<p><em>Sankhara</em> (the second <em>nidana</em> of dependent origination) are the physical and mental processes. The physical processes here refers to breathing and the rest of the involuntary processes like heart beating etc. (i.e. <em>kaya sankhara</em>). Mental processes are of two types. One is the &quot;input path&quot; which processes inputs (the six types of feelings/ sensations) and produces mental states or <em>cittas</em> (i.e. <em>citta sankhara</em>), while the other is the &quot;output path&quot; which produces actions and words (i.e. <em>vaci sankhara</em>). This is based on <a href="https://suttacentral.net/mn44/en/sujato" rel="nofollow noreferrer">MN 44</a>.</p>
<p>&quot;<em>Voharati</em>&quot; is &quot;expression&quot; according to various dictionary entries and also Ven. Thanissaro's translation of AN 6.63.</p>
<p>Perception (<em>sañña</em>) as an aggregate refers to memory and recognizing previously identified objects. This is based on the explanation in the Abhidhamma.</p>
<p>So, it means the mind takes something which is felt/ sensed (through sight or hearing), refers to memory and recognizes previously identified objects, and then as a result, expresses it.</p>
<p>Like you see something running in the garden and look at it carefully and realize that it's a squirrel. So, you say (express) to yourself, &quot;ah... that's a squirrel&quot;.</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-12-11T18:53:29.293Z
this is a good answer, input-output paradigm is useful..
blue_ego
CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-12-11T22:35:46.297Z
strange b/c the output does feel like input at times..
blue_ego
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2024-12-11T14:08:35.040Z
2024-12-11T14:42:25.810Z
2024-12-11T14:42:25.810Z
ruben2020
<p>Vaci-sankhara is <strong>thought</strong> (<strong>vitakka</strong>vicārā vacīsaṅkhāro, <a href="https://suttacentral.net/sn41.6/en/sujato?lang=en&amp;layout=linebyline&amp;reference=none&amp;notes=none&amp;highlight=false&amp;script=latin" rel="nofollow noreferrer">SN 41.6</a>; MN 44)</p>
<p>The easiest answer to the question is from <a href="https://suttacentral.net/mn18/en/sujato?lang=en&amp;layout=linebyline&amp;reference=none&amp;notes=none&amp;highlight=false&amp;script=latin" rel="nofollow noreferrer">MN 18</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>yaṁ sañjānāti taṁ <strong>vitakke</strong>ti</p>
<p>What you perceive, you <strong>think</strong> about.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>AN 6.63 uses the term '<a href="https://suttacentral.net/define/voharati?lang=en" rel="nofollow noreferrer">voharati</a>', which I guess in its context here means 'definitions' or 'expressions' used in/as/facilitating 'communication' rather than 'verbal speech' used for communication.</p>
<p>Sujato in his translation has used the word 'communication', which <a href="https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=3c1a55819b6b7e41&amp;q=communicate&amp;si=ACC90nwKPQWKXvO0LWGU61hOTgoD8JX0c2t3cmtR-KRBmOpdBrhG99STSZqL79UCQ5-f3AiHYGfmXg6DI3N2hd7psiCOUsMwrs8zfieJCI66C5cOwVmt8rI%3D&amp;expnd=1&amp;sa=X&amp;ved=2ahUKEwjksOL1k5-KAxUgTGcHHT_CKD8Q2v4IegUIJBCZAQ&amp;biw=1495&amp;bih=735&amp;dpr=1.25" rel="nofollow noreferrer">in English</a> can mean to transmit <em>mutual understanding</em>, such as:</p>
