Answers.Body: <p>In the vast majority of the cases, 4....d6 and 4....0-0 transpose into each other.</p>
  
  <p>However, with 4....0-0 black keeps the option of playing c6 and d5. Recently, this idea has been played by GM Jobava, known for his original approach in the opening: <a href="http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1867294" rel="noreferrer">Lupulescu-Jobava</a>, <a href="http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1879649" rel="noreferrer">So-Jobava</a> and <a href="http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1882674" rel="noreferrer">Vitiugov-Jobava</a>.</p>
  
  <p>About the last game, <a href="https://www.chess.com/news/view/jobava-dazzles-in-denmark-5446" rel="noreferrer">chess.com</a> comments "Just giving away the g6-pawn. This reporter is at a loss". The engines do not approve Jobava's opening, but somehow he was able to create enough counterplay and to draw the game.</p>
  
  <p>As you play the Sämisch, it makes sense to start with 5.Be3, as Ng4 is not possible. Clearly, 5....d6 6.f3 would transpose to your repertoire. After 5....c6, white has two popular ways to seize the initiative and to obtain an advantage: 6.e5 Ne8 7.f4 d6 8.Nf3 (e.g. <a href="https://chess-db.com/public/game.jsp?id=Parligras,%20Mircea-Emilian.2107139.174199296.28343" rel="noreferrer">Parligras-Fier</a>) and 6.f3 d5 7.cxd5 cxd5 8.e5 Ne8 9.h4 (as in Vitiugov-Jobava). The former should result in a slight but stable advantage for white, while the latter leads to sharper play.</p>
  
  <pre>
  <code>
        [StartPly "7"]
  
        [FEN ""]
        1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.e4 O-O (4...d6) 5.Be3 (5.f3) c6 (5...d6 6.f3) 6.f3 (6.e5 Ne8 7.f4 d6 8.Nf3) d5 7.cxd5 cxd5 8.e5 Ne8 9.h4
  
  </code>
  </pre>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2017-09-04T17:24:14.423Z
Answers.Text: The c6, d5 idea is very interesting to know about. Thank you for the detailed answer.
Answers.UserDisplayName: quid
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2017-09-02T11:23:12.650Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2017-09-04T16:31:06.400Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2017-09-04T16:31:06.400Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Maxwell86
Body: <p>A main line in the King's Indian Defense is this 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6. However,  black could castle instead of d6:</p>
  
  <pre><code>[FEN " "]
  1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 O-O
  </code></pre>
  
  <p>Is this a more-or-less inconsequential move order inversion or does white need to be careful to avoid some pitfall?  </p>
  
  <p>Specifically, in the usual mainline I would play the Sämisch Variation (5. f3) and it does not feel quite right to play f3 there right away, but maybe it is? If not, what should one do as a Sämisch player, Be3 right away? </p>
  
  <p>Or, is this 4. ... O-O an error that white can try to exploit? If so, I assume the refutation ought to be 5. e5. But is this is good idea? </p>
  
  <p>I am most interested in answers geared towards Class A or B players, but will be grateful for any input.  </p>
  
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2017-09-01T23:04:04.747Z
Comments.Text: E5 is a weak move. Look at the game Martner vs Fischer.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Jimmy360
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2017-09-01T23:13:21.743Z
Comments.Text: Yes, Fischer sometimes used this move order, so it cannot be terrible. I guess one argument against it is "Why give white extra options?".
Comments.UserDisplayName: Dag Oskar Madsen
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2017-09-02T05:05:18.070Z
Comments.Text: One point of 4... 0-0 is simply to provoke e5, and to be prepared for what comes next. A lot of white players will play e5 if you castle on the 4th move. You might even catch them by surprise if they aren't familiar with the moves or ideas that follow. Thanks to @Jimmy360 for suggesting the Martner vs. Fischer game. That is a beautiful game.
Comments.UserDisplayName: ktm5124
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2017-09-02T11:41:34.237Z
Comments.Text: http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1008397
Comments.UserDisplayName: Fred Knight
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2017-09-22T22:32:16.607Z
Comments.Text: e5 is actually not a weak move.  Theory has evolved since the Martner vs Fischer game.  Check recent games and you will see this is a main line.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Ywapom
Tags: <opening><1.d4><kings-indian>
Title: Modified move-order in the KID 4. ..0-0. What is the point and how to react?
ThreadText: # Modified move-order in the KID 4. ..0-0. What is the point and how to react?
  
  (Asked by: username_0 on 2017-09-01)
  
  A main line in the King's Indian Defense is this 1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 d6. However,  black could castle instead of d6:
  [FEN " "]
  1. d4 Nf6 2. c4 g6 3. Nc3 Bg7 4. e4 O-O
  
  Is this a more-or-less inconsequential move order inversion or does white need to be careful to avoid some pitfall?  
  Specifically, in the usual mainline I would play the Sämisch Variation (5. f3) and it does not feel quite right to play f3 there right away, but maybe it is? If not, what should one do as a Sämisch player, Be3 right away? 
  Or, is this 4. ... O-O an error that white can try to exploit? If so, I assume the refutation ought to be 5. e5. But is this is good idea? 
  I am most interested in answers geared towards Class A or B players, but will be grateful for any input.
  
  **Tags:** opening, 1.d4, kings-indian
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_1**: E5 is a weak move. Look at the game Martner vs Fischer.  
  > **username_2**: Yes, Fischer sometimes used this move order, so it cannot be terrible. I guess one argument against it is "Why give white extra options?".  
  > **username_3**: One point of 4... 0-0 is simply to provoke e5, and to be prepared for what comes next. A lot of white players will play e5 if you castle on the 4th move. You might even catch them by surprise if they aren't familiar with the moves or ideas that follow. Thanks to @username_1 for suggesting the Martner vs. Fischer game. That is a beautiful game.  
  > **username_4**: http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1008397  
  > **username_5**: e5 is actually not a weak move.  Theory has evolved since the Martner vs Fischer game.  Check recent games and you will see this is a main line.  
  
  ---
  
  ## 1 answers
  
  ### Answer by username_6 on 2017-09-02. Score: 15 | Accepted answer
  
  In the vast majority of the cases, 4....d6 and 4....0-0 transpose into each other.
  However, with 4....0-0 black keeps the option of playing c6 and d5. Recently, this idea has been played by GM Jobava, known for his original approach in the opening: Lupulescu-Jobava, So-Jobava and Vitiugov-Jobava.
  About the last game, chess.com comments "Just giving away the g6-pawn. This reporter is at a loss". The engines do not approve Jobava's opening, but somehow he was able to create enough counterplay and to draw the game.
  As you play the Sämisch, it makes sense to start with 5.Be3, as Ng4 is not possible. Clearly, 5....d6 6.f3 would transpose to your repertoire. After 5....c6, white has two popular ways to seize the initiative and to obtain an advantage: 6.e5 Ne8 7.f4 d6 8.Nf3 (e.g. Parligras-Fier) and 6.f3 d5 7.cxd5 cxd5 8.e5 Ne8 9.h4 (as in Vitiugov-Jobava). The former should result in a slight but stable advantage for white, while the latter leads to sharper play.
  
  
        [StartPly "7"]
  
        [FEN ""]
        1.d4 Nf6 2.c4 g6 3.Nc3 Bg7 4.e4 O-O (4...d6) 5.Be3 (5.f3) c6 (5...d6 6.f3) 6.f3 (6.e5 Ne8 7.f4 d6 8.Nf3) d5 7.cxd5 cxd5 8.e5 Ne8 9.h4
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_0**: The c6, d5 idea is very interesting to know about. Thank you for the detailed answer.  
  
  ---
  
  