<p>The Buddha taught to go forth and be a monk, persevering and achieving the goals of the holy life.</p>
<p>Otherwise, if that is not possible, then try to do well as a lay person, persevering and achieving the goals of the worldly life.</p>
<p>Even the latter is better than growing old, achieving nothing at all.</p>
<p>From <a href="https://www.tipitaka.net/tipitaka/dhp/verseload.php?verse=155" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Dhammapada 155-156</a>:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>They, who in youth have neither led the life of Purity nor
have acquired wealth, waste away in dejection like decrepit herons on
a drying pond deplete of fish.</p>
<p>They, who in youth have neither led the Life of Purity nor
have acquired wealth, lie helplessly like arrows that have lost
momentum, moaning and sighing after the past.</p>
</blockquote>
<p>The story in the traditional commentary:</p>
<blockquote>
<p>While residing at the Migadaya wood, the Buddha uttered Verses (155)
and (156) of this book, with reference to the son of Mahadhana, a rich
man from Baranasi.</p>
<p>The son of Mahadhana did not study while he was young; when he came of
age he married the daughter of a rich man, who, like him, also had no
education. When the parents on both sides died, they inherited eighty
crores from each side and so were very rich. But both of them were
ignorant and knew only how to spend money and not how to keep it or to
make it grow. They just ate and drank and had a good time, squandering
their money. When they had spent all, they sold their fields and
gardens and finally their house. Thus, they became very poor and
helpless; and because they did not know how to earn a living they had
to go begging. One day, the Buddha saw the rich man's son leaning
against a wall of the monastery, taking the leftovers given him by the
samaneras; seeing him, the Buddha smiled.</p>
<p>The Venerable Ananda asked the Buddha why he smiled, and the Buddha
replied, &quot;Ananda, look at this son of a very rich man; he had lived a
useless life, an aimless life of pleasure. If he had learnt to look
after his riches in the first stage of his life he would have been a
top-ranking rich man; or if he had become a bhikkhu, he could have
been an arahat, and his wife could have been an anagami. If he had
learnt to look after his riches in the second stage of his life he
would have been a second rank rich man, or if he had become a bhikkhu
he could have been an anagami, and his wife could have been a
sakadagami. If he had learnt to look after his riches in the third
stage of his life he would have been a third rank rich man, or if he
had become a bhikkhu he could have been a sakadagami, and his wife
could have been a sotapanna. However, because he had done nothing in
all the three stages of his life he had lost all his worldly riches,
he had also lost all opportunities of attaining any of the Maggas and
Phalas.&quot;</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T13:20:14.693Z
2020-11-10T13:25:31.777Z
2020-11-10T13:25:31.777Z
ruben2020
<p>How could they answer... since if knowing, if aware, they wouldn't do such simply to justify their short-comings and doubt... evil, evil, evil... really misfortune if caught in such association.</p>
<p>And yes, it can be down-voted if such helps a little.</p>
<p><em>[Note that this isn't given for stacks, exchange, other householding-trades, but for escape from this wheel]</em></p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T14:26:11.503Z
2020-11-10T14:26:11.503Z
Samana Johann
<p>In the tradition of Thailand, every Buddhist man ordain as monk for a rainy season before get married. Therefore, in Thailand, many monks are not encouraging many more men to remain in the Holy Life. The Holy Life is bitter for a man without virtue that has strong survival instinct of &quot;self&quot;.</p>
<p>When I live in the monastery, for many years, I see many defiled monks lusting after women. It was good to see these men disrobe and find the motherly warmth they needed from a woman.</p>
<p>In the Bible, the Saint Paul said: &quot;<em>It is good... to remain unmarried, as I am. But if they cannot control themselves, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with lust</em>&quot;.</p>
<p>The Dhammapada says:</p>
<blockquote>
<ol start="302">
<li><p>Difficult is life as a monk; difficult is it to delight therein</p>
</li>
<li><p>There are many evil characters and uncontrolled men wearing the saffron robe. These wicked men will be born in states of woe because
of their evil deeds.</p>
</li>
<li><p>It would be better to swallow a red-hot iron ball, blazing like fire, than as an immoral and uncontrolled monk to eat the alms of the
people.</p>
</li>
</ol>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T10:13:16.293Z
2020-11-10T10:20:44.193Z
2020-11-10T10:20:44.193Z
Dhamma Dhatu
<p>Since popular, one thinking compassionate, what might be it's effect, thought that's actually, after assisting ones benefactors, giving, the undertaking most praised by wise? So only foolish, or of much harm for others, oneself?</p>
<p>The same like if encouraging one to leave the holly life?</p>
<p>What are the roots, mind qualities, giving one such deeds set?</p>
<p>How should association with people not praising and seeking the full holly life be seen?</p>
<p><em>[Note that this isn't given for stacks, exchange, other world-binding trades, but for escape from this wheel]</em></p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T03:14:45.550Z
This question is presumably related to [this answer](https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/a/43173/471).
ruben2020
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T03:54:02.857Z
That's good householders pulling in. Better then to assume things in relation would be to reflect why he himselves may discourage and what the effects of such, and cause of such, will be.
Samana Johann
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T03:57:09.923Z
Does he see any discouragement in this answer, and if why? As for Sila no transressions could be seen there, yet mind, kamma... the doers known secret. Nevertheless "funny" answer, thinking that easy leaving home and duties for low purposes, maybe thinking even equal this Ariya-Puggala, and of course even no blind parents and social networks "doing" there duties while consuming elsewhere... But that's another story of defilement.
Samana Johann
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T04:04:51.360Z
Since here an area where discourage of going forth is nearly obligated: there are hundreds of answers dispraising goning forth and in-pulling for ones feed.
Samana Johann
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-11-10T04:09:49.027Z
Since all meta (some metta), does good householder have questions in relation of the questions understanding? Just in case he looks for doing moderation and wishes to keep things simple on topic.
Samana Johann
<karma><right-view><ordination>
What are the effects of discourageing one from going forth?
# What are the effects of discourageing one from going forth?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2020-11-09)

Since popular, one thinking compassionate, what might be it's effect, thought that's actually, after assisting ones benefactors, giving, the undertaking most praised by wise? So only foolish, or of much harm for others, oneself?

