Answers.Body: <p>To complement Daniel's answer: Black often aims for the solid Hanham setup with <code>Nf6</code>, <code>Nbd7</code>and <code>Be7</code> without surrendering the center. The problem is to find a suitable move order from the position</p>
  
  <pre><code>   [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4
  </code></pre>
  
  <p>If black plays <code>3...Nf6</code>, then white gets pressure and a solid plus after <code>4.dxe5 Nxe4 5.Qd5!</code></p>
  
  <pre><code>   [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 Nf6 4.dxe5 Nxe4 5.Qd5!
  </code></pre>
  
  <p>Black can try <code>3...Nd7</code> first, but then the problem is to find a good move after <code>4.Bc4</code>.</p>
  
  <pre><code>   [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 Nd7 4.Bc4 (4...c6 5.O-O Be7 6.dxe5 dxe5 7.Ng5! Bxg5 8.Qh5) (4...Be7 5.dxe5! Nxe5 (5...dxe5 6.Qd5) 6.Nxe5 dxe5 7.Qh5) (4...Ngf6 5.Ng5) 4...
  </code></pre>
  
  <p><code>4... Ngf6</code> loses because of <code>5.Ng5</code>.</p>
  
  <p><code>4...Be7</code> is bad due to the less obvious <code>5.dxe5! Nxe5 (5...dxe5 6.Qd5) 6.Nxe5 dxe5 7.Qh5</code></p>
  
  <p><code>4...c6</code> is probably best, but loses the bishop pair after <code>5.O-O Be7 6.dxe5 dxe5 7.Ng5! Bxg5 8.Qh5</code></p>
  
  <p>The best way to reach the Hanham is probably with the radically different move order <code>1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 4.Nf3 Nbd7</code>, although white then has the option of exchanging into a slightly better endgame with <code>4.dxe5 dxe5 5.Qxd8 Kxd8</code>.</p>
  
  <pre><code>     [FEN ""]
  1. e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 4.Nf3 (4.dxe5 dxe5 5.Qxd8 Kxd8) Nbd7
  </code></pre>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2013-10-22T03:55:18.040Z
Answers.Text: Another move order that's close to your last one (and my preference when I occasionally play the Philidor): `1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 Nbd7 4.Nf3 e5`. This avoids the quick endgame possibility in your `3.Nc3 e5` line; of course it gives White options like `4.f4`, but I've always liked the positions that then arise after `4...e5` myself.
Answers.UserDisplayName: ETD
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Answers.CreationDate: 2013-10-21T19:38:01.580Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2013-10-21T19:43:24.790Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2013-10-21T19:43:24.790Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Dag Oskar Madsen
Answers.Body: <p>Against the Philidor you might experiment with a line I developed myself (don't know how good it is), but if they surrender the center (i.e. exd4), then I develop a setup where I fianchetto the dark-squared bishop on b2, play f3 at some early point (with perhaps a later f4). I usually stick the other bishop on d3 then if they chop it with a knight I take back with the c-pawn, getting a better center than Black at the cost of bishop vs. knight. I usually can start up some sort of middlegame kingside pawn majority attack as a result of all this and create mate threats by Qe1-g3 along with the bishop at b2. It seems to work fairly well but I'm sure some IM/GM could refute the whole thing. Not like we regularly play against those guys though.  :)</p>
  
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Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T14:46:53.333Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2012-05-09T14:46:53.333Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Quantum Elf
Answers.Body: <p>I've always played Morphy's lines. Yes, Nxd4 is probably a little better positionally but Qxd4 leads to a maze of tactics and traps that black probably isn't prepared for.</p>
  
