre.net/civi/test1234/" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://lajoiedevivre.net/civi/test1234/</a>
  I started another question here: <a href="https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/questions/48844/is-it-normal-that-public-pages-made-in-formbuilder-are-not-showing">Is it normal that public pages made in FormBuilder are not showing?</a>
  What gives me headaches is that it works perfectly on WPmaster now, but it didn't and it doesn't work on my websites, as on my raspberry home server.</p>
  <p>Edit: This worked for me: <a href="https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/a/41787/17344">https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/a/41787/17344</a> (Différer jQuery et jQuery Migrate in WP Divi Theme options )</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-18T18:30:05.303Z
Answers.Text: I undeleted this answer as it has now had a solution added. thank you
Answers.UserDisplayName: petednz - fuzion
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-11-17T18:26:40.433Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2024-11-18T11:47:50.220Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2024-11-18T11:47:50.220Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Fredatipik
Body: <p>New install of CiviCRM (latest version) in Wordpress (everything latest version).</p>
  <p>I have created two new forms in two ways</p>
  <ol>
  <li>copied the existing &quot;New Individual&quot;</li>
  <li>created a new form using &quot;Individual&quot;</li>
  </ol>
  <p>then added some fields plus some custom fields we need for the volunteers.</p>
  <p>Also we need this form exposed on the website for ALL users as this is a &quot;Volunteer signup&quot;, so they are NOT in the DB yet. I read all documentation and searched the Internet and stackexchange (civicrm).</p>
  <p>I set the following flags (whether needed or just to make sure)</p>
  <ol>
  <li>Generic allow all users</li>
  <li>Civicrm add contacts</li>
  <li>Civicrm access all data</li>
  <li>access crm backend and api</li>
  <li>all cicicrm permissions and acl</li>
  </ol>
  <p>The issue I am having that 50% of the time (whether I made changes or not) I get &quot;You do not have permission to access this page&quot; - it ALWAYS works when selecting &quot;View Page&quot; in formbuilder.</p>
  <p>So I clean the cache, change some flags. I also checked the filesystem settings as well, even the wp-content/civicrm directory, I cannot find any faults.</p>
  <p>When I make some changes in the form - even just change some text - then save and load the page &quot;civicrm/volunteer-signup&quot; - it sometime works, sometimes does not.</p>
  <p>I just want consistency, so I can rely that this works.</p>
  <p>Is there anything I can do that would help me?
  thanks</p>
  
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2024-11-15T02:53:22.713Z
Comments.Text: When you say "set the following flags" what flag are you referring to exactly? If it's the form permissions, you need to set it to ONLY "Generic - allow all users" and not any of the others.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Coleman
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2024-11-16T02:59:39.727Z
Comments.Text: I tried everything, with just "Generic" and/or other options, clearing the cache, creating a new form etc. Getting the formbuilder form is like roulette for me.
  I can read manuals, I can setup the hardest piece of software in no time.
  Getting a form to work has - somehow - beaten me (I am not easy giving up!)
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2024-11-16T03:10:59.593Z
Comments.Text: NOTE: it works when I press the "View Page" link from within Formbuilder.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2024-11-16T03:20:27.457Z
Comments.Text: In addition IF I get the form to work, fill out the form (cloned from Individual) and submit the form with filled fields it does NOT show up in the database.
  Note: I have a POST submit page set which I can see.
  Submitting the form from WITHIN the formbuilder - no problem data shows up in the database and I can see the added data under contact search.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2024-11-16T04:08:19.727Z
Comments.Text: Also, I changed to one of the default themes, twenty twenty-five - makes no difference.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jobst
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2024-11-17T18:26:40.433Z
Comments.Text: I'm having the same issue. For me the page is showing, but I only have the title and the civicrm logo. AND a lot of jQuery errors in page: https://lajoiedevivre.net/civi/test1234/
  I started another question here: https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/questions/48844/is-it-normal-that-public-pages-made-in-formbuilder-are-not-showing
  What gives me headaches is that it works perfectly on WPmaster now, but it didn't and it doesn't work on my websites, as on my raspberry home server.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Fredatipik
Tags: <wordpress><contacts><formbuilder>
Title: Formbuilder form: SET "Accessible on front-end of website" getting "You do not have permission to access this page."
ThreadText: # Formbuilder form: SET "Accessible on front-end of website" getting "You do not have permission to access this page."
  
