Answers.Body: <p>There has almost certainly never been a &quot;world's best player&quot; in the last few hundred years who would lose to some of the weak CMs around today (or even in 2020). You do not need a rating of 2200 to be a CM in today's world. You can be sub 1200 and &quot;win&quot; the title by finishing in the first 3 in a continental championship for under 8's.</p>
  <p>To see a list of weak CMs go to the <a href="https://ratings.fide.com/advaction.phtml?idcode=&amp;name=&amp;title=c&amp;other_title=&amp;country=%25&amp;sex=&amp;srating=0&amp;erating=3000&amp;birthday=&amp;radio=rating&amp;line=asc" rel="nofollow noreferrer">FIDE advanced ratings search page</a> and search for CMs according to rating ascending. There are currently 7 players rated under 1200 in the list of CMs.</p>
  
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Answers.CreationDate: 2023-06-11T05:14:13.390Z
Answers.Text: The question was asking if they'd lose to *a* modern CM, not if they'd lose to *every* modern CM. Cherry picking the weakest ones is not really in the spirit of the question IMO. It would be like referencing the play of a 90 year old GM when talking about the strength of modern GMs; yes, they have the title, but that's not normally what we mean when we talk about that.
Answers.UserDisplayName: D M
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Answers.CreationDate: 2021-09-18T23:18:47.693Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2021-09-18T23:18:47.693Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Brian Towers
Body: <p>Of the chess players who could reasonably be considered the best in the world in at least one year in history, how far back would you have to go before one of them would lose to a 2020 Candidate Master (or FM or IM) in a classical game? How would historical figures such as Steinitz or McDonnell or Ruy López fare against the different ranks of titled players?</p>
  <p>(Going back far enough, mileage on rules like castling or stalemate may vary. If you think it makes a difference which player's version of rules is used then give the answer both ways.)</p>
  
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-08-15T22:20:39.980Z
Comments.Text: Edited to express what I intended, classical.
Comments.UserDisplayName: A.M.
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Comments.CreationDate: 2020-08-15T23:17:23.783Z
Comments.Text: Every single world champion would wipe the floor with "candidate masters" (which are nothing more than amateurs, and not particularly strong ones) of today. So you'd have to go far, far back
Comments.UserDisplayName: David
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-10-28T10:40:40.053Z
Comments.Text: @David Pretty dismissive of you. A CM is certainly a very strong amateur. (Unless you use Garry Kasparov’s definition of amateur)
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jimmy360
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Comments.CreationDate: 2020-10-28T11:54:02.060Z
Comments.Text: You might take to take a look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2DHpW79w0Y I make no claims as to the accuracy of what is presented
Comments.UserDisplayName: Ian Bush
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-10-29T11:48:46.523Z
Comments.Text: @Jimmy360 many IMs and even GMs are not professionals. So CM's are far from being among the strongest amateurs
Comments.UserDisplayName: David
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-10-29T11:51:50.857Z
Comments.Text: @David yes perhaps only the top 20 can be professionals in a literal sense
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jimmy360
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-10-29T11:54:16.160Z
Comments.Text: @David I’m not disputing that a CM is an amateur. I’m disputing that a CM is “not particularly strong” (although such things are a matter of opinion).
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jimmy360
Tags: <history><famous-players><titles>
Title: Most recent "best in world" player who would be defeated by a CM
ThreadText: # Most recent "best in world" player who would be defeated by a CM
  
  (Asked by: username_0 on 2020-08-15)
  
  Of the chess players who could reasonably be considered the best in the world in at least one year in history, how far back would you have to go before one of them would lose to a 2020 Candidate Master (or FM or IM) in a classical game? How would historical figures such as Steinitz or McDonnell or Ruy López fare against the different ranks of titled players?
  
  (Going back far enough, mileage on rules like castling or stalemate may vary. If you think it makes a difference which player's version of rules is used then give the answer both ways.)
  
  **Tags:** history, famous-players, titles
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_0**: Edited to express what I intended, classical.  
  > **username_1**: Every single world champion would wipe the floor with "candidate masters" (which are nothing more than amateurs, and not particularly strong ones) of today. So you'd have to go far, far back  
  > **username_2**: @username_1 Pretty dismissive of you. A CM is certainly a very strong amateur. (Unless you use Garry Kasparov’s definition of amateur)  
  > **username_3**: You might take to take a look at https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z2DHpW79w0Y I make no claims as to the accuracy of what is presented  
  > **username_1**: @username_2 many IMs and even GMs are not professionals. So CM's are far from being among the strongest amateurs  
  > **username_2**: @username_1 yes perhaps only the top 20 can be professionals in a literal sense  
  > **username_2**: @username_1 I’m not disputing that a CM is an amateur. I’m disputing that a CM is “not particularly strong” (although such things are a matter of opinion).  
  
  ---
  
  ## 1 answers
  
  ### Answer by username_4 on 2021-09-18. Score: 1
  
  There has almost certainly never been a "world's best player" in the last few hundred years who would lose to some of the weak CMs around today (or even in 2020). You do not need a rating of 2200 to be a CM in today's world. You can be sub 1200 and "win" the title by finishing in the first 3 in a continental championship for under 8's.
  
  To see a list of weak CMs go to the [FIDE advanced ratings search page](https://ratings.fide.com/advaction.phtml?idcode=&name=&title=c&other_title=&country=%25&sex=&srating=0&erating=3000&birthday=&radio=rating&line=asc) and search for CMs according to rating ascending. There are currently 7 players rated under 1200 in the list of CMs.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_5**: The question was asking if they'd lose to *a* modern CM, not if they'd lose to *every* modern CM. Cherry picking the weakest ones is not really in the spirit of the question IMO. It would be like referencing the play of a 90 year old GM when talking about the strength of modern GMs; yes, they have the title, but that's not normally what we mean when we talk about that.  
  
  ---
  
  