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Answers.CreationDate: 2022-05-11T03:56:45.417Z
Answers.LastActivityDate: 2022-05-11T03:56:45.417Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Savage47
Answers.Body: <p><code>3. d4</code> is the usual move after <code>1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6</code>.  <em><a href="http://en.wikibooks.org/wiki/Chess_Opening_Theory/1._e4/1...e5/2._Nf3/2...d6" rel="noreferrer">Chess Opening Theory</a></em> states that it is probably the best move, and also concedes <code>3. Bc4</code>:</p>
  <blockquote>
  <p>The best move is probably <code>3. d4</code>. White threatens a queen exchange with <code>dxe5 dxe5 Qxd8+ Kxd8</code> and Black can forget about castling. It puts pressure on the center and the Black fortress may collapse at any time.</p>
  <p>Another possibility is <code>3. Bc4</code> leading to a more positional game, playable for both camps.</p>
  </blockquote>
  <p><a href="https://rads.stackoverflow.com/amzn/click/com/0671768956" rel="noreferrer" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Fred Reinfeld</a> suggests the following line (exclamation marks are his) as in <a href="http://www.chessgames.com/perl/chessgame?gid=1341027" rel="noreferrer">this game</a>.  White maintains a sharp edge:</p>
  <pre><code>[FEN &quot;&quot;]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 exd4 4. Qxd4! Nc6 5. Bb5! Bd7 6. Bxc6 Bxc6 7. Nc3 Nf6 8. Bg5 Be7 9. O-O-O
  </code></pre>
  <p>A good resource to study would be shredderchess.com's <a href="http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/opening-database.html" rel="noreferrer">opening database</a>.</p>
  
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 4.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2022-05-11T06:51:32.850Z
Answers.Text: 3....exd4 is definitely not the main option for Black in the Philidor though
Answers.UserDisplayName: David
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T15:00:54.263Z
Answers.Text: Daniel, thanks for the great insight.  By the way, what did you use to make your image?
Answers.UserDisplayName: xaisoft
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T15:08:44.423Z
Answers.Text: I'm a free member of chess.com.  What I did here was go to the chessgames.com game I linked above, view the [PGN](http://www.chessgames.com/perl/nph-chesspgn?text=1&gid=1341027), copy it, go to chess.com forums and opened a [new post](http://www.chess.com/forum/post.html), clicked on the "Insert position" icon, and copied the PGN file into the popup.  Then I clicked through to move 9 and took a screenshot, saved it, and uploaded it.  Too complicated :)
Answers.UserDisplayName: Daniel
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T15:21:36.020Z
Answers.Text: Yeah, having some way to do this automatically while adding content here would be awesome. Even if it required typing/pasting in PGN or FEN.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Eve Freeman
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T15:29:36.023Z
Answers.Text: http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-diagram-generator.php also works well for creating diagrams - you can setup a position or paste a FEN string.
  
  For pgn, try the [Game Replayer](http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-game-uploader.php)
Answers.UserDisplayName: Andrew
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T15:35:14.193Z
Answers.Text: The Reinfeld reference is a bit outdated, I believe current praxis is not to play 4...Nc6 but 4...a6.  Instead of 4. Qxd4, 4. Nxd4 is preferred.
Answers.UserDisplayName: PeskyGnat
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T15:55:50.573Z
Answers.Text: `4... a6` is better, in fact it is better enough that that is probably why 4 Nxd4 is preferred.  Still, [Shredderchess](http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/opening-database.html) gives a win % for White of 59.2% (out of 470 games) for 4 Nxd4 and 59.2% (out of 130 games) for 4.Qxd4.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Daniel
Answers.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Answers.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T16:14:22.063Z
Answers.Text: Based on Shredderchess stats, a good line for White (with `4. Nxd4`) would be something like `1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 exd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Be7 6. Bf4 O-O 7. Qd2 Nc6 8. O-O-O` with a similarly strong position to Reinfeld's.
Answers.UserDisplayName: Daniel
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Answers.LastActivityDate: 2012-12-18T14:42:05.827Z
Answers.LastEditDate: 2020-06-17T09:59:59.497Z
Answers.UserDisplayName: Daniel
Body: <p>As white, I often encounter the Philidor Defense by black:  </p>
  
  <pre><code>[FEN ""]
  
  1. e4 e5
  2. Nf3 d6
  </code></pre>
  
  <p>I usually play <code>Nc3</code> or <code>d4</code> on the next move, but is this the best move? What are some lines (advantages or disadvantages) against the Philidor?</p>
  
