 What about internal relations? Do we need to acknowledge their existence? We distinguished 3 senses of “internal relation” in our preliminary discussion: internal relations are determined by the mere existence of the things they relate, or internal relations are determined by the intrinsic characters of the things they relate, or internal relations supervene upon the intrinsic characters of the things they relate. So, in one sense or another, it suffices for the obtaining of an internal relation that either the things it relates exist or that the things it relates have such-and-such intrinsic characters. On this basis, some philosophers have concluded that there is no need to admit internal relations as additional pieces of furniture in the Universe (Fisk 1972: 146–9; Armstrong 1978b: 86; Campbell 1990: 99–101; Simons 2010: 204–5; 2014: 314–5; Lowe 2013: 242, 2016: 105–6; Heil 2009: 316–7, 2012: 144–6, 2016: 130, Lowe 2016:102–11, Keinänen 2020). Why do they think this? Truths about internal relations aren’t necessarily equivalent to truths about the things they relate or the intrinsic characters of the things they relate. Nevertheless, all the truths about internal relations are determined by the existence or the intrinsic characters of the things they relate, or supervene upon them. So internal relations are variously declared to be “no addition of being” (Armstrong) or “absent from the fundamental ontology” (Heil) or, more clearly, “there are no such things” (Simons).