  The next stage finds Socrates getting Simmias' rapid agreement that there is an Equal that they know besides the equal sticks and stones. (74ab). The question is whence they acquired this knowledge. It cannot have been from the sticks and stones from which it differs; for they can sometimes appear equal and sometimes unequal, whereas Equality Itself, on the other hand, never appears unequal. Socrates concludes that we cannot have derived our knowledge of Equality from these many equals because we realize that they are deficient or lacking with respect to Equality. He does not specify in what way they are lacking, save for the aforementioned fact that they can and do appear unequal whereas Equality does not and apparently cannot do so.