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T14:25:14.820Z
Comments.Text: Reminds one of the [Légal Trap](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A9gal_Trap) - 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 d6 4. Nc3 Bg4 5. h3 Bh5 6. Nxe5 Bxd1 Bxf7+ Ke7 7. Nd5#)
Comments.UserDisplayName: Daniel
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T14:31:17.870Z
Comments.Text: These traps are great in theory, but I hardly find one who falls for them nowadays
Comments.UserDisplayName: xaisoft
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2012-05-09T14:40:56.720Z
Comments.Text: Yeah, I wouldn't go for it as White or fall for it as Black.
Comments.UserDisplayName: Daniel
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2012-05-17T06:56:40.970Z
Comments.Text: @Danielδ could you update your comment? The second and third moves for black are the same(d6)
Comments.UserDisplayName: Valentin Brasso
Comments.ContentLicense: CC BY-SA 3.0
Comments.CreationDate: 2012-05-17T14:11:39.907Z
Comments.Text: Oops... should be `2. ... Nc6`  Sorry!
Comments.UserDisplayName: Daniel
Tags: <opening><theory><philidor-defense>
Title: How should I play against the Philidor defense?
ThreadText: # How should I play against the Philidor defense?
  
  (Asked by: username_0 on 2012-05-09)
  
  As white, I often encounter the Philidor Defense by black:  
  [FEN ""]
  
  1. e4 e5
  2. Nf3 d6
  
  I usually play Nc3 or d4 on the next move, but is this the best move? What are some lines (advantages or disadvantages) against the Philidor?
  
  **Tags:** opening, theory, philidor-defense
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_1**: Reminds one of the [Légal Trap](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L%C3%A9gal_Trap) - 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 Nc6 3. Bc4 d6 4. Nc3 Bg4 5. h3 Bh5 6. Nxe5 Bxd1 Bxf7+ Ke7 7. Nd5#)  
  > **username_0**: These traps are great in theory, but I hardly find one who falls for them nowadays  
  > **username_1**: Yeah, I wouldn't go for it as White or fall for it as Black.  
  > **username_2**: @username_1δ could you update your comment? The second and third moves for black are the same(d6)  
  > **username_1**: Oops... should be `2. ... Nc6`  Sorry!  
  
  ---
  
  ## 4 answers
  
  ### Answer by username_1 on 2012-05-09. Score: 9 | Accepted answer
  
  3. d4 is the usual move after 1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6.  Chess Opening Theory states that it is probably the best move, and also concedes 3. Bc4:
  
  The best move is probably 3. d4. White threatens a queen exchange with dxe5 dxe5 Qxd8+ Kxd8 and Black can forget about castling. It puts pressure on the center and the Black fortress may collapse at any time.
  Another possibility is 3. Bc4 leading to a more positional game, playable for both camps.
  
  Fred Reinfeld suggests the following line (exclamation marks are his) as in this game.  White maintains a sharp edge:
  [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 exd4 4. Qxd4! Nc6 5. Bb5! Bd7 6. Bxc6 Bxc6 7. Nc3 Nf6 8. Bg5 Be7 9. O-O-O
  
