Answers.Body: <p>What about <code>1.Nf3 Nf6 2.b3 d5 3.Bb2 Bg4</code>?</p>
  <p>Black development plan is very simple, the main line goes like this:</p>
  <pre><code>[FEN &quot;&quot;]
  1. Nf3 Nf6 2. b3 d5 3. Bb2 Bg4 4. e3 Nbd7
  5. Be2 e6 6. O-O Bd6 7. c4 c6 8. d4 O-O 9. Nbd2
  </code></pre>
  <p>In this position, despite white bishop aiming it is own pawn it is still potentially dangerous; therefore, standard <code>e5</code> or <code>c5</code> breaks are not usual in this position.</p>
  <p>The safest approach for black is try to exchange the dark-squared bishops with <code>9...Qe7 10. Ne5 Ba3</code>.</p>
  <p>Another approach, most intuitive in my opinion, is <code>9...Ne4 10. Nxe4 dxe4</code> If white plays <code>11. Nd2</code> then after <code>11. Bxe2 Qxe2. 12...f5</code> black has play on the king side, the bishop is aiming at h2 and the queen can be brought to <code>h4</code> or/and rook to <code>h6</code> via <code>f6</code>. If white plays <code>11. Ne5</code> and then <code>11... Bxe2 12.Qxe2</code> black could play <code>12...f6</code> forcing <code>13. Nxd7</code> and here again black can play on the king's side.</p>
  <p>It is also common to bring the queen play <code>9...Qc7</code> or <code>9...Qb8</code> with the aim of controlling the <code>e5</code> square and preventing <code>Ne5</code>. But I am not very familiar with this plan.</p>
  <p>Also, the position you describe can be reached via <code>1.Nf3 Nf6 2.g3</code> move order.</p>
  <pre><code>[FEN &quot;&quot;]
  1. Nf3 Nf6 2. g3 d5 3. Bg2 e6 4. O-O Be7
  5. b3 O-O 6. Bb2 c5 7. c4
  </code></pre>
  <p>to avoid it you can go for the same black setup, with the bishop on g4.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-27T03:01:06.330Z
Answers.Text: that's a great line. Thanks. But can tell me more about Black's plan in the first position? Like what pawn breaks or squares are Black playing for? Or what Black is trying to accomplish? Should Black play on the Queenside, Kingside, or center?
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-27T16:50:50.857Z
Answers.Text: @Guess601, I updated my answer. I am not a master player, so take my advice with caution :).
Answers.UserDisplayName: Akavall
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-27T17:28:26.407Z
Answers.Text: Thanks a lot for the feedback. I think that in the first diagram it should be 9.Nbd2, and it should be 9...Ne4 10. Nxe4 dxe4.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-27T19:58:53.903Z
Answers.Text: I also think that the 9...Ne4 variation is the most straightforward way of playing. Nice variation.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-27T22:07:50.367Z
Answers.Text: Btw if White starts with 1.b3, I follow it up with almost the same setup but the light-squared bishop is developed to f5 instead of g4. What do you think of this?
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-28T04:30:26.387Z
Answers.Text: I am sure it would be fine. The only thing is would that line transpose to `1.Nf3 Nf6 2.b3 d5 3.Bb2 Bf5`? If so, maybe you could consider playing this, so there is less theory to study.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Akavall
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Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-28T18:45:51.020Z
Answers.Text: yes but I prefer the Bg4 line. So if White allows me to play Bg4 I will play Bg4, else I will play Bf5. The pawn structure is similar, and the plans are almost similar, but the Bg4 line offers more flexibility and straightforward plans imo. So I need to memorize more theory.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-28T18:52:57.893Z
Answers.Text: I meant they are similar if white plays 3.e3 and 4.Nf3. If White plays 3.e3 and 4.f4, then the pawn structure resembles a reversed nimzoindian pawn structure!
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-28T19:35:08.177Z
Answers.Text: I think your reasoning makes sense.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Akavall
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-10-03T00:29:50.713Z
Answers.Text: I just won a game with this line :) https://lichess.org/Julr60Ou/black
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-10-03T00:53:33.640Z
Answers.Text: Nice!!  I am glad to hear that.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Akavall
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Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-27T01:54:09.073Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2020-09-27T17:46:28.373Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2020-09-27T17:46:28.373Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Akavall
Answers.Body: <p>Dont know what theory says but I play the dutch with 1...f5 after white opens with the horsie to nf3  and have decent results against people I play with now for fun.</p>
  <p>Full disclosure I gave up playing in international tournaments decades ago.</p>
  <p>c5 or g6 could work for you if you dont play the dutch.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-25T23:21:13.360Z
Answers.Text: I edited the question in order to include 1...Nf6 for Black, because of my repertoire. Thanks for the suggestion anyway.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Guess601
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Answers.CreationDate: 2020-09-25T22:34:15.340Z
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Answers.UserDisplayName: yukfoo
Body: <p>I usually go for the setup of Nf6, d5, e6, Be7, O-O, c5, Nc6 but I noticed that the White players are so familiar with these positions, and the winning rate for White according to the database is huge against this line! So I would like some recommendations against the Nimzo-Larsen attack when white starts with Nf3, and then plays b3. I would like a position with clear plans and easy to understand if possible.</p>
  <p>Edit: I forgot to mention that I play the Nimzo-Indian and Ragozin defenses with Black. So when White plays d4, or Nf3 on move one, I play Nf6.</p>
  