  (Asked by: username_0 on 2024-11-15)
  
  New install of CiviCRM (latest version) in Wordpress (everything latest version).
  
  I have created two new forms in two ways
  
  1. copied the existing "New Individual"
  2. created a new form using "Individual"
  
  then added some fields plus some custom fields we need for the volunteers.
  
  Also we need this form exposed on the website for ALL users as this is a "Volunteer signup", so they are NOT in the DB yet. I read all documentation and searched the Internet and stackexchange (civicrm).
  
  I set the following flags (whether needed or just to make sure)
  
  1. Generic allow all users
  2. Civicrm add contacts
  3. Civicrm access all data
  4. access crm backend and api
  5. all cicicrm permissions and acl
  
  The issue I am having that 50% of the time (whether I made changes or not) I get "You do not have permission to access this page" - it ALWAYS works when selecting "View Page" in formbuilder.
  
  So I clean the cache, change some flags. I also checked the filesystem settings as well, even the wp-content/civicrm directory, I cannot find any faults.
  
  When I make some changes in the form - even just change some text - then save and load the page "civicrm/volunteer-signup" - it sometime works, sometimes does not.
  
  I just want consistency, so I can rely that this works.
  
  Is there anything I can do that would help me?
  thanks
  
  **Tags:** wordpress, contacts, formbuilder
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_1**: When you say "set the following flags" what flag are you referring to exactly? If it's the form permissions, you need to set it to ONLY "Generic - allow all users" and not any of the others.  
  > **username_0**: I tried everything, with just "Generic" and/or other options, clearing the cache, creating a new form etc. Getting the formbuilder form is like roulette for me. I can read manuals, I can setup the hardest piece of software in no time. Getting a form to work has - somehow - beaten me (I am not easy giving up!)  
  > **username_0**: NOTE: it works when I press the "View Page" link from within Formbuilder.  
  > **username_0**: In addition IF I get the form to work, fill out the form (cloned from Individual) and submit the form with filled fields it does NOT show up in the database. Note: I have a POST submit page set which I can see. Submitting the form from WITHIN the formbuilder - no problem data shows up in the database and I can see the added data under contact search.  
  > **username_0**: Also, I changed to one of the default themes, twenty twenty-five - makes no difference.  
  > **username_2**: I'm having the same issue. For me the page is showing, but I only have the title and the civicrm logo. AND a lot of jQuery errors in page: https://lajoiedevivre.net/civi/test1234/ I started another question here: https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/questions/48844/is-it-normal-that-public-pages-made-in-formbuilder-are-not-showing What gives me headaches is that it works perfectly on WPmaster now, but it didn't and it doesn't work on my websites, as on my raspberry home server.  
  
  ---
  
  ## 3 answers
  
  ### Answer by username_0 on 2024-11-25. Score: 1
  
  I am answering my own question AGAIN with some feedback to people at @civicrm.
  
  I am a seasoned admin but CiviCRM nearly broke me due to the challenges I faced. Please, @CiviCRM, improve the documentation AND provide examples that work straight for VARIOUS scenarious, e.g. give an example that can be cloned for EXTERNAL facing webpages - this was my problem after all.
  
  When I start using new software I just use the examples provided, read the documentation and follow the steps.
  
  It worked as long as used the LINK in form builder "view page" and filled out the form.
  
  What I did not know ALL examples are for internal use, i.e. need a user logged in and/or details of the user passed.
  
  I needed this form to work EXTERNALLY as we are asking new volunteers to SIGNUP - this was my problem.
  
  So I played with MANY settings, I changed setting in "WordPress Access Control". I got the from to work externally and we got plenty of people signed up.
  
  However I got explained (rightly so) one of my settings is dangerous.
  
  Turns out all I had to change the Form security from "User Based" (the DEFAULT) to "Form Based" - suddenly it started working.
  
  I HATE Nationbuilder with a PASSION for so many different reasons, that's why I tried sticking with CiviCRM.
  