  A good resource to study would be shredderchess.com's opening database.
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_0**: username_1, thanks for the great insight.  By the way, what did you use to make your image?  
  > **username_1**: I'm a free member of chess.com.  What I did here was go to the chessgames.com game I linked above, view the [PGN](http://www.chessgames.com/perl/nph-chesspgn?text=1&gid=1341027), copy it, go to chess.com forums and opened a [new post](http://www.chess.com/forum/post.html), clicked on the "Insert position" icon, and copied the PGN file into the popup.  Then I clicked through to move 9 and took a screenshot, saved it, and uploaded it.  Too complicated :)  
  > **username_8**: Yeah, having some way to do this automatically while adding content here would be awesome. Even if it required typing/pasting in PGN or FEN.  
  > **username_9**: http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-diagram-generator.php also works well for creating diagrams - you can setup a position or paste a FEN string.  For pgn, try the [Game Replayer](http://www.chessvideos.tv/chess-game-uploader.php)  
  > **username_10**: The Reinfeld reference is a bit outdated, I believe current praxis is not to play 4...Nc6 but 4...a6.  Instead of 4. Qxd4, 4. Nxd4 is preferred.  
  > **username_1**: `4... a6` is better, in fact it is better enough that that is probably why 4 Nxd4 is preferred.  Still, [Shredderchess](http://www.shredderchess.com/online-chess/online-databases/opening-database.html) gives a win % for White of 59.2% (out of 470 games) for 4 Nxd4 and 59.2% (out of 130 games) for 4.Qxd4.  
  > **username_1**: Based on Shredderchess stats, a good line for White (with `4. Nxd4`) would be something like `1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 exd4 4. Nxd4 Nf6 5. Nc3 Be7 6. Bf4 O-O 7. Qd2 Nc6 8. O-O-O` with a similarly strong position to Reinfeld's.  
  > **username_7**: 3....exd4 is definitely not the main option for Black in the Philidor though  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_3 on 2013-10-21. Score: 7
  
  To complement username_1's answer: Black often aims for the solid Hanham setup with Nf6, Nbd7and Be7 without surrendering the center. The problem is to find a suitable move order from the position
     [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4
  
  If black plays 3...Nf6, then white gets pressure and a solid plus after 4.dxe5 Nxe4 5.Qd5!
     [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 Nf6 4.dxe5 Nxe4 5.Qd5!
  
  Black can try 3...Nd7 first, but then the problem is to find a good move after 4.Bc4.
     [FEN ""]
  1. e4 e5 2. Nf3 d6 3.d4 Nd7 4.Bc4 (4...c6 5.O-O Be7 6.dxe5 dxe5 7.Ng5! Bxg5 8.Qh5) (4...Be7 5.dxe5! Nxe5 (5...dxe5 6.Qd5) 6.Nxe5 dxe5 7.Qh5) (4...Ngf6 5.Ng5) 4...
  
  4... Ngf6 loses because of 5.Ng5.
  4...Be7 is bad due to the less obvious 5.dxe5! Nxe5 (5...dxe5 6.Qd5) 6.Nxe5 dxe5 7.Qh5
  4...c6 is probably best, but loses the bishop pair after 5.O-O Be7 6.dxe5 dxe5 7.Ng5! Bxg5 8.Qh5
  The best way to reach the Hanham is probably with the radically different move order 1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 4.Nf3 Nbd7, although white then has the option of exchanging into a slightly better endgame with 4.dxe5 dxe5 5.Qxd8 Kxd8.
       [FEN ""]
  1. e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 e5 4.Nf3 (4.dxe5 dxe5 5.Qxd8 Kxd8) Nbd7
  
  > **Comments:**
  > **username_4**: Another move order that's close to your last one (and my preference when I occasionally play the Philidor): `1.e4 d6 2.d4 Nf6 3.Nc3 Nbd7 4.Nf3 e5`. This avoids the quick endgame possibility in your `3.Nc3 e5` line; of course it gives White options like `4.f4`, but I've always liked the positions that then arise after `4...e5` myself.  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_5 on 2012-05-09. Score: 2
  
  Against the Philidor you might experiment with a line I developed myself (don't know how good it is), but if they surrender the center (i.e. exd4), then I develop a setup where I fianchetto the dark-squared bishop on b2, play f3 at some early point (with perhaps a later f4). I usually stick the other bishop on d3 then if they chop it with a knight I take back with the c-pawn, getting a better center than Black at the cost of bishop vs. knight. I usually can start up some sort of middlegame kingside pawn majority attack as a result of all this and create mate threats by Qe1-g3 along with the bishop at b2. It seems to work fairly well but I'm sure some IM/GM could refute the whole thing. Not like we regularly play against those guys though. :)
  
  
  ---
  
  ### Answer by username_6 on 2022-05-11. Score: 0
  
  I've always played Morphy's lines. Yes, Nxd4 is probably a little better positionally but Qxd4 leads to a maze of tactics and traps that black probably isn't prepared for.
  
  
  ---
  
  