Answers.Body: <p>There is a "Chess959" which advocates the removal of SP 518 (which is when the factors that lead to "randomizing" the chess pieces happen to have the same arrangement as the traditional layout.) The rationale for removal is that players have so much training in that one starting position that the game becomes less about who is the better, more reactive OTB chess player and more about who has prepared their opening lines. </p>
  
  <p>Assuming both players are actively participating in Chess959 as opposed to 960, in the event of rolling SP 518, simply re-roll.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2018-04-19T21:22:32.067Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2018-04-19T21:22:32.067Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: corsiKa
Answers.Body: <p><strong><a href="https://chess.stackexchange.com/questions/41499/why-was-the-2019-wfrcc-called-slow-rapid-when-its-actually-classical-4515-6">2019</a> Update</strong>:</p>
  <p>From '<a href="https://handbook.fide.com/files/handbook/FRCCRegulations2019.pdf" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Regulations  for the 2019    FIDE    World   Fischer Random Chess Championship</a>', it's excluded:</p>
  <blockquote>
  <p>If during the event the start position of classical chess is selected, the draw for the initial setup of the pieces will be done again.</p>
  </blockquote>
  <p><strong>Even <a href="https://chess.stackexchange.com/questions/41483/why-didnt-wesley-so-get-full-championship-privilege-in-the-2022-wfrcc-unlike-ma">2022</a></strong>:</p>
  <p>Also <a href="https://handbook.fide.com/files/handbook/FRCCRegulations2022.pdf" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Regulations for the 2022 FIDE World Fischer Random Chess Championship</a></p>
  <blockquote>
  <p>If the start position of classical chess is randomly selected, the draw for the initial position of the pieces will be repeated.</p>
  </blockquote>
  <hr />
  <p>Check out:</p>
  <p><a href="https://reddit.com/xksw8k" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Chess959 not Chess960 ! See in 2019 and 2022 regulations that FIDE's World Fischer Random Chess is actually Chess959. Now can lichess please do the same?</a></p>
  <blockquote>
  <p><a href="https://i.sstatic.net/Vs32d.png" rel="nofollow noreferrer"><img src="https://i.sstatic.net/Vs32d.png" alt="enter image description here" /></a></p>
  </blockquote>
  <hr />
  <p>2024 Update:</p>
  <p>In 2024Feb <a href="https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freestyle_Chess_G.O.A.T._Challenge" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Freestyle Chess</a> (GOAT not <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A52UXLpplTw" rel="nofollow noreferrer">MTOAT</a> I guess):</p>
  <p><a href="https://www.chess.com/news/view/2024-freestyle-chess-goat-challenge-day-1" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://www.chess.com/news/view/2024-freestyle-chess-goat-challenge-day-1</a></p>
  <blockquote>
  <p>the way the position is drawn using 958 balls (the normal chess position, and the same position with queens and kings swapped, are excluded)</p>
  </blockquote>
  <p>So SP518 and gender-swapped SP518 (<a href="https://chess960.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/chess960-starting-positions.pdf" rel="nofollow noreferrer">SP534</a>) are out.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-03-29T09:44:06.560Z
Answers.Text: Am I mistaken or is SP534 not equivalent to standard chess (because castling is not symmetrical), and that difference is not trivial (you won't be able to reverse-copy-cat standard openings for long) ? Is so, is there any explanation given about why is it excluded in this 2024 tournament ?
Answers.UserDisplayName: Evargalo
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2024-03-29T11:08:30.750Z
Answers.Text: @Evargalo You're right. It's not copycat, but maybe it's similar enough. I think there was some explanation I saw on twitter or instagram.
Answers.UserDisplayName: BCLC
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2021-01-19T00:58:28.747Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2024-03-28T13:30:28.240Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2024-03-28T13:30:28.240Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: BCLC
Answers.Body: <p>There is no mention of excluding the regular starting position in Appendix F. of the <a href="http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=124&amp;view=article" rel="noreferrer">FIDE Laws of Chess</a>, so it's really Chess960 and not Chess959. I can imagine that there are chess programs or websites which do exclude the regular starting position, but this is against the official rules.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2018-04-19T14:55:20.210Z
Answers.Text: Using the [two tables method](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess960_numbering_scheme) the standard starting position is 518.
Answers.UserDisplayName: corsiKa
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2018-04-19T21:12:08.300Z
Answers.Text: I can confirm that lichess, for example, allows you to have the standard starting position in a Chess960 tournament.  Took me by surprise...
Answers.UserDisplayName: Ghotir
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Answers.CreationDate: 2018-04-19T07:09:23.993Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2018-04-19T07:09:23.993Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Glorfindel
Body: <p>Once in 960 times, Chess960 should just be the same as regular chess. Are there any known instances of this? Or is this selection automatically excluded, after which they just roll the dice again? So is it really &quot;Chess959&quot;?</p>
  <p>EDIT: Found this: <a href="https://lichess.org/forum/lichess-feedback/chess960-starting-position-518-is-like-regular-chess" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://lichess.org/forum/lichess-feedback/chess960-starting-position-518-is-like-regular-chess</a>. An online player complains that he has faced the dreaded 518 two times. And why not? My golfing uncle hit two holes-in-1 during his career, and that’s got to be a lot less likely than 1 in a thousand!</p>
  <p>But I think that Chess960 can’t be that popular at top levels or there would be a celebrated example where GM X faced GM Y over a 518 Game Array.</p>
  
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2018-04-19T14:28:22.643Z
Comments.Text: This is the first time I have heard of Chess 959, though searching on the internet gives other clues.
Comments.UserDisplayName: ABcDexter
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2023-02-13T12:59:42.033Z
Comments.Text: @ABcDexter chess959 is what is played in FIDE WFRCC. See my answer. Fischer random = checss959. Chess960 is a different game from Fischer random.
Comments.UserDisplayName: BCLC
Tags: <chess-variants><chess960>
Title: Chess960 or Chess959?
ThreadText: # Chess960 or Chess959?
  