<ul>
<li><p>to convey knowledge of or information about : make known</p>
</li>
<li><p>succeed in conveying one's ideas or in evoking understanding in others.&quot;a politician must have the ability to communicate&quot;</p>
</li>
<li><p>(of two people) be able to share and understand each other's thoughts and feelings.
&quot;we don't seem to be communicating—we need a break from each other&quot;</p>
</li>
<li><p>convey or transmit (an emotion or feeling) in a non-verbal way. &quot;the ability of good teachers to communicate their own enthusiasm&quot;</p>
</li>
</ul>
<p>For example, <a href="https://suttacentral.net/dn9/en/sujato?lang=en&amp;layout=linebyline&amp;reference=none&amp;notes=none&amp;highlight=false&amp;script=latin#52.1" rel="nofollow noreferrer">DN 9</a> unambiguously says:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>From a cow comes milk, from milk comes curds, from curds come butter,
from butter comes ghee, and from ghee comes cream of ghee. And the
cream of ghee is said to be the best of these.</p>
<p>While it’s milk, it’s not referred to as curds, butter, ghee, or cream
of ghee. It’s only referred to as milk.</p>
<p>While it’s curd</p>
<p>or butter</p>
<p>or ghee</p>
<p>or cream of ghee, it’s not referred to as anything else, only under
its own name.</p>
<p>These are the world’s common usages (lokasamaññā), terms
(lokaniruttiyo), means of expression/definition/communication (<a href="https://suttacentral.net/define/lokavoh%C4%81r%C4%81?lang=en" rel="nofollow noreferrer">lokavohārā</a>) and descriptions
(lokapaññattiyo), which the Realized One uses to communicate
(voharati) without getting stuck on them.</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-12-11T11:31:12.830Z
translating 'vaci-sankhara' as thought is not good imo.
blue_ego
CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-12-11T11:33:09.837Z
'vaci-sankhara' means 'the condition for speech'. The Buddha defined the condition for speech to be applied & sustained thought (vitakka &  vicara). vitakkavicārā vacīsaṅkhāro,.
Dhamma Dhatu
CC BY-SA 4.0
2024-12-11T06:54:13.923Z
2024-12-11T07:13:41.167Z
2024-12-11T07:13:41.167Z
Dhamma Dhatu
<p>Before I asked '<a href="https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/q/49893/19249">how can I hear my thinking?</a>' Now I'm wondering if I'm forced to hear my thinking?</p>
<p>AN6.63 says:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>And what is the result of perceptions?</p>
<p><em>Katamo ca, bhikkhave, saññānaṁ vipāko?</em></p>
<p>Communication is the result of perception, I say.</p>
<p><em>Vohāravepakkaṁ, bhikkhave, saññaṁ vadāmi. Variant: Vohāravepakkaṁ → vohāravepakkāhaṁ (bj, sya-all, pts1ed) | saññaṁ → saññā (sya-all,
pts1ed)</em></p>
<p>You communicate something in whatever manner you perceive it, saying
‘That’s what I perceived.’</p>
<p><em>Yathā yathā naṁ sañjānāti tathā tathā voharati, evaṁ saññī ahosinti. Variant: ahosinti → ahosīti (mr)</em></p>
<p>This is called the result of perceptions.</p>
<p><em>Ayaṁ vuccati, bhikkhave, saññānaṁ vipāko.</em></p>
</blockquote>
<p>Is the result of perception <em>vaci-sankara</em>?</p>

