<p>It's described in a couple of pages of <em>The Complete Foundation: The Systematic Approach to Training the Mind</em> by HH the Dalai Lama.</p>

<p>I paraphrase:</p>

<blockquote>
  <ul>
  <li>It is the one object of all blame -- the source of all miseries therefore the only object to be blamed for all misfortune.</li>
  <li>Normally we blame others because we are self-righteous</li>
  <li>Problems come from the kind of body we assume, which is contaminated and a product of actions -- we possess that body because of attachment to self -- therefore it's attachment to self that gives rise to suffering.</li>
  <li>"The self-cherishing and self-grasping attitudes abide strongly fortified in the mind, we have never been able to shake the in the least."</li>
  <li>It leads to wars (globally) and problems within the family.</li>
  <li><p>It also leads to arguments between people with one assuming they have more truth than the other.</p></li>
  <li><p>The chronic disease of cherishing myself<br>
  is the cause of unwanted suffering<br>
  Perceiving this, may I be inspired<br>
  To blame, begrudge, and destroy<br>
  This self-cherishing demon.</p></li>
  </ul>
</blockquote>

<p>When I read a bit of <a href="https://www.google.com/search?q=%22self-cherishing+attitude%22" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://www.google.com/search?q=%22self-cherishing+attitude%22</a> it seems to include both what Theravada calls "conceit" (e.g. "I am better than you") and other vices, e.g. attachments (and I don't know about comfort-seeking too ... and presumably "becoming" and "birth" and so too).</p>

<p>It possibly doesn't include "the view of a real personal identity" which (as in Theravada) might be stated as a separate problem.</p>

<p>"Bodhicitta" is maybe meant to be the antidote, to the "self-cherishing attitude". I've also seen on video his holiness say that he sees himself as "not special" and "just, like everyone else" -- because otherwise he would be/feel imprisoned (in/by his identity).</p>

<p>Combining the last two paragraphs above, I wonder if sunyata rather than Bodhicitta is the antidote to "the view of a real personal identity" -- but sunyata (without Bodhicitta) isn't enough by itself to get rid of the "self-cherishing attitude".</p>

CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-16T23:51:58.423Z
`What theravada calls conceit? Can conceit walk on earth?` You saw the topic in which Ven Yuttadhammo described "conceit", it's also described here on Wikipedia: [Māna](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C4%81na). Among other things it's identified as a major cause of sectarian argument (e.g. "I know better than you do" etc.).
ChrisW
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-16T23:54:35.357Z
`Separate problem? Separate from what and what?` I was saying that, although HH describes the "self-cherishing attitude" as the only problem or the root problem, in another text I saw it identified as one of two problems -- with the other problem being "the view of a real personal identity".
ChrisW
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-16T23:57:16.043Z
`Are you calling HH dalai lama conceited?` No the opposite -- his saying that "I see myself as being like everyone else" (and not "better than everyone else") seems to be the opposite or absence of conceit.
ChrisW
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-17T00:14:58.033Z
`I doubt one could develop proper bodhicitta without doing sunyata` As you might have seen, the Theravada doctrine is that "identity view" is the first to be eradicated (i.e. before "conceit" is). I guess they might be both a little-by-little step-by-step -- and "gradual training" includes generosity (*dana*) early on, that is, before "stream-entry".
ChrisW
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-17T00:24:27.930Z
I'm saying Theravada doctrine identifies a fetter called "identity view" which might correspond to what Mahayana doctrine calls "the view of a real personal identity". And Theravada identifies several other fetters, which including "conceit" and others -- and that these may all correspond to or be different aspects of what Lojong calls "self-cherishing attitude".
ChrisW
CC BY-SA 4.0
2020-02-16T23:36:04.877Z
2020-02-16T23:36:04.877Z
ChrisW
<p>And to whom does it arise?</p>

<p>As spoken about by Dr. Berzin?</p>

<p>Listen to Seven Point Mind Training by Study Buddhism on #SoundCloud
<a href="https://soundcloud.com/studybuddhism/7-point-mind-training" rel="nofollow noreferrer">https://soundcloud.com/studybuddhism/7-point-mind-training</a></p>

<mahayana>
What is the self cherishing attitude?
# What is the self cherishing attitude?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2020-02-16)

And to whom does it arise?

As spoken about by Dr. Berzin?

Listen to Seven Point Mind Training by Study Buddhism on #SoundCloud
<https://soundcloud.com/studybuddhism/7-point-mind-training>

**Tags:** mahayana


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## 1 answers

### Answer by username_1 on 2020-02-16. Score: 1

It's described in a couple of pages of *The Complete Foundation: The Systematic Approach to Training the Mind* by HH the Dalai Lama.

I paraphrase:

> * It is the one object of all blame -- the source of all miseries therefore the only object to be blamed for all misfortune.
> * Normally we blame others because we are self-righteous
> * Problems come from the kind of body we assume, which is contaminated and a product of actions -- we possess that body because of attachment to self -- therefore it's attachment to self that gives rise to suffering.
> * "The self-cherishing and self-grasping attitudes abide strongly fortified in the mind, we have never been able to shake the in the least."
> * It leads to wars (globally) and problems within the family.
> * It also leads to arguments between people with one assuming they have more truth than the other.
> * The chronic disease of cherishing myself  
>   is the cause of unwanted suffering  
>   Perceiving this, may I be inspired  
>   To blame, begrudge, and destroy  
>   This self-cherishing demon.

When I read a bit of <https://www.google.com/search?q=%22self-cherishing+attitude%22> it seems to include both what Theravada calls "conceit" (e.g. "I am better than you") and other vices, e.g. attachments (and I don't know about comfort-seeking too ... and presumably "becoming" and "birth" and so too).

It possibly doesn't include "the view of a real personal identity" which (as in Theravada) might be stated as a separate problem.

"Bodhicitta" is maybe meant to be the antidote, to the "self-cherishing attitude". I've also seen on video his holiness say that he sees himself as "not special" and "just, like everyone else" -- because otherwise he would be/feel imprisoned (in/by his identity).

Combining the last two paragraphs above, I wonder if sunyata rather than Bodhicitta is the antidote to "the view of a real personal identity" -- but sunyata (without Bodhicitta) isn't enough by itself to get rid of the "self-cherishing attitude".

> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: `What theravada calls conceit? Can conceit walk on earth?` You saw the topic in which Ven Yuttadhammo described "conceit", it's also described here on Wikipedia: [Māna](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M%C4%81na). Among other things it's identified as a major cause of sectarian argument (e.g. "I know better than you do" etc.).  
> **username_1**: `Separate problem? Separate from what and what?` I was saying that, although HH describes the "self-cherishing attitude" as the only problem or the root problem, in another text I saw it identified as one of two problems -- with the other problem being "the view of a real personal identity".  
> **username_1**: `Are you calling HH dalai lama conceited?` No the opposite -- his saying that "I see myself as being like everyone else" (and not "better than everyone else") seems to be the opposite or absence of conceit.  
> **username_1**: `I doubt one could develop proper bodhicitta without doing sunyata` As you might have seen, the Theravada doctrine is that "identity view" is the first to be eradicated (i.e. before "conceit" is). I guess they might be both a little-by-little step-by-step -- and "gradual training" includes generosity (*dana*) early on, that is, before "stream-entry".  
> **username_1**: I'm saying Theravada doctrine identifies a fetter called "identity view" which might correspond to what Mahayana doctrine calls "the view of a real personal identity". And Theravada identifies several other fetters, which including "conceit" and others -- and that these may all correspond to or be different aspects of what Lojong calls "self-cherishing attitude".  

---