  (Asked by: username_0 on 2018-04-19)
  
  Once in 960 times, Chess960 should just be the same as regular chess. Are there any known instances of this? Or is this selection automatically excluded, after which they just roll the dice again? So is it really "Chess959"?
  
  EDIT: Found this: <https://lichess.org/forum/lichess-feedback/chess960-starting-position-518-is-like-regular-chess>. An online player complains that he has faced the dreaded 518 two times. And why not? My golfing uncle hit two holes-in-1 during his career, and that’s got to be a lot less likely than 1 in a thousand!
  
  But I think that Chess960 can’t be that popular at top levels or there would be a celebrated example where GM X faced GM Y over a 518 Game Array.
  
  **Tags:** chess-variants, chess960
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_1**: This is the first time I have heard of Chess 959, though searching on the internet gives other clues.  
  > **username_2**: @username_1 chess959 is what is played in FIDE WFRCC. See my answer. Fischer random = checss959. Chess960 is a different game from Fischer random.  
  
  ---
  
  ## 3 answers
  
  ### Answer by username_5 on 2018-04-19. Score: 25 | Accepted answer
  
  There is no mention of excluding the regular starting position in Appendix F. of the [FIDE Laws of Chess](http://www.fide.com/component/handbook/?id=124&view=article), so it's really Chess960 and not Chess959. I can imagine that there are chess programs or websites which do exclude the regular starting position, but this is against the official rules.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_3**: Using the [two tables method](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chess960_numbering_scheme) the standard starting position is 518.  
  > **username_6**: I can confirm that lichess, for example, allows you to have the standard starting position in a Chess960 tournament.  Took me by surprise...  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_3 on 2018-04-19. Score: 9
  
  There is a "Chess959" which advocates the removal of SP 518 (which is when the factors that lead to "randomizing" the chess pieces happen to have the same arrangement as the traditional layout.) The rationale for removal is that players have so much training in that one starting position that the game becomes less about who is the better, more reactive OTB chess player and more about who has prepared their opening lines.
  
  Assuming both players are actively participating in Chess959 as opposed to 960, in the event of rolling SP 518, simply re-roll.
  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_2 on 2021-01-19. Score: 7
  
  **[2019](https://chess.stackexchange.com/questions/41499/why-was-the-2019-wfrcc-called-slow-rapid-when-its-actually-classical-4515-6) Update**:
  
  From '[Regulations for the 2019 FIDE World Fischer Random Chess Championship](https://handbook.fide.com/files/handbook/FRCCRegulations2019.pdf)', it's excluded:
  
  > If during the event the start position of classical chess is selected, the draw for the initial setup of the pieces will be done again.
  
  **Even [2022](https://chess.stackexchange.com/questions/41483/why-didnt-wesley-so-get-full-championship-privilege-in-the-2022-wfrcc-unlike-ma)**:
  
  Also [Regulations for the 2022 FIDE World Fischer Random Chess Championship](https://handbook.fide.com/files/handbook/FRCCRegulations2022.pdf)
  
  > If the start position of classical chess is randomly selected, the draw for the initial position of the pieces will be repeated.
  
  ---
  
  Check out:
  
  [Chess959 not Chess960 ! See in 2019 and 2022 regulations that FIDE's World Fischer Random Chess is actually Chess959. Now can lichess please do the same?](https://reddit.com/xksw8k)
  
  > [![enter image description here](https://i.sstatic.net/Vs32d.png)](https://i.sstatic.net/Vs32d.png)
  
  ---
  
  2024 Update:
  
  In 2024Feb [Freestyle Chess](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freestyle_Chess_G.O.A.T._Challenge) (GOAT not [MTOAT](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A52UXLpplTw) I guess):
  
  <https://www.chess.com/news/view/2024-freestyle-chess-goat-challenge-day-1>
  
  > the way the position is drawn using 958 balls (the normal chess position, and the same position with queens and kings swapped, are excluded)
  
  So SP518 and gender-swapped SP518 ([SP534](https://chess960.net/wp-content/uploads/2018/02/chess960-starting-positions.pdf)) are out.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_4**: Am I mistaken or is SP534 not equivalent to standard chess (because castling is not symmetrical), and that difference is not trivial (you won't be able to reverse-copy-cat standard openings for long) ? Is so, is there any explanation given about why is it excluded in this 2024 tournament ?  
  > **username_2**: @username_4 You're right. It's not copycat, but maybe it's similar enough. I think there was some explanation I saw on twitter or instagram.  
  
  ---
  
  