The same like if encouraging one to leave the holly life?

What are the roots, mind qualities, giving one such deeds set?

How should association with people not praising and seeking the full holly life be seen?

*[Note that this isn't given for stacks, exchange, other world-binding trades, but for escape from this wheel]*

**Tags:** karma, right-view, ordination

> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: This question is presumably related to [this answer](https://buddhism.stackexchange.com/a/43173/471).  
> **username_0**: That's good householders pulling in. Better then to assume things in relation would be to reflect why he himselves may discourage and what the effects of such, and cause of such, will be.  
> **username_0**: Does he see any discouragement in this answer, and if why? As for Sila no transressions could be seen there, yet mind, kamma... the doers known secret. Nevertheless "funny" answer, thinking that easy leaving home and duties for low purposes, maybe thinking even equal this Ariya-Puggala, and of course even no blind parents and social networks "doing" there duties while consuming elsewhere... But that's another story of defilement.  
> **username_0**: Since here an area where discourage of going forth is nearly obligated: there are hundreds of answers dispraising goning forth and in-pulling for ones feed.  
> **username_0**: Since all meta (some metta), does good householder have questions in relation of the questions understanding? Just in case he looks for doing moderation and wishes to keep things simple on topic.  

---

## 3 answers

### Answer by username_2 on 2020-11-10. Score: 4

In the tradition of Thailand, every Buddhist man ordain as monk for a rainy season before get married. Therefore, in Thailand, many monks are not encouraging many more men to remain in the Holy Life. The Holy Life is bitter for a man without virtue that has strong survival instinct of "self".

When I live in the monastery, for many years, I see many defiled monks lusting after women. It was good to see these men disrobe and find the motherly warmth they needed from a woman.

In the Bible, the Saint Paul said: "*It is good... to remain unmarried, as I am. But if they cannot control themselves, let them marry. For it is better to marry than to burn with lust*".

The Dhammapada says:

> 302. Difficult is life as a monk; difficult is it to delight therein
> 303. There are many evil characters and uncontrolled men wearing the saffron robe. These wicked men will be born in states of woe because
>      of their evil deeds.
> 304. It would be better to swallow a red-hot iron ball, blazing like fire, than as an immoral and uncontrolled monk to eat the alms of the
>      people.


---

### Answer by username_1 on 2020-11-10. Score: 1

The Buddha taught to go forth and be a monk, persevering and achieving the goals of the holy life.

Otherwise, if that is not possible, then try to do well as a lay person, persevering and achieving the goals of the worldly life.

Even the latter is better than growing old, achieving nothing at all.

From [Dhammapada 155-156](https://www.tipitaka.net/tipitaka/dhp/verseload.php?verse=155):

> They, who in youth have neither led the life of Purity nor
> have acquired wealth, waste away in dejection like decrepit herons on
> a drying pond deplete of fish.
>
> They, who in youth have neither led the Life of Purity nor
> have acquired wealth, lie helplessly like arrows that have lost
> momentum, moaning and sighing after the past.

The story in the traditional commentary:

> While residing at the Migadaya wood, the Buddha uttered Verses (155)
> and (156) of this book, with reference to the son of Mahadhana, a rich
> man from Baranasi.
>
> The son of Mahadhana did not study while he was young; when he came of
> age he married the daughter of a rich man, who, like him, also had no
> education. When the parents on both sides died, they inherited eighty
> crores from each side and so were very rich. But both of them were
> ignorant and knew only how to spend money and not how to keep it or to
> make it grow. They just ate and drank and had a good time, squandering
> their money. When they had spent all, they sold their fields and
> gardens and finally their house. Thus, they became very poor and
> helpless; and because they did not know how to earn a living they had
> to go begging. One day, the Buddha saw the rich man's son leaning
> against a wall of the monastery, taking the leftovers given him by the
> samaneras; seeing him, the Buddha smiled.
>
> The Venerable Ananda asked the Buddha why he smiled, and the Buddha
> replied, "Ananda, look at this son of a very rich man; he had lived a
> useless life, an aimless life of pleasure. If he had learnt to look
> after his riches in the first stage of his life he would have been a
> top-ranking rich man; or if he had become a bhikkhu, he could have
> been an arahat, and his wife could have been an anagami. If he had
> learnt to look after his riches in the second stage of his life he
> would have been a second rank rich man, or if he had become a bhikkhu
> he could have been an anagami, and his wife could have been a
> sakadagami. If he had learnt to look after his riches in the third
> stage of his life he would have been a third rank rich man, or if he
> had become a bhikkhu he could have been a sakadagami, and his wife
> could have been a sotapanna. However, because he had done nothing in
> all the three stages of his life he had lost all his worldly riches,
> he had also lost all opportunities of attaining any of the Maggas and
> Phalas."


---

### Answer by username_0 on 2020-11-10. Score: 0

How could they answer... since if knowing, if aware, they wouldn't do such simply to justify their short-comings and doubt... evil, evil, evil... really misfortune if caught in such association.

And yes, it can be down-voted if such helps a little.

*[Note that this isn't given for stacks, exchange, other householding-trades, but for escape from this wheel]*


---

