<h3>The joseki</h3>
<p>This is, as <a href="https://boardgames.stackexchange.com/users/60/mafu">mafu</a> pointed out, the result of a joseki starting with high and low near kakaris against a hoshi, shown in  <em>38 Basic Joseki, page 188, Dia. 4</em> (with colours swapped and rotated to match the question), and <a href="http://www.josekipedia.com/#path:pdqfttndnemeoeqcqdpcrcodpfmd" rel="nofollow noreferrer">in Josekipedia</a>:</p>
<pre><code>$$Wc Double kakari joseki
$$ -----------
$$ ..........-
$$ ......c7b.-
$$ a...X.54..-
$$ O...9.O6..-
$$ d....38...-
$$ .....1X...-
$$ .....20...-
$$ ..........-
</code></pre>
<p>N.B. The pincer is not visible in the diagram mentioned in the question.</p>
<p>The position is also shown in Ishida’s <em>Dictionary of Basic Joseki, Vol II, p. 186, Dia. 96</em>, but with the White pincer (Black in Ishida as the colours are reversed) at <strong>a</strong>; in this case, after White <strong>9</strong>, Black exchanges <strong>b</strong> for White <strong>c</strong> before connecting at <strong>10</strong>, and finally White plays at <strong>d</strong>.</p>
<p>This joseki appeared not to be in Senseis Library, though it belonged on the page <a href="https://senseis.xmp.net/?44PointLowHighDoubleApproachHane" rel="nofollow noreferrer">4-4 point, low-high double approach, hane</a>; I have since added it there. <a href="http://eidogo.com/#kjd" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Eidogo</a> appears to contain only double high and double low kakaris against hoshi, but not the high/low variant.</p>
<h3>How to find it</h3>
<p><em><strong>To be worked out</strong></em></p>
<blockquote>
<p>I tried without success to find this joseki/position with pattern search on <a href="https://senseis.xmp.net/?positionsearch=1" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Sensei’ s Library</a> and <a href="http://eidogo.com/#search" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Eidogo</a>. That was reasonable, as it appears not to have been in either source, though I have since added it to Sensei and it is now found. I also failed to find it in <em>38 Basic Joseki</em>, and in Ishida’s <em>Dictionary of Basic Joseki</em>; that was mainly due to not guessing correctly how the joseki started.  I also failed to find it by experimentation on <a href="http://www.josekipedia.com/" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Josekipedia</a>, again through not trying guessing the start. <em><strong>To add</strong>: suggestions for more effective searching</em>.</p>
<p>Since Black has seven stones to White’s six, he must have started (probably 3-3, 3-4 or 4-5) or White must have started and then played tenuki.</p>
</blockquote>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2018-04-17T12:36:43.683Z
2018-04-23T16:47:24.653Z
2020-06-17T09:01:24.697Z
PJTraill
<p>When introducing pincer <a href="/questions/tagged/joseki" class="post-tag" title="show questions tagged &#39;joseki&#39;" rel="tag">joseki</a> on page 60 of <em>38 Basic Joseki</em>, Kiyoshi Kosugi and James Davies use this position as an illustration:</p>

<pre><code>$$Bc Illustration of pincer
$$ ---------
$$ ........-
$$ .....O..-
$$ ..X.OX..-
$$ ..O.OX..-
$$ ...OX...-
$$ ...OX...-
$$ ...XX...-
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ ....,...-
$$ ........-
$$ .....1..-
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ .....O..-
$$ ....,...-
$$ ....X...-
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ ---------
</code></pre>

<p>I have tried without success to find this joseki/position with pattern search on <a href="https://senseis.xmp.net/?positionsearch=1" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Sensei’ s Library</a> and <a href="http://eidogo.com/#search" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Eidogo</a> and by experimentation on <a href="http://www.josekipedia.com/" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Josekipedia</a>. I also could not find it in <em>38 Basic Joseki</em>, nor in Ishida’s <em>Dictionary of Basic Joseki</em>, though perhaps I erroneously skipped some positions that seemed to me to be excluded.</p>

<p>Does this position arise from a recognised joseki? If so, which, and how might I have been able to find it on-line or in a book?</p>

<p>Since Black has seven stones to White’s six, he must have started (probably 3-3, 3-4 or 4-5) or White must have played tenuki, but I cannot find a very plausible order.</p>

<h3>Update: partial match</h3>

<p>While <a href="https://boardgames.stackexchange.com/users/60/mafu">mafu</a> correctly remarked that it looked like a <em>hoshi approached from both sides, low and high, with black then jumping into the corner after white attached on top of the high approaching stone</em>, I found <a href="http://www.josekipedia.com/#path:qdndnepcpdodoeqcmd" rel="nofollow noreferrer">the following partial position</a> in Josekipedia:</p>

<pre><code>$$Wc Partial sequence
$$ ---------
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ ....18..-
$$ ....54..-
$$ ...76...-
$$ ...32...-
$$ ....a...-
$$ ........-
</code></pre>