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-09-26T16:19:07.070Z
Comments.Text: I am a bit surprised that white has a huge winning rate in the setup that you described, can you show the exact line?
Comments.UserDisplayName: Akavall
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2020-09-26T18:56:54.863Z
Comments.Text: An example line is: 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.b3 d5 3.Bb2 e6 4.g3 Be7 5. Bg2 O-O 6. O-O c5 7.c4 Nc6 8.e3 b6 9.Nc3 Bb7 10.cxd5 Nxd5 11.Nxd5 Qxd5 12.d4 Even if Black plays 10...exd5 still White's winning percentages are high!
Comments.UserDisplayName: Guess601
Tags: <reti-opening>
Title: How to play against Nimzo-Larsen attack if White starts with 1.Nf3
ThreadText: # How to play against Nimzo-Larsen attack if White starts with 1.Nf3
  
  (Asked by: username_0 on 2020-09-25)
  
  I usually go for the setup of Nf6, d5, e6, Be7, O-O, c5, Nc6 but I noticed that the White players are so familiar with these positions, and the winning rate for White according to the database is huge against this line! So I would like some recommendations against the Nimzo-Larsen attack when white starts with Nf3, and then plays b3. I would like a position with clear plans and easy to understand if possible.
  
  Edit: I forgot to mention that I play the Nimzo-Indian and Ragozin defenses with Black. So when White plays d4, or Nf3 on move one, I play Nf6.
  
  **Tags:** reti-opening
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_1**: I am a bit surprised that white has a huge winning rate in the setup that you described, can you show the exact line?  
  > **username_0**: An example line is: 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.b3 d5 3.Bb2 e6 4.g3 Be7 5. Bg2 O-O 6. O-O c5 7.c4 Nc6 8.e3 b6 9.Nc3 Bb7 10.cxd5 Nxd5 11.Nxd5 Qxd5 12.d4 Even if Black plays 10...exd5 still White's winning percentages are high!  
  
  ---
  
  ## 2 answers
  
  ### Answer by username_1 on 2020-09-27. Score: 2 | Accepted answer
  
  What about 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.b3 d5 3.Bb2 Bg4?
  Black development plan is very simple, the main line goes like this:
  [FEN ""]
  1. Nf3 Nf6 2. b3 d5 3. Bb2 Bg4 4. e3 Nbd7
  5. Be2 e6 6. O-O Bd6 7. c4 c6 8. d4 O-O 9. Nbd2
  
  In this position, despite white bishop aiming it is own pawn it is still potentially dangerous; therefore, standard e5 or c5 breaks are not usual in this position.
  The safest approach for black is try to exchange the dark-squared bishops with 9...Qe7 10. Ne5 Ba3.
  Another approach, most intuitive in my opinion, is 9...Ne4 10. Nxe4 dxe4 If white plays 11. Nd2 then after 11. Bxe2 Qxe2. 12...f5 black has play on the king side, the bishop is aiming at h2 and the queen can be brought to h4 or/and rook to h6 via f6. If white plays 11. Ne5 and then 11... Bxe2 12.Qxe2 black could play 12...f6 forcing 13. Nxd7 and here again black can play on the king's side.
  It is also common to bring the queen play 9...Qc7 or 9...Qb8 with the aim of controlling the e5 square and preventing Ne5. But I am not very familiar with this plan.
  Also, the position you describe can be reached via 1.Nf3 Nf6 2.g3 move order.
  [FEN ""]
  1. Nf3 Nf6 2. g3 d5 3. Bg2 e6 4. O-O Be7
  5. b3 O-O 6. Bb2 c5 7. c4
  
  to avoid it you can go for the same black setup, with the bishop on g4.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_0**: that's a great line. Thanks. But can tell me more about Black's plan in the first position? Like what pawn breaks or squares are Black playing for? Or what Black is trying to accomplish? Should Black play on the Queenside, Kingside, or center?  
  > **username_1**: @username_0, I updated my answer. I am not a master player, so take my advice with caution :).  
  > **username_0**: Thanks a lot for the feedback. I think that in the first diagram it should be 9.Nbd2, and it should be 9...Ne4 10. Nxe4 dxe4.  
  > **username_0**: I also think that the 9...Ne4 variation is the most straightforward way of playing. Nice variation.  
  > **username_0**: Btw if White starts with 1.b3, I follow it up with almost the same setup but the light-squared bishop is developed to f5 instead of g4. What do you think of this?  
  > **username_1**: I am sure it would be fine. The only thing is would that line transpose to `1.Nf3 Nf6 2.b3 d5 3.Bb2 Bf5`? If so, maybe you could consider playing this, so there is less theory to study.  
  > **username_0**: yes but I prefer the Bg4 line. So if White allows me to play Bg4 I will play Bg4, else I will play Bf5. The pawn structure is similar, and the plans are almost similar, but the Bg4 line offers more flexibility and straightforward plans imo. So I need to memorize more theory.  
  > **username_0**: I meant they are similar if white plays 3.e3 and 4.Nf3. If White plays 3.e3 and 4.f4, then the pawn structure resembles a reversed nimzoindian pawn structure!  
  > **username_1**: I think your reasoning makes sense.  
  > **username_0**: I just won a game with this line :) https://lichess.org/Julr60Ou/black  
  > **username_1**: Nice!!  I am glad to hear that.  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_2 on 2020-09-25. Score: 1
  
  Dont know what theory says but I play the dutch with 1...f5 after white opens with the horsie to nf3 and have decent results against people I play with now for fun.
  
  Full disclosure I gave up playing in international tournaments decades ago.
  
  c5 or g6 could work for you if you dont play the dutch.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_0**: I edited the question in order to include 1...Nf6 for Black, because of my repertoire. Thanks for the suggestion anyway.  
  
  ---
  
  