<sankhara><perception><thoughtprocess>
Is the result of perception *vaci-sankhara*?
# Is the result of perception *vaci-sankhara*?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2024-12-11)

Before I asked '[how can I hear my thinking?](https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/q/49893/19249)' Now I'm wondering if I'm forced to hear my thinking?

AN6.63 says:

> And what is the result of perceptions?
>
> *Katamo ca, bhikkhave, saññānaṁ vipāko?*
>
> Communication is the result of perception, I say.
>
> *Vohāravepakkaṁ, bhikkhave, saññaṁ vadāmi. Variant: Vohāravepakkaṁ → vohāravepakkāhaṁ (bj, sya-all, pts1ed) | saññaṁ → saññā (sya-all,
> pts1ed)*
>
> You communicate something in whatever manner you perceive it, saying
> ‘That’s what I perceived.’
>
> *Yathā yathā naṁ sañjānāti tathā tathā voharati, evaṁ saññī ahosinti. Variant: ahosinti → ahosīti (mr)*
>
> This is called the result of perceptions.
>
> *Ayaṁ vuccati, bhikkhave, saññānaṁ vipāko.*

Is the result of perception *vaci-sankara*?

**Tags:** sankhara, perception, thoughtprocess


---

## 2 answers

### Answer by username_2 on 2024-12-11. Score: 2 | Accepted answer

Vaci-sankhara is **thought** (**vitakka**vicārā vacīsaṅkhāro, [SN 41.6](https://suttacentral.net/sn41.6/en/sujato?lang=en&layout=linebyline&reference=none¬es=none&highlight=false&script=latin); MN 44)

The easiest answer to the question is from [MN 18](https://suttacentral.net/mn18/en/sujato?lang=en&layout=linebyline&reference=none¬es=none&highlight=false&script=latin):

> yaṁ sañjānāti taṁ **vitakke**ti
>
> What you perceive, you **think** about.

AN 6.63 uses the term '[voharati](https://suttacentral.net/define/voharati?lang=en)', which I guess in its context here means 'definitions' or 'expressions' used in/as/facilitating 'communication' rather than 'verbal speech' used for communication.

Sujato in his translation has used the word 'communication', which [in English](https://www.google.com/search?sca_esv=3c1a55819b6b7e41&q=communicate&si=ACC90nwKPQWKXvO0LWGU61hOTgoD8JX0c2t3cmtR-KRBmOpdBrhG99STSZqL79UCQ5-f3AiHYGfmXg6DI3N2hd7psiCOUsMwrs8zfieJCI66C5cOwVmt8rI%3D&expnd=1&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjksOL1k5-KAxUgTGcHHT_CKD8Q2v4IegUIJBCZAQ&biw=1495&bih=735&dpr=1.25) can mean to transmit *mutual understanding*, such as:

* to convey knowledge of or information about : make known
* succeed in conveying one's ideas or in evoking understanding in others."a politician must have the ability to communicate"
* (of two people) be able to share and understand each other's thoughts and feelings.
  "we don't seem to be communicating—we need a break from each other"
* convey or transmit (an emotion or feeling) in a non-verbal way. "the ability of good teachers to communicate their own enthusiasm"

For example, [DN 9](https://suttacentral.net/dn9/en/sujato?lang=en&layout=linebyline&reference=none¬es=none&highlight=false&script=latin#52.1) unambiguously says:

> From a cow comes milk, from milk comes curds, from curds come butter,
> from butter comes ghee, and from ghee comes cream of ghee. And the
> cream of ghee is said to be the best of these.
>
> While it’s milk, it’s not referred to as curds, butter, ghee, or cream
> of ghee. It’s only referred to as milk.
>
> While it’s curd
>
> or butter
>
> or ghee
>
> or cream of ghee, it’s not referred to as anything else, only under
> its own name.
>
> These are the world’s common usages (lokasamaññā), terms
> (lokaniruttiyo), means of expression/definition/communication ([lokavohārā](https://suttacentral.net/define/lokavoh%C4%81r%C4%81?lang=en)) and descriptions
> (lokapaññattiyo), which the Realized One uses to communicate
> (voharati) without getting stuck on them.

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: translating 'vaci-sankhara' as thought is not good imo.  
> **username_2**: 'vaci-sankhara' means 'the condition for speech'. The Buddha defined the condition for speech to be applied & sustained thought (vitakka &  vicara). vitakkavicārā vacīsaṅkhāro,.  

---

### Answer by username_1 on 2024-12-11. Score: 2

*Sankhara* (the second *nidana* of dependent origination) are the physical and mental processes. The physical processes here refers to breathing and the rest of the involuntary processes like heart beating etc. (i.e. *kaya sankhara*). Mental processes are of two types. One is the "input path" which processes inputs (the six types of feelings/ sensations) and produces mental states or *cittas* (i.e. *citta sankhara*), while the other is the "output path" which produces actions and words (i.e. *vaci sankhara*). This is based on [MN 44](https://suttacentral.net/mn44/en/sujato).

"*Voharati*" is "expression" according to various dictionary entries and also Ven. Thanissaro's translation of AN 6.63.

Perception (*sañña*) as an aggregate refers to memory and recognizing previously identified objects. This is based on the explanation in the Abhidhamma.

So, it means the mind takes something which is felt/ sensed (through sight or hearing), refers to memory and recognizes previously identified objects, and then as a result, expresses it.

Like you see something running in the garden and look at it carefully and realize that it's a squirrel. So, you say (express) to yourself, "ah... that's a squirrel".

> **Comments:**
> **username_0**: this is a good answer, input-output paradigm is useful..  
> **username_0**: strange b/c the output does feel like input at times..  

---

