<blockquote>
  <p>Does anyone have another example or an answer?</p>
</blockquote>

<p>I think that yes, they <em>could</em> be abused... but <strong>the situation you portray is by itself hard to achieve.</strong></p>

<p>To summon <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Slifer_the_Sky_Dragon" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Slifer, the Sky Dragon</a> you must <em>tribute 3 monsters first</em>, something that takes time and surely cards from your hand to achieve.</p>

<p>Next, <em>cards like <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Pot_of_Greed" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Pot of Greed</a> that you mention are Forbidden in competitive play</em> (why, check <a href="https://boardgames.stackexchange.com/q/32511/22373">this other post</a>). Unless you want to play Traditional format you can't use cards like that. And even if you did, in Traditional format you would be able to have 1 copy of Pot of Greed, not 3...</p>

<p>Now, regarding <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Veil_of_Darkness" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Veil of Darkness</a>. Yes, you may draw another card if you draw a Dark monster, but the card also requires you to <em>discard the Dark monster you drew</em> (so no hand number increase). From its text, emphasis mine:</p>

<blockquote>
  <p>During your Draw Phase, <strong>if you draw a DARK monster</strong>(s): You can <strong>reveal any number of them</strong>; <strong>send them to the G</strong>Y, then you can draw 1 more card.</p>
</blockquote>

<p>Finally, there are several other ways to get rid of a monster, regardless if they have 26,000 ATK points:</p>

<ul>
<li>You can return it to the hand (say, <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Compulsory_Evacuation_Device" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Compulsory Evacuation Device</a>)</li>
<li>You can <em>send</em> it to the GY (say, <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Dark_End_Dragon" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Dark End Dragon</a>)</li>
<li>You can destroy it (say, <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Soul_Taker" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Soul Taker</a>)</li>
<li>You can banish it (say, <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Dark_Core" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Dark Core</a>)</li>
<li>You can take control of it (say, <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Creature_Swap" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Creature Swap</a>)</li>
</ul>

<p>etc... So as you can see, using Slifer and hand-number strategy is not as easy as one may think, as there are several ways to counter those cards, as well as some you thought useful are actually not that useful for this scenario.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2019-04-03T03:39:21.187Z
@DarkCygnus Probably a coincidence, though it's possible for users to infer this, given that Guatemala is listed on your profile as your location. +1 for the answer.
user45266
CC BY-SA 4.0
2019-04-03T05:26:05.940Z
Thank you. While I understand the banlists, this was mostly referring to casual play.  I have a friend who always has the winning deck (because he's a hieratic player), but he and I usually talk about hypothetical games and bring up how easy to abuse some cards would be. He ended up asking this, so I figured I could get some outside opinions on the matter.
CarbAddict
CC BY-SA 4.0
2019-04-03T05:32:41.443Z
I see... Still the banlist was just one of the several points covered in the answer, you can refer to any of them instead if you are playing by "house rules" :) (more like Battle City rules ;)
DarkCygnus
CC BY-SA 4.0
2019-04-02T22:56:00.760Z
2019-04-03T01:09:40.493Z
2019-04-03T01:09:40.493Z
DarkCygnus
<p>I'm talking about cards that gain attack based on how many cards you have in your hands. </p>

<p>Say if I had 3 "Slifer The Sky Dragon" copies and had a massive draw deck. I'd have the "Veil of Darkness"x3, "Pot of Greed"x3, a few draw spells, a few monsters with draw effects, and a bunch of DARK monsters. </p>

<p>Veil of Darkness lets me draw a card if I draw a dark monster in the draw phase, and is a continuous spell. If I have 3 Veils, I can draw 3 cards for discarding a single dark monster. if one of those 3 cards are a pot of greed, I can draw 2 more, but then I have an endless draw chain because of my various pots and draw spells. </p>

<p>This means that if my starting hand after summoning Slifer is 5 and I've drawn 21 cards total, I will have had a total of 26000 ATK on Slifer, making almost any attempts to win very slim. </p>

<p>The chances of my opponent having a set card like <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Magic_Cylinder" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Magic Cylinder</a> or some counter-effect monster are also nearly impossible. This means that a card like <a href="https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Ascension_Sky_Dragon" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Ascension Sky Dragon</a> are prone to abuse by the same tricks, given that it doesn't rely on the Nordic Archetype and can easily be supported by Pots and various Draw cards. </p>

<p>Does anyone have another example or an answer?</p>

<yu-gi-oh>
Are Hand-Based Stat Monsters prone to abuse?
CarbAddict
# Are Hand-Based Stat Monsters prone to abuse?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2019-04-02)

I'm talking about cards that gain attack based on how many cards you have in your hands.