<p>which it attributes to <em><a href="https://senseis.xmp.net/?GendaiJosekiJiten" rel="nofollow noreferrer">Encyclopedia of Joseki</a> - Diagram 2.9365</em>. White 3 is a trick move, this is the refutation, but it continues at <strong>a</strong> (reverting to a standard 1-point high joseki), so this is not the answer.</p>

CC BY-SA 3.0
2018-04-12T16:11:22.847Z
Looks like a hoshi that was approached from both sides, low and high, with black then jumping into the corner after white attached on top of the  high approaching stone. I don't know the joseki sequence, but the result seems like a perfect fit for this.
mafu
CC BY-SA 3.0
2018-04-12T18:21:02.353Z
@Mafu: You are right; it is _38 Basic Joseki, p 188, Dia. 4_ — not sure how I missed it :(. If you do not care to provide this as an answer, I shall do it myself.
PJTraill
CC BY-SA 3.0
2018-04-12T21:32:52.737Z
Please feel free to put up the answer! I was just guessing.
mafu
<go><joseki>
What joseki, if any, yields this position on page 60 of 38 Basic Joseki?
PJTraill
# What joseki, if any, yields this position on page 60 of 38 Basic Joseki?

(Asked by: username_0 on 2018-04-11)

When introducing pincer joseki on page 60 of 38 Basic Joseki, Kiyoshi Kosugi and James Davies use this position as an illustration:
$$Bc Illustration of pincer
$$ ---------
$$ ........-
$$ .....O..-
$$ ..X.OX..-
$$ ..O.OX..-
$$ ...OX...-
$$ ...OX...-
$$ ...XX...-
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ ....,...-
$$ ........-
$$ .....1..-
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ .....O..-
$$ ....,...-
$$ ....X...-
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ ---------

I have tried without success to find this joseki/position with pattern search on Sensei’ s Library and Eidogo and by experimentation on Josekipedia. I also could not find it in 38 Basic Joseki, nor in Ishida’s Dictionary of Basic Joseki, though perhaps I erroneously skipped some positions that seemed to me to be excluded.
Does this position arise from a recognised joseki? If so, which, and how might I have been able to find it on-line or in a book?
Since Black has seven stones to White’s six, he must have started (probably 3-3, 3-4 or 4-5) or White must have played tenuki, but I cannot find a very plausible order.
Update: partial match
While username_1 correctly remarked that it looked like a hoshi approached from both sides, low and high, with black then jumping into the corner after white attached on top of the high approaching stone, I found the following partial position in Josekipedia:
$$Wc Partial sequence
$$ ---------
$$ ........-
$$ ........-
$$ ....18..-
$$ ....54..-
$$ ...76...-
$$ ...32...-
$$ ....a...-
$$ ........-

which it attributes to Encyclopedia of Joseki - Diagram 2.9365. White 3 is a trick move, this is the refutation, but it continues at a (reverting to a standard 1-point high joseki), so this is not the answer.

**Tags:** go, joseki

> **Comments:**
> **username_1**: Looks like a hoshi that was approached from both sides, low and high, with black then jumping into the corner after white attached on top of the  high approaching stone. I don't know the joseki sequence, but the result seems like a perfect fit for this.  
> **username_0**: @Mafu: You are right; it is _38 Basic Joseki, p 188, Dia. 4_ — not sure how I missed it :(. If you do not care to provide this as an answer, I shall do it myself.  
> **username_1**: Please feel free to put up the answer! I was just guessing.  

---

## 1 answers

### Answer by username_0 on 2018-04-17. Score: 1 | Accepted answer

The joseki
This is, as username_1 pointed out, the result of a joseki starting with high and low near kakaris against a hoshi, shown in  38 Basic Joseki, page 188, Dia. 4 (with colours swapped and rotated to match the question), and in Josekipedia:
$$Wc Double kakari joseki
$$ -----------
$$ ..........-
$$ ......c7b.-
$$ a...X.54..-
$$ O...9.O6..-
$$ d....38...-
$$ .....1X...-
$$ .....20...-
$$ ..........-

N.B. The pincer is not visible in the diagram mentioned in the question.
The position is also shown in Ishida’s Dictionary of Basic Joseki, Vol II, p. 186, Dia. 96, but with the White pincer (Black in Ishida as the colours are reversed) at a; in this case, after White 9, Black exchanges b for White c before connecting at 10, and finally White plays at d.
This joseki appeared not to be in Senseis Library, though it belonged on the page 4-4 point, low-high double approach, hane; I have since added it there. Eidogo appears to contain only double high and double low kakaris against hoshi, but not the high/low variant.
How to find it
To be worked out

I tried without success to find this joseki/position with pattern search on Sensei’ s Library and Eidogo. That was reasonable, as it appears not to have been in either source, though I have since added it to Sensei and it is now found. I also failed to find it in 38 Basic Joseki, and in Ishida’s Dictionary of Basic Joseki; that was mainly due to not guessing correctly how the joseki started.  I also failed to find it by experimentation on Josekipedia, again through not trying guessing the start. To add: suggestions for more effective searching.
Since Black has seven stones to White’s six, he must have started (probably 3-3, 3-4 or 4-5) or White must have started and then played tenuki.


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