  Please @CiviCRM, improve the Documentation AND provide better examples.
  
  Examples that match different scenarios - especially one for EXTERNAL use - and NAME them in that way.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_3**: civicrm is a community effort. some effort has been put in to updating the documentation about FormBuilder. You are welcome to help. The section here does cover the issue about needing to set eg Individual1 to be Form Based - https://docs.civicrm.org/user/en/latest/the-user-interface/creating-new-forms/#setting-up-forms-to-work-with-secret-links-similar-to-the-use-of-checksums-for-other-civicrm-forms  
  > **username_3**: I added the above based on a recipe mentioned in Chat, and I thought it would be helpful to have it in the docs. Always room for improvements  
  > **username_0**: I understand @petednz and I would love to help - I have to do this via "suggestions" and "feedback". I use CivicCRM in volunteer scenarios, I spend about 30 hours a week contributing that way - I am simply running out of time. I am also trying to promote CiviCRM, I am constantly in our volunteer circles saying "you should not use Nationbuilder but use CiviCRM" - people are hesitant. Also because Nationbuilder has people running around at EVERY SINGLE (political/volunteer) event promoting their product.  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_0 on 2024-11-22. Score: 1
  
  I am a very seasoned SysAdmin, I also know that new software can be tricky - but I nearly threw in the towel with this one.
  Yes I figured it out in the end but this one has been a difficult experience.
  
  I had constant permission problems and submission problems.
  
  Note: when clicking within Formbuilder on "view page" there was NEVER any problem viewing/submitting, it was only when viewing and filling out the form from within Wordpress when the difficulties began.
  
  I made so many changes and tries that I don't know which one solved it, but this is what I did:
  
  * I clutched for straws making sure all FILESYSTEM permission were correct
  * I followed different hints searching the net for similar problems, many did not help
  * The website sits behind cloudflare, so I added an exclusion rule for caching for the forms in cloudflare
  * whenever I save/change a form I clear the civicrm cache
  * I have not restarted my local WP cache, the plugin is still disabled, this was one of the first things I turned off.
  * I make clones of a form at regular intervals to be able to go back to one that worked - this saved me hours repeating.
  
  It **seems** cache related, but what do I know - I am new to CiviCRM.
  
  But there was another problem, whenever I clicked on SUBMIT it would take the submission, in the FORMBUILDER main page it would show me an increase of the number in submissions but the newly submitted data would not be visible when listing all contacts.
  
  Only after adding a number of permissions for the anonymous user in "WordPress Access Control" (add contacts, CiviCRM: access CiviCRM backend and API, CiviCRM: access AJAX API, CiviCRM: access contact reference fields) would the data appear in the civicrm database.
  
  All of this should be included as hints for formbuilder/wordpress submissions.
  
  See my second answer for a solution.
  
  @petednz-fuzion @coleman
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_4**: I strongly recommend that you *don't* give anonymous users the permission to `access CiviCRM backend and API`. This permission should only be given to trusted users. I agree that the documentation on FormBuilder is currently lacking. It would be good to improve this and make it clearer what settings are needed to perform common tasks.  
  > **username_0**: Thanks for your comment @WilliamMortada, I have added my own answer. You are correct, the EXAMPLES and DOCUMENTATION need improvement (I had to calm  down to be able to write this.)  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_2 on 2024-11-17. Score: 0
  
  I'm having the same issue. For me the page is showing, but I only have the title and the civicrm logo. AND a lot of jQuery errors in page: <https://lajoiedevivre.net/civi/test1234/>
  I started another question here: [Is it normal that public pages made in FormBuilder are not showing?](https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/questions/48844/is-it-normal-that-public-pages-made-in-formbuilder-are-not-showing)
  What gives me headaches is that it works perfectly on WPmaster now, but it didn't and it doesn't work on my websites, as on my raspberry home server.
  
  Edit: This worked for me: <https://civicrm.stackexchange.com/a/41787/17344> (Différer jQuery et jQuery Migrate in WP Divi Theme options )
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_3**: I undeleted this answer as it has now had a solution added. thank you  
  
  ---
  
  