Say if I had 3 "Slifer The Sky Dragon" copies and had a massive draw deck. I'd have the "Veil of Darkness"x3, "Pot of Greed"x3, a few draw spells, a few monsters with draw effects, and a bunch of DARK monsters.

Veil of Darkness lets me draw a card if I draw a dark monster in the draw phase, and is a continuous spell. If I have 3 Veils, I can draw 3 cards for discarding a single dark monster. if one of those 3 cards are a pot of greed, I can draw 2 more, but then I have an endless draw chain because of my various pots and draw spells.

This means that if my starting hand after summoning Slifer is 5 and I've drawn 21 cards total, I will have had a total of 26000 ATK on Slifer, making almost any attempts to win very slim.

The chances of my opponent having a set card like [Magic Cylinder](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Magic_Cylinder) or some counter-effect monster are also nearly impossible. This means that a card like [Ascension Sky Dragon](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Ascension_Sky_Dragon) are prone to abuse by the same tricks, given that it doesn't rely on the Nordic Archetype and can easily be supported by Pots and various Draw cards.

Does anyone have another example or an answer?

**Tags:** yu-gi-oh


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## 1 answers

### Answer by username_1 on 2019-04-02. Score: 3

> Does anyone have another example or an answer?

I think that yes, they *could* be abused... but **the situation you portray is by itself hard to achieve.**

To summon [Slifer, the Sky Dragon](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Slifer_the_Sky_Dragon) you must *tribute 3 monsters first*, something that takes time and surely cards from your hand to achieve.

Next, *cards like [Pot of Greed](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Pot_of_Greed) that you mention are Forbidden in competitive play* (why, check [this other post](https://boardgames.stackexchange.com/q/32511/22373)). Unless you want to play Traditional format you can't use cards like that. And even if you did, in Traditional format you would be able to have 1 copy of Pot of Greed, not 3...

Now, regarding [Veil of Darkness](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Veil_of_Darkness). Yes, you may draw another card if you draw a Dark monster, but the card also requires you to *discard the Dark monster you drew* (so no hand number increase). From its text, emphasis mine:

> During your Draw Phase, **if you draw a DARK monster**(s): You can **reveal any number of them**; **send them to the G**Y, then you can draw 1 more card.

Finally, there are several other ways to get rid of a monster, regardless if they have 26,000 ATK points:

* You can return it to the hand (say, [Compulsory Evacuation Device](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Compulsory_Evacuation_Device))
* You can *send* it to the GY (say, [Dark End Dragon](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Dark_End_Dragon))
* You can destroy it (say, [Soul Taker](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Soul_Taker))
* You can banish it (say, [Dark Core](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Dark_Core))
* You can take control of it (say, [Creature Swap](https://yugioh.fandom.com/wiki/Creature_Swap))

etc... So as you can see, using Slifer and hand-number strategy is not as easy as one may think, as there are several ways to counter those cards, as well as some you thought useful are actually not that useful for this scenario.

> **Comments:**
> **username_2**: @username_1 Probably a coincidence, though it's possible for users to infer this, given that Guatemala is listed on your profile as your location. +1 for the answer.  
> **username_0**: Thank you. While I understand the banlists, this was mostly referring to casual play.  I have a friend who always has the winning deck (because he's a hieratic player), but he and I usually talk about hypothetical games and bring up how easy to abuse some cards would be. He ended up asking this, so I figured I could get some outside opinions on the matter.  
> **username_1**: I see... Still the banlist was just one of the several points covered in the answer, you can refer to any of them instead if you are playing by "house rules" :) (more like Battle City rules ;)  

---

