 It is uncontroversial to say that a (further) kind of limit of law is that contained in the idea of legality. Lon Fuller famously identified eight “desiderata” for laws. Laws should be general; they should be promulgated to their norm-subjects; and they should be prospective. They should be understandable (perhaps with professional help); the obligations they impose should be susceptible to being jointly fulfilled; and they should not require anything beyond the capacities of their norm-subjects. Laws should be tolerably stable and, finally, they should actually be upheld by the relevant legal officials, rather than ignored, bypassed or replaced by what the officials applying them consider more congenial standards (Fuller 1964; Rundle 2012: Ch. 4; Waldron 2016 [2020]; Sunstein &amp; Vermeule 2020). Kristen Rundle and Jeremy Waldron both argue that the legal positivism of Hart and Raz, as well as a broader instrumentalism that would take in  Devlin,[13]  is too casual and accommodating in allowing the designation “legal system” and “law” to systems and norms that fall short on the criteria of legality (Waldron 2008: 14; Rundle 2012: 202). This implies that one cannot simply take the question of the limits of law to be an evaluative question. This would underestimate the extent to which supposedly conceptual questions about the existence of legal systems and laws are themselves evaluative questions. Hence the limits of the law should be seen squarely as both an evaluative and a conceptual question. Against this, while granting that conceptual questions matter and are themselves a large focus in the philosophy of law, one might wonder how far they matter to the specific issue of the limits of the law. If it is accepted for example that Fuller’s desiderata for legality or something close to them are indeed desiderata as well as to some extent conceptual features of the law (as does Raz 1977), does it greatly matter that one might conceive of such features as conceptual to a still greater extent?